Another discrimination WWYD

[we"reofftoneverland]

Who cares?

 

[LSUmiss]

Why? Not to be argumentative, but in my simple mind, male* = "attracted to female bodies", lesbian = "attracted to female bodies", therefore they're the same.

* Obviously heterosexual (or bisexual) male.

I’d be more afraid of the male being a pedophile.

 

[LSUmiss]

Because as a society we are pretty messed up on this subject in general. So much of what we have decided is the "norm" (i.e. men not overseeing girls locker rooms, pretty much most things about the LGBTQ community) is rooted in outdated and ill-conceived information. How many boys were assaulted by men in power positions over the years and yet there's no concern for putting men in charge of boys locker rooms? The history of the Boy Scouts and the Catholic church are pretty good examples of the flawed logic behind your question. The whole question is a tangled web.

Adults should be accountable for their actions and trustworthy to hold positions of authority in ANY capacity, regardless of gender, orientation, or any other category they might fall under.

I wouldn’t want one unsupervised male overseeing any of it for this reason. Men are more likely to be pedophiles than women.

 

[LSUmiss]

Never used the shower once ar any school. However, I was only there for PE.

As for the original subject, it’s hard know what one’s motives are. I know some parents/grandparents who are intensely afraid that a child being exposed to LGBT people will somehow increase the chance of that child being LGBT. Even some who don’t want someone LGBT to be a role model.

That was my thought. Even for sports, the showers had stalls in our school gym.

 

[cabanafrau]

You can't discriminate against someone that way unless you can prove that you follow every. single. other. rule from the bible.

I don't believe this is codified into law as you seem to claim.

 

[siren0119]

I wouldn’t want one unsupervised male overseeing any of it for this reason. Men are more likely to be pedophiles than women.

Statistically, that's not true. More men are CONVICTED of pedophilia than women, but don't confuse convictions with occurances. Psychological findings put the rough estimates of pedophilic attraction between 1 and 4% of males AND females.

 

[mumto3girls]

Just curious - did anyone ever shower in middle or high school and actually have someone watch them? In my limited personal experience the showers were in the same locker room as an "office" with an adult in it, but the adult didn't sit there and watch over the showers in any way.

Yes. In my middle school (grades 6-8) the gym teachers would decide towards the end of gym class if it was a day we needed to shower afterwards. The showers were a big open room with shower heads along 3 walls and hooks outside for our towels. We were supposed to go back to our lockers undress, grab our towels, walk to the showers, hang up our towels, and go in and shower. A teacher would “inspect” us on our way out, before grabbing our towels to be sure we were wet. I recall lots of shrieking and attempts to cover the important parts. LOL. It was ridiculous. No one used soap. We basically went in, stood under the shower head for a second trying not to get our hair wet and then ran out. Many times girls were deemed “not wet enough” and sent back to do it again. Pointless.

Fortunately there was none of that nonsense in high school. There were separate shower stalls with curtains and you could choose to shower or not.

My youngest is in middle school now. None of my kids have ever had to shower after gym.

I thought the “inspection” was a creepy power trip. I haven’t given it much thought over the years, but thinking about it today I still dislike those teachers that participated in it. One of the 3 was a known lesbian. I actually remember thinking she seemed more uncomfortable than the other 2 who seemed to kind of enjoy our embarrassment.

 

[LSUmiss]

Statistically, that's not true. More men are CONVICTED of pedophilia than women, but don't confuse convictions with occurances. Psychological findings put the rough estimates of pedophilic attraction between 1 and 4% of males AND females.

Then it would seem men are more likely act on that “attraction” so still more dangerous.

 

[cabanafrau]

Then it would seem men are more likely act on that “attraction” so still more dangerous.

I understand completely that it would seem that way. Years of watching what these kinds of cases look like and learning how these monsters operate have convinced me that they are very well aware of what things seem like -- and using it to their advantage to keep on being predators. Female predators have a huge advantage in this regard. Those same ideas also increase the burden of shame on victims who face incredible uphill struggles to be heard, to be believed -- and not to be further disrespected and disregarded for not being able to fend off a female.

 

[sam_gordon]

Then it would seem men are more likely act on that “attraction” so still more dangerous.

I don't think that's a logical conclusion. There are plenty of reasons why people aren't convicted of a given crime, just because more men are convicted doesn't mean they're more dangerous.

 

[siren0119]

Then it would seem men are more likely act on that “attraction” so still more dangerous.

Nope, they're just more likely to get caught. In that respect, FEMALE pedophiles are more dangerous because they're less likely to face consequences.

 

[LSUmiss]

Nope, they're just more likely to get caught. In that respect, FEMALE pedophiles are more dangerous because they're less likely to face consequences.

So how is the data collected then? I’m skeptical of that. To me the psychological findings of “attraction” seem based on ppl admitting their feelings which is different than acting on it. I just really find this hard to believe. I can see maybe even the concept that more men get caught b/c ppl are embarrassed to admit it was done to them by a female (maybe). But how do you explain that it’s always men who are caught in FBI stings with child porn internet type stings.

 

[siren0119]

So how is the data collected then? I’m skeptical of that. To me the psychological findings of “attraction” seem based on ppl admitting their feelings which is different than acting on it. I just really find this hard to believe. I can see maybe even the concept that more men get caught b/c ppl are embarrassed to admit it was done to them by a female (maybe). But how do you explain that it’s always men who are caught in FBI stings with child porn internet type stings.

You are basing your opinion on what is publicized by the media, and what you know from limited exposure. The scientific studies are generally a combination of psychological study participants, victim surveys and police records. If you TRULY want answers to your question, there are numerous scientific papers and abstracts published on the subject. If I have time later I'll link a few to get you started, but it's nothing a solid google search won't also turn up.

 

[LSUmiss]

You are basing your opinion on what is publicized by the media, and what you know from limited exposure. The scientific studies are generally a combination of psychological study participants, victim surveys and police records. If you TRULY want answers to your question, there are numerous scientific papers and abstracts published on the subject. If I have time later I'll link a few to get you started, but it's nothing a solid google search won't also turn up.

I do plan to research it b/c I find it very odd. I’ve worked in the criminal justice system & with abuse victims & this has just not been my experience. So I’m doubtful of how the data can even be collected if they’re not caught, not convicted & no one reports it. How is that possible? And far as the media, I would think it would be more sensational for them to report women.

 

[Moliphino]

Nope, they're just more likely to get caught. In that respect, FEMALE pedophiles are more dangerous because they're less likely to face consequences.

There's also the common idea that teen boys should enjoy any sexual attention from an older woman. They see it as the kid getting lucky rather than being abused.

 

[tzolkin]

There's also the common idea that teen boys should enjoy any sexual attention from an older woman. They see it as the kid getting lucky rather than being abused.

I get this scenario. And, you're absolutely correct that women are less likely to be viewed or sentenced as harshly as men in the same situation.

However, the other poster specifically was talking about pedophiles. A pedophile is someone who is attracted to pre-pubescent CHILDREN (under 13), so while people who sexually abuse older teens are also guilty of acts with minors they're not technically pedophiles.

I think that's what LSUmiss is having a hard time believing and, honestly, I am too. I'm willing to acknowledge that there are likely just as many women as men who are attracted to underage teens. But, I just don't think there are as many women pedophiles as there are male.

Obviously I recognize that a quick internet search is not totally reliable data, but I just found that one study estimates male child molesters outnumber female by 10 to 1. Another study indicated that 14% of pedophile victims had a female perpetrator, but that frequently this abuse was carried out in collaboration with a male partner (so the female may have been an accomplice, but not the instigator/one with the sexual attraction to children). I also did find the statistic that a previous poster was referring to that states that the rate of attraction is 1-4% in both men and women, but it states that they are referring to attraction to anyone between the ages of 6-17. That's a wide range and does not technically meet the definition of a pedophile.

 

[Mermaid02]

As long as they are a good person and a good coach I don't see the issue.

 

[bcla]

That was my thought. Even for sports, the showers had stalls in our school gym.

My junior high and high schools had open showers next the the lockers. This style with four heads on a post. We had several in the same shower room, but there simply wasn't enough time to use them. I think they were only used by organized sports.

I'm not someone who particularly likes open locker rooms or shower rooms. I might have only taken a single shower in my entire life at one (at a pool shower room) and I kept my swimwear on as long as possible.