Another look at DHS "super crowds"

[Mango7100]

Some of them have almost cult like followings. You see posts all the time with guests gushing over meeting them in the parks- as though they were celebrities. I only follow Josh. He clearly loves WDW, but calls it like he sees it. Never mind, he’s hilariously funny. If someone is getting something for free because of their opinions, their opinions are worthless.

I only read him as well

 

[blistex]

I'm confused too, what time of year is this poster going where they can't get any of these FP?? We just went a few weeks ago and we stayed off site and we got all of these FP in advance. They weren't available at my 30 day window, but I kept checking back and I found everything I wanted. I saw all of these FP come up multiple times on multiple days when I was checking. I got FoP in advance and then got another FoP same day. We could have gone on FoP 4 times with FP because I kept seeing it when refreshing for more FP. It wasn't slow either, wait times were high and it was crowded.

I hear this and it's crazy to me, I've been trying to go on FoP for 3 years. I know all the FP refresh tricks and have managed FP for every other attraction same day, 30 days, and 60+ days out, but I've only once managed to book a FoP Fastpass and it was at 60+3 for our last trip (President's Day week so high crowds). I didn't like the time so I refreshed that thing somewhere between 3-20 times PER DAY (obsessive much, I know) every single day from 60+3 to the day of our trip and never once saw another time for it. Not once. And then we showed up and it was broken, so, my quest continues.

The others though, I mean, Soarin'? How are you not able to get on Soarin' booking at 60 days out? I pull same-day FPs for that and Frozen Ever After every time we go, because my family wants to use our Tier 1 on Test Track every time.

 

[Sarahslay]

Actually, Disney DOES owe guests something. Guests are paying for a service and they are within their right to expect to be reasonably accommodated to enjoy that service.

And yes, this is coming from someone with experience in that department. Disney comped almost $4000 worth of free park tickets with no expiration date for us to return because our last trip was so horrid from crowds and poor service.
I did not ask for a refund, did not ask for anything at all. I just let them know how - after 4 generations and numerous trips - I left with no desire to ever return.

That was last year and I still have no desire or plans to return.

To everyone else, food for thought:

I don’t mind reasonable lines. Lines of an hour or less are reasonable. But lines of 2-4 hours every single day for rides that are YEARS old already is inexcusable.

For the record, my family has yet to ride SOARIN, FOP, SDD, TSM, 7DMT. Yes, that’s correct. Even SOARIN. THIS, despite staying onsite for 60 day FP, being ready as soon as FP booking went live (and rechecking afterwards), and multiple trips.

How many of you here are actually taking the time to voice your complaints to Disney? You don’t have to wait until after your trip to voice concerns. It’s good that we have places like the DIS to discuss among ourselves but at the end of the day we have to get our concerns to Disney.

The current FP system, park hours, and crowd limits are NOT working. Something will have to break before the Anniversary next year and it will. It’s best to get your concerns in now.

I have walked on to all of those rides you mentioned multiple times, little to no wait except for 7DMT (I think the longest I've waited stand by for any of them was 25, and that was with 7DMT during fireworks). I can even get a day of FP for Soarin' easy, I've also been on FOP at close and at RD and not waited long at all, it was actually really easy and I highly enjoyed my day at the park riding everything multiple times. I even extended a trip this past month by a few nights and so added FP just 2 weeks prior to going and still got amazing FP (yes, even for some you mentioned you've never been on because you don't get FP and you won't wait). If you know when to go you don't have to wait, and you don't need FP. If you get them, great, if not it's not the end of the world and you're not forced to stand in line for ever. I have never, and I mean never, stood in line for a ride that was over an hour and I won't ever, and I've ridden every ride in those parks that's currently open. I don't really think it's the system that's broken.

 

[PrincessWithABlaster]

Well I'm gonna stick my neck out here because I really hate the generalizing of people, not all "infleuncers" (hate that word btw) do positive, non realistic posts and still get invited to these media events. I am one of them (not an influencer just someone who has worked very hard for 4 years of live streaming to achieve media invites from Disney) Since we live stream there's no sugar coating anything, not that I would want to, lately most of my streams include phrases like boy it's crowded, and look at the line for food and things like that. SO before we go all "kill the beast" on everyone invited to media events know that not all of them are only posting positive stuff and they still get invited.


I don't agree with anyone tell you to go or not go, I think the best thing is to put the info out there and have the guest research and make their own decisions, who am I to tell someone to spend or not spend their money on Disney.


and RotR is amazing and I'm sure MMRR will be adorable, the guest, through research will know how long the waits are, just by looking at MDE. In the bg thread you see everyone putting in the effort, struggling, sometimes not being able to board until day 2 or 3 and most people would come back and say it was worth it


He doesn't go to media events because he doesn't want to and doesn't want to try. There's a difference. Also Josh is an "influencer" as he is influencing people to not go because of the crowd levels


everyone on their social media get "challenged" every day, you can do that if you so desire. Freedom of speech and all


not from me at least, I always bring my personal opinion and let people decide if they want to experience MMRR or not


almost everyone invited to the media event has first hand account on what's happening, it's not that they don't know is that some chose not to report it in article form, or pictures or video. And your last statement is my approach with everything DIsney.
It has it;s positives and negatives and I like to bring a balance to the situation, again in live stream you really can't cover anything but I do shows like "what are the best bathrooms to use when it's busy" and "rope drop shows" showing how you can really accomplish a lot in that first hour (not currently at DHS unfortunately)
So again, sticking my neck for no other reason than to bring you the other side of the "influencer" and media event invitee. I have posted many accurate, negative stories in Disney's eyes and we still get invited.
And I do think it's ridiculous to be wined and dined, I find that part of the event uncomfortable because I am a shy person by nature so being seated in a round table with 8 strangers during a meal is not exactly my cup of tea, which is why I'm not going to the dinner they are throwing on Monday.
I will say that giving media invitees fp for all attractions and in the case of Tuesday, access to RotR, is a strategic move as some of the media people are from out of state and they need to ride these things to write about them, the responsibility lies in the "influencer" and yes there are a couple out there that only post positive stories and to that I say, shame on them. I take my job very seriously and love helping people out with their Disney planning. I have been fortunate enough to be an AP and a local for 22 years and love sharing my tips and tricks with everyone, which is why I'm here, and was selected to be a Mod. And as usual all of these are my personal opinions

Sorry, @yulilin3 . I don't mean to offend or to lump you in with others. I do have concerns about the way that social media has sort of morphed into a way for companies to put out what are essentially commericals while hiding their intent (and avoiding the types of regulations that are in place for ads). I'm glad you and some others are trying to be factual and not sugar coat things. The Dis folks have a rule that they don't review anything they get for free which is a good one. It's a well known psychological phenomenon that many people feel a sense of indebtedness to a person or company that gives them something. It often influences their behavior even when it's a small gift (which is why doctor's offices are often filled with pads of paper and pens from drug companies). That practice is annoying but doesn't really hurt anything in the case of a company like Disney (as opposed to the medical community where it could be argued that it does real harm). All you have to do is talk to anyone in RL who's been to Disney to know that it's crowded (a girl on my daughter's basketball team just got back and they waited 4 hours for FOP). I guess my annoyance is more with Disney that this seems to be the response to their DHS morning crowding problem that media outlets are trying to bring attention to. But maybe this media event is just their normal 'new ride opening' plan of attack and not a way to get past the bad press that is starting to get out there about the crowding at DHS.

Again, I'm glad you're in the bucket of people who want to show the truth (live streaming isn't a format that I usually get involved with). But I think people also need to know to take a positive review from someone who got a service or item for free with a grain of salt.

 

[mattpeto]

I have walked on to all of those rides you mentioned multiple times, little to no wait except for 7DMT (I think the longest I've waited stand by for any of them was 25, and that was with 7DMT during fireworks). I can even get a day of FP for Soarin' easy, I've also been on FOP at close and at RD and not waited long at all, it was actually really easy and I highly enjoyed my day at the park riding everything multiple times. I even extended a trip this past month by a few nights and so added FP just 2 weeks prior to going and still got amazing FP (yes, even for some you mentioned you've never been on because you don't get FP and you won't wait). If you know when to go you don't have to wait, and you don't need FP. If you get them, great, if not it's not the end of the world and you're not forced to stand in line for ever. I have never, and I mean never, stood in line for a ride that was over an hour and I won't ever, and I've ridden every ride in those parks that's currently open. I don't really think it's the system that's broken.

This traveler clearly needs a TA or will be a perfect candidate for Geenie

Disney can be overwhelming to plan and all that planning is not for everyone.

 

[Sarahslay]

This traveler clearly needs a TA or will be a perfect candidate for Geenie

Disney can be overwhelming to plan and all that planning is not for everyone.

I just think that getting FP for any of these rides really isn't that difficult unless you have a very short trip. I usually don't even pick out when and what I'm doing until the day before my window, and then it's just a rough cut and I just go "ok, this park on this day, we'll see what we get". It's also not hard to check for FP as you are in the parks, or even just stay in the parks late and ride stuff during fireworks. They should get a TA though, would probably cut down the stress a bit for them and maybe they could enjoy themselves.

 

[yulilin3]

Sorry, @yulilin3 . I don't mean to offend or to lump you in with others. I do have concerns about the way that social media has sort of morphed into a way for companies to put out what are essentially commericals while hiding their intent (and avoiding the types of regulations that are in place for ads). I'm glad you and some others are trying to be factual and not sugar coat things. The Dis folks have a rule that they don't review anything they get for free which is a good one. It's a well known psychological phenomenon that many people feel a sense of indebtedness to a person or company that gives them something. It often influences their behavior even when it's a small gift (which is why doctor's offices are often filled with pads of paper and pens from drug companies). That practice is annoying but doesn't really hurt anything in the case of a company like Disney (as opposed to the medical community where it could be argued that it does real harm). All you have to do is talk to anyone in RL who's been to Disney to know that it's crowded (a girl on my daughter's basketball team just got back and they waited 4 hours for FOP). I guess my annoyance is more with Disney that this seems to be the response to their DHS morning crowding problem that media outlets are trying to bring attention to. But maybe this media event is just their normal 'new ride opening' plan of attack and not a way to get past the bad press that is starting to get out there about the crowding at DHS.

Again, I'm glad you're in the bucket of people who want to show the truth (live streaming isn't a format that I usually get involved with). But I think people also need to know to take a positive review from someone who got a service or item for free with a grain of salt.

absolutely, when I am planning anything, from buying new products to a vacation I research a lot, that's just who I am, I want to get the best bang for my bucks, I go to different places, I really hate extremism, either way positive or negative, it's not all bad and not all good, and if I read a review like that I tend to put it in my back burner. A trip to WDW is not an easy thing to do without planning unless you really don't mind lines and not eating where you want to eat, but there are people out there that are just fine with that. I like the ability that we now have to , almost instantly know what's happening at the parks at any given moment, which helps with the planning so the tools are out there, it's just on each person to research and plan

 

[Remy is Up]

I have walked on to all of those rides you mentioned multiple times, little to no wait except for 7DMT (I think the longest I've waited stand by for any of them was 25, and that was with 7DMT during fireworks). I can even get a day of FP for Soarin' easy, I've also been on FOP at close and at RD and not waited long at all, it was actually really easy and I highly enjoyed my day at the park riding everything multiple times. I even extended a trip this past month by a few nights and so added FP just 2 weeks prior to going and still got amazing FP (yes, even for some you mentioned you've never been on because you don't get FP and you won't wait). If you know when to go you don't have to wait, and you don't need FP. If you get them, great, if not it's not the end of the world and you're not forced to stand in line for ever. I have never, and I mean never, stood in line for a ride that was over an hour and I won't ever, and I've ridden every ride in those parks that's currently open. I don't really think it's the system that's broken.

The fp system works absolutely fine. Even for fop. We pull same day for that consistently. Just have to know when and how. The only ride we find difficult to get fps for is 7dmt and even that is doable.

 

[Thecouch]

I like bloggers that go almost every day trying different things. Josh is great as he seems to be always negative so I think you get the truth. He is not looking for the upside of every situation. I like disney Dailey for disneyland. She is positive but try different plans and list all here moves and times and what she does if a ride is down. Some bloggers it's obvious they have extra fastpasses

 

[mattpeto]

I just think that getting FP for any of these rides really isn't that difficult unless you have a very short trip. I usually don't even pick out when and what I'm doing until the day before my window, and then it's just a rough cut and I just go "ok, this park on this day, we'll see what we get". It's also not hard to check for FP as you are in the parks, or even just stay in the parks late and ride stuff during fireworks. They should get a TA though, would probably cut down the stress a bit for them and maybe they could enjoy themselves.

I agree and my only logical conclusion to the poster who couldn’t land easy FP attractions like Soarin’ is they must really be out of the loop. And that’s okay, just get a TA.

 

[Boopuff]

I miss the old "movie studio" aspect of the park. The rides were big crowd-suckers (movie ride, backlot tour, LIghts Motor) Now the attractions don't have the capacity to suck in a lot of people. Think about how many could watch Light Motor. Now I think Indy is the only huge show (Beauty& Beast maybe?) I'm not sure how big of a line sucker MMRR will be. But I really miss the "sounds dangerous show", And remember Stars and Cars parade??? those were the days.

 

[ILovePixieDust]

I guess my point is that the average guest thinks he or she IS doing research by looking at blogs, vlogs, etc. MDE doesn't give the full picture because it doesn't show how many people get/don't get BGs. I saw the early BG information, and figured it would be a piece of cake if I did everything 'right' and wasn't picky about times. Then I started following the recent developments, and I'm quite worried I won't get on. The person who doesn't follow updates may be completely shocked to find him/herself shut out of BGs.

If I'd known about all this earlier, I might have invested in hoppers back when I bought my tickets, but now there's been another round of price increases, and I'd be out more than $250 to upgrade, so I don't have multiple days to struggle and try again and again for BGs. Given the price increases, I have no idea when I'll be back to WDW. I really feel for the family who saved and saved for Star Wars, goes on their only DHS day, and has a glitch on MDE. Lots of people only get one shot, and it's not fair for them to go not realizing what a long shot it is.

When I found out about the huge crowds, I started looking for plan B, and figured I'd do Muppets or Lightning McQueen if the RD lines were too big for headliners. Imagine my surprise to recently learn that those aren't open until 10. I'm a Dis Board regular, and I feel like I've generally got a handle on how things work, but if it's this challenging for me to come up with a good plan for my 4-year-old, I can only imagine how overwhelming it is for someone without that background.




Thank you for keeping it real. I'm still trying to figure out who is who in the "influencer" world. I mostly get my info from Disboards, so I don't know which vloggers and bloggers have which bias. Although I have no idea what livestreams you do (because I don't know who anyone is outside of their screen name/avitar), I appreciate the info you give here and your work as a moderator.

I really liked your post. You made a lot of good points and I think you are spot on. Being someone who does follow the boards like you do, I already feel very overwhelmed with the recent developments and trying to keep up with boarding groups and the strategies. It truly is bananas.

Then when I look at friends planning their trips without HOURS of reading these boards and reading blogs and videos, it is really hard for them to wrap their head around the need to do all this planning ahead of time. I do it because I enjoy it and also want to make the most of my vacation. But I know that not everyone has the time or desire to be following the boarding group thread on a daily basis.
When I tell them you need to practice and boarding groups are gone within 30-60 seconds they are, understandably, horrified and very discouraged from going. Really, the WDW website does not prepare you for that. They say there is a virtual queue - so you think - oh right, great a virtual queue, I'l just join it whenever I get there (I have at least 2 sets of friends who thought this). Not realizing that you need to arrive like 60-90 minutes before park opening and have the quickest fingers in the west (or the east if you are in Florida) in order to score a boarding group. And that in the end it is still a lottery. There is no heads up on the WDW website or MDE app about any of this. It is way less accessible than one is led to believe.....

 

[blistex]

It's also not hard to check for FP as you are in the parks, or even just stay in the parks late and ride stuff during fireworks.

Just gonna go ahead and disagree with you there - it's not hard *for you* but it is hard for some people. I check FP in the parks constantly but someone less tech-savvy may find it very difficult. For us it actually is very difficult to stay in the parks late as we're traveling with two young kids who go to bed at 7 and even though we try to get out to the later stuff they are just done around 7:30. Some friends and I are going on a grown-up trip later this year so we can actually go out late or wait in lines without being pulled out for trips to the bathroom and I am going on FoP that trip no matter what, unless of course they close it which would totally be my luck!

 

[orangecuse]

So...we just left and did DHS Friday 2/28. It was awesome IME. We got BG 6 so very lucky but we rope dropped TSMM (10 min wait - we were in line for rope drop around 7:40) and I was able to pull 4th+ FP for every single ride but SDD (didn’t take them all but saw everything come up). We did AS2 x3, MFSR, TSMMx2, RotR, ToT, LM show, Racing Academy, and had an ADR at Sci Fi for lunch and left around 7. Everything was fast pass (except racing academy of course). We also had 2 infants with us (1 tall enough for As2, one not so our toddler did AS2 6 times because we took turns taking him). It seemed like a LOT of the crowd did not know how to use refresh and so being diligent with that paid off big time. We also found mobile order for Woodys lunch box to be pretty quick (10 minute wait maybe?) for dinner. Were the walkways miserable? Yes. But it seemed like for us at least we still got a ton done and it was our favorite day.

 

[Sarahslay]

Just gonna go ahead and disagree with you there - it's not hard *for you* but it is hard for some people. I check FP in the parks constantly but someone less tech-savvy may find it very difficult. For us it actually is very difficult to stay in the parks late as we're traveling with two young kids who go to bed at 7 and even though we try to get out to the later stuff they are just done around 7:30. Some friends and I are going on a grown-up trip later this year so we can actually go out late or wait in lines without being pulled out for trips to the bathroom and I am going on FoP that trip no matter what, unless of course they close it which would totally be my luck!

I have traveled with young kids, my youngest still can't hang past 8 so I get it, but there is still RD (because luck would have it, my kids wake up by 6am even on vacation along with my husband). There are also those handy FP booths in the parks, scan the band and look up FP, and even my mom, who texts like every key stroke could set off a bomb if she moves to fast, learned easily how to open the app and push the plus sign at the bottom to look for ADRs and FP. I had FP for DHS one day and she wasn't feeling that park (not a thrill ride kinda lady) so she said she was staying in the room to read and nap. Well, we were at BLT and she just couldn't sit still with MK in front of her so she grabbed 3 FP for herself for some calmer rides as she walked over around lunch lol. I got back and I was like "where were you?" and she's like "It really wasn't that hard to book those line skippy things once I actually looked at the app, so I went and had some fun".

I've ridden FOP a dozen times now, I'm sure you'll get on it no problem at all, I know you'll have a great time! I go on solo trips, trips with other adult family members, and with my kids alone (along with full family trips, but those are fewer) and they're all great and unique.

 

[Sarahslay]

The fp system works absolutely fine. Even for fop. We pull same day for that consistently. Just have to know when and how. The only ride we find difficult to get fps for is 7dmt and even that is doable.

I would say that 7DMT is the only one I've never gotten a day of FP for, which is fine since I usually don't ride that one all that often (usually only if I'm with my oldest DD or at an event like EMM or DAH). I do usually have that as a FP option at 60 days, I just usually use it on something else since I'm sure there is someone else/another family who would covet that FP way more than I do.

 

[ilovetotravel1977]

I'm really praying that by December Rise balances out. We are rope droppers, so that isn't an issue. It's the lottery of the boarding groups. Hoping it at least gets to FP status by then.

 

[Delilah1310]

I'm surprised they don't have more evening magic hours at DHS. I think it's just once a week right now, correct?

I would think, in theory, you would have two different sets of visitors - those up for park opening and rope dropping headliners ... but then some people could avoid trying for the headliners in the morning and go for those late evening hours with shorter wait times.
Basically allowing a portion of the rope drop crowd to opt for an evening visit with similar line-wait benefit ... which would make it less busy at rope drop.

Or is this not how it would work? Am I missing something?
I understand there are expenses to keeping to the park open later, but also it seems like it could go a long way to spreading out the headliner demand.

 

[wilkydelts]

Extreme morning crowds are a direct result of RotR Boarding Groups not headliners. So EMH hours would not alleviate this issue.

 

[Delilah1310]

but people stay and do headliners after trying for the boarding group, which makes the mornings crazy crowded at those headliner attractions, right?
if I knew I could the other headliners with shorter waits at night, I may just leave after trying for the BG.