FP+ (No More Paper Fastpasses)

[jeffg4]

That is true, but if fewer people who hold fp are using them, then their "spots" on the ride will be used by people in the standby line, and that line will move proportionately faster. My point was that I don't think it makes sense to assume that disney is profiting from this by making people stay more days in the park, because the limiting factor of how many people get to ride a given ride per day is the ride capacity, not the availability of fp. If you find you are able to ride fewer rides per day because of a change in the fp system, then someone else (probably someone who wasn't using fp effectively before) must be riding more rides per day and the average length of stay probably won't be affected.

Regarding having your ticket scanned, I don't know if it's practical but it would be nice in a way if you only have to physically be present at the parks (connected to their hopefully-to-be-installed wifi) to book, because then we could all book the first fp while waiting in line at the esplanade. Otherwise I'm afraid everyone will start looking at their phones as soon as they go through the turnstiles and cause a traffic jam. But that might open up the door for people to cheat somehow and get fp for tickets that aren't even going to be used that day.

You are making the assumption that the people who weren't good at maximizing the use of legacy FP are going to be good at maximizing the use of FP+. Maybe this isn't the right assumption. Are these people who aren't "in the know" going to book all of their FP+ for headliners right at the 60-day or 30-day marks? Are they going to strategically schedule the FP+'s during the crowded times of day? Are they going to keep refreshing to get better times? Are they going to collect additional FPs after they use their first 3? My assumption would be that the people who didn't do their homework with FP are not going to do their homework with FP+. Maybe the only thing you can assume is that some who weren't getting 3 paper FP's per day might now be getting 3 FP+ per day, but are they getting them for the right attractions and at the right times?

If I'm a Disney exec, my first priority is to get as many people in the park as possible. That means the guests spent their money on tickets. Once they're in the park, the next priority is to keep them in the park so they can spend more money on food and gifts. If they're in the park, they're likely spending money. The next priority is to keep them out of lines (I would think). If people are in lines, they aren't spending money. So, again, if I'm a Disney exec, I would want to keep the lines as short as possible with the parks as full as possible. If Disney knew that FP+ would increase standby wait times for less popular attractions (I'm certain they must have), then there had to be some other financial reason to switch to FP+, because it certainly wasn't done for the benefit of the guests. Maybe setting up and maintaining FP+ was cheaper than continuing to buy and print paper tickets. But you can be certain the switch was to increase the bottom line, be it getting more people in the parks or saving on paper/resources. Big companies simply don't change the way they do business for no reason. Again, if the parks are more crowded, it would stand to reason that many people would increase their length of stay in order to get done what they want to get done. That, I believe, is what Disney is banking on.

 

[mom2rtk]

You are making the assumption that the people who weren't good at maximizing the use of legacy FP are going to be good at maximizing the use of FP+. Maybe this isn't the right assumption. Are these people who aren't "in the know" going to book all of their FP+ for headliners right at the 60-day or 30-day marks? Are they going to strategically schedule the FP+'s during the crowded times of day? Are they going to collect additional FPs after they use their first 3? My assumption would be that the people who didn't do their homework with FP are not going to do their homework with FP+. Maybe the only thing you can assume is that some who weren't getting 3 paper FP's per day might now be getting 3 FP+ per day, but are they getting them for the right attractions and at the right times?

If I'm a Disney exec, my first priority is to get as many people in the park as possible. That means the guests spent their money on tickets. Once they're in the park, the next priority is to keep them in the park so they can spend more money on food and gifts. If they're in the park, they're likely spending money. The next priority is to keep them out of lines (I would think). If people are in lines, they aren't spending money. So, again, if I'm a Disney exec, I would want to keep the lines as short as possible with the parks as full as possible. If Disney knew that FP+ would increase standby wait times for less popular attractions (I'm certain they must have), then there had to be some other financial reason to switch to FP+, because it certainly wasn't done for the benefit of the guests. Maybe setting up and maintaining FP+ was cheaper than continuing to buy and print paper tickets. But you can be certain the switch was to increase the bottom line, be it getting more people in the parks or saving on paper/resources. Big companies simply don't change the way they do business for no reason. Again, if the parks are more crowded, it would stand to reason that many people would increase their length of stay in order to get done what they want to get done. That, I believe, is what Disney is banking on.

I agree that whatever Disney does with this, it will be for one reason..... because they believe it will increase profits.

Just not sure that longer stays is what they are after at DLR when they only sell up to a 5 day ticket.

 

[ClaraOswald]

Extra Magic Hour time at each park!!! Being there BEFORE Rope drop time !! Majority of the time during EMH to enjoy MOST rides WITHOUT LONG LINES or
even needing ANY kind of Fastpass BUT you STILL need to get in the parks EARLY! We don't really love this but we do it anyway!! Also why we usually stay at the resorts to get EMH!!!
Thus agreeing with HydroGuy " FP+ benefits people who like to sleep in but not so much for those willing to pay the price to get to the parks early." As I said before being a "local" and not wanting to go so early in the morning to enjoy the rides when the parks lately seem to be OVER crowded would be AWESOME & IDEAL!! Although when going for the few hours but rides are too long to wait I am just happy hanging around sometimes cuz I love it @ Disney!!

You get on most rides in just 1 hour? Is that really possible? We get the 1 day with an extra hour on our trip (with our 5-day hoppers) but we certainly don't get on a million rides over that time.

When I was a local, we would often just go for an hour or two to wander around and maybe get a snack. It was great. The only thing I liked about living in California. Ha!

At WDW, we never make it to rope drop because we just aren't early risers. So I am happy to hear that the new (and kind of annoying sounding) FP+ may benefit us there. But at Disneyland it's pretty easy to make it to rope drop when you're a 5 minute walk away. So I do hope the new system doesn't allow people to book FP tickets until they are through the gates for the day.

 

[hjgaus]

You get on most rides in just 1 hour? Is that really possible? We get the 1 day with an extra hour on our trip (with our 5-day hoppers) but we certainly don't get on a million rides over that time.

Is this because of your ticket with the 1 magic morning? Do you stay on their property? We do at least 4 - 5 times per year with our AP's & DVC !! I think that = out around 8 -10 Extra Magic Hours.... that's IF we take advantage of CHECK IN day EMH!!! Although ALL the rides are not OPEN for EMH the RIDES we enjoy the most SM, ST,RSR, TSM, CS and sometimes TOT when they choose to open it! Fantasyland is optional for us considering we do not have little ones anymore. Sometimes my kids love to go BACK into the parks as late as possible and try the rides just before closing time cuz they know they are going to return to the room (which over look CA Park) and not drive home!


When I was a local, we would often just go for an hour or two to wander around and maybe get a snack. It was great. The only thing I liked about living in California. Ha!

I know me too!! We also went for school field trips - 3rd & 6th grade, Junior High and High School band trips EVERY YEAR (chaperone/band mom) only 20/30 minute drive!
GRAD NIGHT - me 1984 & my eldest son 2011! Just a few years ago the 24 hour events - had reservations @ villa so no need to find places to nap in parks!
I LUV DISNEY!!!


At WDW, we never make it to rope drop because we just aren't early risers. So I am happy to hear that the new (and kind of annoying sounding) FP+ may benefit us there. But at Disneyland it's pretty easy to make it to rope drop when you're a 5 minute walk away. So I do hope the new system doesn't allow people to book FP tickets until they are through the gates for the day.

It sounds like you're warming up to FP+ ! Are going to WDW soon? If you go at high crowds like Christmas/New Years time such as we did you'll love the FP+ system there - you could even change your choice kinda of last minute if need be!!

HEY.... no bitterness here! Whatever DL becomes is fine with us!!

 

[ClaraOswald]

Nah, no WDW for a couple more years. And we don't go during holidays.

I will like FP+ at Disneyland as long as it's same day bookings only.

 

[bellazachmom]

Two weeks ago we were in line for Indiana Jones at Disneyland when it broke down. A cast member had us give them one of our tickets and tell them how many people were in our party and scanned the one ticket. No paper fastpass was given out. We were able to use this "fastpass" any time during the day and when we did return, they scanned the same ticket and allowed us to enter the FP line. It was about as fast in return as using a paper FP.

We had the same thing happen at Luigi's!! I'm hoping that is a stepin the right direction for the new Paperless FPs

 

[kwdw]

I have to tell you, I'm laughing at this thread. As WDW veteran whose been through the change at WDW and now planning a DLR trip this summer - I WISH DLR had fully rolled out FP+ NOW. I, too, thought that the new plan at WDW was going to be awful. I was an expert at the paper FP system that you pulled in the park and that did work well. And yes - after the change there are some longer stand-by lines at some attractions now. But - man - now that I know HOW to use the FP+ system to my advantage - I love it. All the same concerns are repeated in this thread.

Now, yes, DLR has a different character in that many guests are local and hence, I do suspect the two systems won't be identical. And not everyone is going to love the change, that's for sure. But change happens all the time and we don't get to control all of it. This will change how folks tour DLR - just like it's changed WDW. Crowd flow, touring strategies, wait times - yep - I suspect FP+ however it is rolled out at DLR will change those things.

But those who adjust and figure it out - reap rewards. Planning my days at WDW are SO much easier now.

 

[ClaraOswald]

I have to tell you, I'm laughing at this thread. As WDW veteran whose been through the change at WDW and now planning a DLR trip this summer - I WISH DLR had fully rolled out FP+ NOW. I, too, thought that the new plan at WDW was going to be awful. I was an expert at the paper FP system that you pulled in the park and that did work well. And yes - after the change there are some longer stand-by lines at some attractions now. But - man - now that I know HOW to use the FP+ system to my advantage - I love it. All the same concerns are repeated in this thread.

Now, yes, DLR has a different character in that many guests are local and hence, I do suspect the two systems won't be identical. And not everyone is going to love the change, that's for sure. But change happens all the time and we don't get to control all of it. This will change how folks tour DLR - just like it's changed WDW. Crowd flow, touring strategies, wait times - yep - I suspect FP+ however it is rolled out at DLR will change those things.

But those who adjust and figure it out - reap rewards. Planning my days at WDW are SO much easier now.

I think the main issue is that many DLR people don't like to plan their days in advance that much.

 

[kwdw]

I think the main issue is that many DLR people don't like to plan their days in advance that much.

Yep - I get that. I didn't want/like to plan my WDW days that much either - that was my biggest complaint about the new FP+ system - I didn't like to plan 60 days in advance which park I am going to. And the beauty is - you still don't have at WDW. With the exception of a couple of attractions - FP+ availability at WDW is still decent just the day before or morning of.

I do seriously doubt that DLR will follow the 60 day model - the two resorts don't follow the same ADR rules now.

It will be fun to see how this all plays out!

 

[hjgaus]

Yep - I get that. I didn't want/like to plan my WDW days that much either - that was my biggest complaint about the new FP+ system - I didn't like to plan 60 days in advance which park I am going to. And the beauty is - you still don't have at WDW. With the exception of a couple of attractions - FP+ availability at WDW is still decent just the day before or morning of.

I do seriously doubt that DLR will follow the 60 day model - the two resorts don't follow the same ADR rules now.

It will be fun to see how this all plays out!

OMG !!! THANK UUU !!! Someone who FINALLY understands what I have been trying to say my last few posts on this subject!!!

As I said before " you are not locked in to that 60 day assigned time - you can ALWAYS change it as well !! "

HAVE A NICE DAY!!!

 

[Kender]

"Understanding what you've been trying to say" and "agreeing with what you've been trying to say" are not one in the same. That's like saying "the ground is wet so it must be raining". It could be raining (or been raining), or any other number of things could have happened to make the ground wet.

Myself and I'm sure several others perfectly understood your position and posts on the subject matter. But we just don't agree with you.

 

[brymolmom]

I have to tell you, I'm laughing at this thread. As WDW veteran whose been through the change at WDW and now planning a DLR trip this summer - I WISH DLR had fully rolled out FP+ NOW. I, too, thought that the new plan at WDW was going to be awful. I was an expert at the paper FP system that you pulled in the park and that did work well. And yes - after the change there are some longer stand-by lines at some attractions now. But - man - now that I know HOW to use the FP+ system to my advantage - I love it. All the same concerns are repeated in this thread.

Now, yes, DLR has a different character in that many guests are local and hence, I do suspect the two systems won't be identical. And not everyone is going to love the change, that's for sure. But change happens all the time and we don't get to control all of it. This will change how folks tour DLR - just like it's changed WDW. Crowd flow, touring strategies, wait times - yep - I suspect FP+ however it is rolled out at DLR will change those things.

But those who adjust and figure it out - reap rewards. Planning my days at WDW are SO much easier now.

Serious question for you...I too am a WDW vet and have NOT come around to loving FP+. Back in the pre-FP+ days at WDW, about how many FP's did you pull in the average day?

I just can't get over being limited to once or MAYBE twice on RNR or Soarin or Splash. I also can't get over how LONG the waits are for so many of the attractions that NEVER had lines before they instituted FP+ (Great Movie Ride, Small World, heck - I've even seen a wait time at Figment since it was implemented). We used to be able to go at rope drop - do 4 - 6 headliners before lines formed, pull 2 FP's before lines formed, and then pull 4 - 6 more throughout the day. Plus, in the afternoon when crowds are the worst - we could go on all the 'lesser' attractions with little to no wait times, and honestly those don't even exist anymore since everyone takes a FP+ for them.

Maybe someday I'll come around...And I've never considered myself someone who hates change...But FP+ definitely has not benefited our touring style at all. I will honestly say that we have waited in way more lines at WDW and way more significant lines than we ever have during our FP+ trips. But, keep in mind, in the past, pre-FP+ we never waited in any lines more than 15 minutes...and even that was rare on a week long trip with medium crowds. So maybe people who are more easily convinced didn't pull as many FP's in a day or were used to waiting in more lines...I'm not sure but I just haven't gotten to that point, but genuinely hope I do - because I haven't loved our last couple of trips.

 

[jeffg4]

Serious question for you...I too am a WDW vet and have NOT come around to loving FP+. Back in the pre-FP+ days at WDW, about how many FP's did you pull in the average day?

I just can't get over being limited to once or MAYBE twice on RNR or Soarin or Splash. I also can't get over how LONG the waits are for so many of the attractions that NEVER had lines before they instituted FP+ (Great Movie Ride, Small World, heck - I've even seen a wait time at Figment since it was implemented). We used to be able to go at rope drop - do 4 - 6 headliners before lines formed, pull 2 FP's before lines formed, and then pull 4 - 6 more throughout the day. Plus, in the afternoon when crowds are the worst - we could go on all the 'lesser' attractions with little to no wait times, and honestly those don't even exist anymore since everyone takes a FP+ for them.

Maybe someday I'll come around...And I've never considered myself someone who hates change...But FP+ definitely has not benefited our touring style at all. I will honestly say that we have waited in way more lines at WDW and way more significant lines than we ever have during our FP+ trips. But, keep in mind, in the past, pre-FP+ we never waited in any lines more than 15 minutes...and even that was rare on a week long trip with medium crowds. So maybe people who are more easily convinced didn't pull as many FP's in a day or were used to waiting in more lines...I'm not sure but I just haven't gotten to that point, but genuinely hope I do - because I haven't loved our last couple of trips.

I'm with you. I haven't been to WDW since FP+, but we used to do rope drop till park close with a 3-4 hour break in the afternoon. At MK, we could accomplish 20-30 attractions in that time span, including pulling 7 or 8 FP's. And this in the busy summer months with no EMH's. I did not mind crisscrossing the park to pull FPs as long as it resulted in maximum attractions with minimum waits. With FP+, it sounds to me a day like this is no longer possible. Rather unfortunate. With FP+, it seems like there is no longer a big advantage for people in the know who do their homework ahead of time.

 

[LizzyS]

I'm about to start seriously planning a WDW trip for next year and I'm looking forward to trying out FP+ and the magic bands, tbh.

I'm not a big FP user to begin with, even when I'm at DLR, but I'm willing to have an open mind about it and give it a shot.

 

[ClaraOswald]

We actually didn't use many fast passes on our last WDW trip (2012) because we went in February and the parks just weren't crowded. So we only grabbed a couple a day because that's all we needed. Everything else had short lines. I suspect that just won't be the cast next trip because of FP+ so that kind of sucks.

 

[HydroGuy]

Serious question for you...I too am a WDW vet and have NOT come around to loving FP+. Back in the pre-FP+ days at WDW, about how many FP's did you pull in the average day?

I just can't get over being limited to once or MAYBE twice on RNR or Soarin or Splash. I also can't get over how LONG the waits are for so many of the attractions that NEVER had lines before they instituted FP+ (Great Movie Ride, Small World, heck - I've even seen a wait time at Figment since it was implemented). We used to be able to go at rope drop - do 4 - 6 headliners before lines formed, pull 2 FP's before lines formed, and then pull 4 - 6 more throughout the day. Plus, in the afternoon when crowds are the worst - we could go on all the 'lesser' attractions with little to no wait times, and honestly those don't even exist anymore since everyone takes a FP+ for them.

Maybe someday I'll come around...And I've never considered myself someone who hates change...But FP+ definitely has not benefited our touring style at all. I will honestly say that we have waited in way more lines at WDW and way more significant lines than we ever have during our FP+ trips. But, keep in mind, in the past, pre-FP+ we never waited in any lines more than 15 minutes...and even that was rare on a week long trip with medium crowds. So maybe people who are more easily convinced didn't pull as many FP's in a day or were used to waiting in more lines...I'm not sure but I just haven't gotten to that point, but genuinely hope I do - because I haven't loved our last couple of trips.

I think most (or all) of what you are saying is pretty much spot on. I would add some observations for perspective:

- Most of your touring style (which is similar to how I have toured so I get it) has the biggest bang for the buck at MK where there are more headliner rides than at the other parks.

- Your style breaks down when something unexpected happens to your group - at which point the advantages of FP+ start to kick in. This happened to us at WDW last May when my DW got bit by what we think was a brown recluse spider one evening at DHS. It disrupted us for several days including a couple late arrivals to the park. FP+ was awesome in that case and the ability to modify FPs on my iPhone was a godsend. If you want to gory details read my mini report linked in my signature line.

- It was unusually hot at WDW last May and I have to confess I liked not having to crisscross the parks to get FPs and just having them already in place. Yes, it cost me a couple FP opportunities I might have otherwise had, and I did reserve the FPs 60 days out, but it did have its advantages.

 

[kwdw]

Serious question for you...I too am a WDW vet and have NOT come around to loving FP+. Back in the pre-FP+ days at WDW, about how many FP's did you pull in the average day?

I just can't get over being limited to once or MAYBE twice on RNR or Soarin or Splash. I also can't get over how LONG the waits are for so many of the attractions that NEVER had lines before they instituted FP+ (Great Movie Ride, Small World, heck - I've even seen a wait time at Figment since it was implemented). We used to be able to go at rope drop - do 4 - 6 headliners before lines formed, pull 2 FP's before lines formed, and then pull 4 - 6 more throughout the day. Plus, in the afternoon when crowds are the worst - we could go on all the 'lesser' attractions with little to no wait times, and honestly those don't even exist anymore since everyone takes a FP+ for them.

Maybe someday I'll come around...And I've never considered myself someone who hates change...But FP+ definitely has not benefited our touring style at all. I will honestly say that we have waited in way more lines at WDW and way more significant lines than we ever have during our FP+ trips. But, keep in mind, in the past, pre-FP+ we never waited in any lines more than 15 minutes...and even that was rare on a week long trip with medium crowds. So maybe people who are more easily convinced didn't pull as many FP's in a day or were used to waiting in more lines...I'm not sure but I just haven't gotten to that point, but genuinely hope I do - because I haven't loved our last couple of trips.

We typically pulled 6-7 FPs in a day in the MK when they had the paper ones. Like you - we'd be there at rope drop - hit a headliner or two and start pulling as allowed. It was best before they instituted the forced return time. After that - we probably dropped 4 or 5 because the return times we were able to get when walking by often interfered with dinner plans.

Now with FP+ = we typically only use 2 or 3 at AK, 3 at DHS, 2-4 at EPCOT, and depending on the plans for the day - 3-6 at MK.

At MK - since we don't travel mid-summer - Splash lines aren't usually long when we go. If you hit it early in the morning or late at night, IASW doesn't have long lines. The lines for Pirates is annoying now - so we FP that. HM we try to hit during the parade or early morning (those lines are a bit longer with FP+). So - we typically FP+ in advance - Pirates, SDMT, and either PP or BTMRR. If we are headed to Space - we usually hit that right before or after fireworks - or at RD - but sometimes I skip this unless the boyfriend is around - I don't like the roughness of this. We don't like lines of greater than 20 minutes. Buzz, Pooh, Barnstormer, Dumbo, IASW, Under the Sea - we've been able to get FP+ for those day of after we have used our first three.

At EPCOT - Soarin - I struggle to not get sick on this - so we don't ride it every trip in the first place - so we always FP+ TT and also ride that single rider. I usually FP+ Character Spot and Spaceship Earth. I get sick on Mission Space - and the boyfriend doesn't like it.

At DHS - I agree that the ANNOYING long stand-by lines for Great Movie Ride are a negative. I usually RD TSMM and then head straight to GMR - using my FP+ for TSM later in the day. Now - I don't ride RnR at all, so if the boyfriend is along - he rides that single rider.

At AK - if the boyfriend is along - we FP+ EE. If he isn't - I skip it or maybe single rider. I did FP+ it once in advance without him - and I actually could move it up in time day of - and then once that time had passed - added a Nemo FP+ I didn't have when the day started. If we are headed at RD - I don't FP+ Safari - but I will get one if we aren't going to be there until later. Sometimes we FP+ Nemo or FOTLK. We don't ride Kali (again - not typically hot weather travelers and hence - I don't want to get that wet). I'm a bit wondered about AK traffic flow with the new night-time stuff. I think that will bring more folks into the park - and might make it harder to get into the three currently existing shows without FP+.

 

[tlovesdis]

We had the same thing happen at Luigi's!! I'm hoping that is a stepin the right direction for the new Paperless FPs

DLR has been using this paperless FP system for over a year now for people in wheelchairs and ecv's. I'm surprised it's taken them this long to implement it to everyone!

 

[Angel Ariel]

OMG !!! THANK UUU !!! Someone who FINALLY understands what I have been trying to say my last few posts on this subject!!!

As I said before " you are not locked in to that 60 day assigned time - you can ALWAYS change it as well !! "

HAVE A NICE DAY!!!

Can't speak for others, but I fully understood *what* you were saying. But your experience, and the experience of the poster you quoted, was *not* my experience with FP+. Day of availability was very very limited, and changing FP+ on the fly didn't happen (and yes, we did try).

 

[hjgaus]

Sometimes it works out & sometimes is does not. Love it, leave it or just roll with it either way CHANGE IS COMING !

Good day everyone!