A Gifted Child?

[LisaInNc]

I WISH I could investigate other schools they are not available. This is a small southern town and we don't have a lot of resources.

To give you a better picture. About half of public schools don't meet the minimum NC standards. That is NC not national, it makes me shudder! We have the option of transfering to another school in the county, in my opinion none are any better. The middle school and high schools are beyond your worst nightmare. The high school looks like an inner city slum they are infested with gangs and drugs and this is a small southern town. The school she is in has the kids about a year and a half ahead of the public schools on average.

For private schools we have a few options I have her in the best of the lot. There is a private school with a curriculm that is for what I call underachievers, they tend to take the kids that have problems in the public schools. There is an uber conservative Christian School that requires the MOM's to wear skirts when picking up their children and then the school I have her in.

There is no other options. I can and I would drive her an hour to the nearest major city where there is an array of top schools however I think that a 2 hour commute every day for her would really take a lot away from her childhood especiall in the winter where it gets dark so early. She would not be home in time to play outside for very long.

The argument for home schooling is a strong one except she is an only child and I am a hands on Mom and he Dad is very involved with her. She needs time away from her parents, she needs the socialization of the classroom.

By skipping her I am trying to avoid what happened the last 2 years which was a few days a week she cried she didn't want to go to school because it was boring. This is a child that loves to read and can sit still, the boring part wasn't sitting in the classroom she was bored with the content. When we kicked up the work to the second grade material she was a lot happier.

I want to correct this before she gets a negative attitude about school. I want her challenged and excited about learning. Her Dad and I do a lot with her at home to foster this. I am not trying to make her into an uber child that is in college by the time she is 12 my goal is just to make her happy and challenged in school.

So my plan is to see how 3rd grade goes. If she is still bored, well I don't know I will cross that bridge when I get to it.

 

[karenklo]

I had a meeting with the administrator at my DD's school about her skipping a grade. She is 7 and going from first to second grade. She was consistantly bored last year and was given 2nd grade reading, math and history.

Her school administors a standardized test to every student every year. It's the Stamford test.

The results staggered me. She is testing 5th grade level in a lot of areas and 8th grade for math.

I know she is bright but I didn't expect anything like this. What further brought home the point of it was we were shown the other scores of the kids in her class, without names. They were all in the 2-3 grade range. My DD was so much higher in each testing area.


I was also a gifted child and skipped a grade. When I was in 6th grade, they decided I should go to 8th grade. I was fine socially as I am also very tall. The only problem I had was being younger than everyone else. I finally turned 17 right before I graduated from high school. That meant I was 17 my whole freshman year at college. It was just a little weird! Just be careful about burnout. My parents enrolled me in college programs from 8th to 11th grade in addition to high school. By my freshman year, I just wanted to have a break and have some fun!

 

[FOV]

If your daughters school is so small - class sizes of only 6 students - I am wondering why they can't teach to her at a higher level?

I volunteer in my childrens elementary school and within the same classroom some kids are working on multiplication tables, overs have moved onto division and one child has moved to double-digit long division! This is absolutely more difficult for the teacher but a good teacher can juggle muliple levels of teaching.

My daughter is in the "gifted program" at her middle school. It's not perfect but I prefer this to having her skip a grade. I was only 17 when I started college so I am very sensitive to this.

Good luck with your decision - I know first hand how difficult it is!

 

[lurkernj]

When my DS13 was in kindergarten, he could add, subtract, divide, and multiply and was reading Harry Potter in 1st grade . In first grade, he was quite bored and was starting to assume the role of class clown to entertain himself. I met with the principal (teachers request) to see if there was a way to challenge him, he was not open to skipping him a grade. My husband and I were upset that there wasn't much to offer and looked into private schools, and found that we couldn't afford them(homeschool was not an option as we both needed to work).

We were lucky enought to have him placed with an awesome teacher in 2nd grade who challenged each student individually, the class clown act stopped. By 4th grade, other students began to catch up to his level, and while still considered very bright, no longer stood alone. He is going into 8th grade this year and is still at or around the top of his class. While we were initially annoyed, I think keeping him with his peers has been a great move. If he had skipped, he might not have the current confidence level and might not be among the top of his class, which will make a difference when college applications start going out (has wanted to be a brain surgeon since kindergarten, so some scholarship money would be greatly appreciated).

Also, his sports teammates are his classmates and he has some very strong bonds with this group he has been growing up with all along, so socially, keeping him down has worked out for the better as well.

 

[Strangeite]

I agree with some of the earlier responses. Skipping a grade is not as important as keeping her intellectually engaged. I skipped 2nd grade and was still bored out of my mind.

It is you and her father's responsibility as parents to keep her intellectually stimulated and not the schools. I also agree with the father on the subject of home-schooling (no offense to anyone).

I have found that RPGs are a great way to stimulate while being fun. My 10 year old son has been playing RPGs for 4 years and it has never once occurred to him that they are educational.

 

[RumpleMom]

Your school is small enough for them to easily compact and accelerate the curricula. They have done this in the past for your daughter. This would allow her to stay with her age peers and this is important because kids need to be kids and social time is important too. I think just skipping your daughter is the easy way out for your school.

Do you know your daughter's IQ? Do you know the requirements for the Gifted student program for your state, even though it might not be available in your small town? You can call your local school district for the name of someone on the state level to be an advocate for your child. Do a search for the gifted and talented education program in your state, in Pennsylvania it is PAGE.

I really don't believe all of that is necessary because you are in a private school and the classes are flexible. Ask them to write an IEP (Individualized education program) to accelerate her in the areas she needs.

Our large school district provided a gifted program 1-12, and even a math mentor for all of high school math. DD had 4 kids in her high school math classes.

Skipping either of our daughters would have been a mistake. They needed to be with their social peers, but also with their intellectual peers for classes. I believe you change the curricula and not the social interaction.

Both kids have graduated from college, one has married, they are employed in their fields of study and socially well adjusted.

 

[es45]

My kids just spent 3 weeks in an enrichment program that I had just found out about last fall. It's the Johns Hopkins Center for Talented Youth. They have at home courses as well as summer camps (day camps) that your daughter could possibly enjoy. There are other enrichment opportunities out there if you look - I would think the school could possibly provide you with some ideas. I know the CTY has great courses you can do at home, as well as they can be done with your school. They are called "Distance Education". You can check out their website for more advice for gifted children: www.cty.jhu.edu

A talent search for gifted children that is a little closer to you is the Duke University Talent Identification Program. www.tip.duke.edu They offer enrichment opportunities in NC.

 

[shelly3girls]

I do not understand how in a classroom of 6 children, the teacher cannot accomodate your daughter's needs.

Only you can really decided what is best for your child but I wanted to share my experience. As an accelerated child I was always bored. I did go up a grade level for reading and was taught math independently. By the time I hit middle school we were grouped by ability and I was still bored. Once I went to college I finally found a place where I was challenged. Skipping a grade would have done nothing for me other than making me leave my parents home a year younger.

 

[Mickeypooh99]

Your child sounds just like my 7 year old son. He is testing well above grade level in multiple subjects. He has been bored in school. We have decided to skip him from 1st to 3rd grade this fall. He is in a public school, and they were very supportive of our choice. Everyone has their own opinion, and you need to decide the best choice for your child. Something that helped me to decide was a report called a nation deceived. http://www.accelerationinstitute.org/Nation_Deceived/

My son is very comfortable with older children. Some of his best friends are 10 year olds. So I am not concerned with the age difference. My son wants to learn. I think this is one the best reasons we decided to grade skip him. He has been doing an online math program this summer, and is now taking spanish lessons. I find that he thrives on the extra learning. He doesn't want to sit around bored all summer. I never force him to learn, he just wants to. Sitting around in 1st grade was a waste of his time, I won't have him do it again this year in 2nd.

If you are looking for enrichment for your child I would suggest language or music lessons. Also there are many online courses available.

 

[perkinsrose]

Here are some of the books I've borrowed from library or bought in attempts to understand giftedness, challenge & nurture DS at home, and how to advocate for my DS in public school.


Davidson, Jan and Bob with Laura Vanderkam. (2004). Genious Denied: How to Stop Wasting Our Brightest Minds. NY: Simon & Schuster.

Delisle, Ph.D. & Judy Galbraith, M.A. (2002). When Gifted Kids Don’t Have All the Answers: How to meet their social and emotional needs. Minneapolis, MN: Free Spirit Publishing Inc.

Matthews, Dona J., Ph.D and Joanne F. Foster, Ed.D. (2005). Being Smart about Gifted Children: A Guidebook for Parents and Educators. Scottsdale, AZ: Great Potential Press, Inc.

Quart, Alissa. (2006). Hothouse Kids: The Dilemma of the Gifted Child. NY: Penguin Press.

Strip, Carol A., Ph.D. and Gretchen Hirsch. (2000). Helping Gifted Children Soar: A Practical Guide for Parents and Teachers. Scottsdale, AZ: Great Potential Press, Inc.

Welte, Leah. (1996). Challenging Gifted Children. Westminster, CA: Teacher Created Materials, Inc.

Walker, Sally Yahnke Walker, Ph.D.
The Survival Guide for Parents of Gifted Kids: How to understand, live with, and stick up for your gifted child.

Smutny, Joan Franklin
Stand up for your Gifted Child: How to make the most of kids’ strengths at school and at home.

Gailbraith, Judy M.A.
You Know your Child is gifted when…

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"gifted" lists on listmania at AMAZON.COM

https://www.amazon.com/gp/community..._rpli/?query=gifted&search-alias=rp-listmania

 

[perkinsrose]

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1653653,00.html

TIME magazine article



http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/08/26/AR2007082600909.html

The Gifted Children Left Behind

 

[K and K's Mommy]

Perkinsrose - Thanks for the resources!

Both of my oldest are in gifted programs. I am so thankful my district has a strong gifted program. They are tested in kindergarten and then have their own classrooms. My son is very gifted. He taught himself to read at 4. There is no way he could have skipped a grade. He is young for his grade anyway, and he still seems socially immature. My DD on the other hand is very mature socially, but academically she'll be fine right where she is!

I want to encourage you all to be advocates for gifted education. Like I said, I am extremely lucky to have a gifted program in my area. All the teachers are endorsed with a gifted and talented endorsement so they understand these kids. I worry much more about my DS because of his perfectionism, unwillingness to try new things because of fear of failure (BIKE RIDING), and his social issues. It really does help that he is in a class with kids who are somewhat like him although they are definitely still each individuals. My DD tested into the program, but her scores are not as high. Quite honestly, I worry less about her because she doesn't have near as many other issues. She relates much more to everyone around her.

OP - good luck! With your situation, I think I would probably skip. I have a cousin who skipped 7th and just graduated from college. He starts medical school this fall so he will not be entering the work force at 20.

 

[Chad&Janet]

I think it to be an interesting topic. When I was in school, our public school gifted program was likely a little under-funded, so they wouldn't take very many. The requirement was for the child to score quite high on the Stamford Binet. Not sure what kind of criteria they used to choose the children who were actually tested. I have heard of modern gifted programs strictly going by grades or GPA to ascertain "giftedness," which I don't think makes much sense.

Anyway, the mother of a friend of mine was super pushy about getting her son into the gifted program. When I was over at her house, I would get quizzed about what we did in gifted and if I remembered how I got into the program. She forced the school to test her son repeatedly (his older brother had been classified as gifted) only for him to fail to meet the requirements each and every time.

I think moms especially can be over-bearing about this. It's yet another way to separate/segregate ourselves from others. (i.e. I'm Methodist, I'm Baptist, I'm Church of God). My friend, I'm sure, left high school with a feeling of lacking talent in some way; since he could never quite meet the requirement.

I agree that gifted programs need to be in place, but some of these modern programs are placing up to half of the school in gifted. At most, 10% of a given population should be classified as such. A moderately gifted child should test 130 or higher on the Stamford Binet and a highly gifted child should test 145 or higher. If your child falls into this category, it should be kept quiet and nurtured privately away from other students. I also feel that the child should definitely NOT be told of any test results.

 

[proteus]

I agree with some of the earlier responses. Skipping a grade is not as important as keeping her intellectually engaged. I skipped 2nd grade and was still bored out of my mind.

It is you and her father's responsibility as parents to keep her intellectually stimulated and not the schools. I also agree with the father on the subject of home-schooling (no offense to anyone).

I have found that RPGs are a great way to stimulate while being fun. My 10 year old son has been playing RPGs for 4 years and it has never once occurred to him that they are educational.

I don't understand the comment that the parents are responsible for keeping a child stimulated instead of the schools. If the child is repeating work they have already mastered in school what is the point of going to school?

I was gifted in math and was excited to start in 5th grade. On the first day of school I took my math book home and over the next two weeks completed the entire book and handed in all the assignments for each chapter. It was not very challenging and I looked forward to doing 6th grade math. Instead the teacher put me in the back of the room and had me do puzzles for the rest of the year. I was so discouraged that my interest in math declined and I felt like I was being punished for working so hard.

I understand the social issues but is it more important to get a good education or hold back a student because you are concerned that he/she may not adapt to a higher grade? My DD mastered cursive in 2nd grade, she could do complete sentences. In 3rd grade she went from private to public school where they were learning how to do cursive letters. Instead of recognizing that she was way ahead (in all other areas as well) they kept her in 3rd grade and she complained of being bored for the entire year. This was clearly a waste of time and like my case only serves to discourage the child. The message is if you work hard and are bright you will be held back so don't bother.

 

[perkinsrose]

Perkinsrose - Thanks for the resources!

Both of my oldest are in gifted programs. I am so thankful my district has a strong gifted program. They are tested in kindergarten and then have their own classrooms. My son is very gifted. He taught himself to read at 4. There is no way he could have skipped a grade. He is young for his grade anyway, and he still seems socially immature. My DD on the other hand is very mature socially, but academically she'll be fine right where she is!

I want to encourage you all to be advocates for gifted education. Like I said, I am extremely lucky to have a gifted program in my area. All the teachers are endorsed with a gifted and talented endorsement so they understand these kids. I worry much more about my DS because of his perfectionism, unwillingness to try new things because of fear of failure (BIKE RIDING), and his social issues. It really does help that he is in a class with kids who are somewhat like him although they are definitely still each individuals. My DD tested into the program, but her scores are not as high. Quite honestly, I worry less about her because she doesn't have near as many other issues. She relates much more to everyone around her.

OP - good luck! With your situation, I think I would probably skip. I have a cousin who skipped 7th and just graduated from college. He starts medical school this fall so he will not be entering the work force at 20.

We have some of the same issues related to DS giftedness like perfectionism. DS hadn't gotten really good at bike riding til 8 1/2 yrs. (our neighbors kids were whipping around without training wheels at age 3 or 4 !!)

I have not had my youngest IQ tested. (we went to local university and paid $250 for Wechsler IQ testing). I worry about comparing the two kids if I eventually have her tested. I suspect she is also gifted but not sure how much a score would help her at this point. With DS, the official label that came with IQ results was the hard evidence i needed to advocate for him in pub. school. For now, do what i can at home with DS and really do the same for DD6.

things i do at home:
play chess (even kindergartners can learn!)
board games
read aloud good kids' novels (and talk about it!)
encourage independent reading
encourage writing/journals
visit museums & zoos
watch & discuss documentaries
("the Universe"series on right now is really neat)
do math workbooks in the summer

as well as do other things/actvities (not focussing on cognitive development) to keep them active, well-rounded & happy!

 

[moopdog]

My DS-7.5 had extensive testing outside of our school in the Spring, and tested at a (I guess) higher than average IQ of 126. The Dr. who tested him said that in reality it would be much higher if he didn't also have a "touch" of ADD and also Tourette Disorder.

The school, however could care less. They seem to act like it's nothing special. My son also has a small class of 10 students. Because of this, I am not overly concerned. I don't want him to skip for that reason alone - the next class up has 20. Also I don't want more attention drawn to him than he may already get with his Tourette's, as his classmates are "used" to him. We will teach him extra at home, and hope it's enough... when he's eligible for our enrichment program in the 4th grade, I hope that also helps. BTW, he tested at college level in some things - my DH and I were both FLOORED by that, because to speak with he seems quite normal... not Doogie Howser by any means! LOL.

Now my REAL concern is my 5 year old DD who will enter kindergarten this year into an over-filled class of 29! She is already reading at 'almost' the same level of my son and WE NEVER TAUGHT her how!! She is average in all other aspects, so it will be interesting to see how she makes out. Wish us luck and I'll do the same for you!

 

[Longsx3]

We considered skipping DD(12) a grade mid 2nd grade at her teachers urging as she was already receiving gifted services. We decided against it.

There were several reasons why, but really it came down to for our DD as I believe with most gifted children it isn't that she knows everything it is the pace at which she learns everything. She typically only needs to be exposed to a topic once, we felt if we skipped 2nd grade we could be forced with the same choice again in the future. Instead we worked with her teachers each year to provide her with modified class work and it has worked out very well. I will also say that age played a part in our decision, DD's bday is August so she is already one of the youngest for her grade, skipping a grade would make her almost 2yrs younger than other students, we did not feel comfortable with that. We felt that if we double promoted her that when High school hit and she was 13 going into 9th grade and wanted to do a typical H.S. activity that we could not say no because she is only 13 as opposed to 14-15 when it was our choice not hers.

5yrs later here is what we have learned from our choice, While she still does very well socially, she didn't have any real issues until 4th grade for her that is when the kids really started to notice a difference and when some teasing began had we double promoted her she would have been exposed to that teasing a year younger and I would not have wanted that for her.
Academically she is still outstanding, even though there were times in school where she waited for the other kids to catch up she has learned how to fill that time herself, either by helping some one else, working on some extended curriculum or enjoying her book.

Finally not skipping a grade has not stunted her learning process, at the end of this past year she did an achievement test, this test was done to see where she was academically ....her overall level was over 4grades higher. I know what a tough choice this can be and every child is different but I would encourage your school to work with your DD in her current grade.

 

[perkinsrose]

I think it to be an interesting topic. When I was in school, our public school gifted program was likely a little under-funded, so they wouldn't take very many. The requirement was for the child to score quite high on the Stamford Binet. Not sure what kind of criteria they used to choose the children who were actually tested. I have heard of modern gifted programs strictly going by grades or GPA to ascertain "giftedness," which I don't think makes much sense.

Anyway, the mother of a friend of mine was super pushy about getting her son into the gifted program. When I was over at her house, I would get quizzed about what we did in gifted and if I remembered how I got into the program. She forced the school to test her son repeatedly (his older brother had been classified as gifted) only for him to fail to meet the requirements each and every time.

I think moms especially can be over-bearing about this. It's yet another way to separate/segregate ourselves from others. (i.e. I'm Methodist, I'm Baptist, I'm Church of God). My friend, I'm sure, left high school with a feeling of lacking talent in some way; since he could never quite meet the requirement.

I agree that gifted programs need to be in place, but some of these modern programs are placing up to half of the school in gifted. At most, 10% of a given population should be classified as such. A moderately gifted child should test 130 or higher on the Stamford Binet and a highly gifted child should test 145 or higher. If your child falls into this category, it should be kept quiet and nurtured privately away from other students. I also feel that the child should definitely NOT be told of any test results.

Do you feel the same way about kids that are learning disabled? Should they be nurtured quietly and privately? Should they not be told that they learn in a different way and need different kinds of support?

 

[zoemurr]

was reading Little House books by herself the summer before preschool.. and has tested with an IQ of 150 on 2 different tests over the years.

K was a disaster. She felt so different from the other kids that she was constantly dumbing herself down. She was pulled for gifted (by herself.. another problem in her book) and her first grade teacher made a whole plan just for her (which looked great on paper, but I really didn't want her doing everything alone, when her self esteem was already plunging.) So, we bumped her up. It took her a long time for her to get back to herself, and to understand that she wasn't so different anymore. The teacher said after 3 days you would have never known she wasn't there the whole time.

So far we have had no social problems, but she is very tall, mature, and easy going. In our case, keeping her back would have caused more problems than promoting her. However, with your small class size, I don't really see why it would be necessary, unless your DD feels singled out by doing different work, as mine would have.

DD really hates for anyone to know she has skipped, and I am forbidden from discussing it in public. She also knows that she is allowed to take a year off between HS and college if she does something productive.

Good luck... it was an easy decision for us, but only you really know your child.

 

[Aristomommy]

I agree that gifted programs need to be in place, but some of these modern programs are placing up to half of the school in gifted. At most, 10% of a given population should be classified as such. A moderately gifted child should test 130 or higher on the Stamford Binet and a highly gifted child should test 145 or higher. If your child falls into this category, it should be kept quiet and nurtured privately away from other students. I also feel that the child should definitely NOT be told of any test results.

Most gifted programs require achievement in the 95th percentile and a high IQ test. That means that at the most the top 5% would receive gifted services, not half. Our school district requires 130+ on the SB-V. A 145 would mean that a child is in the 99.9th percentile. How many children would have that in an average school district? Maybe 1, maybe none.

Gifted children know they are different, they don't need to be told. DD9 knew since she started school that she learned faster than many of her friends and sometimes she "just knows" something without being instructed. It would be irresponsible of me as her parent to ignore it and never discuss it. DD knew she was tested and while I have never told her exact numbers, I have shared after the fact that she qualified for a particular program (such as Davidson Young Scholars). She knows her achievement scores because I feel it does not harm for her to know the results.