AP Changes

drp4video

DIS Veteran
Joined
Apr 19, 2003
Messages
626
Major changes happening for AP holders. They suck. I am probably not going to renew my pass.

Changes can be seen at the disney site, or if I can say this, not sure, at the Mousesavers site. If I can't name the site, please delet and I apologise.
 
While I'm not especially pleased with the information available thus far, we have no idea how it will actually work out or how long it will stay. I especially don't like the booking 4 months in advance, AND the forced online booking.

Regardless, buying the AP for the room discounts is always a mistake. If that is your deciding factor in buying one, then it's probably the best idea not to get one again.

N.E.D.
 
It is one of the factors. It saves me a lot of money. Another is the factor of course are convenience to go in the morningi or afternoon to a park and not feel like I wasted a day ticket as I did not stay the whole day.

I live in Michigan so I go only two maybe three times a year. If room discounts disappear, financially it makes sense to get a MWY pass for 10 days with a no expiration date, and use my AAA discount for the room.
 
I got real angry when I came home and read this stuff, and wound up sending a long-winded email through the Passholder web site:

WillCAD said:
There are many rumors flying about today on the subject of major changes in the works for Walt Disney World Annual Passholders.

Some of these rumors are extremely disturbing and disheartening to me as a Passholder and as a frequent visitor (15 times since 1990) to the WDW resort, and I would like to address some of these rumors, as well as some of the current Passholder policies and trends of the past few years.

1) Buying an Annual Passport
Current procedures for obtaining and renewing a WDW Annual Passport (AP) or Premium Annual Passport (PAP) seem reasonable and flexible. Buying an AP from Disney's EarPort store at Orlando International Airport, one of the other local locations, or at Guest Relations and ticket windows at the WDW theme parks is simple and quick, as is exchanging a voucher from an on-line or telephone AP purchase.

However, the AP cards themselves are somewhat flimsy, cheap, and sub-standard; just up the road at Universal Studios, an AP is not only half the cost, but comes with substantially better dining and merchandise discounts than a WDW AP, and the card itself is a hard-laminated ID card with the Passholders picture on it. That's value! WDW could certainly learn a thing or two from their immediate competition at Universal Studios Florida.

2) Discounts
WDW Passholders have historically been granted discounts on merchandise, dining, and tours. But these discounts have shrunken repeatedly over the years until they are now a pale shadow of their former selves, and are far inferior to the 15% dining and 20% merchandise discounts granted to Universal Studios Passholders, not to mention the extremely limited number of locations where these WDW discounts can be used.

Match your competition! Give WDW Passholders a 20% discount on all merchandise bought at any gift shop in the theme parks or resorts (excluding carts, excluding periodicals, excluding non-WDW sundries in the resort gift shops), and spread the dining discounts to include both table and counter service venues throughout the property (excluding smaller drink and snack carts). And allow PAP Passholders these discounts at venues inside DisneyQuest and the water parks. Give Passholders these discounts and watch your revenues soar as they buy, buy, buy those discounted items!

3) Room discounts
WDW Passholders wait with baited breath all year long to see their WDW room discounts released. But those discounts change from year to year, season to season, and day to day, as WDW uses Passholders like seat fillers at the Oscars to boost low bookings, then conveniently forgets about them when the bookings increase. Passholders are, by definition, WDW's most loyal, most dependable, and most profitable repeat customers, and loyal, repeat customers are the backbone of any successful business. Instead of taking us for granted and only throwing us bones in the form of room discounts in time of sub-par bookings, WDW should be elevating Passholders to exalted, privileged status among WDW Guests.

Passholder room discounts should be stabilized and standardized to reflect a flat, across the board discount of 35% off the rack rate, and availability should be standardized at 15% of all standard room categories and 10% of all preferred room categories at all WDW resorts. Packages should also be discounted by 35%, across the board. Cancellation policies, also, should be better than those available to the general public from the Walt Disney Travel Company, and should match those currently available to room-only bookings.

RUMOR: Passholders will be forced to only book on-line or through a travel agent
This is absolutely terrible, since not all Passholders book through travel agents or have internet access.

RUMOR: Passholder deposits will become non-refundable
This is a travesty! The word "non-refundable" is typically used only by cheap, sleazy, second-rate, or outright fraudulent travel peddlers interested only in bilking and wringing out every cent from their victims while giving little or nothing to them in return. Disney has always been above such sheer greed tactics in the past, but apparently the winds of change sometimes bring foul odors with them.

RUMOR: Passholders will only be allowed to book one room at a time
So if my family is large enough to need two rooms, I can only get my Passholder discount on one of them? Again, that's a tactic of sheer greed, designed to wring every last penny out of Passholders. Tactics like these will simply drive me out of WDW and into off-site non-Disney hotels.

RUMOR: Current, activated APs will be required for all Passholder room bookings - vouchers will no longer be sufficient
So if I buy an AP on-line or by phone in advance of my trip, but can't activate it until I arrive, then I can't book a room at the AP rate? Seeing as how an AP voucher is completely non-refundable under any circumstances, having one should entitle a person to book a room with the AP rate, so long as they can show the activated AP at check-in or immediately after.

And while on the subject, it should be possible to exchange a voucher for an AP at any of the resorts, so that those with AP rates can show their valid APs at check-in, as required, instead of being forced to go to one of the theme parks or Downtown Disney before going to the resort. This is an especially acute issue for those who fly into Orlando from the west coast and don't arrive until late in the evening when the parks and Downtown Disney are closed.

RUMOR: Passholder-discounted rooms will require booking no less than 120 days in advance
So if I decide to take a trip on only 30-days notice, I can't get my Passholder discount? That's dumb; having an Annual Pass makes it possible for Passholders to go to WDW more often, sometimes on short notice, which is good for WDW because it means more profits coming into their coffers. But if I have to pay rack rate for a trip unless I book more than 120 days out, I may just stay off-site, or even stay home. And if I don't take those extra trips during the year, then why do I even need the AP in the first place?

4) Conclusion
Give more, give better, and give consistent discounts to the very best customers you have, or you risk alienating them and potentially losing them top your competition.

If the above rumors about AP booking policies do indeed come to fruition, I will not only let my AP lapse without renewing, but I may take a couple of years off from my yearly WDW vacations to visit places like Las Vegas and New Orleans instead. I love WDW and I love my yearly trips there, but if WDW can't treat their very best, most loyal, most dependable customers (Passholders) better than their direct competition (Universal Studios), then I will have little or no incentive to spend my hard-earned vacation dollars at WDW instead of someplace else where I can get far more value for them.

Live the Magic!
 

Very well said! I highly agree with EVERYTHING you wrote!!!

I hope someone "gets it!"
 
I mentioned this in one of the other threads about this... There is no question that these changes aren't going to sit well with folks who have derived a lot of benefit from the AP discounts in the past. By the same token, I think it is important to keep in mind that the folks putting these changes in place aren't doing what they're doing to upset people. Indeed, it makes most sense to me to assume that these folks are making these changes because their research and experience shows that they'll end up providing the best return to the owners of the company. Despite how disappointing the changes may be, I would hope folks recognize that it is not a personal slap.

Things are changing in many sectors of the economy that were most hard-hit by 9/11. I take this as a very good sign. Due to the down-turn in the economy after 9/11, I was forced to take a substantial pay-cut in order to keep my company in business. We've struggled for four years, and we're still struggling. I'm hoping that these changes are just the beginning of indications that America is beginning to spend money again, that the economy will be significantly improving in the months to come, so I can have a greater sense of security that I'll have a job next month and the month after.
 
I completely agree. I am REALLY upset about this. I go a minimum of four times year. But, if this is the way things are going to change. My Disney habits are going to change as well. If Disney wants my repeat business, things had better change for the better and not the worse. I really hope many people complain to Disney about these changes. If enough people roar, maybe we will be heard.
 
Your letter was very well written, Willcad.

I hope lots of us passholders express our concerns not only here but also directly to Disney like Willcad did.

Those 10 day non expiring hoppers are looking better and better. I almost went with them this year but DD15 talked me into the AP's. Now she's not even going on our third trip with us.

I am really thinking about scheduling more non park days for trips after our AP's expire and just rationng the days. We'll see.
 
Jackie021368 said:
I really hope many people complain to Disney about these changes. If enough people roar, maybe we will be heard.
The real key will be how these changes affect or don't affect revenues. If all folks do is send mail, but they still spend just as much money (or more), or if other folks step-in and take their place as customers -- customers perhaps more willing to spend more money rather than less -- then all the roaring in the world won't matter.

Disney does pay attention to the impact of these kinds of things, though. Just as there are examples of unpopular changes that stuck because they were a net-gain for the company, there are many examples where Disney put changes in place only to put another change on top of it, or revert the original change, only a relatively short time later, because the anticipated (positive) impact of the original change never materialized.

Customers will make their purchasing decisions based on their own perception of value and the alternatives available to them. If these changes result in enough people making decisions in that regard that are not to the company's benefit, the company will surely "change the changes". :)
 
Good letter WillCad.

I would rather them come out and say we're doing well again so they'll no longer be room discounts for AP holders than the stupid and INSULTING new AP rules put out. Who is gonna put down a nonrefundable deposit on a room before they even know what the price is gonna end up being?!?
 
You'd be surprised, Shan, especially if the promise to provide a Best Rate Guarantee is genuine and validated by some experience. I can guarantee you that I'd have a new car tomorrow (not any car -- mind you -- rather this specific car I have had my eye on) if I could be sure that the price I'd end up paying for it is the lowest price anyone buys that car at this month in my state. Hands down. Instead, I've been twiddling my thumbs about a new car for three months already, and probably will for three more years, because I don't see a way of not ended up regretting how much I paid. A new car is definitely not worth that kind of stress.

In a way, that's why I bought into DVC. At the time I bought in it was already well-established that that was unquestionably the best way to get the lowest price for 40+ years of vacations at WDW. And indeed, I paid in advance, (somewhat) non-refundable.
 
Do you know what really stinks... Is that as a Florida Resident, we may just pick-up and go to Disney one weekend. Usually during the off season, so now if we decide to do that, we can not get our passholder rates at the hotels.

I agree with the other post that talked about Disney keeping up with Universal. As much as I love Disney, Universal is much more superior when it comes to people staying on property, and handicapped guests. If my kids were older, it is getting to the point where I would rather vacation there than Disney. Disney is really slipping in the past few years. First with the actions of their cast members and now this. Disney better get a clue!
 
I think this is a result of the new incentive plan for Central reservations. They do not want AP holders calling for prices on rooms & not booking. The CR answering the phones, are booking us anyway so their #'s look good. Which is tying rooms up until the deposite deadline passes. IMHO


Is all this rumer or has the WDW web site posted any of this. I only have a voucher so I can not go to the Passholder section.
 
drp4video said:
If room discounts disappear, financially it makes sense to get a MWY pass for 10 days with a no expiration date, and use my AAA discount for the room.

That's exactly the issue I've been grappling with recently, and with the new changes I'm going with the MWY 10 day pass. We typically take 2 and sometimes 3 trips down per year, but without a resort discount we'll take 2 trips and use 10 or fewer days in the Disney parks per year. I may just have to branch out and *gasp* do a few days of universal. :)

I'm not a big complainer, but I do have to say that over the past year it seems that Disney has not been as loyal to its frequent visitors as we have been to Disney. It does change my outlook a bit.
 


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