Just back ~ disappointing trip

[mattsdragon]

I'm not going to join the Disney apologists on this one either... Ride maintainence is a big issue right now. Sure, you notice the effects more when it is busy but we had days where we encountered several breakdowns in one day on both of our last two trips (one in January where long hours certainly weren't the issue, and the other at Memorial Day so cold wasn't a factor) and I'm actually a little worried over it when it comes to our next trip because we're taking a first timer for what will probably be her only visit to WDW... So if, as happened last trip, all three mountains, Pirates, and Haunted Mansion are all closed for chunks of our only MK day and at Epcot we have the same experience with Nemo, Figment, Soarin', Spaceship Earth and Test Track, it is far more upsetting/disappointing than it would normally be.

.

Question. . .

How is being pragmatic about ride breakdowns being a "Disney Apologist"?

The parks are open 365 days a year, and the second a ride is brought down for any type of refurb, they get a million complaints from everyone who had their entire trip ruined because "X" ride wasn't working while they were there. So they bring the ride down for the minimum amount of time necessary to do preventative maintenance, which really doesn't give it a complete refurb, which causes more problems to snowball.

I am actually talking out of experience as a technician on electronic equipment for ships. When a complicated piece of equipment is brought down to "cold steel", there is A LOT of things that need to be done to ensure that when it is brought back to operational readiness, it had better have had ALL these things done to it, in order to prevent further malfunction.

Well, the problem is that upper management, be they park managers, or Commanding Officers, don't care about those details. They want to get the ride/RADAR/engine/weapons system back up YESTERDAY (I have been told to produce working products that I do not have during normal bodily functions that are biologically uncomfortable, let alone possible). So they don't actually give enough time for proper maintenance to be performed.

We've all seen reports from CM's who attest that maintenance budgets and times have been cut, but so long as Little Johnny gets to ride the Mad Tea Party when the Jones family from Kenosha shows up, who cares right. I'm just being a "Disney Apologist".

 

[WDSearcher]

I posted earlier about my experience being there over Christmas and New Years. We had a great time and were able to ride plenty of things everyday....and this was with hauling 4 kids through the parks. And we don't stay all day...we go for a few hours in the mornings and few hours in the evenings.

But I will agree with you on the rides being down waaay too much! We also go to Kings Island and Cedar Point which has major roller coasters and they aren't down anywhere near as much as the Disney rides!

Keep in mind, though, that both Kings Island and Cedar Point are closed for around 5 months every year, which gives them a pretty comfortable window to do ride maintenance. I'm sure Disney would have no ride problems at all if they closed from November through March!

 

[VeganCupcake]

3 hour wait for space mtn. yesterday! There is no way I'd wait that long!

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=3040882

Actually almost 4!!!

On the rides breaking down-
Disney make enough money to hire more than enough people to fix these problems so they don't happen as frequently period. Even if it's not perfect, it shouldn't be as bad as some people are reporting. It's not like the parks are open 24 hours a day.

 

[thedonduck]

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=3040882

Actually almost 4!!!

On the rides breaking down-
Disney make enough money to hire more than enough people to fix these problems so they don't happen as frequently period. Even if it's not perfect, it shouldn't be as bad as some people are reporting. It's not like the parks are open 24 hours a day.

No, but they are open sometimes up to 18 hours a day. That leaves very minimal time for workers to come in, clean, repair lights, etc. provide the daily inspections, etc. Let alone actually fix broken parts of rides that are (at least some) 30 years old if not older.

Disney is damned if they do, damned if they don't. People complained and complained and complained that their trip was ruined because BTMR was closed for refurbishment as was Test Track. So Disney rushed to get the minimal amount done to reopen. Now people are complaining that rides are breaking. They opened more hours (EMH and added late hours) so that has greatly cut into the amount of time they have for maintenance. Yet when Disney pulled back on EMH people were up in arms. I'm not a Disney apologist at all, for the amount of money we spend at the parks, I want them perfect. However, I'm realistic with the issues and problems.

 

[dpuck1998]

As someone who has been to cedar point and disney often. I have had far worse luck with rides being down at cedar point than I ever have at disney. Anyone that goes to cedar point can tell you how often top thrill dragster goes down, the same with millennium.

 

[ttintagel]

As someone who has been to cedar point and disney often. I have had far worse luck with rides being down at cedar point than I ever have at disney. Anyone that goes to cedar point can tell you how often top thrill dragster goes down, the same with millennium.

If I'm paying Cedar Point prices, I have lower expectations. For Disney prices, I have higher ones.

 

[sandym718]

As someone who has been to cedar point and disney often. I have had far worse luck with rides being down at cedar point than I ever have at disney. Anyone that goes to cedar point can tell you how often top thrill dragster goes down, the same with millennium.

And Maverick!

 

[alecshawn]

I disagree. I've been down for Christmas frequently and I've always gotten to ride everything I want, multiple times if I want, and I'm only in the parks mornings and evenings. Meticulous planning does wonders

However, yes, the crowds are HUGE and FP's for most attractions are gone by 10 am, if not earlier. The crowds are bigger in the evenings than in the mornings by FAR. It is not a week to mosey in the parks at 11 am and want to ride stuff. It's not hard to find information on how busy Disney is that week either

Actually, you make a great point...Christmas serapates the novice from expert. YOU, obviously know what you are doing and planned accordingly.
I am a fastpass commando and do plan as well....we just avoid christman.

 

[Ginny Favers]

I was there the last week of April and experienced an inordinate number of breakdowns, too. We still had a good time, but it is frustrating. Even the "Disney Apologists" have to admit that ride breakdowns is not something that Disney should accept being associated with.... and unfortunately, talking with my friends, I'm realizing that's starting to be the case. And yet it has been going on like this for over a year. To me, ride maintenance should be on the bottom of the list when it comes to things that can be cut back on because not only does it inconvenience people, it puts the safety of the rides into question . . . I'm not sure how many people have to complain to them before they get the picture.

 

[mattsdragon]

I was there the last week of April and experienced an inordinate number of breakdowns, too. We still had a good time, but it is frustrating. Even the "Disney Apologists" have to admit that ride breakdowns is not something that Disney should accept being associated with.... and unfortunately, talking with my friends, I'm realizing that's starting to be the case. And yet it has been going on like this for over a year. To me, ride maintenance should be on the bottom of the list when it comes to things that can be cut back on because not only does it inconvenience people, it puts the safety of the rides into question . . . I'm not sure how many people have to complain to them before they get the picture.

You're absolutely right, it isn't acceptable.

But on the bottom line, anything that is purely overhead, as maintenance is, doesn't go over well with penny pinchers who end up in high level, decision making positions.

It's never a good thing, but sometimes it's hard to see the bottom line when your head is in the clouds.

Oooh, that was a good one. Where's the tag fairy when you need her/him?

 

[Eastern]

Several CMs have posted here that Disney added more FPs to the mix when they started time enforcement last March. The supposition is that they would then take those slots back out later to use for Fastpass+. That capacity is going to have to come from somewhere.

It really did seem to me during our recent trip that FPs were available much later into the day, and that return times were far sooner than anything I had ever experienced before. And we've gone the same week for several years now.

I agree. We were there from Dec 29 to Jan 3 and it seemed that we were always waiting in standby for a very long line of fastpassers to get through. On one ride in particular, Winnie the Pooh, the CMs seemed to be letting in dozens and dozens of fast passers, then 5 standbys, then another 40 fast passers. People were really getting mad. Sometimes it looked like the fast passers were all through, but the CMs would hold the standby lane back and WAIT for more fast passers to appear. It was so odd.

It also seemed that we could get fast passes later into the day, but the return times were so soon they weren't doable. We were at Maelstrom and the FP return times were ~ 40 min away. You can't really leave and do something else, and what's the point of waiting? You may as well be in line.

The only ride that broke down for us was BTMRR. The CM said he expected it to be down 'for awhile' so we didn't wait. Other rides we saw had intermittent breakdowns but since we had done them already, or didn't want to do them, we weren't affected. I can see how the perfect storm of ride breakdowns can really affect a touring plan.

We did lots of rides during early magic hours and at night during the fireworks, but it really was a bit stressful with the crowds. My family agrees that it was fun, but we probably wouldn't go again during peak crowd levels. We noticed that other people seemed to be stressed out and snapping at each other more than we have ever seen before. Lots of pushing and shoving and rudeness. So even if you had a plan, and executed it well, you had to deal with that, too.

ps we noticed an extreme amount of line-cutting as well. The longer the line, the more people cut.

 

[mom2rtk]

It also seemed that we could get fast passes later into the day, but the return times were so soon they weren't doable. We were at Maelstrom and the FP return times were ~ 40 min away. You can't really leave and do something else, and what's the point of waiting? You may as well be in line.

Yes, this is exactly what we experienced. It's almost like they researched the optimal delay that would cause folks to shop while waiting. Too long and they'd go do something else. Too short and they'd just stand there and wait. I've got it......... 40 minutes!

This just seemed so different from our past experiences I was prepared for more running around gathering FPs now that they enforce end times. I wasn't really prepared for this awkward return timing.

 

[Eastern]

ps they should have a FP option for Cava de Tequila. We waited in a relatively short line for 30 minutes to get to the bar and order a drink to take away. Meanwhile, people were getting to the front of the line and parking themselves at the bar so the rest of the line was basically standing and waiting for them to finish their drinks. It was ridiculous.

Many people were cutting this line, sneaking under the rope. One was a CM who just gotten off duty!! (she had her name tag on at first. I complained about her cutting and another person said 'oh look, she is a worker' but she just got on line and waited with the rest of us).

I did complain at the end to the woman manager who was directing the line. She said "Oh, they are not supposed to stand at the bar, I will move them away". She really wasn't doing a very good job.

 

[Lehuaann]

I've never even been in a FP line that even had 50 or 100 people in it. Are they issuing more FP's than they used to? Of course, I've never been during a peak season.

We were in a few 100+ FP lines in Oct, and this was not during peak season. Our FP line for KSafari was more like 200+ and started outside the que.....down the hill! CM's had to set up ropes. When new FPer's came to front of line (where CM was), they couldn't believe the FP line was being directed down the hill.

TSM was another 100+ FP line.

I don't know if it's too many FPs or the way they are holding people to the time. One thing I do know is that FP lines seem worse than ever.

 

[DVCJones]

I remember disney before fastpass.

I don't think I would go back to disney if they went back to the old ways. The number one piece of advice on the DIS is during peak crowd levels ALWAYS arrive early and work the fastpass system. If you go during those times and you don't heed this advice you should accept your fate and not blame the system. Early bird gets the worm, ounce of prevention and all that jazz.

Exactly what I was thinking...

We go in the Spring. It often falls over the Easter break. We know it will be crazy and make sure we are there at opening during Easter week. When it doesn't fall on Easter there is more room to be a little slower in the mornings.

As much as I would love to see WDW decorated for the holidays, I am not willing to deal with what comes with that crowd wise.

The early bird catches the worm or the Fastpass in this case.

 

[Halbleib1]

We were there Dec10-22 and experienced two rides down. The first week it was Finding Nemo in Epcot. The following week it was Splash Mtn. We were told by a CM working splash that it is happening more and more often due to it's age. While disappointing and we had to change our plans to be able to ride another day it wasn't the end of the world. Had more been down than I would have been just as upset as the op. The major problem while we were there was the monorail being down. It took some time getting around with it down. That was upsetting because it has been an ongoing problem that they don't seem to plan on perm fixing anytime soon. Crowds were not bad the whole time we were there except at qs locations. Matter of fact they seemed to be less than what we experienced during the same time in 2008 and 09. QS locations were busier than TS this trip. Even BOG the night we ate dinner there had some empty tables. As far as qs we found that eating during the times that Disney has on the park maps not to was the least busy. More people must be following that than in the past. I do have to say this trip was more disappointing overall than our previous 5 trips. The food has def gone down at both qs and ts locations. The wait staff as well were not as friendly overall as in the past at both qs and ts locations. Don't get me wrong there are still some great ones as well. Also they seemed to have a lot of computer issues this trip. They were down more than once. Really shouldn't be surprised considering their websites. The photopass site is so slow and has so many issues I don't know if we will buy it again. It is not worth the money if you can't even get on to edit your pics. When I do get on it takes hours to just get a few pics done. We still had a good time but for our family it is time for a change of scenery and a more relaxing vacation esp for the planner which is me. Lol


Edited to add: I did notice them letting in more FP riders than standby riders. Esp for peter pan. It was no wonder that the standby line was so long the whole time we were there. We rode that only using FP. We had extra FP the one night from my parents and husband not riding that my two kids and I rode twice in a row. The second time we practically walked right on despite long FP and standby lines because they were loading so many FP riders at a time.

 

[katt789]

Sorry that your trip wasn't as good as you hoped it would be.
Obviously with it being the holidays, it's not going to be the same in May, it's usually pretty decent for crowds.
I also find that rides are going to be "down" more often in huge crowds simply because of guests doing things they shouldn't (standing up, moving around, dropped something off the ride, etc)

If I were you I wouldn't cancel your next trip, I've gone over 10 times, and have had some not so great trips in there, but every time I'm in Disney there's still some amazingly magical aspect to it, and that's what makes it worth it. To me, so what if there's a bunch of rides breaking down or a huge tour group that chants the entire way through a 70 minute standby line and then lets another 20 people into the line infront of them? The best you can do is roll your eyes, and focus on the pixie dust that's going on on the other side of you.

Give it a second chance? And go into it thinking positively, not about this last trip. If you think about all the things that went wrong over the holidays, you'll immediately see everything in a bad light, think of it as "hey, awesome, we're back in Disney for some amazing fun"

 

[MikeandReneePlus5]

I wonder what, exactly, breaks down on these rides?

I would really enjoy a behnd the scenes TV show or a tour that gets into all that.

Any CMs or experts out there that can shed some light?

 

[stargazertechie]

I wonder what, exactly, breaks down on these rides?

I would really enjoy a behnd the scenes TV show or a tour that gets into all that.

Any CMs or experts out there that can shed some light?

From my limited knowledge of rollercoasters, it all comes down to the required spacing between cars. There are sensors in the tracks that keep track of the gap between ride vehicles. If there are too many that are in one section of the track (example- too many rockets coming back into the loading platform on Space Mountain, or a "log jam upstream" on splash mountain due to slow loading on multiple consecutive ride vehicles) the ride automatically triggers an emergency stop (e-stop). From that point, the ride has to go through a reset cycle where they bring all of the ride vehicles in, go through the pre-ride safety test (the same as they do at the beginning of operations each day) and then and only then are they able to start loading guests again.

E-stops are also triggered if the computers detect (either correctly or incorrectly) that a restraint is not fastened properly.

 

[MikeandReneePlus5]

From my limited knowledge of rollercoasters, it all comes down to the required spacing between cars. There are sensors in the tracks that keep track of the gap between ride vehicles. If there are too many that are in one section of the track (example- too many rockets coming back into the loading platform on Space Mountain, or a "log jam upstream" on splash mountain due to slow loading on multiple consecutive ride vehicles) the ride automatically triggers an emergency stop (e-stop). From that point, the ride has to go through a reset cycle where they bring all of the ride vehicles in, go through the pre-ride safety test (the same as they do at the beginning of operations each day) and then and only then are they able to start loading guests again.

E-stops are also triggered if the computers detect (either correctly or incorrectly) that a restraint is not fastened properly.

Interesting...

and so following on it seems difficult to solve with maintenance. All the maintenance in the world isn't going to get around the unknowable variable of humans loading/or unloading conescutive cars too slowly...