A different perspective on D23

[doconeill]

I dont see it as a loyalty program.

I see it as a way to bring people into the Disney parks to spend money during the slower seasons.

People in the parks spend money.

But that is Disney's business. They HAVE to get you into the parks and spend money. Otherwise it won't survive.

Now, the SEASONAL pass has blackout dates. I don't think they are too bad - mostly at times where Disney is at or close to capacity in some areas. But it could be argued that it is to get the locals on day trips into the parks.

The ANNUAL pass has no such restrictions. You can use it any time, as often as you want, for 1 year. You pay roughly the equivalent of 12 days of MYW park hoppers but get to go a lot more. I think that DOES reward loyalty - if you are going to go two WDW for 12 or more days, they are saying "Hey, here's a ticket for you just for coming so often!" They are not also going to give you free room and board on top of it, because at that point they are better off not having you there.

As for times being tough, I actually don't believe that any publically traded company (which is answerable to the shareholders in general, at least according to our current legal system) is NOT going to simply throw money away for the sense of goodwill when they cannot make revenue targets - the shareholders would have a fit. So I don't actually see any sort of new loyalty program coming any time soon. I can see it AFTERWARDS, as a thank you to those who stuck with Disney through the tough times, when Disney can afford to drop the margin in some areas.

Shareholders unfortunately do not give a damn about guests - because they don't understand the model. Current shareholder culture is all about fast returns. The only way this can change is for Disney to cultivate a culture among its shareholders of the understanding that by putting money back IN to its guests (which are its true revenue stream), which could affect revenue short term, it would may off big dividends at a later time. Which alas I think is impossible. Especially with all the other money-losing divisions that have to be tentpoled by those that are bringing in revenue.

 

[redrosesix]

Shareholders unfortunately do not give a damn about guests - because they don't understand the model. Current shareholder culture is all about fast returns. The only way this can change is for Disney to cultivate a culture among its shareholders of the understanding that by putting money back IN to its guests (which are its true revenue stream), which could affect revenue short term, it would may off big dividends at a later time. Which alas I think is impossible. Especially with all the other money-losing divisions that have to be tentpoled by those that are bringing in revenue.

OT, but here is my spin on shareholder side of things (comparing what I think are the 2 most common types) ...

I don't agree with this completely -- I think that investors will compare WDC to all of the other publicly traded corps. and choose to buy the one that gives them the best return on their money. Having said that, there are different types of investors. For example, I am a value investor -- I buy a stock that I feel is underpriced relative to its value. When it reaches its potential value or something changes in its outlook, I sell (so...there are many times I have sold a stock the same week I bought it) I also don't like mucky companies, like WDC, where they have their hands in too many pots, most of which are contradictory. So, I like companies like Gap, mining co.'s, and restaurant chains -- they need to have a clearly defined vision.

Many investors look for long term holds -- this is the type of investor that might prefer a pharmaceutical company. They're willing to hold the stock while the co. is developing break-through drugs. They drop them if they don't see potential increases in income in the long term.

So...I don't think WDC fits either of these investment models. And both of these require a pretty good understanding of how the co. works and the economic forces they are contending with.

That being said, the most pressure to get a return on investment doesn't come from individual shareholders -- it comes from the larger shareholders ie. mutual funds and pension funds. Just one of these selling off their shares in a co. has a drastic effect on the share price. I think that fund managers' requirements to bring up the fund values (as a result of the blood bath that they have just experienced) is going to have a big effect on the types of investments they choose. These investors would certainly fit your scenario of requiring short-term gains, so I think for the time being you are correct in your analysis.

 

[WebmasterJohn]

Sadly some people have. Including ranting and yelling about how bad it is in their podcasts. I've also sadly seen people who are into Disney enough to join the DISboards and post, say that's it, they're done with Disney because of D23.

It really saddens me the amount of anger displayed over something like this; it is like any other product, if you do not want it you put it back on the shelf. A reasonable person does not stand there in the store, hold it up high, and tell everybody how horrible it is.

In my opinion one of the most powerful by-products of the internet has been the ability for people to share viewpoints and ideas. Unlike newspapers or magazines that present the information, the internet affords everyone the oppportunity to share individual opinions. I think that is really cool.

If people feel D23 is not a good idea then they can post about it - if they do think it's a good idea then they can post about that as well.

Some people have taken the initiative to start and maintain blogs or podcasts where their ideas and opinions can be heard. I know some people think these things are supposed to be 'informational only' and shouldn't include opinion but some do.

You, as a consumer, have the right to tell anyone you want how you feel about a product. We, as consumers, have the same right. We just happen to have a podcast.

Instead of feeling sad, or upset that others are displaying dissenting views you should be happy that these vehicles exits. I am. I like reading the different views expressed here and I think it helps me get a good idea of what people think and how they respond to it.

If people are unhappy with D23 and choose not to join they have that option - you have the same option not to listen to a podcast that doesn't meet your needs or makes you sad.

Personally I am very proud of what we have created with the DISUnplugged. It allows people to hear a group of people discuss what they like and don't like about something they love, Disney. I think we are informational as well as editorial and for me the editorial provides for a mucher deeper understading of what we discuss. If you don't want our opinions, or you're afraid we'll say something that will make you sad you have the option of not listening. Or you can even come here and post that you didn't like what was said.

I can guarantee you that this won't be the last you hear us discuss this topic on the podcast. I can also guarantee we haven't said the last thing you will disagree with either.

 

[LudwigVB]

I have a confession: I am now D23. Call it "Battered Disney Fan Syndrome," but after looking at the site and promo videos, I went back hoping that this time it will be different.

I got my income tax refund yesterday, and it was larger than expected. I also got word yesterday from a graduate school in southern California that I have been accepted, so I will be able to attend the Expo in September (and go to Disneyland every single weekend; I've never been and am stoked!). All things considered, I had extra money I was not expecting and I had a reason to celebrate, so I got caught up in the moment and became a charter member of D23.

Maybe J65 can be a shelter for battered Disney fans!

 

[doconeill]

Not to tout another podcast - in fact, I've never listened to this one - but one of the co-hosts posted in another forum that tomorrow's show will have the Disney Archives master Dave Smith, manager Betsy Kline, and D23 head Steven Clark, and concerns/questions will be answered.

The post on the WDW Radio forums. The podcast is Mouse Guest Weekly.

Might be interesting to hear what they have to say after the backlash.

John, feel free to squash this post if the links are not appropriate.

 

[DisneyKevin]

I can't resist pointing out the incongruency of these two statements.
I mention podcasts, and you know immediately one of them that has said bad things. But you also claim something else...

Which is it?

This is a bit of a value judgement. Stating an opinion that differs from yours is not "saying bad things". It's saying something with which you dont agree.

And I had to assume that you were speaking of the DIS Unplugged podcast because of what you had posted earlier on this same topic.

Since most of the sentiment here seems to be blatant negativity and factually baseless complaints, I'm going back to my regular forum stomping grounds, where people are more focused on the fun they can have than the negativity they can espouse.

Again.....I just have a different opinion than you do.

But I'm glad you are listening to the podcast and posting on the Unplugged board.

 

[wilde_oscar]

just think, you could be like me and have a different opinion than everyone. And what makes the show (DisUnplugged) great is that it is all about the "hosts" opinions. Kinda like The View, but entertaining and with informative content.

 

[wilde_oscar]

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

so who would be whom... I'll start with Kevin would be Rosie, John would be Joy... and no one wants to be Elisabeth.

 

[cchev]

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

so who would be whom... I'll start with Kevin would be Rosie, John would be Joy... and no one wants to be Elisabeth.

But she's so SMART and makes great points!

 

[WaltD4Me]

just think, you could be like me and have a different opinion than everyone. And what makes the show (DisUnplugged) great is that it is all about the "hosts" opinions. Kinda like The View, but entertaining and with informative content.

And the really cool thing about the DISUnplugged is that you can respond and interact with hosts of it. And now I gotta admit I watch The View...and I can't even TELL you how many times an opinion on that show has made mad, but there really isnt a way to convey that to them, except send an email that you know only some flunky will read if you are lucky.

So I think it's an awesome thing that here, you can not only discuss topics with other like minded...or not so like minded Disney fans, but also the whole Podcast team. Most of the time, I find most of the discussions fascinating and truly thought provoking. I could do without the "Who should be allowed to use an ECV/Wheelchair" discussions, but other than that, it's all good.

 

[black562]

I heard that Lou Mongello is planning a big exclusive party in September at the Adventurer's Club.

I was going to mention that but wasn't sure if it would be appropriate...so I just said "open for private parties".

I would love to go to that, but I have a Tourism Conference I have to attend and I'm not sure if I can make it down in time.

 

[wishspirit]

Ok, again my thoughts:

After reading this the biggest gripe is over the term 'rewarding the fans' by Iger. To some, having a chance for more Disney information and exclusive merchandise is equal to a reward. To a lot of Disney fans this is not equal to a reward (me included), and with the way it was promoted not even being up to scratch makes us really feel used (still no email!)

Now I am not criticising people who want to join D23, more power to you! I personally cannot afford it with the shipping to the UK (another kick in the teeth for international fans, but I have posted about that before).

A lot of Disney fans think that they need to show more support for the ones who go a lot, or have invested interest in the company (AP holder, DVC members). It may not benefit ME (I am going for the first time in 4 years in September, so excited!) however my mother is a DVC member and AP holder, and I would love her to be rewarded for that loyalty. However you could say that the 2 1/2 years of billions of dreams were a way of rewarding people just for going to their parks (not that I won a dang thing in California! )

However this blip on the part of the Disney Company does not put me off going or make me any less excited, however if they advertise D23 in the parks, I will not deny my feelings on it.

I would me MUCH prouder to wear a DIS shirt in MK that I ever would wearing a D23 one, which to me shows me as a real Disney fan! (I would prefer a J65 one if I could get one! )

 

[disneyholic family]

i've fallen behind on the podcasts (wedding plans/apt. renovations for DS - in time for his wedding day/ etc etc)..
anyway....i haven't a clue what D23 is....i googled it and found the website...after a short glance i still don't have a clue what it is...

 

[eazyeray]

I'd like to compare the D23 to the Red sox Nation club that I'm a member of.

Both have a member card. D23 has a "suitable for framing" certificate and RSN has a bumper sticker (almost as similar and useless to me). Both have access to online content although RSN has exclusive content for members. RSN has discounts at all MLB stores, raffles for game tickets, early access to purchase tickets, member partys with celebrities, free online audio of ALL MLB games, and a magazine at an additional cost. D23 Has a magazine, a special gift, and access to an expo.

Cost, RSN $14.95 - D23 $74.95.

I don't have a problem giving to Red Sox 15 dollars for what they give me. I do have a problem with 75 dollars for what I would get from D23. That being said I went to Barnes and Noble today and bought the magazine. It's good quality and has interesting articles, very thin though and probably not worth 16 bucks. I'm still gonna keep buying them in hopes they get a little bigger with more content.

 

[Launchpad11B]

I'd like to compare the D23 to the Red sox Nation club that I'm a member of.

Both have a member card. D23 has a "suitable for framing" certificate and RSN has a bumper sticker (almost as similar and useless to me). Both have access to online content although RSN has exclusive content for members. RSN has discounts at all MLB stores, raffles for game tickets, early access to purchase tickets, member partys with celebrities, free online audio of ALL MLB games, and a magazine at an additional cost. D23 Has a magazine, a special gift, and access to an expo.

Cost, RSN $14.95 - D23 $74.95.

I don't have a problem giving to Red Sox 15 dollars for what they give me. I do have a problem with 75 dollars for what I would get from D23. That being said I went to Barnes and Noble today and bought the magazine. It's good quality and has interesting articles, very thin though and probably not worth 16 bucks. I'm still gonna keep buying them in hopes they get a little bigger with more content.

You being a Red Sox fan renders your opinion as questionable at best! Go Yankees!.......................Kidding, I can't tell you how happy I am that spring training is here!!

 

[LudwigVB]

Not to tout another podcast - in fact, I've never listened to this one - but one of the co-hosts posted in another forum that tomorrow's show will have the Disney Archives master Dave Smith, manager Betsy Kline, and D23 head Steven Clark, and concerns/questions will be answered.

The post on the WDW Radio forums. The podcast is Mouse Guest Weekly.

Might be interesting to hear what they have to say after the backlash.

I am listening to the Mouse Guest Weekly podcast right now, and it is pretty interesting. So far, Smith, Kline, and Clark are talking about their jobs as archivists. Something they mentioned I found interesting was that Dave Smith found the Mary Poppins snowglobe on the shelf in the office of a janitor, who said he found it in the garbage and, not knowing what it was, thought it looked neat!

This reminded me of my time back in college when I was a castmember at the Haunted Mansion at WDW. Underneath Madame Leota (Seance Circle) were many props from extinct attractions just laying around and collecting dust. Among them were an old Max the Deer from Country Bear Jamboree, a rudder from the Mike Fink Keel Boats, and Mr. Ham from Kitchen Kabaret. Mr. Ham was relocated to the closet behind the second Stretch Room, and eventually "disappeared." One of the longest-serving Mansion castmembers is married to a retired imagineer who helped design Kitchen Kabaret. We thought she might know what had happened to Mr. Ham, but we did not ask questions!

 

[LudwigVB]

Okay, in the Mouse Guest Weekly interview, Clark breaks D23 down as such:

Free content on web will include insider blogs from all the different departments (these blogs are not up yet; the current site is just a skeleton).

Membership content includes just what they announced - a magazine with articles that go "beyond the marketing and press material," a gift that is not a pin (or two pins, "no pinning involved"), exclusive merchandise not to be confused with half the stuff in the D23 Boutique (Walt Disney Signature Collection, Fantasia stationary, etc... these and the $800 pen are not part of D23), the merchandise will include replicas and special collector items from the archives, and finally the Expo.

After listening to this interview, I think the only benefits for buying a membership right now are the exclusive merchandise and the Expo. Everything else, the real meat of the program, will be free and on the website. Again, with the void left after the demise of the old Disney Channel and Disney Magazine, I am thrilled to have access to "Vault Disney" once more.

As for the merchandise, I am not much of a collector; I prefer things like the Walt Disney Treasures dvds. Here's an interesting speculation I had (completely unrelated to anything I have read or heard, so this is not a rumor, just my thoughts), what if Disney feels it cannot release Song of the South to the general public without a backlash, but it could release it as exclusive merchandise for the D23 collector? With a pixie-dust disclaimer from Leonard Maltin, of course! Hmm...

As for the Expo, now that I know I will be in southern California in September and can go, I am very glad I joined D23. I went to a recent conference where it cost $800 to be a "Diamond Member," which allowed for skipping the lines to get into the ballrooms and to get books signed by authors, for reserved front-row seating, and for special receptions. I paid $25 for regular student admission! It seems that D23 members will have similar benefits as the "Diamond Members" at that past conference, but D23 members are not paying extra. Instead, they are getting discounts and special treatment. That alone justifies for me being a member.

To sum up, if you are not a collector or planning on going to the Expo, save your money unless/until new benefits are offered.

 

[LudwigVB]

Now, Clark is talking about other special events for members. They will initially be held at Disneyland and WDW, including things like early movie screenings. The goal is to expand these events to all around the country once they know where their fans are located (New Jersey!).

The merchandise and special events are considered by Clark to be "perks" and not the purpose of the membership. He said that the membership breaks down to the magazine subscription and a little extra for access to the perks. For Clark, Smith, and Cline, they basically have nothing to do with the merchandise. Their focus is on the web content.

Now we have it, straight from the creators! D23 is not a loyalty program or a collectors program. The free portion is the focus. They feel that they are giving back to the fans through the free content.

Oh, wait, a little teaser: Will they bring special exclusive events and benefits to the theme parks? "Absolutely!" Will family and friends be allowed to participate, or do they all need to be members? "Members will be able to bring along guests." What does the future hold? "We hope it evolves as fans tell us what they want!" "We want it to be a real community and not just a club; we want people to share in it as a community."

 

[WaltD4Me]

Thanks for posting about the podcast with Dave Smith...it was really interesting, I can't believe they were so non-chalant about the stuff from the Haunted Mansion while they were doing the re-furb! I wonder what would have happened to that stuff if they people from the archives hadn't happened to be there? I really, really hope they follow through and build a museum, it would just be amazing. I think it's sad that all that wonderful Disney history is just sitting in boxes in a warehouse.

 

[Matt@WDWR]

They need to stop saying free. lol It costs at the minimum of $80. kidding aside, I can't rant forever. I just hope they realize the ire and keep adding to it. I am not sure why they did not have some of these "insider blogs" already on the site.