So tired of the "teachers work for free every day" FB posts

[Ceila]

I teach, so I have many friends who are teachers. Many of them are FB friends as well.

I am getting so tired of the "Every school in America has teachers working for free every day" type of posts. It always goes on to talk about how we come in early, stay late, and do work at home grading or responding to e-mails or whatever, and then always mentions how we don't get overtime.

Well, guess what? We're salaried. We're not hourly employees. That means we don't get overtime. We all entered this profession knowing this. We entered it knowing, too, that we don't get bonuses, but we also know that we don't have to report to our workplace during winter break, spring break, and for just over 2 months every summer.

I hear teachers complain that they feel like "the public" doesn't treat them as professionals, and yet they turn right around and complain about doing work outside of normal work hours. Most professionals I know do this!

/Rant over, flame suit on.

 

[EMAW_KSU]

I agree. I do not see it on FB but in person.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

Fortunately, I've "never" had to come in early, stay late, travel out of the country, work a Saturday or Sunday, show up at 3:00 am during a thunderstorm because the burglar alarm went off, transport animals trapped in the warehouse, or do any other kind of "work" outside 8-5 at any of my salaried positions

 

[cabanafrau]

Well I'm not a teacher or a facebooker, but I don't see any reason to flame you. Teachers do a hard and often thankless job. I'm forever grateful to the awesome teachers my kids and myself have had in our lifetimes. That said, there is a tendency to become very shortsighted among teachers and become completely unaware that most working professionals work many, many unpaid hours -- quite often many more unpaid hours than teachers do quite frankly. Not to mention that many of those professions come with the expectation that those hours will be worked without question and continued employment depends on it. In my experience teachers don't find those demands placed upon them in quite the same way at all.

 

[Mizzoufan]

I think most people are trying to stand up for teachers not insult them.

 

[Dawnlight]

I teach, so I have many friends who are teachers. Many of them are FB friends as well.

I am getting so tired of the "Every school in America has teachers working for free every day" type of posts. It always goes on to talk about how we come in early, stay late, and do work at home grading or responding to e-mails or whatever, and then always mentions how we don't get overtime.

Well, guess what? We're salaried. We're not hourly employees. That means we don't get overtime. We all entered this profession knowing this. We entered it knowing, too, that we don't get bonuses, but we also know that we don't have to report to our workplace during winter break, spring break, and for just over 2 months every summer.

I hear teachers complain that they feel like "the public" doesn't treat them as professionals, and yet they turn right around and complain about doing work outside of normal work hours. Most professionals I know do this!

/Rant over, flame suit on.

No flames coming from me. Besides the time off for vacations, many teachers also get time off during the day when the kids are at recess, art, music, PE, library, and other special classes.

 

[Rhombus]

Fortunately, I've "never" had to come in early, stay late, travel out of the country, work a Saturday or Sunday, show up at 3:00 am during a thunderstorm because the burglar alarm went off, transport animals trapped in the warehouse, or do any other kind of "work" outside 8-5 at any of my salaried positions

I'm confused. On Eliza's DIY thread, you said you make more money working than taking a day off to do things around the house, which I took to mean you get paid hourly.

You can't take days off (while being paid) for household tasks?

 

[Gumbo4x4]

I'm confused. On Eliza's DIY thread, you said you make more money working than taking a day off to do things around the house, which I took to mean you get paid hourly.

You can't take days off (while being paid) for household tasks?

I am hourly today. I've been salaried in the past

Unfortunately, even being hourly doesn't shield one from after hours calls that end up being donated time these days

 

[Ceila]

I believe the OP's first words were that they are a teacher themselves. Can you point out specific teacher bashing in the thread?

If you don't like the tenor of the discussion, perhaps you can offer a counterpoint opinion with substance to that which you find offensive?

Yes, those were my first words. I'm certainly not bashing teachers. I'm frustrated at the attitudes displayed by many of my colleagues. They often come across as martyrs or holier-than-thou when it comes to doing work outside of school hours, when most professionals I know do the same.

 

[morgan98]

Yes, those were my first words. I'm certainly not bashing teachers. I'm frustrated at the attitudes displayed by many of my colleagues. They often come across as martyrs or holier-than-thou when it comes to doing work outside of school hours, when most professionals I know do the same.

This is a very refreshing post from a teacher. My mother retired from teaching 3 years ago after teaching for almost 40 years. I grew up with teachers all around me. The thing that strikes me as odd now that I am 45 and been in the full time workforce for 23 years is how teachers often do come across as martyrs and feel that any work outside of normal hours is somehow only unique to them.

I think teaching is hard work and I most definitely do not have the personality for it. I had many excellent teachers during school. This is not about not appreciating the contribution. This is more about the fact that there are many hard working people that feel under appreciated across all occupations.

 

[cabanafrau]

Yes, those were my first words. I'm certainly not bashing teachers. I'm frustrated at the attitudes displayed by many of my colleagues. They often come across as martyrs or holier-than-thou when it comes to doing work outside of school hours, when most professionals I know do the same.

I know what you mean. To be fair I think all of us get a little guilty of that at times, whether we're nurses, lawyers, IT support, doctors, whatever. Teachers just have slightly shorter work hours than most to begin with, so it grates a bit more I guess.

 

[bcla]

Well I'm not a teacher or a facebooker, but I don't see any reason to flame you. Teachers do a hard and often thankless job. I'm forever grateful to the awesome teachers my kids and myself have had in our lifetimes. That said, there is a tendency to become very shortsighted among teachers and become completely unaware that most working professionals work many, many unpaid hours -- quite often many more unpaid hours than teachers do quite frankly. Not to mention that many of those professions come with the expectation that those hours will be worked without question and continued employment depends on it. In my experience teachers don't find those demands placed upon them in quite the same way at all.

When I've had to do additional work to meet a schedule, it's typically with an understanding that you work a little bit longer to meet a deadline, then you get a little leeway to leave early some other time. There is the concept of unofficial "comp time". Some of the companies in my industry don't even have any official vacation time, although it's kind of interesting since vacation can't be accrued. At those places one just works out vacation with a manager. There might be the idea of people working 16 hour work days as salaried employees, but that is exceedingly rare. Most people would be dropping like flies doing that for any more than a week.

Frankly, I've seen a lot of teachers in my lifetime who went well above and beyond - especially those dealing with low-achieving schools and/or classrooms. I've heard it said from some teachers that they much preferred teaching the college-track students because there's typically less drama. I've done some volunteer work at a school, and the one thing one teacher tried unloading on me was grading homework. I hated doing it, especially when it was obvious that many students were just cribbing of each others' work. It can be hours and hours of grading homework and tests, especially if a teacher has 5 classes a day. Several teachers did additional unpaid or low paid work as coaches or transporting students to school events.

Teachers' salaries are generally tied to some scale, and there's not a whole lot of room to get huge pay increases other than basic seniority.

 

[morgan98]

When I've had to do additional work to meet a schedule, it's typically with an understanding that you work a little bit longer to meet a deadline, then you get a little leeway to leave early some other time. There is the concept of unofficial "comp time". Some of the companies in my industry don't even have any official vacation time, although it's kind of interesting since vacation can't be accrued. At those places one just works out vacation with a manager. There might be the idea of people working 16 hour work days as salaried employees, but that is exceedingly rare. Most people would be dropping like flies doing that for any more than a week.

Frankly, I've seen a lot of teachers in my lifetime who went well above and beyond - especially those dealing with low-achieving schools and/or classrooms. I've heard it said from some teachers that they much preferred teaching the college-track students because there's typically less drama. I've done some volunteer work at a school, and the one thing one teacher tried unloading on me was grading homework. I hated doing it, especially when it was obvious that many students were just cribbing of each others' work. It can be hours and hours of grading homework and tests, especially if a teacher has 5 classes a day. Several teachers did additional unpaid or low paid work as coaches or transporting students to school events.

Teachers' salaries are generally tied to some scale, and there's not a whole lot of room to get huge pay increases other than basic seniority.

While 16 hour days for an extended period may be rare, a 50 hour week (5-10 hours days) is almost an expectation in my industry. Sure, if you have a slower week, you can leave at 1 on Friday without taking vacation, but that is because you have already put in more than 40 hours that week anyway. And these are "true" 50 hours weeks that are being charge to client codes in 10-15 minute periods.

 

[Goofy_Disney_Dad]

While 16 hour days for an extended period may be rare, a 50 hour week (5-10 hours days) is almost an expectation in my industry. Sure, if you have a slower week, you can leave at 1 on Friday without taking vacation, but that is because you have already put in more than 40 hours that week anyway. And these are "true" 50 hours weeks that are being charge to client codes in 10-15 minute periods.

I agree on the expected hours portion. I can remember being happy about a few 50 hour weeks in a row. Certainly didn't make up for the occasional 80 hour week, but it is what it is.

 

[cabanafrau]

When I've had to do additional work to meet a schedule, it's typically with an understanding that you work a little bit longer to meet a deadline, then you get a little leeway to leave early some other time. There is the concept of unofficial "comp time". Some of the companies in my industry don't even have any official vacation time, although it's kind of interesting since vacation can't be accrued. At those places one just works out vacation with a manager. There might be the idea of people working 16 hour work days as salaried employees, but that is exceedingly rare. Most people would be dropping like flies doing that for any more than a week.

Frankly, I've seen a lot of teachers in my lifetime who went well above and beyond - especially those dealing with low-achieving schools and/or classrooms. I've heard it said from some teachers that they much preferred teaching the college-track students because there's typically less drama. I've done some volunteer work at a school, and the one thing one teacher tried unloading on me was grading homework. I hated doing it, especially when it was obvious that many students were just cribbing of each others' work. It can be hours and hours of grading homework and tests, especially if a teacher has 5 classes a day. Several teachers did additional unpaid or low paid work as coaches or transporting students to school events.

Teachers' salaries are generally tied to some scale, and there's not a whole lot of room to get huge pay increases other than basic seniority.

My husband is in IT for a very large corporation that has been offshoring much of their workforce for years. His team now numbers less than you can count on one hand because they need a few bodies stateside for specific tasks. It is expected to put in extra hours daily, as well as being available by phone or email 24/7, including vacations. It's hard enough to find the time to take your actual vacation time, let alone attempt to utilize unofficial comp time. Does he occasionally scoot out 20 min early to pick up a car from being serviced or take off an hour and a half for a dentist appt? Yes. In truth he simply winds up logging back in once he gets home to deal with an emergency or answer some questions on a project. His friends in the same field working elsewhere find it very much the same. Is he better compensated than a teacher? Yes. However he also undertakes much more ongoing education than a teacher does as well to keep abreast of technology. He easily averages 60 hour work weeks year round.

Financial services is another sector notorious for demanding grueling hours.

 

[Ceila]

When I've had to do additional work to meet a schedule, it's typically with an understanding that you work a little bit longer to meet a deadline, then you get a little leeway to leave early some other time. There is the concept of unofficial "comp time". Some of the companies in my industry don't even have any official vacation time, although it's kind of interesting since vacation can't be accrued. At those places one just works out vacation with a manager. There might be the idea of people working 16 hour work days as salaried employees, but that is exceedingly rare. Most people would be dropping like flies doing that for any more than a week.

Frankly, I've seen a lot of teachers in my lifetime who went well above and beyond - especially those dealing with low-achieving schools and/or classrooms. I've heard it said from some teachers that they much preferred teaching the college-track students because there's typically less drama. I've done some volunteer work at a school, and the one thing one teacher tried unloading on me was grading homework. I hated doing it, especially when it was obvious that many students were just cribbing of each others' work. It can be hours and hours of grading homework and tests, especially if a teacher has 5 classes a day. Several teachers did additional unpaid or low paid work as coaches or transporting students to school events.

Teachers' salaries are generally tied to some scale, and there's not a whole lot of room to get huge pay increases other than basic seniority.

It's not just the occasional extra time at work, it's the work from home that gets trotted out as well, such as grading and planning. My DH, and most other professionals I know, bring work home fairly regularly. It's simply what is expected in many professions. Many people in many professions go above and beyond, but it seems that quite a few of my colleagues ignore that.

 

[sunnyday123]

Thank you so much for this.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

I know what you mean. To be fair I think all of us get a little guilty of that at times, whether we're nurses, lawyers, IT support, doctors, whatever. Teachers just have slightly shorter work hours than most to begin with, so it grates a bit more I guess.

I think it starts with how frequently teachers are teased (in good spirit or otherwise) about all the "time off" they have in their profession. The rebuttal of course is that many of them will be working during a portion of that "time off".

So, it is true that for many teachers, not all of their "time off" is actually "off". And while it's fair for teachers to point that out, it's not something unique to the profession. The unique part is the ribbing they receive.

 

[cabanafrau]

I think it starts with how frequently teachers are teased (in good spirit or otherwise) about all the "time off" they have in their profession. The rebuttal of course is that many of them will be working during a portion of that "time off".

So, it is true that for many teachers, not all of their "time off" is actually "off". And while it's fair for teachers to point that out, it's not something unique to the profession. The unique part is the ribbing they receive.

That's very true as well. I still think overall teachers put in an average of less hours than a great many other professions when you factor in all of the "off hours" additional work factored in.

And while teacher pay may not be quite as substantial as other professions, around here teacher benefits far outpace most in the public sector workforce, which shouldn't be overlooked.

 

[cbellasmomma]

In all of my salaried positions I also had the option of coming in late, working from home, etc. along with being expected to take work home, come in early if need be. So it was a give and take on the extended hours. I have never met a salaried teacher that was given the other side of being a salaried employee - you know...the benefits. Can you go in late if you need to wait for the cable installer?