Advice for planning trip with dsd... w/ venting

Any chance you can get her in to a counselor? At 11 years old, she has to be very confused. If I go, Mom gets hurt and cries. If I don't go Dad get's hurt.

Maybe someone on the outside can help HER chose what is best for HER.
Most 11 y/o need a little help sometimes, making grown-up decisions. This sounds like a child who doesn't want to hurt either parent.

Ask the school social worker, counselor, nurse where to take her. I'm sure they would be more than willing to help.

Good Luck

Judi
 
The biggest problem is the ex is she has never moved on and never remarried or really even dated. So dsd has become her partner or equal instead of a parent/child relationship. She allows her to make adult decisions, but worse than that, she puts unspoken guilt on her... ie, making her feel guilty because she left mommy at home alone all weekend/for vacations and she was lonely without her there.

In that case, I bet her mother is the reason she cancelled the earlier trip, because she made her feel guilty for going. Instead of threatening DSD, I'd try to find some way to make her understand that she is not responsible for her mother's happiness, and that she has a right to go on vacation with her family.
 
Ok some background first. I have a ds 12, ds 2 and then step daughter that is 11. Somewhere along about 2-3 years ago she became so attached to her mother that our (meaning dh AND myself) relationship with her has significantly changed... meaning she doesn't really like coming to our house or visiting with us.... unless she is getting something... ie christmas, birthday presents or if we are going somewhere she likes to go. While I think this is sad and I would call her bluff and not take her anywhere or buy her much until she changes her tune, dh loves her and can't see the forest for the trees! He thinks if we continue to cater to her whims that she will eventually come around. (Having said that he does see that she puts stressers on our family... didn't want anyone to think he was oblivious to whats going on.)

She has always gone to WDW with us, last year's trip rolls around and She decided NOT to go!!!! We were shocked. :scared1: This decision was made 2 weeks before the trip. We had already purchased tix and made ressies for dining. I had to call and make changes to the ressies and in order to do that we were actually given different times.

So this year's trip is in the works, we have never gone at Christmas time and since I thought she would probably never go on a trip with us again, I decided we would plan a Magical Christmas. DH tells dsd over the weekend that we are planning to go and low and behold... SHE WANTS TO GO! ?!?!? Now what?

We still have her ticket from last year that she can use, but I was planning on using it for ds and not have to to spend the extra money on a tix for him. The ticket issue is not AS big of a deal as I know that if she doesn't use it we WILL go back and eventually it will get used. I just don't like knowing that we might spend the extra AGAIN and that ticket still sits at home unused.

And what about ressies... If I make them and then she backs out last minute I may have a hard time getting them changed.

The other thing is that her mom will NOT let her miss school for a trip, if she goes we will leave the day after Christmas and be there the week of New Years, if she doesn't go then we would probably go the week before Christmas and let ds miss a few days of school.

I told her that this was a decision that once made up was set in stone! We normally drive, but are planning to fly, so I will be fuming if I buy her an airline ticket and she backs out.

Ok enough... what to do????? :confused3

Any experience dealing with step kids in this scenario?

btw... her father and I have been married since she was 3 so this isn't a new family experience for her. I have been in her life as long as she can remember!

any help would be extremely appreciated!

I think that the poor child needs a break. As PPs have mentioned, 11 is a really tough age for a girl without extra drama. You say that relationship changes started 2-3 years ago, which would have been right around the time that your younger son arrived. Probably rocked this child's world to not only be a part-time daughter, but for her dad to now have another child other than her.

I am sure that dealing with all of this has been stressful and frustrating for you, but I think that the child needs kid gloves at this point. You say that her mom specializes in making her feel guilty. That can't be fun. In reading your post though, some animosity and anger towards your dsd comes through. Please be sure that this isn't expressed in your dealings with her. It sure sounds like she could use a supportive adult woman in her life. It probably won't be easy, 11yo girls aren't under the best of circumstances, but I think the effort will pay off in the long run.

Good luck to you.
 
I'd tell her that since she didn't want to go last year you had no idea she'd want to go this year, so you already booked your trip for a week that she will be in school. Since her mom won't let her miss school there's just no way that she'll be able to go with you this time.

It will be good for her to have to deal with the consequences of her actions. If she is going to behave unpredictably, she may get left out from time-to-time.

:scared1: That is JUST HORRIBLE advice. Terrible.

Your DD is only 11 years old. And yes I mean DD, I HATE the word step. Hate it. I have a DD and DS from DH's first marriage. That is how I describe it if need be other wise they are just DD and DS. She should be your child as much as your "own" children.

I cannot imagine planning a family vacation and leaving a family member out. I would include her in your plans, and open a dialagou between your DD and her mother and find out why she backed out last time. Guilt could be a factor. I know when we take the kids, they miss their mom and she misses them, but we make sure there is ample communication if possible.
 

Please be understanding of her.

She's 11. Most 11 year old girls are miserable, aren't they?

She's also obviously stuck in the middle between her mom, her dad, and you. I do not know the family dynamics or history, and frankly, no one on this board has her take on the family or her mom's, but really, you need to remember that she's the outsider in your family (she lives with her mom, right?), and I'm sure she knows it.


I also have a friend whose fiancee is jealous of his 11 year old daughter and complains about him spending too much time with her, and I'll tell you that it's an ugly situation for all involved. Though you haven't said you resent her, it seems like you might, and again, that's really bad for all of you. She could be playing some games to get the attention or to get her dad to prove that he still loves her. I'm not saying that's good, but I'm saying it's understandable.

Please don't take offense at this. I just feel bad for her caught up in such drama.

I would plan on her going with you. If she backs out, she backs out. Next year, her dad should decide what to do about it. And if I were you, I'd let your DH call the shots here because she's his daughter.

I agree with this.

I can't believe you guys even planned a vacation without asking her if she wanted to go first. And other than the airline ticket, which you could always hold for a later trip, you don't have to put a lot of money out front for her, do you?

My DD is 11, and as someone else said, some days she can't get enough Mommy time, and other days she doesn't know I exist.

Put yourself in her shoes. Your two children live full time with HER dad. Did her attachment isses start about the time your youngest was born? Is it anxiety that HER dad now has another kid, and maybe she doesn't mean as much to him as she used to?

Kids don't think like we do, give her a break, she's in tough position.
 
Any chance you can get her in to a counselor? At 11 years old, she has to be very confused. If I go, Mom gets hurt and cries. If I don't go Dad get's hurt.

Maybe someone on the outside can help HER chose what is best for HER.
Most 11 y/o need a little help sometimes, making grown-up decisions. This sounds like a child who doesn't want to hurt either parent.

Ask the school social worker, counselor, nurse where to take her. I'm sure they would be more than willing to help.

Good Luck

Judi

This is a great idea. We went through the same thing right about the time (11-12). Luckily, the school that she was attending had a great guidance counselor who helped her through it. He helped her to understand that the divorce wasn't her fault and that she should enjoy her time with each parent and it was not her job to make sure they were happy, that she needed to concentrate on her own happiness. She also went to a counselor outside of school for a short period of time. She's now 20 and a very lovely, well adjusted young woman.
 
How would you handle this if she were your real daughter? Whatever your answer is should also be your answer about how to handle this situation.

I do have to add that I find it sad that you would plan a family vacation that didn't include her just because she opted out last year.
 
If this were our daughter there would be no "opting out at the last minute".

I agree with others that you shouldn't have planned the trip without her, but she is old enough to keep a commitment.

I wouldn't let my own daughter decide at the last minute not to go somewhere. If she says she's going, and I've spent money on her, she's going.

Her dad needs to step up and take some part in making her understand this with the help of her mom. It's really not your responsibility or your place. They need to work together to help her make good decisions and feel right about them.
 
Any chance you can get her in to a counselor? At 11 years old, she has to be very confused. If I go, Mom gets hurt and cries. If I don't go Dad get's hurt.

Maybe someone on the outside can help HER chose what is best for HER.
Most 11 y/o need a little help sometimes, making grown-up decisions. This sounds like a child who doesn't want to hurt either parent.

Ask the school social worker, counselor, nurse where to take her. I'm sure they would be more than willing to help.

Good Luck

Judi

DH has asked the ex to get her into counseling, either with family or by herself, many times! She refuses and dh's insurance would even pay for it in its entirety. He has even offered to take her himself, but she won't agree, and unfortunately we only have her (at most) every other weekend. No counselor will agree to Sat/Sun every few weeks to meet.

I don't think many of you understand the irrationality of the mother. When things are in the child's best interest, she will go out of her way to do things the opposite way. Another example is that DH carries insurance on her, but the mother rarely takes her to the doctor or dentist, unless she is severely sick. She has been to the dentist ONE time in her life and she had so many cavities, she left with a mouth full of crowns. She never has physicals which are pd for in full, the last time she went to the dr. she was so sick it took 2-3 weeks of different anti-biotics to get her over her ailment. This is a child who is almost 12. I'm not saying the mother is neglectful, I just don't think she thinks those things are important. She is kept clean and fed and clothed, but just to basic necessities. As I have said in a previous post, we are comfortable financially, but when we take her shopping we have been dictated by the mother, not to buy her "name brand" clothes - "it isn't necessary". -- ? what? I am a bargain shopper and I tend to get clothes on clearance racks, and we have outlet malls, but if you look at my children, they look very well dressed (but at discounted rates). How bad of a "step" mom would I be if I bought my kids nice clothes and bought the "step" kid wall-mart clothes?? So we buy her clothes where we shop, then we get into trouble when we take her home for it. WTH?

Many of you commented that this stress might have been caused by the arrival of our other son... you could absolutely be correct. But then what? What do we do differently to make her feel better? We normally stay home on the weekends that she isn't here and save family outings for when we have her to include her. But we continue with plans if she CHOOSES not to come along. What else are we to do? How are we to change the fact that she might not feel "at home" here? We think we are doing our best, maybe we aren't, but we do everything we can to include her.

We DON'T plan a trip without her, but if she backs out or tells us she isn't going we can't MAKE her go. Who would have thought that a child would refuse to go to Disney and the beach for a vacation, when she has gone on vacation with us every year for 7 years, (WDW or the beach or both)? We were BOTH dumbstruck. So when this Christmas trip was being discussed we immediately told her we were going and asked her to go. We really just didn't think she would go with us, so we were surprised when she said she wanted to. I just have fear that we would book it then last minute she would back out.

I never intended for this to get to this point, I just wanted advice on how to plan to INCLUDE her but with the possibility that she might back out.

To reiterate, I LOVE HER very much, but like every parent/child relationship I do get irritated with things that happens with her. Just like I do with ds 12 when he does something dumb. But because I am a "step" parent I have no "control" to fix things with her.

And I have ALWAYS treated her equal as my kids, but Sorry Miss Jasmine, I do feel different about her than I do my bio kids, as does dh with my child, he cares for/loves him, but he isn't his child and therefore has different feelings for him. Anyone that says they don't feel different about their bio and step kids is lying. Especially when the mother of the step kids creates problems. I can honestly say I have different feelings about my own 2 kids, they are in different stages in life and therefore I have different relationships with each one. Dh is probably closer with ds than I am with dsd, but that is because we all live together and ds's bio-father is not in the picture, so dh treats him as his own. I'm not in that position, because dsd does live with her mom. But at our house we are very mother/daughterly and she does call me mom and I do introduce her as my daughter.

Broken families are NOT easy, but you do the best you know to do. I feel extreme guilt to my own ds 12 for marrying a man who would not take a part of his life, and I acknowledge that to him. I didn't plan to get divorced, nor did I plan my life to include helping to raise someone else's child, but it’s the cards I've been dealt and I'm extremely proud of my life and my family and wouldn't change any of it for the world. No one is an expert. We are not perfect. I'm not a perfect mom, not to her or to my other kids. I know that, I make mistakes, but I'm doing the best I can and I listen to advice.... hence starting this thread. I thought maybe someone that had gone through the same situation could give me advice that I could use. I never meant to get it to this level.

Thanks to all who have given constructive criticism and good advice, and to those who thought you needed to jump to conclusions, you should put yourself in other's shoes first.
 
How would you handle this if she were your real daughter? Whatever your answer is should also be your answer about how to handle this situation.

I do have to add that I find it sad that you would plan a family vacation that didn't include her just because she opted out last year.

I have to say I immediately felt sorry for your step daughter as well when I read your post. She's just a child. There seems to be a lot of hostility towards her mom. Even in your posts describing your DSD ..Its "Us" and "her". She should be just as much a part of your family as your other kids. Vacations should include her unless she opts otherwise. Would you plan a vacation during a time that one of your children couldn't go?

It doesn't seem to be just about the money..Seems likes there some other issues going on here...The plane ticket is the only non-refundable item.. Whats' that like $200-300? And your saying you wouldn't buy her Christmas gifts if she doesn't go?

Maybe The adults here have to work on improving their relationships with each other. More communication? Then your step daughter won't be dealing with so much drama.

Sorry if its seems harsh..I just really feel bad for the little girl.
 
I'm sure it's really hard for you, all this and I don't mean to get on your case. But I just think it was a huge mistake to plan the trip without her in the first place.

Yes, she is a flighty kid.
Yes, she has a difficult mom.
Yes, it costs you money.
Yes, it is maddening.

Agreed. Agreed. Agreed.

BUT, she is a little girl and your husband's child and she didn't ask for any of this. Your husband needs to help her understand how to keep a promise, but you have to just keep trying and never give up with this child. She needs to be always invited, always included, always treated exactly like the other kids. Without fail.
 
If this were our daughter there would be no "opting out at the last minute".

I agree with others that you shouldn't have planned the trip without her, but she is old enough to keep a commitment.

I wouldn't let my own daughter decide at the last minute not to go somewhere. If she says she's going, and I've spent money on her, she's going.

Her dad needs to step up and take some part in making her understand this with the help of her mom. It's really not your responsibility or your place. They need to work together to help her make good decisions and feel right about them.


I agree, when I plan a trip my kids WILL be there! There is No opting out, at least not at their ages. And that is what we thought last year with her, she has ALWAYS gone with us on EVERY vacation. But obviously her mom told her she didn't have to go, (or perhaps, asked her not to go) but at any rate, she was allowed by her mom (and dad too by not making a stand I guess) to opt out. That is what I have said that she is making decisions that should be left to adult to make.

Several of you have said that I should leave this to the mom and DH to deal with and stay out of it... I DO! I don't discuss anything with the mom that is DH's job as the father. I just do the trip planning.

And again... WE DIDN"T PLAN A TRIP WITHOUT HER. We invited her within the week of deciding to go. We just had talked about it with each other (DH and myself) and didn't know if she would go. We did tell her we wanted very much for her to go. We talked about it as a family - all 5 of us were talking about it. Yes, ds 2 is very excited about going to the "mouse castle" as he calls it.

Maybe in trying to keep this readers digest version I'm leaving out things, but we never PLANNED a trip with out her. And nothing has even been booked yet. We are just still in the planning stages.
 
And again... WE DIDN"T PLAN A TRIP WITHOUT HER. We invited her within the week of deciding to go. We just had talked about it with each other (DH and myself) and didn't know if she would go. We did tell her we wanted very much for her to go. We talked about it as a family - all 5 of us were talking about it. Yes, ds 2 is very excited about going to the "mouse castle" as he calls it.

Maybe in trying to keep this readers digest version I'm leaving out things, but we never PLANNED a trip with out her. And nothing has even been booked yet. We are just still in the planning stages.

I'm so glad! Sorry if I misunderstood!

Really, this is a drag for you and your husband needs to get with the program and talk to his daughter.

My dh has a stepmother that made all the decisions and fought with his mom all the time when he was young but his dad just let it all happen and my dh came to really resent his dad for it, not specially the women. He just really wishes his dad would have been a man and spoken up for him. I bet his dad thought he was being the "good guy", but dh just wanted a dad.
 
I'm so glad! Sorry if I misunderstood!

Really, this is a drag for you and your husband needs to get with the program and talk to his daughter.

My dh has a stepmother that made all the decisions and fought with his mom all the time when he was young but his dad just let it all happen and my dh came to really resent his dad for it, not specially the women. He just really wishes his dad would have been a man and spoken up for him. I bet his dad thought he was being the "good guy", but dh just wanted a dad.

I've told dh this, and explained the "Down the road" aspect. I've asked if he didn't think that she would rather look back on her childhood and see a dad that may have caused an occassional wave, but it was for her benefit, that it was to SEE her to have relationship with her. But he has been that "good guy" for so long now, that it's just the way things are.

Most of you don't realize I argued with dh when the ex would say "I'm changing weekends because we need to do ____. Or, Easter weekend is your weekend, but I want her instead, so I'm keeping her home with me." I would say ok is she going to give you an extra weekend some other time... no. It would infuriate me that he would let her dictate him seeing his daughter, but to "not cause waves" he would just not say anything. I am the one that told him to fight for his rights. I wasn't the one saying... Oh, I'm so glad that she doesn't have to be here. I'm not that person. I think that everyone assumes that because you are a step parent that you don't like the child and that is simply not the case here. I have thought since she was a very small child that things were not done the way they should, but dh wouldn't say anything and it wasn't my place to say anything. btw when dh & I met he wasn't even having overnight visits with her, it was at my insistance that he start doing those, as dictated in their papers. Don't get me wrong he saw her a lot, but it would just be for a couple hours here and there each week. There was no reason that he didn't do the overnights, just that the ex didn't want him to. He had to contact and attorney and have them write her a letter telling her that he would be at her house at x time to pick up daughter for his visitation. And to top it off ex works as a secretary at a LAW firm! She knew the law, but thought she could pull the wool over dh's eyes. It took me to tell him to enforce it.

just fyi...
 
Wow...it is amazing to me how people can get so snippy and rude without knowing the whole story or the ins and outs of this particular situation.

AMSYW~ I do not envy your situation...and I commend you on looking for ways to make this particular situation better! I think it a shame that you are getting such back lash when what you really needed (asked for) was constructive help.

I don't have much to add other than shower her with love to the best of your ability and continue to work with your husband in regards to this so you both can see each others point of view.

I hope this trip works out with few hiccups along the way and that this will truly be a magical Christmas for all of you!

:flower3:
 
btw... I'm not trying to sound like goodie goodie here, but I feel I'm being made out to be the "evil Step-mom" and I'm not even close to that. We have had problems in the relationship and I am honest with those. We also have had the occassional problem between ds12 and dh, we work through them. Everyone has family problems and in step families they are magnified because there are usually two households dealing with the issues. But I'm not the evil person that I think many on here have made me out to be. Many times I have been an advocate for her when her father was not being it.
 
And I have ALWAYS treated her equal as my kids, but Sorry Miss Jasmine, I do feel different about her than I do my bio kids, as does dh with my child, he cares for/loves him, but he isn't his child and therefore has different feelings for him. Anyone that says they don't feel different about their bio and step kids is lying. Especially when the mother of the step kids creates problems. I can honestly say I have different feelings about my own 2 kids, they are in different stages in life and therefore I have different relationships with each one. Dh is probably closer with ds than I am with dsd, but that is because we all live together and ds's bio-father is not in the picture, so dh treats him as his own. I'm not in that position, because dsd does live with her mom. But at our house we are very mother/daughterly and she does call me mom and I do introduce her as my daughter.
What does the mother's behavior have to do with YOUR feelings toward your DD? Treating someone as equal and loving someone as equal are two different things. You say you feel differently about your "own" kids, but do you love them each the same? This paragraph makes me sad. :(
 
Wow...it is amazing to me how people can get so snippy and rude without knowing the whole story or the ins and outs of this particular situation.

AMSYW~ I do not envy your situation...and I commend you on looking for ways to make this particular situation better! I think it a shame that you are getting such back lash when what you really needed (asked for) was constructive help.

I don't have much to add other than shower her with love to the best of your ability and continue to work with your husband in regards to this so you both can see each others point of view.

I hope this trip works out with few hiccups along the way and that this will truly be a magical Christmas for all of you!

:flower3:

Thank you SO MUCH for your kind words. I truly appreciate them. :hug:

It is unfortunate that people jump to conclusions! But it happens.:rolleyes1
 
What does the mother's behavior have to do with YOUR feelings toward your DD? Treating someone as equal and loving someone as equal are two different things. You say you feel differently about your "own" kids, but do you love them each the same? This paragraph makes me sad. :(

I guess I can't answer the the first question, only to say that my love for her doesn't change, but my attitude toward the situation is affected with the mother causing conflict.

No I don't love my kids the "same". I have very different relationships with each, they are 10 years apart. They came in different stations in my life. Me and older ds are extremely close because for the first 4 years of his life it was just he and I, his father never really wanted a child and felt he was an inconvenience. Then with younger ds, he was a very much wanted-surprise baby after 8 years of infertility and a lost pregnancy. Dsd holds a special place in my heart because she is the only daughter I have. I live in a house of boys, so when she is there we get to have "girl time" I love each of the them with all my heart and can't measure the love for one over the other, but it IS indeed different.

As an occassional watcher of Dr. Phil, he has said on many occassions that parents really don't love their kids the "same" if they are honest. Each child has different personalities and parents have different relationships with them because of it. That doesn't mean they love them less... just differently. I fully believe that.

I am very close with my mother and have been since I was an adult, not so much when I was growing up. We shop together and I talk to or see her every single day. My brother was always a momma's boy growing up, but isn't that close to her now. My sister lives 200 miles away and therefore isn't at all close to her. But she loves us all very much. Her & I are better "friends" though. She HATES shopping with my sister, but that is just because of my sister's personality, but they can visit at home just fine. It doesn't make her a bad mom, she just has different relationships with each of us.

I think you just don't see that.
 


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