MK no longer "dry"????

Discussion in 'The DIS Unplugged Podcast' started by OKW Lover, Sep 13, 2012.

  1. DisneyKevin

    DisneyKevin Kelvis Moderator

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    "Times and conditions change so rapidly that we must keep our aim constantly focused on the future."

    Walt Disney

    Walt's ideas would have evolved.

    Stranding his ideas in 1966 (or before) does a disservice to his legacy of forward thinking.
     
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  3. DisneyKevin

    DisneyKevin Kelvis Moderator

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    There were no other parks when Walt was alive.
     
  4. *NikkiBell*

    *NikkiBell* The WDW Merchandise Walking Bible Moderator

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  5. DisneyKevin

    DisneyKevin Kelvis Moderator

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    Walt's idea for Epcot was that it was to be city where people worked and lived.

    It didn't turn out that way, even though that's what he said he wanted. He was very clear about that. As you've pointed out...there is even video.

    It also didn't come in to existence until the 1980s....16 years (minus two months) after he died.
     
  6. BilltM

    BilltM Dizfan

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    Keep in mind that Walt had an Aunt Jemima restaurant in his park and agreed to sell ladies undergarments on Main Street. [/QUOTE]

    Victoria Secrets or Fredricks ;)
     
  7. *NikkiBell*

    *NikkiBell* The WDW Merchandise Walking Bible Moderator

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    Victoria Secrets or Fredricks ;)[/QUOTE]

    :lmao: That's the modernized version.
     
  8. sceavis

    sceavis Mouseketeer

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    Bringing alcohol into a children's fantasy land is not forward thinking
     
  9. DCTooTall

    DCTooTall <MARQUEE BEHAVIOR=ALTERNATE><img src=http://www.em

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    Walt's idea for the Entire Florida Project was EPCOT.... With a City center at the center of the property, A possible entertainment area north of the city (MK), and industrial areas down at the southern end of the property. Considering Walt's Experimental Prototype Community Of Tomorrow was a pre-planned living/breathing city with residential, business, and entertainment areas (both for families and adults without families), as well as public transportation galore.... I'd have a feeling there would've been a pub or 2 someplace in the area. Walt himself liked to occasionally have a drink after work, so I don't think he would've said his community would've been dry. (That would've been the equivalent of saying that Orlando would've had to be completely dry...).


    The EPCOT Center as built, and the one Walt planned, were two totally different things that can't really be compared.



    (FYI... since it may not be clear in this post, I'm into the pro-dry MK camp for tradition and slippery slope sakes.... )
     
  10. DisneyKevin

    DisneyKevin Kelvis Moderator

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    That's an opinion.

    I'm curious why alcohol is being demonized.

    Why arent all of Walt's wishes being fulfilled.

    Nikkibell has pointed out video showing what Walt wanted Epcot to become.

    I'm guessing no one has called Guest Relations to complain about this.
     
  11. *NikkiBell*

    *NikkiBell* The WDW Merchandise Walking Bible Moderator

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    I definitely agree. There definitely would have been alcohol in the "community" and Walt did enjoy his whiskey, from what I understand. MK, though, was to be kept "dry."
     
  12. DisneyKevin

    DisneyKevin Kelvis Moderator

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    Didnt Walt also mention the Magic Kingdom being for children "of all ages"?
     
  13. *NikkiBell*

    *NikkiBell* The WDW Merchandise Walking Bible Moderator

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    For me, it's obvious why the alcohol issue is being raised as a concern: it can lead to unruly or even "dangerous" behavior that could interrupt the atmosphere of a family park. Can and do some people drink responsibly? Yes. Are there those who do not? Yes. Should we risk that from happening in, as another poster described so well, a children's fantasyland?

    Similarly, Epcot as it is today instead of the original idea does not have the potential to cause harm - either emotionally, spiritually, or physically - due to its difference from the intended. Alchohol, in my opinion, does.
     
  14. DisneyKevin

    DisneyKevin Kelvis Moderator

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    I guess I should point out that I dont drink alcohol....pretty much ever.

    I'm just curious with all of the examples given of how Walt's wishes have been changed or ignored, why the one about the Magic Kingdom being "dry" has been engraved in stone.

    Why has this become the golden rule when having a racist restaurant removed from the Magic Kingdom wasn't an issue/

    It's my opinion that this was done because times changed...regardless of what Walt thought or felt.
     
  15. BilltM

    BilltM Dizfan

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    “As part of the overall theming, we wanted to offer wine that enhances the guest experience :confused3 and complements the French-inspired cuisine,” says Stuart McGuire, Beverage Director, Walt Disney Parks and Resorts. “The wines focus primarily on France’s famous wine-growing regions, including Champagne, Alsace, Loire, Rhone, Burgundy and Bordeaux.

    “We’ll also offer the leading French beer, Kronenbourg 1664,” says McGuire. “And, staying in the general region, we’ll also offer Belgian beers.”
     
  16. DisneyKevin

    DisneyKevin Kelvis Moderator

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    I'm confused.

    What about drinking in Epcot is causing emotional, spiritual or physical harm?

    Is it the alcohol?
     
  17. mytripsandraces

    mytripsandraces DIS Veteran

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    Which book? I haven't been able to find anything about Walt Disney's determination to keep alcohol out of the Magic Kingdom in Florida.

    I totally agree, Kevin. I am not a drinker and don't drink wine or beer at all, so don't see a need for alcohol in the Magic Kingdom, but I'm not going to base my opinion on the perceived wishes of a man who has been dead for almost 45 years, especially a man who made his fortune through sales. He would most definitely have revisited the issue over the years. If he weren't interested in continual growth and improvement in the parks, they would look very different. If he had wanted the Florida Magic Kingdom to be just a copy of the original Disneyland, the castle would be a lot shorter! ;)
     
  18. DisneyKevin

    DisneyKevin Kelvis Moderator

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    You have added a confused smilie and I'm not sure where the confusion comes from.
     
  19. k5jmh

    k5jmh When Yuba plays the Rumba on his Tuba...

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    BOG will just cause my DW to be in FOG. i will never be able to get her out of Fantasyland now. :rotfl2:
     
  20. DCTooTall

    DCTooTall <MARQUEE BEHAVIOR=ALTERNATE><img src=http://www.em

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    Kevin, ultimately here's where I stand on the issue.

    i don't really like the idea that the MK isn't dry anymore, in large part because of the tradition, a deference to the whole "what would Walt want" crowd.... and the simple fact that if you wanted a drink, it's not like the Monorail resorts were far or hard to get too.

    I personally love having a drink at the other parks, and La Cava and the Tune Inn Lounge are two of my favorite places in some of the other parks, so I don't have a problem with alcohol served in the parks in general.

    Beyond the opening of the door and not trusting Disney's current management to resist the temptation.... I ultimately don't think 1 TS restaurant, for 1 meal, is going to be the end of the world that leads to a dramatic change in the park. (beyond just the breaking of tradition... which honestly... most people who aren't huge Disney fans aren't even going to be aware of.)


    That said... What worries me is that Slippery slope. That temptation for the current Disney Management to make it more readily available within the park itself, outside of a single TS meal at a single restaurant.... to the cart or any CS location having it as an option. While the presence and availability of a beer or mixed drink isn't by itself dangerous thing... and I trust the average guest to not go overboard... there are certain things unique to the MK that I feel could lead to more issues than what we see in EPCOT, MGM, or AK. Keep in mind, these are all just my opinions, and observations I've taken...

    1. I feel that the MK tends to be the hottest park out of the 4. This could just be due to fact it's the oldest, and it has a lot of outdoor, switchback based ride queues. You already run into perfectly reasonable people who know their limit, finding themselves more tipsy, or ill, than they are used too... simply because they didn't realize how the Florida heat would impact them different than back home. With less locations to get out of the heat, and all the lines capable of getting pretty hot and miserable.... I could see even more issues from someone who only has 2 beers (or even just 1) having it impact them much more than normal.

    2. In part because of the heat issues.... I also feel like the MK is probably the most stressful out of the 4 parks. Between the heat, the high number of rides/attractions people feel like they need to get too [hurry up and wait].... the fact it's an older park with more bottlenecks from the heavy crowds.... And the big headline activities that require staking out a random spot early [parades and fireworks]... The stress can easily be there if you let it. Adding alcohol to that and you might increase the chances of tempers boiling over more than they already do.

    3. And quite frankly.... IMHO... I feel like the MK has probably the highest density of children than the other parks. Maybe it's just impression... or maybe it's due to the parks more compact size that AK an EPCOT, combined with the large number of family attractions that even the smaller child can enjoy. (and the Fantasyland Stroller Parking Lots don't hurt the impression). It just seems like something where opening up the door for the occasional rotten apple just isn't worth the impact to that many kids at once.


    Again.... These concerns are mostly aimed at the creep of the availability beyond just the one location into something much more extreme than anything Disney has currently publicly announced or hinted at, So this could be as pointless as getting all worked up about how much I'm going to enjoy the Rhine River Ride at EPCOT, or the Western River Expansion in Frontierland. But, since we are all talking about things here, It doesn't hurt any to express my concerns as well about what could happen.
     
  21. DisneyKevin

    DisneyKevin Kelvis Moderator

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    As I've pointed out...I dont drink, so whatever decision is made will not directly have any effect on me or my enjoyment of the Magic Kingdom.

    My question remains to be...why is this different than anything else Walt wanted?

    I was just in California Adventure at the end of July. CarsLand was packed with families with kids of all ages and alcohol was available everywhere.....everywhere and all day. The Wine Country Trattoria is across the walkway from CarsLand.

    Why is that different. Why isnt there an angry outcry and calls to Guest Relations?

    Is it because Walt did not say "I dont want alcohol in CarsLand?"

    I'm being facetious....but I dont see a difference between alcohol being served all day in CarsLand and it being served in Frontierland.

    The only difference I see it that Walt said this decades ago and as I've pointed out.....not everything he said he wanted happened.

    Why is this different?
     

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