AP sales…

[AnnaKristoff2013]

yes, but this day we’re not blacked out. Others who planned accordingly were able to use their magic keys to enter the park….. Proper planning prevent piss poor performance.

this is different than not book DVC point until a month before they expire to find out there are no rooms left!

Your dvc analogy is actually unwittingly a really good example of why the AP buckets were a problem. DVC has a set number of points in the system and they cannot sell more points then what is declared, such that theoretically everyone will be able to use all the points they have bought. (Obviously in practice you can’t always get the dates you want, etc.). However, what they did with AP’s was different. They sold them without a care about whether everyone would actually be able to use them, and artificially limited their use by “blocking out” spots for more profitable day ticket guests. The DVC analogy would be if they started just taking rooms out of inventory (beyond those that disney owns the points for and beyond breakage), to rent those rooms to cash guests.

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

Because of this law suit Disney is not able to properly treat their DVC members, by providing them annual passes

False. Because of this lawsuit Disney is **choosing** not to provide annual passes to sale for DVC members. They could absolutely start selling them anytime they wanted to, if they stopped discriminating against AP holders in favor of day guests. They obviously dont’ want to do that because day guests are more profitable.

 

[Robbie Cottam]

Because they wouldn’t sell day tickets to walk-ups during a phase IV closure. The issue isn’t that they blocked out passholders becuase they hit capacity. The issue is that they blocked out passholders while hitting an artificial capacity they made up while simultaneously continuing to sell tickets to day guests.

I’m going to wait and see what parks of the complaint the judge dismissed.

 

[Robbie Cottam]

Your dvc analogy is actually unwittingly a really good example of why the AP buckets were a problem. DVC has a set number of points in the system and they cannot sell more points then what is declared, such that theoretically everyone will be able to use all the points they have bought. (Obviously in practice you can’t always get the dates you want, etc.). However, what they did with AP’s was different. They sold them without a care about whether everyone would actually be able to use them, and artificially limited their use by “blocking out” spots for more profitable day ticket guests. The DVC analogy would be if they started just taking rooms out of inventory (beyond those that disney owns the points for and beyond breakage), to rent those rooms to cash guests.

I disagree they “blocked out”, if you’re are also claiming that the AP bucket was full.
Either the dates were blacked out and NO AP member were able to enter the park that day using their AP. Or Other annual pass holder filled the bucket for the day and there were no more relations available.

Having the AP alone does not Guarantee admission.

I still what to see what parts of this case were dismissed.

 

[Robbie Cottam]

False. Because of this lawsuit Disney is **choosing** not to provide annual passes to sale for DVC members. They could absolutely start selling them anytime they wanted to, if they stopped discriminating against AP holders in favor of day guests. They obviously dont’ want to do that because day guests are more profitable.

If that were true they would be renew annual passes at all.

I renewed my annual pass last week, so you are in fact wrong.

 

[Sandisw]

If that were true they would be renew annual passes at all.

I renewed my annual pass last week, so you are in fact wrong.

Except renewals doesn’t increase AP holders..except those with pixie passes.

And, if someone doesn’t renew, it goes down with no new ones sold. So, by stopping the sales, they have chosen to prioritize those who use day tickets instead.

 

[Robbie Cottam]

Yes, but the extend the time that I could potentially be part of a class.

I find it more that slightly amusing that in 8 trips I have gone on and two the my SO has gone on with her kids I was not there we have had ZERO ISSUES booking park reservation.

Guess I part of Disney’s chosen class….
Or I book early and often.

Again, with knowing what the judge dismissed we are all speculating here….

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

Yes, but the extend the time that I could potentially be part of a class.

That is not how class action lawsuits work.

 

[Robbie Cottam]

Actually, it is exactly how a class action law suits works. It you bought a product during a specific time.

if you purchased this product between a and b, you may be part of a class…..

That is not how class action lawsuits work.

this one is a wells fargo class action:
“Consumers who used a bank ATM to withdraw cash from another bank ATM and paid an unreimbursed surcharge between October 1, 2007 and November 12, 2021 may be eligible for payment.”

you realize just because you bought a product once does not make you part of the class right.

you also realize that without knowing what parts of the lawsuit were dismissed, if the the plaintiff will amend her complain, how Disney will answer, and if that amended complaint will survive….we are actually arguing over fiction!

 

[Ms Bibbidi]

.

 

[Robbie Cottam]

As you said, these are early days. My Pacer subscription is not active, so I cannot read Judge Carter’s April 6, 2022 order. I do not want to pay for it just to answer someone who is … well anyway. That is futile. So let’s refocus to see if we can observe some palpable recent change in Disney’s handling of park reservations for passholders since April 6th. I know I did see a change towards prioritizing passholder access starting November 24th. I know conduct of a defendant correcting tortious acts cannot be admitted in evidence to prove the tort, but we are not in court. It may help us see which way they are going now.

I am kind of conflicted by this case and the manipulation of reservations to throttle passholders. I want Disney to be ok because I love Disney World etc like everybody else. But using reservations to surreptitiously define availability and throttle passholders is quite another thing. I would vote to drop the reservation system and move on, but I guess I do not get a vote. Is there any place where we can be noisy enough that Disney might hear us and consider doing that?

You both realize this is not a class action case at this point, correct?

 

[New Mouse]

I disagree they “blocked out”, if you’re are also claiming that the AP bucket was full.
Either the dates were blacked out and NO AP member were able to enter the park that day using their AP. Or Other annual pass holder filled the bucket for the day and there were no more relations available.

Having the AP alone does not Guarantee admission.

I still what to see what parts of this case were dismissed.

Actually it does....that's what by standard definition an AP is.

 

[New Mouse]

As you said, these are early days. My Pacer subscription is not active, so I cannot read Judge Carter’s April 6, 2022 order. I do not want to pay for it just to answer someone who is … well anyway. That is futile. So let’s refocus to see if we can observe some palpable recent change in Disney’s handling of park reservations for passholders since April 6th. I know I did see a change towards prioritizing passholder access starting November 24th. I know conduct of a defendant correcting tortious acts cannot be admitted in evidence to prove the tort, but we are not in court. It may help us see which way they are going now.

I am kind of conflicted by this case and the manipulation of reservations to throttle passholders. I want Disney to be ok because I love Disney World etc like everybody else. But using reservations to surreptitiously define availability and throttle passholders is quite another thing. I would vote to drop the reservation system and move on, but I guess I do not get a vote. Is there any place where we can be noisy enough that Disney might hear us and consider doing that?

Why they don't just drop the reservation system at this point is actually very odd.

They don't have the staff and they are providing a garbage experience either way, so what's it matter?

 

[Robbie Cottam]

Actually it does....that's what by standard definition an AP is.

then you also have not read the rules.
Ap passes do not included special events, or private events,
They also require, since the parks reopen post covid, that you have a reservation.

 

[New Mouse]

then you also have not read the rules.
Ap passes do not included special events, or private events,
They also require, since the parks reopen post covid, that you have a reservation.

Disney requires it. No one else requires it.

Again, by standard accepted definition, an annual pass allows unlimited admission minus stated black out dates.

I can't sell you a Ferrari and then tell you in the fine print that we will replace the engine with a Volkswagen when we feel like it.

 

[Robbie Cottam]

Disney requires it. No one else requires it.

Again, by standard accepted definition, an annual pass allows unlimited admission minus stated black out dates.

I can't sell you a Ferrari and then tell you in the fine print that we will replace the engine with a Volkswagen when we feel like it.

That is true, but when you buy the sign the contract to buy a used F40 you don’t get to ***** that is is not an Enzo… You sign know what that contract says before you buy it.

oh and btw :

2022 Calendar-Year Discounts​

Universal Orlando Resort Passholder benefits and discounts are valid Jan. 1 – Dec. 31, 2022, unless otherwise noted. Benefits and discounts listed below are subject to availability and to change without notice.

universal has the same restriction but please go live in your woke world

 

[New Mouse]

Universal doesn't have a park reservation system? Park admission isn't considered an ancillary benefit. It's considered the product. Come on back to the world of common sense.

 

[Robbie Cottam]

Universal doesn't have a park reservation system? Park admission isn't considered an ancillary benefit. It's considered the product. Come on back to the world of common sense.

 

[Robbie Cottam]

Funny I was going to say the same thing about you, but how about we wait to see what happen with this case, first.

 

[New Mouse]

Funny I was going to say the same thing about you, but how about we wait to see what happen with this case, first.

Funny I was going to say the same thing about you, but how about we wait to see what happen with this case, first.

We can but the fact Disney is not selling APs at the moment because of this says all you really need to know about what their legal team thinks.