American College of Pediatricians issues Gardasil concern
- Thread starter Disneychick75
- Start date
ronandannette
I gave myself this tag and I "Like" myself too!
- Joined
- May 4, 2006
mommysaurus
Mouseketeer
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2016
Admittedly I haven't read the whole thread so I'm not sure if it has been mentioned but these two comments on the first page stood out to me. I had the vaccine in my 20's when it first came out. I was at the very top end of the recommended age range. I have successfully conceived a child without even trying for one. I know I can't be the only one. Gardasil was FDA approved in 2006 so there should be a fairly decent amount of people who had the vaccine and are of a child bearing age?
littleblackegg
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Sep 6, 2014
The cohort of women who have received the vaccine is massive. More than adequate for data collection. Even if there were 100 people who experienced premature menopause, it wouldn't be statistically significant. A major research project would need to occur to tie Gardasil to this condition. And hey, 100% of people who receive the MMR vaccine will die.
Magpie
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Oct 27, 2007
I'll see your lemming and raise you a mouse lemur!
ronandannette
I gave myself this tag and I "Like" myself too!
- Joined
- May 4, 2006
I'll see your lemming and raise you a mouse lemur!
I fold...those googly eyes - squee!
maelstrom
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2006
I got the first shot in the Gardasil series as an adult, even though I already had/have a strain of HPV (one of the cancer-causing strains, which has been fun). I was forced into it as an adult by a nasty, inconsiderate, rude, dismissive, intimidating doctor. I threw up and felt weak & dizzy before ever leaving the office. I never went back for the subsequent shots; I was in a monogamous relationship with my now-husband and, as I said, already had (at least) one strain of HPV; and after how I felt after the first shot, I wasn't going back for more.
I am still battling the cervical issues that have come up due to the HPV. I've had numerous pap smears and cervical biopsies, as well as a LEEP procedure (this is where they literally cut & burn away a chunk of your cervix). The LEEP did not end with clear margins so my pap smears still come back "bad" and I've been urged to have more cervical biopsies and likely LEEP procedures, which I'm really just not interested in. I firmly believe that I have PTSD due to the trauma of everything that went on, including the procedures themselves and the doctors who performed them. I have yet to meet a gyn who understands how absolutely disgusting and invasive I find these procedures to be and understands the mental toll they take on me. (/ side rant)
All of that said, I don't think that I could in good conscience let my (hypothetical) daughter receive this vaccine. I got sick from it, but entirely too many other girls and women have gotten way sicker from it. This vaccine was released prematurely and needed more testing. I want to see what the long-term results are when all of the 12-year-old girls who are getting it now grow up and try to reproduce, etc. I'm not an anti-vaxxer by any means; my future hypothetical children will definitely be vaccinated against polio, mumps, rubella, measles, whooping cough, chicken pox, etc. But I don't think this HPV vaccine is a good idea right now. And I say that as someone with HPV and who has had a lot of trauma relating to it.
I am still battling the cervical issues that have come up due to the HPV. I've had numerous pap smears and cervical biopsies, as well as a LEEP procedure (this is where they literally cut & burn away a chunk of your cervix). The LEEP did not end with clear margins so my pap smears still come back "bad" and I've been urged to have more cervical biopsies and likely LEEP procedures, which I'm really just not interested in. I firmly believe that I have PTSD due to the trauma of everything that went on, including the procedures themselves and the doctors who performed them. I have yet to meet a gyn who understands how absolutely disgusting and invasive I find these procedures to be and understands the mental toll they take on me. (/ side rant)
All of that said, I don't think that I could in good conscience let my (hypothetical) daughter receive this vaccine. I got sick from it, but entirely too many other girls and women have gotten way sicker from it. This vaccine was released prematurely and needed more testing. I want to see what the long-term results are when all of the 12-year-old girls who are getting it now grow up and try to reproduce, etc. I'm not an anti-vaxxer by any means; my future hypothetical children will definitely be vaccinated against polio, mumps, rubella, measles, whooping cough, chicken pox, etc. But I don't think this HPV vaccine is a good idea right now. And I say that as someone with HPV and who has had a lot of trauma relating to it.
roseaster
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2013
You appear very young, and I get the trauma, but the thing I would like to ask and reinforce is that you know that women DIE of cervical cancer? Honestly it is quite alarming that you say that you "not interested in" further treatment.
It is certainly your choice as to whether, or not, you wish to seek treatment, but this is not something to take lightly. I am a nurse. I've been a nurse for a very long time. I have seen young women die of this disease. It was not an easy death.
The other concern is about "hypothetical children." While the jury is out on the validity of the study that was linked in the OP, it has definitely been proven that cervical cancer DOES absolutely cause fertility problems. My very best friend growing up had cervical dysplasia. She, too, had to have multiple procedures and is unable to have children. She has had multiple miscarriages because her cervix is no longer strong enough to hold a pregnancy, even on bed rest. Obviously you know the longer that it goes untreated, the farther it spreads, and the more tissue that has to be removed. Possibly even a hysterectomy.
I recognize that not all doctors are great, or personable, but if you do intend to have children in the future, or you intend to have a future, you need to be treated.
The missed point, here, is that if HPV had been prevented, none of this would even be an issue.
To me, nausea and dizziness are really very minor issues compared to life threatening cancer.
FTR, I have 4 girls. All who have been vaccinated and the only adverse reactions they have had are sore arms.
maelstrom
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2006
As I said, I already was dealing with HPV before there was ever a vaccine. There was no preventing HPV for me. I had no way of knowing that my boyfriend at the time was a carrier, and there was no vaccine. I got a PAP every year, and everything was fine until it wasn't.
I'm not gung-ho about having children. I'd rather have a hysterectomy and put this behind me than have children, to make my feelings clear.
I'm 30 years old (young, but not so young) and I've been dealing with this for a decade. I am aware that women can and have died from cervical cancer. I currently do not fall under the cancer banner; just abnormal cervical cells for the current time. That's where I stand at the moment.
My cousin is in the same boat as me and has had 3 children with no issue. I realize that this is not everyone's experience, but it does show that it is definitely possible. Not that I take that as "oh, yeah, of course that'll be my case too", just pointing out that it is possible.
My mother and mother-in-law are both nurses and I get the lectures more than I care to.
Truth be told, I would rather have a hysterectomy than be sliced and diced and burned by a thoughtless doctor who does not understand my feelings and mental state and brushes me off when I mention that I have PTSD from all of this and acts like my feelings don't matter, than to try to "treat" it so that I can *maybe* pop out a kid. A doctor who deals in issues like this *needs* to be personable and caring and understanding. I have yet to meet one who is, and that is so sad. When you are literally BURNING away a woman's private parts, you need to be considerate; if you can't be, it may be time to find a different specialty.
I appreciate your caring and your well thoughts and wishes.
roseaster
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2013
I understand, truly. I am 45 and in the last few weeks of a high risk unplanned pregnancy. I do know that not all OBGYNs are created equally. I've experienced it and witnessed it. I just wouldn't want anyone to make a life altering decision based on a bad experience.
What I meant by prevention. I realize that your situation couldn't be prevented, but if a vaccine could prevent your child, or anyone's child, or, really, anyone from going through what you have gone through, I think it would be worth the price of transient dizziness and nausea.
I really do hope that you can find an OBGYN with some compassion whom you can trust.
What I meant by prevention. I realize that your situation couldn't be prevented, but if a vaccine could prevent your child, or anyone's child, or, really, anyone from going through what you have gone through, I think it would be worth the price of transient dizziness and nausea.
I really do hope that you can find an OBGYN with some compassion whom you can trust.
I hope hope you find the right doctor for you. If you lived close I would recommend my ob. She is incredibly kind and understanding and when we decided enough with fertility treatments she hugged me and told me how sorry she was it didn't work for us. All the doctors in her practice are women and I think it does make a difference although the ob I used for my first dd was a man. Who has since left practicing. I had a great experience with him even though the pregnancy was not so great
Magpie
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Oct 27, 2007
Due to some confusion in paperwork, my son was 12 before he got his final shot for measles, mumps and rubella. It made him sick for days. Fever, swelling, pain... I'm still glad he got it, though.
My daughter got her HPV shots in middle school, and sailed through, along with her classmates, with no side effects. She is now almost 20.
Everyone is different, and side effects are a risk we take with every vaccine, knowing that the benefits outweigh that risk. I'm sorry you were traumatized. In my neck of the woods, we don't give the shot to anyone who is sexually active. We give it before.
Please take care.
gemini2727
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2009
I feel horrible for you that you have gone through so much, and wish you luck finding a more compassionate ob/gyn,
but I'm confused by your conclusion that you wouldn't get the vaccine for any hypothetical children you might have?
Your trauma seems to stem from the diagnostics and treatment of your HPV, not so much from the temporary side effects of the vaccine. Wouldn't you try to avoid all of that if you could by getting them vaccinated?
mefordis
If you can dream it, you can do it.
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2006
Thanks for speaking up. It's very brave since there are people who make a living pushing this poison who will be quick to discredit you. You will save a few lives by doing this, no doubt.
I have also read that the vaccine has no efficacy in women who have already been exposed to the two cancer-causing strains included in the vaccine. In fact, these women may have a greater risk of developing cervical cancer.
I'd say keep doing your research and reading other people's experiences, and go with your gut. This vaccine has a HUGE black eye and one day people will wake up and it will be pulled off the market, much like the swine flu vaccine was in the 70's, as well as small pox vaccine and oral polio vaccine was also in the US.
Pulling myself away from this thread and blocking the vaccine pushers as I just cannot read anymore propaganda any longer. Peace out and I really hope your family sails through these injections without incident.
Oh, one more thing: if the CDC can lie about the swine flu vaccine, why wouldn't they lie about others?
CBS "60 MINUTES" documentary on the swine flu epidemics of 1976 in the U.S. It went on air only once and was never shown again.
In this stunning video interview done by Mike Wallace, you will hear that:
1) The CDC did NOT test the actual vaccine that ultimately went to 46 millions Americans (X-53).
2) The vaccine killed hundreds of people and permanently maimed/injured several thousands in America.
3) The public was NOT warned about the possible permanant neurological sicknesses that could result from taking the shot.
4) The CDC knew that the shot was dangerous but did NOT put this information on the waivers that people would sign before getting the shot.
5) The entire vaccine campaign was ordered and started BEFORE any confirmed case of swine flu was actually found.
6) The actual only confirmed flu case that was deadly (and this is dubious since the soldier refused a sick bed order), was one soldier who had the flu and collapsed on a forced march, all other soldiers, four of them, were back to normal within days without getting a shot.
7) The CDC freely used the names of well-known movie stars without their permission to launch the campaign successfully, including Mary Tyler Moore.
8) Mary Tyler Moore did NOT take the shot, although the CDC said she did. She wisely said "NO" because she suspected it was not healthy. Her doctor ultimately agreed.
9) Dr. Sencer, head of the CDC at the time, ordered the campaign as well as the advertising for it, and not once was any danger mentioned in any of the literature!
10) The CDC LIED to the public to sell a vaccination campaign, and Mike Wallace nailed the head in this interview, as Dr. Sencer is left squirming in his chair!
Last edited:
Geoff_M
DIS Veteran, DVC Member, "Cum Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc
- Joined
- Sep 13, 2000
Actually, I wouldn't be that kind in that assessment. The press release doesn't even contain any new information. The two primary studies they cite were published in 2013 and 2014. They've just regurgitated them in a effort to try and keep the "controversy" alive and to try and make people think that this is somehow new. As for the two studies themselves, they were from 2013 and 2014 (and the 2014 studies was largely a rehash of a study they two authors released in 2012). In both cases they are "case studies". A case study is where researchers find examples of patients that fit their hypothesis and then try to offer speculative arguments as to why their findings are likely correct. Medscape observed this about case studies in medicine: while they still have a place in medicine "their anecdotal nature lacks the scientific rigour of large, well conducted studies, and they have therefore fallen down the hierarchical ladder of medical evidence." In another words, case studies are basically a collection of anecdotes. Often times, they are the studies of last resort for people that cannot prove their points via more accepted means.
And in these cases, each of the two primary studies that ACoP offers is a collection of three anecdotal subjects each. That's right, their "findings" were supported by only three young women each. In Colafrancesco, et al, two of the three cases were sisters! This is a bit odd since it is known that POF can have a genetic link. As for the speculation, there's plenty of it to be found. Dr. David Gorski does a excellent take down of both sets of authors:
Ovarian failure caused by Gardasil? Not so fast…
Antivaccinationists against the HPV vaccine, Round 5,000
Additionally, as for Little & Ward, Gorski found that they are also members of what in effect is an ideological "sister" group to the ACoP in Australia. This didn't surprise him as "I intentionally concentrated on the biased and utterly speculative nature of this particular case report, which was so speculative and biased that the editors of BMJ Case Reports should hang their heads in shame for having published such twaddle. What I didn’t mention (although I thought about mentioning it) is that whenever you see a publication as bad as Little and Ward’s case report, it’s at least 95% likely that the authors have a serious axe to grind and that they are publishing because of ideology leading them to twist the case report or data to fit rather than having their conclusions flow naturally from the data."
Lastly, I don't have the time necessary to point out all of the misinformation posted above regarding the 1976 Swine Flu Vaccine debacle (and it certainly was), but here's some good articles where people can fact-check for themselves from the LA Times, Medscape, Pacific Standard, and CDC that offer a fuller perspective of what did (or didn't) happen back then after 40 years of additional insight after Mike Wallace was playing "gotcha" with CDC staffers:
LA Times: Swine flu 'debacle' of 1976 is recalled
PubMed: Swine influenza A at Fort Dix, New Jersey (January-February 1976). III. Extent of spread and duration of the outbreak.
Medscape: Influenza Vaccine and Guillain-Barré Syndrome—Is There a Risk?
Pacific Standard: The Swine Flu Vaccine: 1976 Casts a Giant Shadow
CDC: Reflections on the 1976 Swine Flu Vaccination Program
Last edited:
I continue to be confused, although sympathetic, especially since someone close to me has had to endure many of the same treatments. If you could go back in time to before you contracted HPV and prevent it by taking the vaccine, you could have avoided all the misery and painful treatment you have suffered. I just can't see why anyone wouldn't trade dizziness and nausea that may follow a shot to escape all that. The young woman I know would certainly go back in time and get the vaccine if it meant she could avoid getting HPV and avoid all the medical treatment which results. If anything, it seems like enduring what you have would have made you wish you could have gotten the vaccine and avoided the disease entirely. That's why I'm confused. At any rate, I am sorry for what you have been through.
If I had been within the age range approved to take the vaccine, I 100% would have. Instead, I had to endure the pain and monetary expense of treatment even after being monogamous and getting tested with each of my (very few) partners. Not to mention the hassle it caused at work when I had to have emergency surgery after I suffered a known but rare complication following a LEEP that ultimately resulted in me being placed into a different position.
smokeyblue
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2009
This subject is just so gutting to me; this is a curable cancer and possibly preventable with this vaccine. I used to work on a general surgery unit. Once in awhile we would have young women who due to their economic situation hadn't had routine gynecologic care and had developed cervical cancer. Usually it seemed like it was a recurrence of the cancer that would take them down. Seeing a woman in her mid-30's to early 40's just absolutely ravaged by disease was haunting.
The truth is anyone can contract HPV and statistics show that more of us have it than don't. Just because we may only have one partner or may be "careful", that doesn't mean our partner has the same history. I don't begrudge anyone their right to make a choice about vaccines, but if I had children, they would be getting this one.
The truth is anyone can contract HPV and statistics show that more of us have it than don't. Just because we may only have one partner or may be "careful", that doesn't mean our partner has the same history. I don't begrudge anyone their right to make a choice about vaccines, but if I had children, they would be getting this one.
Disneychick75
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Jan 19, 2014
I don't happen to hold with that particular belief held by the American College of Pediatricians. Saw the article, thought it was interesting, and posted it.
Aren't you a doctor? Do you believe and listen to 100% of what the AM, FDA and CDC publish? I'm not talking about vaccines in particular. My point is a site can have compelling information even if we don't happen to agree with everything posted on the site. Lord knows we come to the Dis and get good information about touring Disney even though we do not agree with everything posted here.
Share this page
GET A DISNEY VACATION QUOTE
Our Dreams Unlimited Travel Agents will assist you in booking the perfect Disney getaway, all at no extra cost to you. Get the most out of your vacation by letting us assist you with dining and park reservations, provide expert advice, answer any questions, and continuously search for discounts to ensure you get the best deal possible.
CLICK HERE
