Airtran- is it worth it to pay for seats?

[majorbulk]

I am traveling with my 3 year old on AirTran. So, a 3 year old is not allowed to travel without an adult (seems obvious to me). So is it true that AirTran may seat us apart unless we pay for specific seat assignments? Wouldn't that be traveling without the adult? First off, I don't care if I am sitting in an aisle or middle or at the back or the front or where-ever. Don't care. But, I don't see how AirTran can legally seat a 3 year-old without a parent/guardian. I'm not trying to take away someone else's seat who paid for their seat. I just don't see how AirTran can separate us if it violates their policy to do so... When my child is 6 or maybe 5, I can see how it is a luxury to be seated next to each other, but a 3 year old would likely not follow instructions as her vocabulary is very limited . On AirTran's web site, there are exceptions for those with all kinds of disabilities. If you had an adult with the mental capacity of a 3 year old that would definitely qualify right? So why not an actual 3-year old? I think if Airtran can't seat a toddler next to their guardian, they should not be taking my money for the ticket. There must be a line here somewhere right? Would Airtran seat an infant without a parent next to them?

 

[kaytieeldr]

I am traveling with my 3 year old on AirTran. So, a 3 year old is not allowed to travel without an adult (seems obvious to me). So is it true that AirTran may seat us apart unless we pay for specific seat assignments?

You've read AirTran's policies. Rather than play "what if" and "they should", simply comply with their policy. If you wish to choose your seats when you purchase your tickets and consider it merely part of the cost of traveling, do so. If you're willing to risk being seated apart from any/all your travel companions during the flight, check in at exactly 24 hours before departure and select from the remaining available seats, go ahead.

Since you will be on the same enclosed and securely sealed airplane as your three year old, that child will not be traveling without an adult. It's not reasonable for the adult to make a concious decision to refuse to pay for seat selection then expect the airline or other passengers to kowtow to them.

 

[sam_gordon]

I am traveling with my 3 year old on AirTran. So, a 3 year old is not allowed to travel without an adult (seems obvious to me).

Your first sentence has nothing to do with your second sentence. If you found somewhere about a 3 yo needing to travel with an adult, I wonder if that's concerning traveling as an "unaccompanied minor".

So is it true that AirTran may seat us apart unless we pay for specific seat assignments? Wouldn't that be traveling without the adult?

Yes, and no.

First off, I don't care if I am sitting in an aisle or middle or at the back or the front or where-ever. Don't care. But, I don't see how AirTran can legally seat a 3 year-old without a parent/guardian.

OK. What law says they must seat a 3 year old with an adult?

I'm not trying to take away someone else's seat who paid for their seat.

Um, yes you are. Here's the situation... enough people paid for seats so there are no "two adjacent seats together". So you want someone who paid for their seat to move so you can sit with your 3yo. How is that not "trying to take away someone's seat".

I just don't see how AirTran can separate us if it violates their policy to do so...

Can you please post the part of their policy that shows kids must sit with their parents?

I think if Airtran can't seat a toddler next to their guardian, they should not be taking my money for the ticket.

I think if a parent MUST sit next to their children, they can pay for seat selection.

There must be a line here somewhere right?

So is it part of their policy or not? You seem to claim before that separating kids violates their policy, but now you don't seem sure.

Would Airtran seat an infant without a parent next to them?

Why take the chance?

 

[LdnCpl]

It baffles me why people are willing to pay $2000.00 + for a trip to WDW, pay $500.00 + for plane tickets yet balk at paying $6.00 per seat. Is that really a dealbreaker? For piece of mind I shelled out my $60.00 for 5 people rtn and never gave it a second thought.

 

[ccgirl]

It baffles me why people are willing to pay $2000.00 + for a trip to WDW, pay $500.00 + for plane tickets yet balk at paying $6.00 per seat. Is that really a dealbreaker? For piece of mind I shelled out my $60.00 for 5 people rtn and never gave it a second thought.

And we have a winner. As it has been said MANY TIMES on this thread, if you want to sit next to your child (regardless of the age) pay for the seat!

On all of my flights this year there have been no 2 seats together at the 24 hour mark. Therefore, you would be seated away from your child had you not pre-purchased the seats. As others have said, there is no law you need to be seated next to your child. There have also been many examples of people being seated away from their child because they did not pre-purchase seats due to their entitlement. Buy the seat if you want to sit next to your child. Piece of mind ofr $24!

 

[Hannathy]

I am traveling with my 3 year old on AirTran. So, a 3 year old is not allowed to travel without an adult (seems obvious to me).

True they are not allowed to TRAVEL without an adult they have to be 5, yours is traveling with an adult. It doesn't say they HAVE to sit with who they are traveling with!

 

[Lewisc]

This question comes up a couple of times a month. For the most part people on DIS aren't stupid.

Maybe airlines need better warnings. Something like---Are you sure you don't want to purchase an assigned seat? Passengers who don't purchase assigned should be prepared to wind up with a middle seat, separated from your family. People who want to sit next to their child or spouse should purchase a seat.

edit to add? Why not ask if the passengers want to sit together? A yes response and the purchase seat screen pops up.

 

[ladyhawk14624]

This question comes up a couple of times a month. For the most part people on DIS aren't stupid.

Maybe airlines need better warnings. Something like---Are you sure you don't want to purchase an assigned seat? Passengers who don't purchase assigned should be prepared to wind up with a middle seat, separated from your family. People who want to sit next to their child or spouse should purchase a seat.

edit to add? Why not ask if the passengers want to sit together? A yes response and the purchase seat screen pops up.

Great ideas. We've paid for our seats together. I'd feel bad for a parent that couldn't sit next to their child but I don't think I'd switch. That said, we're sitting on the side of the plane with only 2 seats so hopefully we won't encounter anyone trying to take one or both of them. I keep checking the AirTran site and looking at what seats are still available for our flight. Should be interesting to see how/if that changes at the 24 hour mark.

 

[tjmw2727]

I am traveling with my 3 year old on AirTran. So, a 3 year old is not allowed to travel without an adult (seems obvious to me). So is it true that AirTran may seat us apart unless we pay for specific seat assignments? Wouldn't that be traveling without the adult? First off, I don't care if I am sitting in an aisle or middle or at the back or the front or where-ever. Don't care. But, I don't see how AirTran can legally seat a 3 year-old without a parent/guardian. I'm not trying to take away someone else's seat who paid for their seat. I just don't see how AirTran can separate us if it violates their policy to do so... When my child is 6 or maybe 5, I can see how it is a luxury to be seated next to each other, but a 3 year old would likely not follow instructions as her vocabulary is very limited . On AirTran's web site, there are exceptions for those with all kinds of disabilities. If you had an adult with the mental capacity of a 3 year old that would definitely qualify right? So why not an actual 3-year old? I think if Airtran can't seat a toddler next to their guardian, they should not be taking my money for the ticket. There must be a line here somewhere right? Would Airtran seat an infant without a parent next to them?

I feel the opposite, I feel that it is my responsiblity to make sure that I take care of my families needs not Air Tran or any air carrier. I will do everything in my power to make that happen; including pay for a seat assignment, check in online as early as possible and arrive at the airport/gate on time or early.

 

[tjmw2727]

duplicate

 

[aubriee]

This question comes up a couple of times a month. For the most part people on DIS aren't stupid.

Maybe airlines need better warnings. Something like---Are you sure you don't want to purchase an assigned seat? Passengers who don't purchase assigned should be prepared to wind up with a middle seat, separated from your family. People who want to sit next to their child or spouse should purchase a seat.

edit to add? Why not ask if the passengers want to sit together? A yes response and the purchase seat screen pops up.

If you go to the Air Tran web site and act like you are booking a flight, you will see that after you choose your flights and click confirm, a screen comes up asking if you want to choose your seats and about 3/4's of the way down that screen are four large blocks with pictures on them. The first block says 'extra leg room', the second says 'sit together', the third says 'aisle seat', and the fourth says 'window seat'. That second block should be a clue that if you want to sit with your family you'd better click it. When you do, a picture of all the seats on the plane shows up with an option to choose your seats. Not sure how much clearer they can make it. If you want to sit with your family, pay to do so. I frequently fly solo and always pay for my preferred aisle seat close to the front of the plane. Those seats are more expensive, but are worth the $15.00 ($30.00 r/t), because I don't handle sitting in the back of the plane and looking up that long, skinny tube and I don't like window or middle seats, plus I like that they guarantee me boarding zone 1 (as long as you pay for them ahead of time and don't wait until 24 hours prior to try to get them for free). If I'm willing to cough up the $15.00 fee to sit where I want, then don't expect me to give that seat up to a parent who was too cheap to pay for the $6.00 seats they need to sit next to their kid further back in the plane.

 

[dudspizza]

Great ideas. We've paid for our seats together. I'd feel bad for a parent that couldn't sit next to their child but I don't think I'd switch. That said, we're sitting on the side of the plane with only 2 seats so hopefully we won't encounter anyone trying to take one or both of them. I keep checking the AirTran site and looking at what seats are still available for our flight. Should be interesting to see how/if that changes at the 24 hour mark.

You can hope no one tries to take the seats.... at least you have both seats on that side.

I was flying AA a couple of years ago, solo. I booked with miles and was one of the very first to choose my seat. Seats are free, so no cost to me. I watch my seats like a hawk and the aisle next to me on this MD-80 (2x3) is empty, even at online check in. Well, I get on the plane to see a dad sitting in that aisle seat and his daughter, maybe 4-5 sitting in my seat. He says, "the airline put her over there", pointing at the aisle seat across from him and then he says, "will you take that one". Dumbfounded and not wanting to be a total jerk, I took the aisle and sat down. I wasn't happy, especially when I choose my seat way in advance, but I dealt. A thank you or can I buy you a drink would have been nice, but nothing. He blamed it on the airline. Heck, his kid was in my seat with all of her toys out already, so you know he pre-boarded to make sure he took that seat! I don't wait to board, I board as soon as I can.

 

[majorbulk]

Wow, thanks for all the replies. For those that are pointing out the $24 round trip cost, I know what the cost is and that is not the point I am trying to make. The point is the principle. I believe it is extortion to take advantage of family members that must sit adjacent to each other. My wife just pointed out that our daughter will still be 2 years old when we take this next flight. So how is a 2 year old supposed to follow instructions during a plane crash and exit the plane?

Some have correctly pointed out that the current AirTran policy for a guardian sitting next to someone only applies to those with certain disabilities. But, why wouldn't a 2 year old toddler be covered by this? I would ask what's the difference? If I had a broken leg in a cast (for instance), I would manage to get off of the plane in an emergency (with or without assistance), but a 2 year old? My 2 year old wouldn't even know to unbuckle her seat belt. And in a smoke filled plane, nobody would even notice a toddler still in her seat as the plane is evacuated. And who would put the life vest on the child? Who would put the oxygen mask on the child? In a crash people fend for themselves first. I'm sure in the FAA plane evacuation testing, a 2 year old is never seated away from a parent, because the 2 year old won't get off the plane. So of course I am paying the $24 fee. I have no choice but to pay because for me, it's not just a convenience like it is for others with children that are old enough to follow the simple instructions in the event of an emergency. It's one thing to pay a fee for a seat so I can look out the window, or share a DVD with a sibling, or so I can sleep on a shoulder. It is quite another when one person is dependent on another to travel safely.

From the AirTran site:

Pre-reserved Seating
An advance seat assignment is available to any self-identifying passenger with a disability. We recommend you indicate your seating preference when you make your reservation, e.g., bulkhead, left aisle, right aisle, etc.

For customers with a disability traveling with a personal care attendant, seats can be arranged side by side. For passengers who have limited mobility, there are seats with moveable aisle armrests. If you have a fixed or immobilized leg or you are traveling with a service animal and desire to be assigned to a bulkhead seat, please advise us when you make your reservation.

I would contend that a 2 year old requires as much, if not more assistance than someone who qualifies under the above quoted policy.

A two year old should qualify under that policy for multiple reasons as follows... According to Federal Aviation Regulation 14 CFR, Part 382, included persons are those that are limited in "one or more major life activities", including: "...caring for one’s self, performing manual tasks, walking..., speaking...". It is obvious that a 2 year old would qualify under any of those four criteria and you only need one. You can read details of it on airconsumer.dot.gov. This forum wouldn't let me include links because I am too new.

 

[majorbulk]

...I wasn't happy, especially when I choose my seat way in advance, but I dealt.

The flight attendant should have asked you first, I think. That person was just using their kid to hog a seat and it's not right. If someone is accompanying a minor and wants to sit adjacent to that minor, it should be arranged more than 24 hours in advance of departure with an assignment.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Wow, thanks for all the replies. For those that are pointing out the $24 round trip cost, I know what the cost is and that is not the point I am trying to make. The point is the principle. I believe it is extortion to take advantage of family members that must sit adjacent to each other.

It is not extortion in ANY way.
Airline travel is a choice.
Airlines do not take advantage of family members. They offer the same OPTION to preselect seats at a cost to ALL non-qualifying passengers (yes, there are exceptions - however, we're talking about a specific airline that DOES charge to preselect seats).
Two passengers who MUST sit adjacent to each other MUST pay to preselect seats. Period. All due respect, any two-year-old is the responsibility of her/his parent or guardian, not the responsibility of the airline.

My wife just pointed out that our daughter will still be 2 years old when we take this next flight. So how is a 2 year old supposed to follow instructions during a plane crash and exit the plane?

If a member of one's travel party is incapable of following instructions, it is incumbent upon a responsible member of that party to be proactive - in this case, by paying in advance to preselect adjacent seats. STOP BLAMING THE AIRLINES.

And in a smoke filled plane, nobody would even notice a toddler still in her seat. And who would put the life vest on the child? Who would put the oxygen mask on the child? In a crash people fend for themselves first.

You display an amazing lack of faith in your fellow beings. Who would put the oxygen mask on that same child if the accompanying adult were incapacitated?

I'm sure in the FAA plane evacuation testing, a 2 year old is never seated away from a parent, because the 2 year old won't get off the plane. So of course I am paying the $24 fee.

I'm sure the FAA never tested plane evacuation with a two year old.
But you're not paying a $24 fee. Stop looking at it that way. Realize the airlines simply broke down the ticket pricing. Would you feel better if your $238 round trip ticket cost you $250?

Pre-reserved Seating
An advance seat assignment is available to any self-identifying passenger with a disability. We recommend you indicate your seating preference when you make your reservation, e.g., bulkhead, left aisle, right aisle, etc.

For customers with a disability traveling with a personal care attendant, seats can be arranged side by side. For passengers who have limited mobility, there are seats with moveable aisle armrests. If you have a fixed or immobilized leg or you are traveling with a service animal and desire to be assigned to a bulkhead seat, please advise us when you make your reservation.

I would contend that a 2 year old requires as much, if not more assistance than someone who qualifies under the above quoted policy.

A two year old should qualify under that policy for multiple reasons as follows... According to Federal Aviation Regulation 14 CFR, Part 382, included persons are those that are limited in "one or more major life activities", including: "...caring for one’s self, performing manual tasks, walking..., speaking...". You can read details of it on airconsumer.dot.gov.

Please show me ANYWHERE in AirTran's quoted policy or on their website where it's stated or implied that this seating arrangement will be done at no additional cost.

I'm not seeing it.

 

[majorbulk]

It is not extortion in ANY way. Airline travel is a choice.

Ah I see, so the airline says $24 please if you want your child to be safe. Otherwise, who knows what might happen.

I'm sure the FAA never tested plane evacuation with a two year old.

Never? My guess is you're wrong, but google can't find the history of all evacuation tests and their criteria. I actually don't know details of all the tests ever done by the FAA. But, by virtue of an airline issuing tickets to minors, they are assuming responsibility to transport them in a safe and regulation compliant way.

Please show me ANYWHERE in AirTran's quoted policy or on their website where it's stated or implied that this seating arrangement will be done at no additional cost.

I'm not seeing it.

You're not seeing it because it does not say they charge for it. That's because they can't charge for such accommodations. I put it in my last post. If you google "air consumer charges prohibited" and take the top hit from airconsumer.dot.gov, you should see that such charges are prohibited because they are discriminatory. It's under the heading: "Charges for Accommodations Prohibited". You should also look at the Air Carrier Access Act.

Look, I'm not saying AirTran is a bad airline. I like flying AirTran. I just think this policy, which other airlines probably share, may not be in FAR compiance for safety.

 

[maxiesmom]

Never? My guess is you're wrong, but google can't find the history of all evacuation tests and their criteria. I actually don't know details of all the tests ever done by the FAA. But, by virtue of an airline issuing tickets to minors, they are assuming responsibility to transport them in a safe and regulation compliant way.

By your saying that, you are claiming a parent is a sure safety measure. What about the child who has a dingbat for a parent that panics at the least little thing? Is the airline then responsible for that child as they are for an unaccompanied child? You can't say a child is safe flying just because the parent is along. The only way to make that true would be for every parent to have to go thru some kind of safety screening and test that would then allow the airline to say the parent is that child's safety measure.

You really need to stop blaming the airline for this. If you want the parent to be the one resonsible for a child's safety on the plane, then wouldn't part of that be being smart enough to buy a seat next to that child? If the parent can't show that much care for a child they think needs assistance, why does that responsibilty then fall on the airline?

 

[uva185]

Ah I see, so the airline says $24 please if you want your child to be safe. Otherwise, who knows what might happen.


Never? My guess is you're wrong, but google can't find the history of all evacuation tests and their criteria. I actually don't know details of all the tests ever done by the FAA. But, by virtue of an airline issuing tickets to minors, they are assuming responsibility to transport them in a safe and regulation compliant way.


You're not seeing it because it does not say they charge for it. That's because they can't charge for such accommodations. I put it in my last post. If you google "air consumer charges prohibited" and take the top hit from airconsumer.dot.gov, you should see that such charges are prohibited because they are discriminatory. It's under the heading: "Charges for Accommodations Prohibited". You should also look at the Air Carrier Access Act.

Look, I'm not saying AirTran is a bad airline. I like flying AirTran. I just think this policy, which other airlines probably share, may not be in FAR compiance for safety.

How hard is it to understand that AirTran has unbundled the fees that were previously included in the price of the ticket. Not all airlines do this and you always have a choice when flying. If you don't like the unbundled pricing method then fly an airline that still bundles it's fees into the price of a ticket.

In terms of legality. A disabled person is protected class under Federal law. A 2 year old is not. Sorry, it's as simple as that.

 

[sam_gordon]

You're not seeing it because it does not say they charge for it. That's because they can't charge for such accommodations. I put it in my last post. If you google "air consumer charges prohibited" and take the top hit from airconsumer.dot.gov, you should see that such charges are prohibited because they are discriminatory. It's under the heading: "Charges for Accommodations Prohibited". You should also look at the Air Carrier Access Act.

I tried this and didn't see anywhere where someone with a disability doesn't have to pay for their seat. Maybe I'm just missing it. But at the airconsumer.dot.gov, I found...

Carriers cannot impose charges for providing facilities, equipment, or services to an individual with a disability that are required by DOT's Air Carrier Access regulations. They may charge for optional services, however, such as oxygen and accommodation of stretchers.

So I googled 'DOT's Air Carrier Access regulations'. And again couldn't find anything saying those with disabilities don't need to pay for their seat. I don't see how you could say charging for the seat is discrimination since everyone is required to do that (in order to get a specific seat).

I also don't see anywhere where the airline must provide a seat next to someone who is disabled. The closest thing I could find is...

Airlines may not require a person with a disability to travel with another person, except in certain limited circumstances where the rule permits the airline to require a safety assistant. If a passenger with a disability and the airline disagree about the need for a safety assistant, the airline can require the assistant, but cannot charge for the transportation of the assistant.

The bolding is mine, but the way I read it is if the airline agrees a "safety assistant" is needed, the assistant gets a free flight. Would be great for parents & young kids, but let me know how that argument works out for you.

Now, I might be missing the segment you're talking referring to, so if I am, please point it out.

As mentioned before, if your $238 RT fare (and needing to pay for seat selection) was actually $250 RT (and not needing to pay for seat selection), would you still take the flight?

Airlines are giving passengers what amounts to a "line item veto" or an itemized list of charges. You pay 'x' amount for the flight. Don't care where you sit and only have carryons? You don't pay any more. You want a window/aisle/sit next to someone? You need to pay a little more. You want to check bags? Pay a little more.

 

[pilotwife_02]

How hard is it to understand that AirTran has unbundled the fees that were previously included in the price of the ticket. Not all airlines do this and you always have a choice when flying. If you don't like the unbundled pricing method then fly an airline that still bundles it's fees into the price of a ticket.

This is what I was going to say. Instead of looking at it as an extra fee to seats when purchasing your tix, think of the cost to buy the tix without a seat assignment as a "discounted" price.