Absolutely nauseating...Toddlers and Tiaras

[Lisa loves Pooh]

, come on, you know that was a figure of speech, dont you ?

Asked and answered.

 

[si-am]

I signed up for Miss Teen New Hampshire because I thought it might be nice to get some scholarship money, but then I realised I'm 5'3 and I weigh 145. I'm fat in their eyes, and the girls who grow up in that mindset are psychologically scarred. Telling a little girl that she has to be a certain size, shape, or type, no matter how much work goes into it, is going to affect her self-esteem and body image. That is the problem I have with pageantry-the negative effect on girls' minds. The same goes for the beauty aspect, because like a PP said, if you're 'ugly', you'll never place. There are SO many things little girls could be doing instead of this. I watch the show because I like the glamour, but I think pageantry should be limited to older girls or adults who know what they're getting into and can deal with the results.

Well this is kind of my problem with it too: why are we putting teens in pageants to win scholarship money? What does one have to do with the other? Why not place emphasis on academics and smarts rather than tans, hairspray, and makeup?

 

[Aisling]

Well this is kind of my problem with it too: why are we putting teens in pageants to win scholarship money? What does one have to do with the other? Why not place emphasis on academics and smarts rather than tans, hairspray, and makeup?

I think because a lot of teenage girls like getting all prettied up and competing with each other. They do it every day even if not on a stage.

 

[hereyago]

toddlers and Tiaras: i have seen that show and ewww. some of the mothers are trying to live their life they wanted through their kids. just as some other moms in cheering or gymnastics.


The kids wear flippers to cover missing baby teeth. wear fake eyelashes, make up. thousands of dollars for outfits.

it's bad enough they will be doing it in real life when they are older, but the prancing around like Miss America?

and Eden Wood, she has a doll made after her, that is crazy as heck. and Mackenzie, um, her parents need a slap, just sayin. she is going to be a barrel of fun when she gets older-NOT!

 

[si-am]

I think because a lot of teenage girls like getting all prettied up and competing with each other. They do it every day even if not on a stage.

True, but they shouldn't be rewarded for it by a free trip to college.

 

[PolyndianPrincessJes]

I saw the promotion for the show. I figured it was not some thing I would watch when they describe one of the 6 year old contestents as "sexy".

Unless it's a 6 year old bottle of scotch, the word sexy should never be used to describe it.

I decided it was not some thing I want to watch and please a 6 year old blowing a kiss over her shoulder while winking is a hell of a lot different than cheering.

This! I really never even gave this show a second thought until I heard the latest commercial describe the kids as "sexy stars." Made my stomach turn.

 

[FredinFL]

True, but they shouldn't be rewarded for it by a free trip to college.

I don't know about that... put yourself out there and rip your body apart to win an athletic scholarship, or be pretty and say what they want to hear and win a a pageant scholarship? Hmmmm....

 

[Theosus]

Most of the parents look like they're trying to live and fulfill their life through their children, no matter what the cost is.

In the higher competitions, the claws come out and the credit cards. Now in some of the local city pageants, I have seen some down to earth girls and down to earth parents. It's more of something to do, rather than about the $10,000 dress they'll probably only fit into for three months.

I'd love to be in on this racket... Wow talk about a money maker. My wife and i watch most of the episodes and it cracks us up. These people living in a trailer driving a POS car, spending 6 grand a pageant on hair makeup dresses traveling and entry fees. I tell you what, you just give me the 6 grand, and I'll give you a plastic trophy, a crown too big for anyone under 21 to wear, and 500$ cash. Sound good?

 

[Becky2005]

I don't know, you can have the same issues with anything. I know Toddlers & Tiaras is a crazy train wreck show but I also know if they showed natural ones nobody would watch it!!!! LOL!

My daughter did gymnastics, dance & ice skating all those things that others say you should up them in INSTEAD of pageants. She got decent at gymnastics and had been doing that from Kindergarten through Freshman year and well...she ended up with back surgery so no more gymnastics EVER! Completely took that world away from her.

While in recovery and watching Toddlers & Tiaras -- she asked me if she could do a pageant because since she couldn't do gymnastics anymore "she had no talent" -- we never told her that but in her mind she had done gymnastics for so long it was just part of who she was and it was taken away not by choice that she needed to find a place to belong again.

You better believe I started looking at pageants! I had no clue either....I was looking for something small, local fair type thing to start with because trust me if my DD could she would so do a FULL Glitz pageant (i.e. most of what you see on Toddlers & Tiaras!). I found one locally that didn't require a swimsuit & talent was optional. She loved it. She was competing against 165 girls, so no she didn't place. She did it again the following year and will be doing it again this year & she is excited because she moved into Teen which means she will only have about 65 girls or so in her division. She loves the dressing up (we ended up finding her formalwear pageant dress while we were shopping for Prom dresses this year!).

We also ended up doing a fundraising pageant for Shriners Hospitals due to this because that is where she went for her back & we love them so much. She came up with the idea and it got into motion. Ours does start at age 5 but we let the girls wear make-up because I don't see it any different than doing Bibbity-Boppity Boutique -- basically the girls want to dress up fancy & be on stage. So, ours is a combination with natural hair, teeth, etc... but still getting to do the fancy dress-up with make-up stuff.

DD also took dance class this year and frankly she was freaking out because her costume was too short and the instructor just told her she would be fine. Thank goodness for dance tights or she would have been showing off WAY more than she ever showed off in any pageant and her stage make-up was way more than she wore at the pageant too. Those booty shorts are short!

 

[SandrA9810]

I don't know, you can have the same issues with anything. I know Toddlers & Tiaras is a crazy train wreck show but I also know if they showed natural ones nobody would watch it!!!! LOL!

My daughter did gymnastics, dance & ice skating all those things that others say you should up them in INSTEAD of pageants. She got decent at gymnastics and had been doing that from Kindergarten through Freshman year and well...she ended up with back surgery so no more gymnastics EVER! Completely took that world away from her.

While in recovery and watching Toddlers & Tiaras -- she asked me if she could do a pageant because since she couldn't do gymnastics anymore "she had no talent" -- we never told her that but in her mind she had done gymnastics for so long it was just part of who she was and it was taken away not by choice that she needed to find a place to belong again.

You better believe I started looking at pageants! I had no clue either....I was looking for something small, local fair type thing to start with because trust me if my DD could she would so do a FULL Glitz pageant (i.e. most of what you see on Toddlers & Tiaras!). I found one locally that didn't require a swimsuit & talent was optional. She loved it. She was competing against 165 girls, so no she didn't place. She did it again the following year and will be doing it again this year & she is excited because she moved into Teen which means she will only have about 65 girls or so in her division. She loves the dressing up (we ended up finding her formalwear pageant dress while we were shopping for Prom dresses this year!).

We also ended up doing a fundraising pageant for Shriners Hospitals due to this because that is where she went for her back & we love them so much. She came up with the idea and it got into motion. Ours does start at age 5 but we let the girls wear make-up because I don't see it any different than doing Bibbity-Boppity Boutique -- basically the girls want to dress up fancy & be on stage. So, ours is a combination with natural hair, teeth, etc... but still getting to do the fancy dress-up with make-up stuff.

DD also took dance class this year and frankly she was freaking out because her costume was too short and the instructor just told her she would be fine. Thank goodness for dance tights or she would have been showing off WAY more than she ever showed off in any pageant and her stage make-up was way more than she wore at the pageant too. Those booty shorts are short!

But unfortunately this isn't what makes tv so glamorous. It's nice to see it being done in a good way, and for a good cause. There are kids and parents that can do it for fun, and make it a special moment.

Has your daughter noticed any of the girls, that have been doing it for years longer than her, having issues with self beauty and self esteem?? That's a big concern about the ones on tv, is how much emphasis is placed on these kids to be perfect, and at such a young age. Some of these over the top moms are teaching them things that they shouldn't even understand at a young age like that.

 

[toontownnutter]

I think I've become desensitised by watching it. Prior to watching I was mortified. When I first started watching I was mostly horrified. Now I've been watching it awhile nothing much shocks me. Though the mother holding her daughter down while she got her eyebrows waxed dropped my jaw. And then the mother admits the kid got her face burnt from wax last time and that's why she's so upset this time.

 

[golfgal]

We don't just dress them up and call them dancers. That statement alone tells me you are pretty much completyely ignorant of what goes into any of this.

As i have said before, it is not so much the outfits that bother mealthough I do beileve there is a huge difference between pagent attire and dance attire. Dancers don't put on fake hair, fake teeth or spray tans. The purpose is not to make little girls look sexy, despite what you seem to think. What bothers me about what I have experienced of the pagent world is the fact that it seems to tear girls down rather than build them up, but as I stated that is my experience. I don't think it is fair to sterotype eveyone who participates in anything based on the actions of a few. I notice you didn't give an answer as to my assessment of travel sports. Seriuosly, isn't it the same thing dressed up in a different package? The glory of being dressed up and on stage traded for the glory of winning??

I have to agree with Fred on this one, for the competition sect of dancing, the moms, costumes and the flaunting of the girls is no better then what you see in the pageants. The girls are heavily made up, the DO wear fake hair, spray tan, over do the make-up etc. Maybe not in your gym but all you have to do is turn on ESPN to watch nationals and see that this IS the case. IT is all about how you look. No one is denying the athleticism it takes to do this, but the focus is still on how you look. There is also just the "attitude" that goes along with this. For a real dance studio, ballet focused, no, you don't see this, but for the dance line/comp squad type cheerleading it is most defiantly there.

When I was in the Colorguard, make up was not for glamor or glitz, it was to help show expression. That's why it was the darkest eyeliner, brightest red lipstick, dark blush, and you ALWAYS had to smile on stage (unless the role calls for something different). Hair is always pulled back in a bun, ponytail, or braid.

Girls and guys came in all different shapes and sizes, but at the same time, the amount of exercise and activity that goes into these things, keeps the person in shape. Plus the better shape, the easier it is to do those things. It's more of a result than the purpose of being part of dancing.

No one has fake tans, fake teeth, or fake hair.

That is not true today. There are plenty of marching bands where the colorguard all has hair extensions, all have fake tans, etc. Heck, one competition we were at a couple years ago the judges had handfulls of hair extensions that fell off during the show for one band. Other bands have strict guidelines on how tall you have to be, how much you weigh, how long your hair is, etc.

 

[Disney Doll]

So I agree with your general sentiments about this specific thing, but probably disagree with you about comparable sentiments related to other things. So there is no practical difference between this and, say, bluegrass music (which I don't like). If we're unwilling or unable to get laws passed against it, then it isn't our place to say what is or is not "no business".

And no, I don't think people who enjoy bluegrass music should be shot.

You know what bicker, it's my place to say pretty much anything I want about anything on a message board, as long as it meets the guidelines of the board and is not vulgar or threatening.

And you, and everyone else, have every right to disagree with me.

And I agree with everyone who has said that toddlers being put into this position is sick and shows a great deal of poor judgement on the part of their parents.

 

[Disney Doll]

Wishing someone shot because you don't agree with what they do is a bit extreme.

While they may not parent per your accepted standards, wishing them dead isn't the way to go.

ETA: Yes, I am aware it is an expression.

Well then why would you comment on it?

 

[Becky2005]

But unfortunately this isn't what makes tv so glamorous. It's nice to see it being done in a good way, and for a good cause. There are kids and parents that can do it for fun, and make it a special moment.

Has your daughter noticed any of the girls, that have been doing it for years longer than her, having issues with self beauty and self esteem?? That's a big concern about the ones on tv, is how much emphasis is placed on these kids to be perfect, and at such a young age. Some of these over the top moms are teaching them things that they shouldn't even understand at a young age like that.

Not that we noticed. There were girls there she didn't care for but out of 165 girls that is going to happen! The few she met and became friends with they are really nice! One has gone on to win one of the Preliminaries in Miss Outstanding Teen now and in the running for the state title. The funniest thing ever was it was a round about way we met. I was sitting in the audience, heard someone talking about how his wife was a gymnastics judge & I KNEW she had looked familiar! Turns out she had judged many of DD's gymnastics competitions AND she knew DD's gymnastics/cheerleading coach (because her coach is also a certified gymnastics judge). She also overheard me mentioning to someone about DD's story since her first pageant was only 6 months after her surgery! Her daughter is also a very talented dancer. Her daughter and herself helped us out at our pageant and they were a BIG help (last year was our first year so we had some kinks that hopefully are worked out this year! ).

So, in our area I guess dance, gymnastics & pageants all blend together although you don't hear a lot about a ton of pageants. If I hadn't researched I would have had no way to know there was this HUGE pageant happening nearby but they basically take over the entire resort every year.

Since DD is moving up to a new division this year, it will be different. I don't know if the one family is also moving up or if they are still in Jr. Teen and well...due to the Outstanding Teen rules her friend won't be competing I am 99% sure she would have still be in Jr. Teen this year due to the way the deadline for birthdates fall. You compete at what your age is on Jan. 1 even though the competition isn't until Sept. So DD will be competing as a 16 year old even though she's nearly 17 1/2 and last year she competed WITH braces on even (no flippers to be found! I'm 99% sure those are against the rules anyway).

 

[princessmom29]

No, I'm a girl. I still don't see the difference. Hoochie is hoochie, whether you are a pageant kid or not.

As far a travel sports go, I don't think I've ever seen a travel team with glitter, tutus and sparkly slippers. But, I've already stated, I haven't seen everything.

Going for a win isn't just for sports kids. Again, if the child enjoys it, I don't see the harm. YOU are the best judge of your child. Or at least, you should be.

http://www.dancedejavu.com/JAZZpg1.html - some recital dresses

http://www.dancedejavu.com/CHARACTER.html - more

http://www.pageantdesigns.com/in-stock-girls-short-pageant-dresses.html - some pageant dresses

http://www.pageantdesigns.com/in-stock-girls-long-pageant-dresses.html - more

You can go over the top with either, or be more sedate. I don't see much of a difference, other than the pageant dresses look a bit better made.

YOu picked trhe absolute worst examples you can find of dance costumes. Those are HORRIBLE. Here are some my DD wore this year. These are what they are SUPPOSED to look like:
http://www.weissmansreadytoship.com/tiny_ballet/4956.aspx
https://curtaincallcostumes.com/products/product-page-t.php?prodid=1693
I don't see much resemblance to pagent dresses. Our studion would NEVER use most of what you showed. TACKY.

If that is the misconception of what I said, let me retract that.

There are many other avenues that people try to pretend are more acceptable for little girls other than pageants. My problem lies in the fact that if you are going to hate on pageants because of the way the girls dress, then you need to pony up to the fact that many (NOT ALL) dance recital costumes are are far more provocative than any pageant dresses. Just as glitzy, just as over the top.

If you have other problems with pageants, like the girl who posted about being told she didn't fit the mold, fine. But don't say your major problem with the whole thing is the costuming and hair and compare it unfavorably to dance costuming. Because that's just ridiculous.

There are many parents forcing their kids to do the dance recitals and "you name" to fulfill there unfulfilled dreams, not only pageant kids. Let the kids be kids, let them do something they love, as long as they aren't getting hurt, who cares? You can't protect them from every thing. There's always someone not quite good enough to make the cut, that's a lesson everyone learns eventually.

Like I have been saying, my problem with pagents is NOT the makeup, dresses ect though I do feel they are too much and not at all like dance costumes. My problem is that it teaches little girls that you have to be pretty and fake to be a winner, or to accepted and like. Dance, at least the way we do it, doesn't do that.

Really? Did you bother to look at the "dance costumes"? Because a few of those aren't all about enhancing the dance, unless of course it's the dance of the 7 veils.

If you are going to compare the costumes, many of the dance costumes are much more provocative than the frilly glitz dresses many of the pageant girls wear. Again, there are many people who push their kids in these events just the pageant kids.

I wasn't talking about the "deep wonderful things kids learn from participating" in these things really, I was talking about how if you think the pageant kids outfits are too much, you need to see some of the dance recitals going on around the country, because their outfits are much worse, much sexier, much more over the top adult looking.

Also, if done right, the pageant thing could be a lot of fun for a girl and her mom or dad. The people zeroed in for these shows are the over the top people, the people with story, the people that will make an impact. Are there a lot of them? Sure. So what? There are a lot of pushy parents out there. If they did a show on dance or cheer, you'd see them there too.

The key word is SOME recitals. Far from all of them do this, in fact , I can only think of one studio locally who pushes that kind of thing. All of them compete but there is only one that uses the over the top costumes.

In my expereince, very few parents in the pagent world can "do it right". The very quickly get caught up in that world and become some version of what you see on TV. Yes, those are the most extreme example, but typically, if you spend any time at all in that world, you end up going there. The only poeple I know wo don't only do 100% natural pagents where no makeup ect is allowed, and there are no glitz dresses.

I have to agree with Fred on this one, for the competition sect of dancing, the moms, costumes and the flaunting of the girls is no better then what you see in the pageants. The girls are heavily made up, the DO wear fake hair, spray tan, over do the make-up etc. Maybe not in your gym but all you have to do is turn on ESPN to watch nationals and see that this IS the case. IT is all about how you look. No one is denying the athleticism it takes to do this, but the focus is still on how you look. There is also just the "attitude" that goes along with this. For a real dance studio, ballet focused, no, you don't see this, but for the dance line/comp squad type cheerleading it is most defiantly there.



That is not true today. There are plenty of marching bands where the colorguard all has hair extensions, all have fake tans, etc. Heck, one competition we were at a couple years ago the judges had handfulls of hair extensions that fell off during the show for one band. Other bands have strict guidelines on how tall you have to be, how much you weigh, how long your hair is, etc.

I don't know of a single competition dance or cheer mom(and I know MANY of them) that tans her DD. ONE cheer gym uses a small hairpiece, and the parents really don't like it so I doubt it will be in the cards next year. For most of those girls, the curls ARE their real hair. You can tell the difference if you know what to look for. We recently watched all star nationals on ESPN, and I only spotted one team with hairpieces. Tanning never even entered my mind so I wasn't looking for that. Several of our local gyms make nationals every year. So no, not everyone that competes on a ntoional level does those things.

I did cologuard in high school and college along with dance. I have NEVER heard of weigh ins or height checks for cologuard. We didn't do tanning, fake hair, or anything other than normal stage makeup. Neither did any squad we played. Dance teams did, but college dance teams are NOT something I want DD involved in. They are way to cutthroat. I watched friends starve themselves and use laxitives to make weight to dance. THAT atmosphere is destructive, but a well run studio that takes kids as threy are is not, and most dance studios that compete are just that. Very few actually exhibit the over the top behavior you are talking about, but those are typically the ones you see, becuase everyone is talking about how over the top they are.

 

[luvsJack]

I don't know about that... put yourself out there and rip your body apart to win an athletic scholarship, or be pretty and say what they want to hear and win a a pageant scholarship? Hmmmm....

An athletic scholarship doesn't have to be about tearing your body apart.

I would rather know that dd earns one by doing something other than "being pretty". As long as the girl who gets the pagent scholarship doesn't set her whole world on her looks and knows she can accomplish things because of her abilities--good for her and I think the scholarships are great. But some of these little girls on this show, because of these idiot mothers, are going to grow up thinking everything they can do is because of their looks.

I have to agree with Fred on this one, for the competition sect of dancing, the moms, costumes and the flaunting of the girls is no better then what you see in the pageants. The girls are heavily made up, the DO wear fake hair, spray tan, over do the make-up etc. Maybe not in your gym but all you have to do is turn on ESPN to watch nationals and see that this IS the case. IT is all about how you look. No one is denying the athleticism it takes to do this, but the focus is still on how you look. There is also just the "attitude" that goes along with this. For a real dance studio, ballet focused, no, you don't see this, but for the dance line/comp squad type cheerleading it is most defiantly there.

No, the FOCUS is on the ability to cheer not on their looks. They may all do some of these things to look "uniform" but the focus is not on their looks. I have been around a lot of girls that cheer competitively and know of no "attitude". And actually there are several squads here that have one national comps and they do not use spray tans or fake hair--only make up with glitter

That is not true today. There are plenty of marching bands where the colorguard all has hair extensions, all have fake tans, etc. Heck, one competition we were at a couple years ago the judges had handfulls of hair extensions that fell off during the show for one band. Other bands have strict guidelines on how tall you have to be, how much you weigh, how long your hair is, etc.

Are these band members told that they have to do these things to "look better"? or is it so that they all look the same? And I would have to ask the band director what hair extensions had to do with performing in the band.

For me, its not just what these girls wear. Its the thought process that they NEED flippers because their natural little girl teeth aren't pretty enough. That a 3 year old NEEDS a spray tan. That these children are at these pagents crying in the back because they are tired and they don't want to do this and these "mothers" keep pushing them. At that point it ceases to be something for the child and starts to be for the mother.


All of my kids have stayed involved in something from the time they were very young. And everything was a choice for them, not for me. And at no time would I have ever let someone push dd to do something to change her looks. A little glitter or heavy lipstick so that they shine on stage is one thing. Something that makes a child look years older is completely different. IMHO, there is no reason for pagents that change the way the child looks.

 

[FredinFL]

The dance outfits I found were on the first sight that popped up when I looked for them. I agree, the are some of the worst I've ever seen myself. Some of the were a lot like I've seen friends have their kids wear for dance competitions or recitals. Sometimes they absolutely cringe at the costumes that get chosen.

When my daughters did dance they had absolutely adorable little ballerina outfits, it's usually the hip hop/Jazz that have the most out there costumes.

As with dance, the cheer also depends on your studio and/or, I don't know what to call it, league? The general group you cheer against? I'm not sure of the particulars. My friends dd used to have the fake hair ponytail curls when they were littler. They don't use the fake hair now.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Well then why would you comment on it?

Because he wrote it and I was expressing my opinion. If OP was not open to discussion, why would he post it in the first place?

I added my edit as I found it funny that folks thought that I believed the OP to be serious. I was saving them the trouble.

If you don't agree with what I posted, that is okay as well.

 

[Disney Doll]

Seems silly to comment on a remark that you knew was in jest as if you didn' know it was in jest, but hey, knock your socks off!