All DVC Member Cruise Complaints/Concerns Post Here

[HookdonWDW]

Just an observation: The Moderator stated that this thread was started in order for people to voice their DVC Cruise Complaints/Concerns. Then, I started reading posts, and all I saw was a lot of defense of the cruise. That doesn't seem to be the original intent of this thread. It's one thing to respond to specific points of posts, but this isn't what I am seeing. ::end of observation::

MPO is that if you want to spend your points on this cruise, feel free. As members of DVC, we chose not to participate in this cruise, because we can keep our original cruise plans for October and save enough points to cover a few days at a WDW before/after our cruise. Different strokes for different folks. I'm sure you'll all have fun, as will we.

I am concerned that DVC is being seen as a way to make up for the lack of sales that Disney is experiencing as a whole. IMHO, this cruise was a great way to fill up a boat that probably would have sailed half full, as well as adding people to the boats before/after this cruise by shifting the people who had originally booked this date.

This also means that there are now quite a few points that have been turned over to DVD just from people cruising on this boat. (In addition to the "normal" trading that takes place each year)I'm not an expert on how it works, but I do wonder if this means that DVD will be able to hold onto more rooms during peak holiday times (Easter, 4th of July, Thanksgiving, etc...) when both "paying customers" and DVC members are sometimes unable to find the rooms they want. Due to timing of the sale of the cruise, we probably won't see any effect until Fall 2003. Will I be able to get the room I want during the Food & Wine Festival and Christmas next year? Will 7 month reservations become even harder to come by?

My next thought is for those going on the cruise. Many of those who are going have plenty of points, are paying cash, or are using cash and points. I have read posts from others who have now banked and borrowed to have the points for this cruise. They want to go on this "Special" cruise. Now, I realize that it's futile to try to control what others do, nor is it something I particularly want to do, but I wonder if we will see quite a few more DVC contracts on the resale market, because people are making dues payments/monthly payments, and are tapped out on points for the next couple of years. Will the cruise seem worth it then? And if there is a sudden glut of contracts on the market, will it lower the buyback point?

Please don't take this as a slam of the cruise or the people going on the cruise. As I said, I'm sure the cruise will be fun, and I'm sure that people will have a great time. We plan on using points to go to DLP, and I know that many on this board would never dream of "wasting" their points in this manner. As I said, these are just my concerns...

 

[Crissup]

Originally posted by HookdonWDW
This also means that there are now quite a few points that have been turned over to DVD just from people cruising on this boat. (In addition to the "normal" trading that takes place each year)I'm not an expert on how it works, but I do wonder if this means that DVD will be able to hold onto more rooms during peak holiday times (Easter, 4th of July, Thanksgiving, etc...) when both "paying customers" and DVC members are sometimes unable to find the rooms they want. Due to timing of the sale of the cruise, we probably won't see any effect until Fall 2003. Will I be able to get the room I want during the Food & Wine Festival and Christmas next year? Will 7 month reservations become even harder to come by?

Actually, I don't think DVD has anything to do with this deal. This deal is between DVC and DCL. It would not be in DCL's best interest to hang onto these points. They will be rented out to cash paying customers.

I see this as DVC offered us something that we don't normally have. If we wish to partake, then we can. If not, then we don't have to. As long as we are not forced to participate, I don't see the problem.

 

[HookdonWDW]

Originally posted by Crissup


Actually, I don't think DVD has anything to do with this deal. This deal is between DVC and DCL. It would not be in DCL's best interest to hang onto these points. They will be rented out to cash paying customers.

I see this as DVC offered us something that we don't normally have. If we wish to partake, then we can. If not, then we don't have to. As long as we are not forced to participate, I don't see the problem.

I believe that DVD controls the points in DVC that are rented out to cash paying customers. I never thought that DCL would hold onto the points. I believe that DVD pays DCL for the rooms on the cruise. If my assumptions are correct, DVD would be involved because they control those points once they are used for the cruise. If I used DVD where I should have used DVC, I type corrected. Please excuse me, and change out all of the "DVD"'s in my post for "DVC"'s

Secondly, the fact that the points would be rented to cash paying customers is exactly what I was questioning. The question remains... if this is true, how will this affect the ability of DVC members to make point reservations during peak times? Will a higher number of rooms be assigned on a cash basis, making it more difficult to book rooms starting next fall, especially at the 7 month mark?

Also, I believe I stated that everyone has the right to use their points as they choose, SEVERAL TIMES in my post. I just wanted to discuss the possible ramifications of bulk point-usage on room availability.

 

[CarolAnnC]

It seems to me that the ship full of 2,700+ DVC members are using their points (and cash for some) for a cruise here instead of booking up DVC Rooms with them. So there probably will be a greater chance of getting that particular time and/or room that you may desire....

 

[Crissup]

Originally posted by HookdonWDW
Secondly, the fact that the points would be rented to cash paying customers is exactly what I was questioning. The question remains... if this is true, how will this affect the ability of DVC members to make point reservations during peak times? Will a higher number of rooms be assigned on a cash basis, making it more difficult to book rooms starting next fall, especially at the 7 month mark?

Let's assume there are 100,000 points available in DVC (obviously, a grossly understated figure, but for the purpose of example). That means that there are 100,000 points available to use on room rentals. Now, 50,000 of those points get used to trade into DCL. DCL can rent those points out to cash paying customers as they wish. But, that wouldn't necessarily affect room availability. There are still a total of 100,000 points out there and only 50%, the percentage that was traded, are available to cahs customers. I only see this being a problem if there is a significant difference in the time frames that DVC members normally like to vacation vs cash paying customers. That would upset the scales a bit, but I don't believe it would cause more than a ripple in the system.

Originally posted by HookdonWDW
Also, I believe I stated that everyone has the right to use their points as they choose, SEVERAL TIMES in my post. I just wanted to discuss the possible ramifications of bulk point-usage on room availability.

You're correct, you did mention that SEVERAL TIMES in your post. I just chose to mention my opinion in my post once.

 

[CarolAnnC]

IMHO, this cruise was a great way to fill up a boat that probably would have sailed half full, as well as adding people to the boats before/after this cruise by shifting the people who had originally booked this date.

For those who may not be aware of the immense popularity of the Disney Cruises, I would just like to clarify here that almost all of the cruises on the Wonder and the Magic sail at or near full capacity. DCL does not have any problem filling their ships at all - even in the least desirable hurricane season. Just an FYI to keep the facts straight here folks. Now on with your regularly scheduled programming.....

 

[dbond]

Have any of you priced other cruise ships lately in comparison to DCL prices. A 7-day Western Caribbean on DCL in March is running roughly $1200 higher than the same cruise on RCCL's Voyager of the Seas, their largest ship. DCL however, is not having a problem filling up that ship, why would they need to discount a cruise for DVC'ers when they could have filled the ship themselves. So, I think the perk for DVC'ers is actually the fact that they have the whole ship to themselves. There will be DVC CM's on board specifically to entertain you, the DVC member. All of the DCL staff will know who you are, and will treat you accordingly. But for those of you who expected discounts, why should DCL be willing to give up a sailing at a discount, they would be losing money if they did and they are not in the business of losing money. And how could DVC afford to take up the slack and offer members a discount and cover those costs they have to DCL themselves. If that were the case, every member, even those of us that chose not to go would then have to assist in the cost of covering that loss. DCL & DVC are separate entities and they both have to make what they consider smart business decisions. The believed that offering this to members was a smart decision, albeit I'm sure a risk, but they took the risk and constructed the costs so as not to lose their shirts in the process. DCL was willing to take a risk of losing an entire sailing but lo and behold the members stepped up and booked, and then DVC looks great in the eyes of DCL, their members came through as planned. It can only be the start of better things possible down the road, hopefully

 

[HookdonWDW]

Originally posted by CarolAnnK
It seems to me that the ship full of 2,700+ DVC members are using their points (and cash for some) for a cruise here instead of booking up DVC Rooms with them. So there probably will be a greater chance of getting that particular time and/or room that you may desire....

I know that those people won't be using their points at the DVC Resorts, since they were spent on the cruise. That's what inspired my question.

If 200,000 points (fictitious number) are used on this cruise, how does DVC/DVD decide when to sell them as cash ressies? Do Feb. Use Year points get used in Feb, August points in August and so on, or can DVD simply hold aside more rooms in the more desirable times of the year? If DVC/DVD can use the points whenever, doesn't this lead to the possiblity of fewer points being available during peak periods (ie. 20% of the rooms that are available on points at Thanksgiving on points are now cash ressies)? Does DVC/DVD have to offer these points for cash reservations during their original use year?

I know that people routinely use their points for things other than stays at a DVC resort, but I don't believe that this amount of points has ever been traded for one event in the past. I'm just curious on what effect (if any) this will have on ressies (especially at 7 months).

 

[HookdonWDW]

Originally posted by CarolAnnK


For those who may not be aware of the immense popularity of the Disney Cruises, I would just like to clarify here that almost all of the cruises on the Wonder and the Magic sail at or near full capacity. DCL does not have any problem filling their ships at all - even in the least desirable hurricane season. Just an FYI to keep the facts straight here folks. Now on with your regularly scheduled programming.....

To say that DCL is sailing at or near capacity on all cruises, and has no problem filling ships may be misleading IMO. If you check on Expedia, you can still find cabins available for September 4 day Magic Cruises in every category that they book (Cat. 4-11). In 5 out of the 8 categories, you get the max # of room choices, which is 8. In a quick 5 minute check, I identified over 60 cabins that were empty in a cruise 2 weeks from now. I'm pretty sure that I didn't figure out all of the empty cabins in my quick search . Additionally, Expedia offers the DCL at a reduced rate. I found Disney cruises at up to 50% off of the list price for the cruise. How many of the rooms that DCL sells are sold at these reduced rates?

DCL definitely offers a great cruise for your money, and I'm planning to cruise with them next year myself. I just think that when we look at the larger picture, that DCL is getting a great deal. They've filled up an entire ship at a higher-than-advertised price. There's not an empty room or a discounted room on the entire ship. My Economics professor would have been proud!

 

[CarolAnnC]

Rest assured, we at the DIS would never "mislead" our posters. The owner of Dreams Unlimited Travel, Pete Werner, also owns these DIScussion boards. Myself and TnRobin moderate the Cruise Board as well as the DVC Board here. So we pride ourselves on having access to up-to-the minute cruise details.

In fact, if there were only 60 available rooms on a September cruise that would be fabulous!! There are 877 staterooms on board, so a 90%+ sailing capacity in Hurricane Season is fantastic!!

For anyone interested in reading all about Disney Cruises, you may want to visit our DIS Cruise Board. Here is the link to get you on there. Enjoy!!

click here to view the Cruise Board

 

[RobDoc]

Just for clarification...

My understanding of how DVC points are used is that all Disney reservations are in a pool of rooms accessed by CRO and WDTC.

Once DVC points are used for a non-DVC reservation an appropriate number of villa nights are placed in this pool and are accessed by CRO/WDTC for cash reservations. They are not controlled by DVC or DVD at that point. I suppose they could also be used at non-DVC resorts in the same fashion DVC members can use them.

If these same points were used by DVC members at their home resorts, there would be a similar demand placed on DVC resort reservations, so the fact that they are now available for cash reservations should make little difference on other member's ability for point reservations. The points will still be subject to normal expiration deadlines.

With the number of discounted rooms available at WDW at this time, I expect that the CRO pool may be on the short side of the financial aspect of this member's cruise since they may have difficulty renting rooms reserved with those points for enough to cover the expenses paid to DCL.

The "pool" referred to above is more of an internal accounting system where credits are shifted to all resort and cruise participants based on the occupancy reserved. DVC resorts are on a slightly different basis, since the resort operating budgets are already covered by our dues.

I don't think points released to CRO/WDTC will affect member's ability to reserve in any negative fashion at all.

 

[KarenNY]

My only complaint is- I'm not going

 

[j6010]

Carol,

Have followed this issue for awhile.

Just to keep perspective -- I am now in Bahrain (on the Persian Gulf and about 250 miles se of Iraq). Family is in U.S. I expect to be here awhile. I would like to go on any DCL cruise, esp. DVC cruise this next year with DVC members -- regardless of points, upgrades, cabins, etc. etc. etc.

BUT IT AINT GOING TO HAPPEN!!

Any cruise I go on this next year will be in a lot warmer and more arid weather. Ship wont be nearly as comfortable either.

Just to keep perspective -- sometimes you dont realize how blessed you are, until what you have had is now gone.

In listening to the complaints about the increased points (yes, DIS made a mistake in charging DVC members more), just remember that it is a blessing to be able to go on this vacation at any cost, and a blessing that DVC members have the option on going on the DCL members only cruise at all.

As I sit over here for a long while, (unfortunately including Thanksgiving and Xmas), I will reminisce about the times at WDW and the one trip with my family on the Wonder. Hopefully, one day (it will be in the distant future) my family and I can go.

V/R
j6010

 

[Beth]

God Bless you and your family, j6010.
Thank you for "putting it all in perspective" for us.

 

[WDWLVR]

J6010 - Thank you, thank you, thank you. You have done a wonderful job of putting things in perspective for all of us.

We are going on the cruise and I can thank you and many others like you for making it possible by defending our freedom.

Blessings to you, your family and all you serve with.

 

[CarolAnnC]

Thank you so much j6010 for sharing your thoughtful reflections with us.

I gained my own personal perspective two years ago when my husband died suddenly at a young age, leaving me to finish raising my two daughters alone. We had bought into DVC 3 years prior to his death and thank God, we were able to make some wonderful memories with him for my daughters to cherish.

I hope that you are able to rejoin your family in the near future, and also make some more wonderful memories with them.

God Bless you for making the sacrifice to give us all safety and freedom here in the U.S.

 

[ncligs]

Just booked a 4 day Cruise (Wonder) for Feb 2004. I checked with DVC points for a catagory 7 with veranda, it was 143 pts each. So if I would have went through DVC,using points, it would have been 286 pts for DW and myself
I booked it on-line through DreamsUnlimited, got the early booking special, $50 rebate, and $50 on-board credit. So the total for our 4 day cruise using cash is $1400. Now I see why most people use $$ instead of points to go cruising.
We are not going to rent any of our points, but I can see how some people would rent them out, and use the money for the Cruise. If I would have rented out just 143 points it would have paid for the cruise for 2 people, and DVC wants 286 pts for 2 adults for this 4 day cruise???

P.S. Now I see what fellow DVC'ers (Johnny Fedora and Deerh) are upset about.If points for cruising, keep going up every year, using points to cruise is not very wise.

 

[j6010]

Carol and others,

Thank you, and Carol especially thank you for remaining kind (and not bitter) after the loss of your husband.

I send greetings from Bahrain.


V/R
j6010

 

[Johnnie Fedora]

It's important to remember that very few of us really know each other or the personal strife that each of us struggle with...past, present and future. We can only guess from the manner in which someone expresses themself cyberly.

Having said that, I think 99.99% of the posts on the DIS (positive and negative) would be inconsequential to someone truly suffering personal loss or facing immenant military conflict.

Individuals with strongly differing opinions can still have the same things very well in perspective.

Speaking for myself, I'd trade all my DVC points for the next 40 years if I could guarantee my family wellness, safety, security, happiness, joy and love for the rest of their lives.

I think most of us would agree that we use DVC/trip planning/DIS postings as an escape from reality. Nothing wrong with that. I'd just like to see the whole DVC program retain it's value over time. And in my opinion, it hasn't over the short run (the member cruise is just one example). I'd like to use DVC as my personal escape well into the future. I look forward to many happy vacation memories for my family.

J6101: I wish you a safe return, and I hope you will be able to enjoy your DVC vacations sooner rather than later. You and all our military service personel are in our thoughts and prayers.

CarolAnnK: I'm sorry to learn of your husband. I hope you have found all the needed comfort to cope with that loss.

Ncligs: I'm glad my opinions where able to help you save your points for lots of extra OKW and VB vacations--rather than trading them all for one 4-day vacation. I'm sure you will enjoy all your trips.

Disney Corp: I hope you can gain some perspective too and realize that sometimes it might be nice to stop treating DVCers as an endless revenue stream that will pay anything for all things DVC/Disney. I know this DVCer won't.

Like the DVC resorts...Like Disney vacations...Don't like being taken for granted.

JMHO....Johnnie

 

[Regina]

j6010, I can't tell you how amazed I am that you found the time to comment on this discussion. It's much appreciated.

Please know that I'll be praying for your safe return.