A few more dining plan questions

[mickman1962]

If the pooled credits and the whole adult using the so called child credit things was a for real glitch do you think it would take this long for Disney to correct the problem if they were concerned about it? I would suggest that they would have corrected the situation at the begining of this year if they were aware of it and thought it was a problem.

I'm quite sure that 99.9% of the people use the plan in it's intended form, so yes it probably isn't high on Disney's list to fix. Still doesn't make it right. Juts curious about the people who do use the childs plan for adult meals, do you do this elsewhere? or just at Disney? Buy childs lift tickets at the ski lodge and use them for adults? the movies? I ask because to me this has always been and will be a morals issue, not whether or not Disney is making money. I'm sure I probably do some things that you would find morally wrong as well.

 

[mickman1962]

So before the morality police start imaging just what Disney has in mind when viewing the dinning plan I would suggest you look at the entire marketing package and the success it has had before you think Disney has a blind eye on this issue. I think there is a reason that the CM's let people use the plan this was is that Disney doesn't really care. Thier primary objective in the current plan is to get you staying on site and staying at Disney longer and spending more. Just look at the statement about per capita spending being up. So far it appears that the plan along with other changes is more than accomplishing thier goals.

Again thanks for reinforcing my point, why is a person's morality based upon what a company will allow them to do?

 

[Pedler]

Again thanks for reinforcing my point, why is a person's morality based upon what a company will allow them to do?

In this particular case I think that what the company allows them to do is actually what does define the morality of the situation. Those who find this use of the plan immoral tend to equate it to stealing from Disney. If Disney doesn't see it as stealing or immoral then what makes it immoral? Or to put it another way if Disney encourages the activity, which by most accounts they do, then what makes it immoral? If Disney doesn't define it as an abuse then what makes it an abuse of the system?

 

[Pedler]

I'm quite sure that 99.9% of the people use the plan in it's intended form, so yes it probably isn't high on Disney's list to fix. Still doesn't make it right. Juts curious about the people who do use the childs plan for adult meals, do you do this elsewhere? or just at Disney? Buy childs lift tickets at the ski lodge and use them for adults? the movies? I ask because to me this has always been and will be a morals issue, not whether or not Disney is making money. I'm sure I probably do some things that you would find morally wrong as well.

If a company were to issue me a coupon for a meal without restrictions on how to use the coupon I would use it in the best manner to maximize my savings. If the coupon said it was only for a childrens meal then I would use it for that but it this case the dinning plan is just a coupon for a meal. The only restriction is that if a child uses it they have to order from the childrens menu but the coupon itself does not limit who may use it.

 

[thelionqueen]

In this particular case I think that what the company allows them to do is actually what does define the morality of the situation. Those who find this use of the plan immoral tend to equate it to stealing from Disney. If Disney doesn't see it as stealing or immoral then what makes it immoral? Or to put it another way if Disney encourages the activity, which by most accounts they do, then what makes it immoral? If Disney doesn't define it as an abuse then what makes it an abuse of the system?

 

[mickman1962]

I'm sending this letter to Disney, I will let you know their response. I will wait a day or two if anyone has issue with how I wrote it. I think I pretty well described the way the people who disagree with me say that Disney lets the meal plan be used.



To Whom It May Concern:

I'm going to Disneyworld in April with 6 kids and 6 adults. I'm staying in the cabins 6/cabin so I'm going to have one adult and 5 kids (ages 3-8) in one cabin and plan to get the meal plan. I'm will be paying for 5 kid's plans and one adult plan. So according to what I've read on the internet (supposedly all the plan is pooled together and there really is no such thing as adult TS's and child TS's), all 6 adults can now eat all week after only paying for one adult plan and all I have to do is pay out of pocket for the little kids and use the TS's from their plan to buy the adult's dinner and I can save some money. As you can see from my one days savings below, if I do it his way it would be a lot cheaper for me. Is this really allowed?

Thank You

1 adult plan =$35
5 kids plan =$50
6 oop kids meals = $60
total $145

VS.

6 adult plans =$210
6 kids plans =$60
total = $270

 

[Lewisc]

I don't really care what response you get. The rules and procedure for pooling credits are detailed in the brochure and on Disney's website. Disney can certainly change the rules but an email from Disney isn't really enough notice to change the rules to anyone but to the person who gets the email.

Everyone on your reservation must purchase dining. Do you think Disney intended guest split their reservation? Are you planning to stay in the cabin with 5 kids? Are you planning to lie about who's staying in what cabin?

Sorry but your scheme certainly violates the intent of the rule that requires that your entire group purchase dining. The terms of the dining package don't allow you to transfer components. It's not clear if Disney has to allow you to use your credit to purchase meals for people not on your plan.

People who bank child credits are following the writen rules. Your plan is certainly not using the plan as intended.

I'm sending this letter to Disney, I will let you know their response. I will wait a day or two if anyone has issue with how I wrote it. I think I pretty well described the way the people who disagree with me say that Disney lets the meal plan be used.



To Whom It May Concern:

I'm going to Disneyworld in April with 6 kids and 6 adults. I'm staying in the cabins 6/cabin so I'm going to have one adult and 5 kids (ages 3-8) in one cabin and plan to get the meal plan. I'm will be paying for 5 kid's plans and one adult plan. So according to what I've read on the internet (supposedly all the plan is pooled together and there really is no such thing as adult TS's and child TS's), all 6 adults can now eat all week after only paying for one adult plan and all I have to do is pay out of pocket for the little kids and use the TS's from their plan to buy the adult's dinner and I can save some money. As you can see from my one days savings below, if I do it his way it would be a lot cheaper for me. Is this really allowed?

Thank You

1 adult plan =$35
5 kids plan =$50
6 oop kids meals = $60
total $145

VS.

6 adult plans =$210
6 kids plans =$60
total = $270

 

[Pedler]

I'm sending this letter to Disney, I will let you know their response. I will wait a day or two if anyone has issue with how I wrote it. I think I pretty well described the way the people who disagree with me say that Disney lets the meal plan be used.



To Whom It May Concern:

I'm going to Disneyworld in April with 6 kids and 6 adults. I'm staying in the cabins 6/cabin so I'm going to have one adult and 5 kids (ages 3-8) in one cabin and plan to get the meal plan. I'm will be paying for 5 kid's plans and one adult plan. So according to what I've read on the internet (supposedly all the plan is pooled together and there really is no such thing as adult TS's and child TS's), all 6 adults can now eat all week after only paying for one adult plan and all I have to do is pay out of pocket for the little kids and use the TS's from their plan to buy the adult's dinner and I can save some money. As you can see from my one days savings below, if I do it his way it would be a lot cheaper for me. Is this really allowed?

Thank You

1 adult plan =$35
5 kids plan =$50
6 oop kids meals = $60
total $145

VS.

6 adult plans =$210
6 kids plans =$60
total = $270

As LewisC said your definition of what you want to do with the plan is clearly different than using credits for adults that have also paid for the dinning plan. Having said that other people in the past have writting letters about this and the results have been varied. In some cases the CM's have stated that there are child and adult credits when there are not. In other cases they have stated that credits are attached to each individual card when they are not.

Right now I am confident that I could call on this topic and get a variety of answers that contradict each other. The reality of the situation is that credits are not tracked seperately, the brochure states you can use them as you see fit and the CM's at the restaurants not only allow but encourage this activity. The only people that seem to have a problem with it are some folk here at the DIS that are offended by this allowed use of the program and imagine rules and morality that does not exist.

 

[mickman1962]

Everyone on your reservation must purchase dining. Do you think Disney intended guest split their reservation? Are you planning to stay in the cabin with 5 kids? Are you planning to lie about who's staying in what cabin? Sorry but your scheme certainly violates the intent of the rule that requires that your entire group purchase dining. The terms of the dining package don't allow you to transfer components. It's not clear if Disney has to allow you to use your credit to purchase meals for people not on your plan.
People who bank child credits are following the writen rules. Your plan is certainly not using the plan as intended.

I'm going down with my 5 kids and 6 other family members under 2 seperate reservations. There is nothing in the rules that state every person going down with me (actually it will be 32 people in total) has to be under my reservation.

"Violates the intent of the rule"

for this one you get another thanks for backing up my point. As the intent of a 2 tiered pricing system is not so people of equal traits pay different prices.

 

[mickman1962]

CM's at the restaurants not only allow but encourage this activity.

Exactly, someone making $8/hr at Disney does not dictate corporate policy (thus my letter to corporate Disney) have you ever been to a restaurant where the waitress gave you a free refill or two to get a better tip? Do you think the owner encourages this? I doubt it, as it only helps the employee not the company. What is there to discourage them doing this as there tip is based upon to total price of the bill, not the cost of the dining plan. You would have to be an idiot to think that the waiter at Disney is not going to everything he/she can to get the bill as high as it will go.

Another thanks for proving my point, you have been invaluable.

 

[k-rat]

I love to read the boards but never wrote a message but feel compelled to write on this subject. First--spoke to a manager at the contempory who explained that children credits can be used by an adult or child or vice versa. I also questioned him about beating the system----he said the rules ALLOW adults using child credits.We chattered a bit and he explained that most adults will not spend $40--a couple $80 each day of their vacation. There would be some days they would but others they wouldn't. If a family buys the plan Disney is guaranteed their monies no matter what.
In closing if you are happier not pooling your credits don't pool and pay more if you wish to pool DO IT.

 

[BAST]

I spoke with a CM today while making my August ADRs (we will be using the DP for the first time (2 adults, 2 kids)).

First scenario - DW and I will be going to YS for dinner w/o the kids. CM said YS is a 2TS restaurant but that we could use our kids TS credits for our meal since the kids would not be there.

Second scenario - the four of us will go to AP, another DP signature restaurant. CM suggested that people often pay OOP for kids so that the family does not use of so many TS credits.

I have followed this debate for some time and never understood why certain people care so much that families use pooled credits in the way they see fit. If WDW wanted what I am doing to stop, they could do it easily. In addition, WDW certainly could prevent employees from encouraging this type of usage (given how much the CM's need to say with each ADR (no smoking, business casual, arrival time, etc), they could certainly add a sentence or two about using pooled credit they way I intend).

 

[eugeniuss]

do people really think that a multibillion dollar company like disney is clueless as to how the menu plan is being used? if disney could be "duped" this easily, they wouldnt be where they are today. they know exaclty what goes on each second at their parks and they read all message boards on the net, so if they really thought that it was a problem, they would very easily change it to suit themselves better. i bet they do realize that the plan gets more people to stay at the resorts and eat onsite instead of out, which influences what disney is most concerned about, their bottom line.

 

[mickman1962]

I am not disagreeing with any of you as to what CM's are telling you,(anyone who frequents these boards know that getting the same answer from any two CM's is a crapshoot at best) I merely said I want a definitive answer from CORPORATE DISNEY as to their official stance on this subject. Since most of the responses state that I am wrong, state that Disney not only allows but also encourages this practice, I would think that you would welcome an official response as it would prove me wrong. If everyone else is right and I am wrong, then there is no reason to respond to my posts other then to take issue with the actual wording of my letter to CORPORATE DISNEY. If you are right and I am wrong, then I am sure CORPORATE DISNEY will tell me that and I will come back and write a sincere apology to any person here who I offended by calling them immoral.

Not coming back till I get a response fromn Disney

 

[DebIreland]

Mick,
I also emailed Disney on Tuesday for their official policy regarding this issue. I've heard nothing back yet.

I also sent a separate email suggesting an idea that 10 to 15 year olds be offered the choice of taking either the child's plan @ 11 dollars or the adult plan @ 38 dollars with a rule that those who've chosen the cheaper (child's) plan must order from the child's menu. It would then be up to the parents to decide which plan would suit the dietary habits of their 10 year old (or 11 year old etc.).

It never dawned on me before but now I see why Disney are charging 10 year olds the adult rate. It's because they (Disney) can't be bothered to differentiate the credits so therefore, they're afraid that too many 11, 12 and 13 year olds would eat a whole load of adult food (in reality some would, many wouldnt). Instead of taking that risk (of losing money on food) Disney are erring on the side of caution (from their own point of view of course) and are charging the child the adult rates. Maddening really. If they could just find a proper system to differentiate child credits from adult credits, I am sure they would then offer the child rate to children older than 9.

 

[slcmkh]

This is the greatest thread ever.

 

[slcmkh]

Mickman, I'll be very curious to hear regarding corporate disney's response to your letter.

I can certainly understand both sides of this discussion. It will be interesting to hear corporate disney's take on the use of pooled credits, rather than opinions based on CMs suggestions and guests' experiences.

There is another similar thread out there from about a week ago and there were numerous posts indicating that they were not able to pay OOP for kids meals thus reserving the TS credits for adult meals at a later time.

I think there is always a little wiggle room with things like this and ultimately folks are going to do what they feel comfortable with depending on what they believe is permissible, or what they have been encouraged to do by CMs.

Another analogy is the age 10 adult park ticket thing. Three times now as my children have reached that age, I have been tempted to just say they were 9, knowing they could easily pass for 9 and that no one would ever ask or know that I was buying a child park ticket for my 10 year old. Each time I didn't feel right about that, although it wasn't breaking the law and although it seemed a ridiculous age to call my children adults, and although I could have gotten away with it. So, each time I used it as a value lesson for my kids and paid the adult ticket price, and let them know that even though we could have done otherwise, we did what was right.

And yes, the adult age park ticket is more set in stone than the pooled credit issue. Yes, the pooled credit issue is based on what appears to be a little vaguery in the policy. This is why I am interested in corporate disney's response. Just wonder what the official line is.

Good thread.

 

[Pedler]

I'm going down with my 5 kids and 6 other family members under 2 seperate reservations. There is nothing in the rules that state every person going down with me (actually it will be 32 people in total) has to be under my reservation.

If they are staying in your room they need to be on the same reservation. So in your case the 5 kids would be sleeping in your room and not another room under another reservation.

 

[Pedler]

Exactly, someone making $8/hr at Disney does not dictate corporate policy (thus my letter to corporate Disney) have you ever been to a restaurant where the waitress gave you a free refill or two to get a better tip? Do you think the owner encourages this? I doubt it, as it only helps the employee not the company. What is there to discourage them doing this as there tip is based upon to total price of the bill, not the cost of the dining plan. You would have to be an idiot to think that the waiter at Disney is not going to everything he/she can to get the bill as high as it will go.

Another thanks for proving my point, you have been invaluable.

I think that most likely the person you get a response from is also going to be along the same lines of the $8/hr person.

But just be be sure I understand this you are saying that if you get some sort of official response saying that there are not child / adult credits and they can be used in any manner you deem fit then you will no longer view the use of credits in this manner as immoral? Does that mean then that Disney is getting to define what is and is not moral with regards to the use of the dinning plan?

 

[Pedler]

I am not disagreeing with any of you as to what CM's are telling you,(anyone who frequents these boards know that getting the same answer from any two CM's is a crapshoot at best) I merely said I want a definitive answer from CORPORATE DISNEY as to their official stance on this subject. Since most of the responses state that I am wrong, state that Disney not only allows but also encourages this practice, I would think that you would welcome an official response as it would prove me wrong. If everyone else is right and I am wrong, then there is no reason to respond to my posts other then to take issue with the actual wording of my letter to CORPORATE DISNEY. If you are right and I am wrong, then I am sure CORPORATE DISNEY will tell me that and I will come back and write a sincere apology to any person here who I offended by calling them immoral.

Not coming back till I get a response fromn Disney

mickman1962,

As one poster above mentioned they discussed with with a manager at a resort not just a CM. I too will be curous as to the response you receive from corporate disney though I am not sure what corporate disney you would write to on this. It would most likely have to go to someone involved in the food service or resort operations. The main corporation would not have much if any knowledge of this.

I would clarify your letter a bit and let them know that the 5 kids you plan to get the credits for an use are actually staying in your room on your reservation. That is a key requirement for them to be able to get the dinning plan while others in your group do not. It is an all or nothing thing and they have to actually stay in your room. For example you can't list them on your reservation and have them stay with others just to get the dinning plan. That I think everyone can agree would be fraud as you have to provide thier names and date of birth to make the reservation.