ABD China changes?

neurosx1983

Mouseketeer
Joined
Nov 16, 2019
One thing I learned from the DIS podcast was that ABD is a niche custom travel company and to unravel the trips and cancel trips is a complicated scenario because they rely on outside vendors. It's really too bad that they cannot offer more flexible policies for current trips in 2020, esp July and August guests. And even the 2021 flexible policy must be booked by June, but what about displaced guests in the future? I really like the Amawaterways "Travel with Peace of Mind" policy. I would definitely book future ABDs if I could have the piece of mind when I booked, without all these 'book by' limitations.

If Disney truly has BILLIONS, they could at least offer the Amawaterways type of policy to us, their most dedicated supporters of their business. I would love it if ABD could offer a similar 'Travel Waiver Plus' for $80/$175 per person!


Travel with Peace of Mind
APPLICABLE FOR FUTURE SAILINGS (COMMENCING AUGUST 1, 2020)

In light of the recent global events and uncertainties around travel, we wish to offer our guests additional flexibility and peace of mind so they may continue to safeguard the wonderful plans they have made for their much-anticipated river cruise with AmaWaterways. As a result, we will offer for a limited time, special provisions which allow guests with new or existing reservations to purchase AmaWaterways Travel Waiver Plus*. AmaWaterways Travel Waiver Plus provides cancellation for any reason, up to 24 hours prior to the start of their AmaWaterways booked services (cruise, pre-cruise land extensions, air etc.)

Should guests decide to cancel their cruise for any reason, they will have the following options based on date of cancellation:
  • Cancellation received up to 7 days prior to start of AmaWaterways services:
    Future Cruise Credit** covering cancellation penalties, and the balance will be refunded based on our standard cancellation policy for services purchased through AmaWaterways.
  • Cancellation received between 6 days to 24 hours prior to start of AmaWaterways services:
    Future Cruise Credit** issued for 100% of AmaWaterways services to be used towards any sailings within 24 months of cancellation date
For all new or existing reservations for Europe and Southeast Asia (deposited or paid in full), Travel Waiver Plus may be purchased up to 48 hours prior to the start of AmaWaterways purchased services. For Africa Safaris & Wildlife Cruises, Travel Waiver Plus must be purchased within 90 days prior to sailing and once full payment has been received.
Travel Waiver Plus price:

  • $80 per person – for those who purchase AmaWaterways Cruise Protection Plan*
  • $175 per person – if purchased without AmaWaterways Cruise Protection Plan* or if you have purchased travel protection independently
I heard this on the dis show too and I frankly don't buy it. Disney has to work out how to cancel with their hotels and tour guides and restaurants themselves and leave us as the customers out of that process. It's not our problem. That's the whole reason we pay at least a 30-50% premium by using ABD versus doing the same itinerary on our own...we shouldn't have to worry about the process of undoing it.
 

lovetotravel

Mouseketeer
Joined
Sep 23, 2005
I heard this on the dis show too and I frankly don't buy it. Disney has to work out how to cancel with their hotels and tour guides and restaurants themselves and leave us as the customers out of that process. It's not our problem. That's the whole reason we pay at least a 30-50% premium by using ABD versus doing the same itinerary on our own...we shouldn't have to worry about the process of undoing it.
I agree with this!!
 

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disneyholic family

disney on my mind....
Joined
Jan 31, 2002
Yes they have billions in cash, but consider that the end of the second quarter of their fiscal year their profit just fell 91%, and if you think about it, COVID only was a thing for the second part of March. Their next quarter will most likely be worse.

I think its the same idea of the airlines not wanting to give refunds either...they're cash strapped. United/Delta/AA and Disney, if you think about it, are just a super scaled up version of a mom and pop store that's bleeding business. Their revenues are huge (in the billions) but I'm guessing they're spending billions also... Same reason United apparently needed a bailout from the govt.

I'm not an economist so maybe I'm not one to talk. I'll stick to brain surgery!
My husband is an economist and he's much more cynical.
He doesn't think it's a cash issue, but rather that Disney holds off canceling in the hopes that the guests will cancel first resulting in Disney keeping the deposit.

that also makes sense to me. LOL
 
  • MiddKid

    Earning My Ears
    Joined
    Feb 19, 2017
    Yes they have billions in cash, but consider that the end of the second quarter of their fiscal year their profit just fell 91%, and if you think about it, COVID only was a thing for the second part of March. Their next quarter will most likely be worse.

    I think its the same idea of the airlines not wanting to give refunds either...they're cash strapped. United/Delta/AA and Disney, if you think about it, are just a super scaled up version of a mom and pop store that's bleeding business. Their revenues are huge (in the billions) but I'm guessing they're spending billions also... Same reason United apparently needed a bailout from the govt.

    I'm not an economist so maybe I'm not one to talk. I'll stick to brain surgery!
    There is a difference between a loss on the income statement and being cash strapped. In the quarter ended March 28, TWDC had a net income of approximately $460M. Yes, it's down year over year, and yes next quarter will be worse, but they still made money. Now let's look at cash...

    Cash (and equivalent) on hand as of 3/28 was $14.3 billion. This is literally liquid cash they can tap right now. It doesn't even account for the various ways a company can quickly generate cash by leveraging their assets. Additionally, in the last few weeks they've also secured over $12B in new cash flow via debt offerings and lines of credit. This coupled with active cost management actions (furloughs, construction shut downs, etc) means they will be far from cash strapped any time soon. Did the business take a dive? Absolutely. Cash strapped? Not so much.

    Now, let's circle back to ABD. If you listened to the most recent earnings call today you'd hear them say that while the Cruise Line is extremely popular, it is an extremely small percentage of the overall Parks/Resorts/Products division. ABD, we can assume, is fly on the DCL back. TWDC could refund all of the ABD trips and not break a sweat financially. It's a TINY business.

    And to @lovetotravel 's post about it being "complicated" to unravel, I'd argue it's a lot simpler than most businesses. Talking about using outside vendors...most every company in the world uses outside vendors. When Apple's iPhone volumes drop, they need to deal with outside vendors for component sourcing, production, packaging, transportation, distribution, and more. ABD is simpler than that.

    Not saying this for any purposes other than saying the Walt Disney Company is fine. ABD isn't holding off on cancelling because the company is cash strapped or because it's incredibly difficult to work with outside vendors. They are doing it because they want to avoid refunds as much as possible from a business management/profit maximization perspective. I have a July 4 trip to Norway still on the books. Am I annoyed that they haven't cancelled? Yes. Do I get it? Of course. Do I feel bad for them because they are "cash strapped" or "bleeding?" Heck no.

    Final thought:
    Bleeding, cash strapped business: Norwegian Air (which we are booked on to get to our 7/4 trip): Needed a massive bailout/rescue plan this week. Converting $1B in debt into stock. Stock is trading at $0.48/share. Talking about halting operations until 2022.

    Vs.

    Disney: After today's earning report stock is at $98.70 in after hours down 2%. Market Cap of $183B. Questions on today's earnings call were about what the parks would look like upon re-opening, when content production would start back up, and whether or not they may launch Hulu earlier in Europe (to name a few). There was very little concern about cash position and the long term viability of the business.
     

    laceltris3

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Oct 23, 2013
    I too was unpersuaded by the explanation that they have to work with outside vendors. I mean, Tauck has outside vendors for hotel and transportation and local guides and activities, and they seem to not want to punish their customers for it. You can't book Tauck online either, so the spiel about it all being hand crafted was... meh.

    Our 2020 trip is finally dead. The last cancellation I was waiting for, Air France, came through. I was glad they cancelled for June/July now and didn't make me play cancellation chicken.

    We have DCL booked for Christmas, but I assume we will not go. I cannot imagine we will, as a matter of fact.

    I am so sad that our spring break, summer, and Christmas travel plans are all dead. I know it's a small problem, but I get so much joy from traveling with the kids, and my oldest starts high school this year.

    I think I will go ahead and book with TB. It'll still be transferable, and with the extra $500 per person they gave me for leaving the money, it's so so nice. I will for sure wait on booking airfare until next spring, though. I normally by 10 months out and cannot see doing that again!
     
  • AquaDame

    DCL
    Moderator
    Joined
    Jul 7, 2010
    One thing I learned from the DIS podcast was that ABD is a niche custom travel company and to unravel the trips and cancel trips is a complicated scenario because they rely on outside vendors. It's really too bad that they cannot offer more flexible policies for current trips in 2020, esp July and August guests. And even the 2021 flexible policy must be booked by June, but what about displaced guests in the future? I really like the Amawaterways "Travel with Peace of Mind" policy. I would definitely book future ABDs if I could have the piece of mind when I booked, without all these 'book by' limitations.

    If Disney truly has BILLIONS, they could at least offer the Amawaterways type of policy to us, their most dedicated supporters of their business. I would love it if ABD could offer a similar 'Travel Waiver Plus' for $80/$175 per person!


    Travel with Peace of Mind
    APPLICABLE FOR FUTURE SAILINGS (COMMENCING AUGUST 1, 2020)

    In light of the recent global events and uncertainties around travel, we wish to offer our guests additional flexibility and peace of mind so they may continue to safeguard the wonderful plans they have made for their much-anticipated river cruise with AmaWaterways. As a result, we will offer for a limited time, special provisions which allow guests with new or existing reservations to purchase AmaWaterways Travel Waiver Plus*. AmaWaterways Travel Waiver Plus provides cancellation for any reason, up to 24 hours prior to the start of their AmaWaterways booked services (cruise, pre-cruise land extensions, air etc.)

    Should guests decide to cancel their cruise for any reason, they will have the following options based on date of cancellation:
    • Cancellation received up to 7 days prior to start of AmaWaterways services:
      Future Cruise Credit** covering cancellation penalties, and the balance will be refunded based on our standard cancellation policy for services purchased through AmaWaterways.
    • Cancellation received between 6 days to 24 hours prior to start of AmaWaterways services:
      Future Cruise Credit** issued for 100% of AmaWaterways services to be used towards any sailings within 24 months of cancellation date
    For all new or existing reservations for Europe and Southeast Asia (deposited or paid in full), Travel Waiver Plus may be purchased up to 48 hours prior to the start of AmaWaterways purchased services. For Africa Safaris & Wildlife Cruises, Travel Waiver Plus must be purchased within 90 days prior to sailing and once full payment has been received.
    Travel Waiver Plus price:

    • $80 per person – for those who purchase AmaWaterways Cruise Protection Plan*
    • $175 per person – if purchased without AmaWaterways Cruise Protection Plan* or if you have purchased travel protection independently
    I... I want this for our May Rhine...! :headache:
     

    Sakura1017

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Apr 26, 2019
    So Im still waiting for Disney to cancel my trip. Looks like for 2020 they only have the Sept and October dates listed right now. I'm so confused because for the September trip, which is the one I am waiting for them to cancel, it says now accepting waitlist, as well as available for private group travel. So is this group full then? I doubt many people are wanting to travel to this destination without a vaccine yet. I would love for them to give me my deposit back so I have to wait for them to officially cancel. CDC still has level 3 warning to avoid all non-essential international travel.
     

    Sakura1017

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Apr 26, 2019
    Disney is so incredibly cash strapped right now that they’re going to wait until the absolute last second to cancel because they want to hang on to as much cash as possible. Their entire business is crumbling.
    Yes they can continue to keep our money and build interest when it's in their hands. Their probably also gonna wait about 30 days until you get a refund as well.
     
  • StephHow83

    Earning My Ears
    Joined
    Apr 29, 2020
    So Im still waiting for Disney to cancel my trip. Looks like for 2020 they only have the Sept and October dates listed right now. I'm so confused because for the September trip, which is the one I am waiting for them to cancel, it says now accepting waitlist, as well as available for private group travel. So is this group full then? I doubt many people are wanting to travel to this destination without a vaccine yet. I would love for them to give me my deposit back so I have to wait for them to officially cancel. CDC still has level 3 warning to avoid all non-essential international travel.
    Yes be patient...wait for them to cancel...our July 5th trip just canceled 2 days ago 😒
     

    dolewhipdreams

    Counting days until my next Dole Whip
    Joined
    Feb 24, 2017
    So Im still waiting for Disney to cancel my trip. Looks like for 2020 they only have the Sept and October dates listed right now. I'm so confused because for the September trip, which is the one I am waiting for them to cancel, it says now accepting waitlist, as well as available for private group travel. So is this group full then? I doubt many people are wanting to travel to this destination without a vaccine yet. I would love for them to give me my deposit back so I have to wait for them to officially cancel. CDC still has level 3 warning to avoid all non-essential international travel.
    I feel for you. We were in the exact same boat with our August 30 trip until about a week ago. My guess is that it will be cancelled soon, since it is showing the private group travel message.

    Just for reference, my cancellation came 116 days before the scheduled departure, which obviously isn't any sort of round number. So I'm not certain that they have any sort of defined rule around timing for cancellations right now.
     

    sayhello

    Have Camera, Will Travel
    Joined
    Oct 28, 2006
    So Im still waiting for Disney to cancel my trip. Looks like for 2020 they only have the Sept and October dates listed right now. I'm so confused because for the September trip, which is the one I am waiting for them to cancel, it says now accepting waitlist, as well as available for private group travel. So is this group full then? I doubt many people are wanting to travel to this destination without a vaccine yet. I would love for them to give me my deposit back so I have to wait for them to officially cancel. CDC still has level 3 warning to avoid all non-essential international travel.
    The other day, just before they cancelled all land trips for July, they marked all those trips as "Now Accepting Waitlist - Please Call for Details". But what I also noticed is that they did not remove any other notes that were already out there on the website. So it was "Now Accepting Waitlist - Please Call for Details" and stuff about booking the Escape with the trip, and stuff like that that really didn't apply any more. So I wouldn't put too much thought into the "Available for Private Group Travel - Please Call for Details" note. If you're booked on it, then it can't be a Private Group trip. Unless they cancel your reservation and try to move you to another date, at which point, you ask for your refund. By the way, the July land trips were cancelled less than 24 hours after I saw that all of them were marked as "Available for Private Group Travel - Please Call for Details". I'd wait and see what happens!

    Sayhello
     

    virtuoso1989

    virtuoso1980
    Joined
    Jul 28, 2015
    So Im still waiting for Disney to cancel my trip. Looks like for 2020 they only have the Sept and October dates listed right now. I'm so confused because for the September trip, which is the one I am waiting for them to cancel, it says now accepting waitlist, as well as available for private group travel. So is this group full then? I doubt many people are wanting to travel to this destination without a vaccine yet. I would love for them to give me my deposit back so I have to wait for them to officially cancel. CDC still has level 3 warning to avoid all non-essential international travel.
    We are in the Sept 13 trip. I called today to ask if I could transfer to another trip as I work in healthcare and all international trips need to have a quarantine before I can go back to work. Ours was already transferred from another trip so technically would have been bound to this trip. The vacationista initially said there was no changes for our trip yet so to call back just before the PIF date. She called me back about 10 minutes after and said they were going to allow a one time change. We were going to change to next year's trip on the same week. However, because it is a transfer and not a new booking, we could not get the early bird discount. The new trip would have added $1500 to our original trip. We paid $1750 for the deposit. So if we moved, we'd only "save" $250 vs if we cancel altogether, lose the deposit, and get the early bird next year. plus, we would be restricted, as it was already a transferred fund. We have decided to get a domestic trip around the same time as our original which would have a higher chance of happening, plus I would not have to deal with a quarantine.

    Ps. I had called the other to ask about the trip and so far, there were 13 people booked for the trip. I was told that it was still happening, but idk how many of those people would just cancel anyway. I honestly do not think that China is happening this year.
     

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