Brazilian Tour Groups?

[madenon]

I agree....kind of like speaking in their native language rather than speaking English while in public...I find this VERY disrespectful myself...no matter what the nationality. AND...before everyone jumps my case....I think the same is true when a US citizen visits a country where another language is spoken...to me it is just common-courtesy.... Respect for the country you are VISITING not a citizen of!

Being disrespectfull just because someone talks to a relative in their own native tongue? Just because you can't listen in on their conversation, that doesn't make them being disrespectfull. Or do you really think you'll be speaking fluent japanese 24/7 when you take some kids on a trip to disneyland Tokio, just because your in public? Poor kids, not even being allowed to talk to eachother in their own language.

Or think about the do-Europe-in-no-time-tour a lot of americans and azians take. If you visit several countries in a couple of days, never staying more than 3 days (most of the times not even more than one) in a country, you simply can't speak the native language of each country, let alone of each region. (yes, there are quite a few countries overhere with more than one official language being used in one country)

If you ask me; speak whatever you like, as long as you at least try to speak the language used in the region you're in at that particular time when you're speaking to or want to speak to someone other than those in your party. It's non of anyones bee-wax what I'm talking about with those I'm travelling with if I'm just minding my own business.

I'm proud of the way most of us overhere think about this subject. Respect is shown by the effort people put into understanding our country and culture (which includes the language but is way more than that one thing) and their overall behaviour. Actually speaking the language at a proper level or not doesn't make or break the deal for being respectfull or not. Not only will tourists have a big chance of running into anyone that besides dutch also speaks english, french, german, turkish, maroccan, papiamento, spanish or italian, but most will actually put the effort into helping people out in their own language if they see those people are really trying hard and appreciate the help they get.

Really, how disrespectfull can it be to hear someone talk russian for all I care, when you walk down main street, as long as they say "please", "sorry", have some kind of translation booklet with them etc. when talking to those around them? Even Mickey doesn't speak most of the time. Is he disrespectfull when he bumps into someone on accident and doesn't say sorry in english but in gestures? Or do we have different standards to hold the mouse to?

If we can like the mouse and think he's all that, just because of his great additude and putting effort into it, why can't we give those who happen to speak a different language or come from a different place the same treatment?

 

[mkycrzy1971]

That's a little harsh, don't you think? You can't expect people, if they don't know the language, to be entirely silent in public.
There are obviously tourists that can speak English, but people just visiting a country can't be expected to know the native language. I feel bad for people who travel a lot if this is the case!

Nope...not at all....and here is why... My family arrived in this country from France in 1896 (and my husband's family arrived from France in the 1930's)...both of our families learned the language very quickly (and without the internet and other technology...imagine that!)...out of respect to the US for being allowed to come to the country, both of our families thought it was very important to speak English ONLY in public.

I did not say that these visitors should be silent, I just think a little respect for the country you visit goes a long way....I am sure that MOST do not come to this country not knowing any English...how would they get around and function??? There are certainly not signs posted for every language...in my opinion, there should only be signs posted in one...ENGLISH...the language of the land....I am sorry if there are some that do not agree...however, coming from a decendant of an immigrant, I think it is a very reasonable request.

 

[mkycrzy1971]

Being disrespectfull just because someone talks to a relative in their own native tongue? Just because you can't listen in on their conversation, that doesn't make them being disrespectfull. Or do you really think you'll be speaking fluent japanese 24/7 when you take some kids on a trip to disneyland Tokio, just because your in public? Poor kids, not even being allowed to talk to eachother in their own language.

Or think about the do-Europe-in-no-time-tour a lot of americans and azians take. If you visit several countries in a couple of days, never staying more than 3 days (most of the times not even more than one) in a country, you simply can't speak the native language of each country, let alone of each region. (yes, there are quite a few countries overhere with more than one official language being used in one country)

If you ask me; speak whatever you like, as long as you at least try to speak the language used in the region you're in at that particular time when you're speaking to or want to speak to someone other than those in your party. It's non of anyones bee-wax what I'm talking about with those I'm travelling with if I'm just minding my own business.

I'm proud of the way most of us overhere think about this subject. Respect is shown by the effort people put into understanding our country and culture (which includes the language but is way more than that one thing) and their overall behaviour. Actually speaking the language at a proper level or not doesn't make or break the deal for being respectfull or not. Not only will tourists have a big chance of running into anyone that besides dutch also speaks english, french, german, turkish, maroccan, papiamento, spanish or italian, but most will actually put the effort into helping people out in their own language if they see those people are really trying hard and appreciate the help they get.

Really, how disrespectfull can it be to hear someone talk russian for all I care, when you walk down main street, as long as they say "please", "sorry", have some kind of translation booklet with them etc. when talking to those around them? Even Mickey doesn't speak most of the time. Is he disrespectfull when he bumps into someone on accident and doesn't say sorry in english but in gestures? Or do we have different standards to hold the mouse to?

If we can like the mouse and think he's all that, just because of his great additude and putting effort into it, why can't we give those who happen to speak a different language or come from a different place the same treatment?

I do not want to listen to their conversation...and I would NOT take myself nor my children to another country without learning the language and using in public...just as my ancestors did when they came to America in 1896 from France.

 

[Zingela]

Nope...not at all....and here is why... My family arrived in this country from France in 1896 (and my husband's family arrived from France in the 1930's)...both of our families learned the language very quickly (and without the internet and other technology...imagine that!)...out of respect to the US for being allowed to come to the country, both of our families thought it was very important to speak English ONLY in public.

I did not say that these visitors should be silent, I just think a little respect for the country you visit goes a long way....I am sure that MOST do not come to this country not knowing any English...how would they get around and function??? There are certainly not signs posted for every language...in my opinion, there should only be signs posted in one...ENGLISH...the language of the land....I am sorry if there are some that do not agree...however, coming from a decendant of an immigrant, I think it is a very reasonable request.

I see where you are coming from, however, we are talking about a vacation here, not a full-blown immigration. There's quite a difference.

Like someone mentioned before, I hope I'm not expected to learn and speak Japanese just to spend a week or two in Disneyland Tokyo, or any other foreign language vacation spot!

Translation handbooks and general guides are handy for any tourist traveling to any foreign country, though, and should be used if possible!

 

[madenon]

That's a little harsh, don't you think? You can't expect people, if they don't know the language, to be entirely silent in public.
There are obviously tourists that can speak English, but people just visiting a country can't be expected to know the native language. I feel bad for people who travel a lot if this is the case!

If you ask me, it also has to do with english (still) being the most commenly used language and america being such a big country.

When living in a place like the netherlands, you learn the importance of languistic skills and tolerance very early on. One hour to the east, and I'll hear german. One hour to the west, and I'll be hearing words like "bloody" or "tea". Two hours to the south and I'll be hearinf flamish, one hour more and it's french. Going north and within no time here come the scandinavian languages. In the first years of highschool you will be obliged to follow at least four different languages, dutch included, after which you pick your majors with dutch and english being obligated untill graduation. (in fact; english is being educated at most middelschools, starting as early as the age of 6 or some even earlier)

 

[mkycrzy1971]

I see where you are coming from, however, we are talking about a vacation here, not a full-blown immigration. There's quite a difference.

Like someone mentioned before, I hope I'm not expected to learn and speak Japanese just to spend a week or two in Disneyland Tokyo, or any other foreign language vacation spot!

Translation handbooks and general guides are handy for any tourist traveling to any foreign country, though, and should be used if possible!

Not really....I guess I feel that way because of how adamant my family has always been about their own ancestors feelings.

Yes, I would expect to learn and speak Japanese (at least somewhat well) before spending a week or two in Disneyland Tokyo or any other foreign language of the land I might be visiting...again, to me it is all out of respect for being allowed to visit....afterall, it is a privilege to be able to do so...not necessarily a right.

 

[Tam1067]

I see where you are coming from, however, we are talking about a vacation here, not a full-blown immigration. There's quite a difference.

Like someone mentioned before, I hope I'm not expected to learn and speak Japanese just to spend a week or two in Disneyland Tokyo, or any other foreign language vacation spot!

Translation handbooks and general guides are handy for any tourist traveling to any foreign country, though, and should be used if possible!

Very well said. To compare a group of teens or tourists visiting the US to someone who immigrates here is just silly and unrealistic.

I have no problem with Brazilians speaking Portuguese to each other--in fact, that's what I'd expect they do. I lived in France for 6 months during college. I speak French. Yet when I spoke to my American friends (who also spoke French), we always spoke in English to each other. It's unnatural and unrealistic to speak another language with someone from your own country. I would say even immigrants who live here will most likely continue to speak their native language to each other, and that's also not a problem for me as long as they attempt to learn English for when they communicate in the rest of the world.

However, visitors to another country should know the answer to the common Disney question of "How many" meaning "How many are in your party?" I was frustrated more than once when the Brazilian groups we saw didn't know how to answer that question and would slow up the ride loading process because they couldn't or wouldn't attempt to give a number in English. Also, they should learn the etiquette of the country they're visiting, and if they bump into someone, say "Excuse me" or "Sorry" in English. Those are easy phrases to learn and useful. And the chanting, whether it's in English or any other language, is very rude, but I would bet English speaking Americans in large groups might act the same way if they were allowed to.

 

[sassyat30]

To me, language isn't a problem. Brazilian children learn English starting at age 6...pleading ignorance doesn't work with me....hopefully, I won't have the misfortune of dealing with them on our next trip. If I do, I won't be silent and will say something to them, to their leader and to a CM.

Rude, inexcusable behavior (no matter the nationality) is the problem. It needs to be curbed and those large groups (whether they be cheerleaders, Japanese, Brazilian, whatever) need to be warned about the "American" (sorry, for lack of a better term) way to act in the parks and what is acceptable and what isn't.

There is no reason why a group of 50-100 kids has one or two adults with them...THAT is totally unacceptable.

 

[sassyat30]

I just wanted to clarify (after reading the post above mine ) that I have no problem with the foreign languages when speaking to each other...that is expected and perfectly reasonable.

It's when the groups are dealing with CM (at rides) or other patrons in the parks, that I believe they should knock off the act and speak English that they've been learning since they were practically toddlers.

 

[hollieplus2]

Can anyone tell me when the Brazilians are there? We had the "pleasure" of meeting them last July and I read through this topic and found out they are there in January also. What other times are they usually there? We are going Sept 28-Oct 8. Will they be there? We upgraded to POFQ for this very reason since last July we were at POP. NEVER AGAIN.

 

[madenon]

I do not want to listen to their conversation...and I would NOT take myself nor my children to another country without learning the language and using in public...just as my ancestors did when they came to America in 1896 from France.

Ehm, maybe my education is not what I think it is, but as far as I know the original native tongue of america wasn't english. English is a language that we Europeans once inforced on the native people of america because we were too hungry for more money and land.

Not only that, but in those days there were very little, if any, chances to learn a different language while still being in the country one is planning on leaving. That being said; those immigrants not coming from the UK, most of them would have learned the language after arriving to America.

Totally different thing as to learning a language and speaking if fluently enough before you actually go, let alone if someone is only going for a very small amount of days.

But than again, I don't think we want to drag our ancestors into a discussion about language and showing respect or disrespect to a countries culture. If there ever were any human beings who put the word disrespect to a new level, it were our European ancestors with their colonisation and slavery politics. And yes, my ancestors have quite a shady reputation in this also, to say the least.

Come on! People are at WDW for a couple of days to visit with the mouse. A lot of them save up for it for a long time, might just be their only visit ever. Let them be. As long as they can manage themselves, are polite and pleasant, what's the real problem in all of this?

 

[edcarmo]

Can anyone tell me when the Brazilians are there? We had the "pleasure" of meeting them last July and I read through this topic and found out they are there in January also. What other times are they usually there? We are going Sept 28-Oct 8. Will they be there? We upgraded to POFQ for this very reason since last July we were at POP. NEVER AGAIN.

You will see Brazilians all year long... on the other hand... the tourist groups (teenagers "organized" by travel agencies) mainly at July and January (typical vacation time)

 

[lpizzuro123]

Come on! People are at WDW for a couple of days to visit with the mouse. A lot of them save up for it for a long time, might just be their only visit ever. Let them be. As long as they can manage themselves, are polite and pleasant, what's the real problem in all of this?

I agree and have no problem with them talking in their native language and I do not feel that they need to learn the English language if they are coming here on vacation but I do have a problem when they cannot manage themselves and are not polite and pleasant and I do understand the whole getting excite thing (heck I get excited also) but just do not want them plowing me down on the street.

Linda

 

[abordelon]

Are the tour groups vacationing throughout the entire month of July? We are going the 23rd to the 30th. We usually go the 2nd week of August and have never encountered a group.

 

[mkycrzy1971]

Ehm, maybe my education is not what I think it is, but as far as I know the original native tongue of america wasn't english. English is a language that we Europeans once inforced on the native people of america because we were too hungry for more money and land.

Not only that, but in those days there were very little, if any, chances to learn a different language while still being in the country one is planning on leaving. That being said; those immigrants not coming from the UK, most of them would have learned the language after arriving to America.

Totally different thing as to learning a language and speaking if fluently enough before you actually go, let alone if someone is only going for a very small amount of days.

But than again, I don't think we want to drag our ancestors into a discussion about language and showing respect or disrespect to a countries culture. If there ever were any human beings who put the word disrespect to a new level, it were our European ancestors with their colonisation and slavery politics. And yes, my ancestors have quite a shady reputation in this also, to say the least.

Come on! People are at WDW for a couple of days to visit with the mouse. A lot of them save up for it for a long time, might just be their only visit ever. Let them be. As long as they can manage themselves, are polite and pleasant, what's the real problem in all of this?

Okay...be sarcastic if you feel the need...HOWEVER...the language used TODAY in America IS English..."the language of the land"....SORRY (and yes, I have Native American ancestors too...only 4 generations back). I am not going to continue this conversation NOR comment on ancestors wrongs...it is below me to do so (again, out of respect to our country and knowing what is right)...however, I will say that if it were not for them coming to America (with nothing but the clothes on their backs mind you!) and working their way into becoming a citizen of this great country, I would not have the luxuries (nor freedom) that I have today...therefore I choose to show my respect and always will to ANY country willing to allow entry to foreigners...visitors or immigrants....PERIOD...END OF DISCUSSION! I am very sorry to those of you who do not agree.

 

[madenon]

Nope...not at all....and here is why... My family arrived in this country from France in 1896 (and my husband's family arrived from France in the 1930's)...both of our families learned the language very quickly (and without the internet and other technology...imagine that!)...out of respect to the US for being allowed to come to the country, both of our families thought it was very important to speak English ONLY in public.

I did not say that these visitors should be silent, I just think a little respect for the country you visit goes a long way....I am sure that MOST do not come to this country not knowing any English...how would they get around and function??? There are certainly not signs posted for every language...in my opinion, there should only be signs posted in one...ENGLISH...the language of the land....I am sorry if there are some that do not agree...however, coming from a decendant of an immigrant, I think it is a very reasonable request.

While you might not see the fun in it (and I must say; it's not my first choice either), that doesn't mean travelling without knowing the language is definately a dumb thing to do. For a lot of people it is just that factor that makes their travel interesting. Go to another part of the world of which we have no real understanding, and just do it. Just be amongst those people and life live like they do. Just go with the flow and learn. It really is such a great experience to learn not only the true culture instead of a tourist-version we get fed, but also to enlarge personal development. At the moment it is a real hit with the students overhere to go on a solo trip or with 2 or 3 friends to china. Not only Beijing and Bangkok, but the real rural China. Chinese is one of the hardest languages to learn or speak and besides the big cities there aren't many who wil speak english, nor will there be any signs. They take special booklets with them in which pictograms are shown. Communication is done by using the booklets and learning the language as the go. And you know what? They all come back with so much love and respect for the place, having more self-confidence and with the chinese people not being offended but inviting them into there homes and lives to learn from and enjoy eachother.

On the other hand there are those so arrogant, they will act rude. But hey, they probably were rude at home also. That doesn't have to do with languistics, but with peoples caractre and set -or lack of- of moral values.

 

[boomhauer]

Come on! People are at WDW for a couple of days to visit with the mouse. A lot of them save up for it for a long time, might just be their only visit ever. Let them be. As long as they can manage themselves, are polite and pleasant, what's the real problem in all of this?

There is no problem with this. However, that's not how alot of these tour groups conduct themselves.

These horror stories abuot them are not made up. They've occured. Disney is aware of it. Ask any manager and they'll tell you the same thing: This type of behavior is common in their country. They don't understand the concept of standing in line. They all get warnings from Disney when booking the trip.

What the managers don't tell you is, this is just standard practice. Once they are there, yelling, chanting, shouting, cutting in line, ruining other people's evening and spoiling the magic for them, they do nothing to stop it.

Here's my personal feeling: I wouldn't go to another contry and start any American chants, national anthems, etc. I'd be respectful of the country I was in and treat them as my host. These tour groups are the EXACT opposite.

 

[AJKMOM]

Ehm, maybe my education is not what I think it is, but as far as I know the original native tongue of america wasn't english. English is a language that we Europeans once inforced on the native people of america because we were too hungry for more money and land.

Not only that, but in those days there were very little, if any, chances to learn a different language while still being in the country one is planning on leaving. That being said; those immigrants not coming from the UK, most of them would have learned the language after arriving to America.

Totally different thing as to learning a language and speaking if fluently enough before you actually go, let alone if someone is only going for a very small amount of days.

But than again, I don't think we want to drag our ancestors into a discussion about language and showing respect or disrespect to a countries culture. If there ever were any human beings who put the word disrespect to a new level, it were our European ancestors with their colonisation and slavery politics. And yes, my ancestors have quite a shady reputation in this also, to say the least.

Come on! People are at WDW for a couple of days to visit with the mouse. A lot of them save up for it for a long time, might just be their only visit ever. Let them be. As long as they can manage themselves, are polite and pleasant, what's the real problem in all of this?

The real problem is that they can't manage themselves, they aren't polite or pleasant. According to many of these posts, the behavior is bad enough that people plan their vacations to avoid the tour groups.

Swarms of people moving wheelchairs and strollers, knocking kids over, cutting in line by the dozens? Sounds like trouble to me.

I hope someone tells us when in January could be a problem, because we are going right after New Years Day to celebrate a birthday.

 

[hollieplus2]

You will see Brazilians all year long... on the other hand... the tourist groups (teenagers "organized" by travel agencies) mainly at July and January (typical vacation time)

That's what I wanted to know. I don't mind Brazilians, just the large group of unsupervised teens. Glad to know that most won't be there in Sept. We thought about going in December but it would have been Pop Warner week. We didn't want that group either. Nothing against Brazilians or Cheerleaders I just don't want to deal with large upsupervised groups if I don't have to.

 

[boomhauer]

That's what I wanted to know. I don't mind Brazilians, just the large group of unsupervised teens. Glad to know that most won't be there in Sept. We thought about going in December but it would have been Pop Warner week. We didn't want that group either. Nothing against Brazilians or Cheerleaders I just don't want to deal with large upsupervised groups if I don't have to.

Problem is, they are supervised. It's just that the "supervisors" are just as bad, if not worse.