ADA Rules Question Regarding Fort Wilderness (and campgrounds in general)

[clkelley]

I am a big fan of Fort Wilderness, we camp there quite often and reallly love it there. However, our camper does not have a shower, so we use the comfort stations at the Fort. The comfort stations are clean and beautiful and very accessible, BUT....

My spouse has some mobility issues which mostly involve his flexibility in dressing.

There are no shower facilities at the Fort (and many other campgrounds around the country) that allow for opposite sex assistants.

What are the rules regarding this?? Do you think campgrounds will eventually have to provide private shower facilities that either sex can use, or will we have to either get a camper with a shower or quit going to campgrounds when DH will eventually have to have my assistance in the shower.

 

[SueM in MN]

I don't have time to check it out right now, but there are rules that have to do with recreational facilities that it may be addressed in.

 

[LilyWDW]

I am not required by law to provide a companion restroom in a building. As long as I can provide the correct number of accessible stalls for the building (space) in question, a unisex bathroom is not a requirement. In fact, usually the unisex restroom is used when it is not feasible to renovate or add the needed single sex stalls.

A4.22.3 Clear Floor Space. In many small facilities, single-user restrooms may be the only facilities provided for all building users. In addition, the guidelines allow the use of "unisex" or "family" accessible toilet rooms in alterations when technical infeasibility can be demonstrated. Experience has shown that the provision of accessible "unisex" or single-user restrooms is a reasonable way to provide access for wheelchair users and any attendants, especially when attendants are of the opposite sex. Since these facilities have proven so useful, it is often considered advantageous to install a "unisex" toilet room in new facilities in addition to making the multi-stall restrooms accessible, especially in shopping malls, large auditoriums, and convention centers.

Shower stalls fall within the same parameters as bathrooms. While you could make a unisex shower stall area, it is not required under law as long as you are able to provide significant accessible stalls as normal.

So, unless the law is changed, they would not be required to provide private facilities as long as they meet all other laws. Unisex restrooms (and in extension showering facilities) are not required under the law, though the DOJ does say they could be used as a reasonable way to provide the access.

Otherwise:

2. Where strict compliance to the guidelines for accessible toilet facilities is technically infeasible in the alteration of existing facilities, accessible "unisex" toilets are a reasonable alternative.

Note: quotes are from the DoJ ADA site

 

[clkelley]

Interesting!! Thanks for the info. It honestly really surprises me. Although I know everyone's disabilities are different, like I said DHs are mostly getting up and down and flexibility in putting on socks and shoes and perhaps in the future shorts and/or pants.

A larger shower with a grab bar is not going to help him do that. But a shower that a person of the opposite sex can also enter will.

 

[dclfun]

Is there any way you could just enter either restroom with him to help him in the shower? The same problem would exist in areas without companion restrooms and a disabled adult who needs help transferring, for instance. I know many a lady who has been in the mens restroom to help their spouse or older son and vice versa. Perhaps putting a sign on the door, "warning...female in restroom assisting disabled male" would be enough so there's no shock when someone enters and finds you there.---Kathy

 

[bookwormde]

If there are not private facilites you are allowed to attend to him in his facility (with reasonable care to anounce and wait for others using the facilites to make such adjustments as they feel they need to).

bookwormde

 

[Schmeck]

If there are not private facilites you are allowed to attend to him in his facility (with reasonable care to anounce and wait for others using the facilites to make such adjustments as they feel they need to).

bookwormde

Perhaps showing where that is written in the ADA would help? Or is this just your opinion?

 

[LilyWDW]

Perhaps showing where that is written in the ADA would help? Or is this just your opinion?

He is correct. If the facility does not offer a private area for this sort of assistance, then they would have to provide a way. This would include allowing a companion, even of the opposite sex, to give them the help they require. This would be considered a reasonable accommodation.

 

[bidnow5]

I can't put socks or shoes on so I use Crocs as far as pants go a robe till he gets back to the trailer should do

 

[clkelley]

I can't put socks or shoes on so I use Crocs as far as pants go a robe till he gets back to the trailer should do

Yeah, we did finally find a pair of house shoes that he can slip on and off to walk to the shower. (Can't do CROCS either as he can't get the back strap around his ankle without help, has trouble walking in them without the back strap.)

We'll probably end up going to the robe thing. Will have to find one then sew a zipper into it. I KNOW he won't agree to walk/scooter back and forth with just a waist tie robe

 

[wmah]

Have not actually camped here but at other campgrounds I have gone in to the ladies room with a female friend to assist her as she has a hard time actually going from her power chair to the shower bench if it even has one, sometimes I bring a shower chair in with us. We some times just go in the mens shower instead. Only really did this when we camp in a van.

The rv I have is a converted school bus and I did put in a shower stall so when using that we had no problem other than they were 5 gallons of of water showers.

Something I do when staying at a campground is when writing a review at http://www.rvparkreviews.com is to also say how the showers were in regards to being accessible or not and if they were unisex. I did see one that had a sign on it that even stated to use this one last to try and keep it open for the wheelchair user.

 

[Schmeck]

He is correct. If the facility does not offer a private area for this sort of assistance, then they would have to provide a way. This would include allowing a companion, even of the opposite sex, to give them the help they require. This would be considered a reasonable accommodation.

They have to provide a way, but not if it causes a hardship to the facility/business. The ADA is written as a very vague set of rules - "Reasonable Accommodation" can be taken in many different ways, and unless it is stated specifically in the ADA, the only recourse someone may have to set things right is to file a suit against the facility. So, if it says point-blank in the ADA that you must allow an opposite sex attendant in a shower facility, bring that with you in print.

If they refuse to let someone of the opposite sex enter the showers, what is that person going to do? There's no "ADA Police" that you call and the issue is magically resolved. The Reedy police may be called if someone complains, but they only restore the peace, might take a written statement of complaint, they can't make a judgement call on the ADA. Our courts do that.

What would Disney management do? They might offer the OP an accessible room onsite to use for showering. WDW only has to guarantee you a refund or room, not a specific one, or a specific resort.

I'm not saying that it's OK for Disney to have no appropriate showering facilities at FW. I think it stinks that they don't have a companion assisted shower room. I'd be quite willing to write to the powers that be about it. I'm even going to mention it when we are down there in a few weeks. We won't be staying at FW, but we'll be in the area, and I'm going to see if I can find a manager or two to talk to.