Frustrated, sad, mad, and out of ideas

I wonder if there are any programs in her area where someone would bring their dog over for a visit? and maybe let your mom come out for a walk with them and their dog? they have dogs that visit in nursing homes and hospitals perhaps there is something similar. if there isn't, there certainly should be! a lot of peoples day would be brightened by a visit from a dog (and you don't need to shower for a dog!)

Another thought is maybe she can try an assisted living place for 2 or 3 months. Keep her current place and let her do a "test drive". Often women, especially, find that they like the assisted living place because of the social aspects and after a couple months what to stay. Would she agree to that? You would probably have to go up there and take her to visit places...and can she afford assisted living?

Hugs Lisa. The later years are so hard. From the day I first met my MIL (in her 50's) she said the only way we were ever getting her to move out of her house was feet first. And that's exactly how it happened. But it made her later years so hard on everyone around her.

I hope you can find a way to balance her needs and wants, while giving you the peace of mind you seek.

I'm not sure where you live, so this service might not be available for your mom. Here, we have a type of homecare, where they will assist with showering, shampooing hair etc, or if the senior insists they can do it themselves, they will just be in the home while the senior does it themselves, incase there is a fall. Homecare will run small errands such as picking up prescriptions etc. but the beauty of this is about twice a week, someone is checking in to see if they are all right.

It sounds like your mom is afraid she might need to go into a nursing home, so she is refusing any assistance in case it leads to this. If this is so, I understand. Being of sound mind, she has the right to choose how she will live. But it is putting extra burden on you, and it will not get easier. As time passes, you will be called upon to do more and more. So, assess your life, and try to look to the future. Include her in a discussion about what she thinks she will be doing 5, 10 years from now. I'm sure she doesn't want to burden you. Actually, she sounds like a nice lady. So, if she is reasonable, see if she can project herself in her minds eye to what will happen. What if something happens to you? What if she has a stroke? What if she develops some form of dementia? Questions of this type don't have to be answered right away. The conversation can be continued a few days later, after she has had some time to think on it. But these questions really should be answered, and she needs to be included it this conversation.

If she is truly depressed, I don't think outings or a pet will solve it. Medication might be needed, in which case your doctor will need to be involved. If it's the blues, they pass, but this seems to be lingering. Everyone needs a reason to get out of bed. We all need a plan for the day, a purpose or goal. And we all need to be needed. Let her know how much you need her. You depend on her for what ever help she gives you. I really think sitting a few feet from her, facing her, and having a heart to heart with her is the best thing.

weeniecat2442 said:

I wonder if there are any programs in her area where someone would bring their dog over for a visit? and maybe let your mom come out for a walk with them and their dog? they have dogs that visit in nursing homes and hospitals perhaps there is something similar. if there isn't, there certainly should be! a lot of peoples day would be brightened by a visit from a dog (and you don't need to shower for a dog!)

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My Mom LOVED when the Dogs visited the Nursing Home she was in-great idea for a bizness!

Has your DM ever actually visited potential assisted living facilities or is she just going by "what she's heard"? Could you get her just to go and look at some different places to actually see what they have to offer?

My DGM did this to my DM until she passed at 103 and I hate to tell you but it only gets worse . DGM lived in her own house until her 80s, an apartment until her early 90s, then the condo next door to DM the last decade. That was the WORST decision for the both of them, honestly. It aged my DM tremendously. All I can say is please consider counseling for yourself, because you will need it if the situation remains the same.

Terri

Thank you so much, everyone! I'm am so sorry for those of you going through the same thing with your loved ones. It's so tough.

Unfortunately, I have tried almost every option you guys have suggested. I have taken her for lunch at the independent/assisted living place. She LOVED it! And then she said, "I will definitely move in there when I am ready!" We've asked repeatedly what her definition of ready is and she can't define it.

They don't have "day care" around here that I have been able to find. The only ones I can find are for those with Alzheimer. We do have a senior center right down the road. She simply has no interest. Personally, I think the biggest factor in this is her inability to walk. She uses a walker around the house, but she can't get her walker in and out of the car on her own. We've taken her to the medical supply store and tried every walker they have and she simply can't do it. She isn't stable enough to not hold on to anything while pulling a walker out. When she goes to Walmart, she simply waits in the parking lot until an employee comes by and asks him to go in the store and get her a scooter. We've tried to get her to get buy her own scooter, but she is afraid to drive with one on the back of her car and her car won't fit in her condo garage with the lift/scooter on the back.

She has a senior center right down the street from her condo, but she won't go. She used to go with my dad years ago so she is very familiar with it. Again, I think the walking issue has a lot to do with it. Even if she scores a close handicap spot, without the walker or a scooter, she can't walk in on her own.

Hey, ya know where she could use both a walker and scooter without any worries? The assisted living place!!!! Yeah, don't think I don't bring that up regularly!

I don't have weeks on end that I can stay with her up north. I simply don't have that kind of time. My husband flies up there a few times for work and stays with her for a few days. I have a cousin who is in her 70's and lives an hour away from her. She tried to visit every six weeks or so, but in the past few years even those visits have dwindle because of the cousin's health. I have a brother who lives 40 minutes away so he looks in on her maybe every two weeks. He is a great cook and makes things for her to just pull out of the freezer and heat up (not that she actually does that very often). Unfortunately, while my brother loves my mom dearly and would do anything for her, he is also kind of a loser and just not on the ball enough to really keep a good eye on her.

She doesn't want a "stranger" coming into her house to visit or check up on her. She is honestly so sociable so I think this is just depression. When she gets her hair done, shops at Walmart, flies down here, she talks to everyone and they talk back. I swear she knows the life story of the people she meets! But she only goes out here because I insist. While she is in her condo alone, she simply doesn't go anywhere unless she absolutely has to. Day in and day out she sits alone with very few exceptions.

I've begged her to give the assisted living place a one month trial. If she hates it, I will never ask her again. She refuses.

It comes down to one of two things. I either ignore it as best as I can and what happens happens. Or, I put my foot down and force the issue. I've begged her to not make me do that. I've told her how much guilt that would cause me and I don't want to go down that road. She listens, says it will all work out, and changes the subject. We used to tease my dad about being stubborn. It wasn't until after he was gone that we realized she was the stubborn mule in that relationship!

Definitely a conundrum.

Do you talk to her about how you feel? How you are worried and it's affecting your health? Do you think she'd be more amenable to trying something if she felt guilty about you? Moms are supposed to worry about their kids even when they grow up, right?

What tone do you use when you talk about assisted living? Are you being positive in your inflections? Do you sound ademant that she try this? I think the way you talk about things may also help a bit.

LisaR said:

Thank you so much, everyone! I'm am so sorry for those of you going through the same thing with your loved ones. It's so tough.

Unfortunately, I have tried almost every option you guys have suggested. I have taken her for lunch at the independent/assisted living place. She LOVED it! And then she said, "I will definitely move in there when I am ready!" We've asked repeatedly what her definition of ready is and she can't define it.

They don't have "day care" around here that I have been able to find. The only ones I can find are for those with Alzheimer. We do have a senior center right down the road. She simply has no interest. Personally, I think the biggest factor in this is her inability to walk. She uses a walker around the house, but she can't get her walker in and out of the car on her own. We've taken her to the medical supply store and tried every walker they have and she simply can't do it. She isn't stable enough to not hold on to anything while pulling a walker out. When she goes to Walmart, she simply waits in the parking lot until an employee comes by and asks him to go in the store and get her a scooter. We've tried to get her to get buy her own scooter, but she is afraid to drive with one on the back of her car and her car won't fit in her condo garage with the lift/scooter on the back.

She has a senior center right down the street from her condo, but she won't go. She used to go with my dad years ago so she is very familiar with it. Again, I think the walking issue has a lot to do with it. Even if she scores a close handicap spot, without the walker or a scooter, she can't walk in on her own.

Hey, ya know where she could use both a walker and scooter without any worries? The assisted living place!!!! Yeah, don't think I don't bring that up regularly!

I don't have weeks on end that I can stay with her up north. I simply don't have that kind of time. My husband flies up there a few times for work and stays with her for a few days. I have a cousin who is in her 70's and lives an hour away from her. She tried to visit every six weeks or so, but in the past few years even those visits have dwindle because of the cousin's health. I have a brother who lives 40 minutes away so he looks in on her maybe every two weeks. He is a great cook and makes things for her to just pull out of the freezer and heat up (not that she actually does that very often). Unfortunately, while my brother loves my mom dearly and would do anything for her, he is also kind of a loser and just not on the ball enough to really keep a good eye on her.

She doesn't want a "stranger" coming into her house to visit or check up on her. She is honestly so sociable so I think this is just depression. When she gets her hair done, shops at Walmart, flies down here, she talks to everyone and they talk back. I swear she knows the life story of the people she meets! But she only goes out here because I insist. While she is in her condo alone, she simply doesn't go anywhere unless she absolutely has to. Day in and day out she sits alone with very few exceptions.

I've begged her to give the assisted living place a one month trial. If she hates it, I will never ask her again. She refuses.

It comes down to one of two things. I either ignore it as best as I can and what happens happens. Or, I put my foot down and force the issue. I've begged her to not make me do that. I've told her how much guilt that would cause me and I don't want to go down that road. She listens, says it will all work out, and changes the subject. We used to tease my dad about being stubborn. It wasn't until after he was gone that we realized she was the stubborn mule in that relationship!

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Lisa, I so identify with you. I'm going through the same thing with my 80yr old mother!

Mother lives about 400 miles away. She is 100% competent of her faculties. She lives in a large house which she has filled with her hoard; it's not dirty (well, the carpets are ruined with pet stains.) She basically lives in 3 rooms--her bedroom, the family room, and the kitchen. Every flat surface in the house is piled high with junk--books, papers, old bills, junk mail. And OMG! the catalogs! She gets about 50 catalogs a year and she keeps them all. She has stuff for recycling piled up all over the house. There are pictures stored in giant Rubbermaid containers, closets full of old clothes, piles and piles of material and patterns which she never touches. She won't allow anyone to touch her hoard. It's a maddening experience when I go down to see her, because of the huge amount of clutter.

My experience with Mother is pretty much the same as yours. She won't allow anyone to come into her house, other than us kids. No friends, no household help. She sits in her recliner, naps, and watches TV. She is no doubt depressed, but she will not even talk to her doctor about it. Mother lives in a declining neighborhood, but she doesn't see it. We've all tried to prod her to move to a senior living apartment, where she would have safety, people her own age around her, activities, and meals available. She has the money for it. But it's never gonna happen. Mother adopted 2 cats and a 90-lb dog four years ago, effectively making it nearly impossible for her to move to an apartment (we 5 kids have assured her that we will take her pets for her.) She can't even make decisions about her junk mail and recycle pile, let alone one her pets!

Unfortunately, I see this playing out poorly. Mother has already had 3 TIAs. She has diabetes and atrial fib. She is malnourished because she no longer cooks; she just nibbles on junk all day. Mother can't feel her feet and I fear that eventually she is going to fall and break something. We've tried to impress on her that she needs to go ahead and make some decisions, while she still can. But I don't have a lot of hope.

Sorry this is so long. Your post just touched a tender chord in me. Although I love my mother dearly, I have had to learn to let go. I foresee bad things in her future, but she is in her right mind so she can make her own decisions. I can't just swoop in and save her from herself. I can't forcibly confiscate her stuff. I can't make her make the right decisions or take her pet away. So, I wait. I wait for the big stroke, the heart attack, and the fractured hip. I wait for the break-in and the house fire. It makes me sad and quite a bit anxious, but I just have to let it go.

Another suggestion would be to check for an aging service in her area to see if they can at least drive her places so she can get out more. Depends on what they have funding for but it would be for dr appointments, grocery shopping, hair appointments, etc. I volunteer for a service like that in my area.

Happy Snowman said:

Another suggestion would be to check for an aging service in her area to see if they can at least drive her places so she can get out more. Depends on what they have funding for but it would be for dr appointments, grocery shopping, hair appointments, etc. I volunteer for a service like that in my area.

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OMG! I just asked my mom if I could find someone to take her to lunch or dinner three days a week or to help her run errands, would she be willing to go? She said YES!!! I'm speechless! Now I just need to figure out how to find a couple total strangers that I could trust with this. I looked at the senior centers near her and didn't see anything. I Googled phrases like senior sitters, senior services, and senior companions in her area and came up empty. I'll try making some calls next week and see what I can find. Thanks for the idea! Since she continually shoots down anything I suggest, this is a huge step forward. Of course, it may be that I have been on her all day and her mommy guilt finally kicked in. I don't care, I'll take it!

Thanks so much to everyone for all the great suggestions. I am sorry there are so many going through the same thing. It sucks, but it is a little better reading other stories and knowing we aren't alone in this.

LisaR said:

OMG! I just asked my mom if I could find someone to take her to lunch or dinner three days a week or to help her run errands, would she be willing to go? She said YES!!! I'm speechless! Now I just need to figure out how to find a couple total strangers that I could trust with this. I looked at the senior centers near her and didn't see anything. I Googled phrases like senior sitters, senior services, and senior companions in her area and came up empty. I'll try making some calls next week and see what I can find. Thanks for the idea! Since she continually shoots down anything I suggest, this is a huge step forward. Of course, it may be that I have been on her all day and her mommy guilt finally kicked in. I don't care, I'll take it!

Thanks so much to everyone for all the great suggestions. I am sorry there are so many going through the same thing. It sucks, but it is a little better reading other stories and knowing we aren't alone in this.

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The group I drive with is a regional non-profit service that is associated with several assisted living homes and other organizations. Look up a Senior Ombudsman in her area and they would probably know of a group or organization that does something similar.

LisaR said:

OMG! I just asked my mom if I could find someone to take her to lunch or dinner three days a week or to help her run errands, would she be willing to go? She said YES!!! I'm speechless! Now I just need to figure out how to find a couple total strangers that I could trust with this. I looked at the senior centers near her and didn't see anything. I Googled phrases like senior sitters,.

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Lisa-we found Mom's sitter thru her church-both were members. She "sitted" 4 hours -3 times a week while her husband was at his garden-he sold veggies at Farmers market. Ran errand s with mom etc

I'm thinking service groups like the Lions club or Legion, Kiwannis etc. might put you in the direction of such help.

Great news about your mom agreeing to have someone assist her! I wish each community had A standard name for senior services. Ours is a county commission on aging and they have exactly what you are looking for- you can hire (on a graded scale by income) aides who will take you on errands, light housekeeping, meals, etc. My mom is 94 and I moved her older sister in with her when they were in their 80's. We've been through the home care, retirement home and assisted-living phases with both of them.

That is great news!!! I was going to ask if when you spoke to her if you make it more about her or you? I was going to suggest how if she did these things it would make it better on you. That might just give her the right excuse to do it. She isn't doing it for herself she is doing it for you. Reverse psychology.

LisaR said:

My mom will be 85 next month. Given her age, she is doing extremely well! Her mind is fantastic. She does have a great deal of arthritis that makes getting around difficult. All things considered, she really is healthy. At a recent visit with the orthopedic doctor (I was with her) the doctor said, "You need to move that body and exercise that mind and you'll be just fine." The problem is, she isn't doing that.

.

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Lisa-I am bumping this because mY MIL has suddenly become your Mom!

Yesterday she informed her DD (my saint of a SIL) that she wasn't attending the BarBQ sunday for Mothers day!
SIL's son has both his mom and MIL and BOTH grandmothers and us and kids etc-a fun gathering
MIL complains its hard to get around over there with her walker...her walker wont fit in their bathroom door (??) the seats are hard in the dining room. (They have a lovely one story BIG home on a huge lot with lots of big trees and shade) She'd rather sit in her dark living room ALONE all day than go

Then I called her-and she told me her DD (my sil) is upset....I kept trying to explain she is turning into a hermit

THEN she gives me the bombshell-she WONT go to my son's Engagement Party or to ANY OF THE OTHER EVENTS in the next 6 months-like the bridal shower!!!...she will only go to the wedding. And I am willing to bet she cancels on the wedding too........I am really hurt, and trying not to get angry with her.

Well, I know that these comments might not be popular, and not what one likes to hear.
But, here are my thoughts, based on our experience with my MIL.

They say you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.
I think that this is true.
And, the OP states that 'she is a stubborn old thing', who says "Why the hell would I do that...".
That is not just a horse, but a stubborn old mule.

My MIL lived, basically, out in nowhere.
Lake property, 10 miless from her community, and at least 45 minutes from the closest main town/city with a good hospital, etc.
And almost an hour from us (in the opposite direction)
So, for us, two hours, at least, each way, to take her get medical care.

My FIL died years ago.
She basically sat there, in her home, like the OP has described, for years, until she passed away last year.
NOTHING at all we could have done about that.
Not unless she became more mentally incapacitated and was not of sound mind.

She INSISTED and DEMANDED that she was not going to go anywhere, but right back home.
When she was hospitalized, she refused any additional treatment, or suggestions for going somewhere that she could get adequate medical care and assistance, and just said 'I WANT TO GO HOME'. Period, end of story.
The doctors were also frustrated.

We were only able to get her into care when she became fully incapacitated and almost paralyzed, physically.

She lived 'out in nowhere'...
And all she would say is "I wish I had family who could come take care of me."
My husband is not retired, He has to work full time, we have a son. And I am barely capable of taking care of things here.
That was just not going to happen.
Yet, there was that guilt trip.

The OP's mother is an 85 year old woman.
She is basically physically incapacitated.
It does sound like she is depressed, as she is not able to deal with her age and mortality.
She is barely ambulatory.

I, myself, have health concerns.
I have had surgery on my foot, and was not really able to walk.
I know how this is.
But, with an elderly woman, hings, physically, are NOT going to get any better for her.

And, OP, this is actually pretty common.
You are not alone.
Have seen the posts here on the DIS on similar threads.

OP, here are my thoughts.
You are fortunate in that she concedes the absolute need to come and live with you during the winter months.
I know it is just MAY, But, perhaps you can see what you can do to get thru this summer.
Can you visit her at all.
Could you try to set up some kind of weekly elderly wellness check, or meals on wheels...
Just do-it, and see how it goes. If she might, even with a lot of moaning and groaning, accept it.
THEN, come this fall, get her back into your home, and go from there.
Maybe look into all options and have some things set up???

My heart goes out to you.
These situations with elderly parents are SO HARD!!!

NewRVLady said:

Lisa-I am bumping this because mY MIL has suddenly become your Mom!

Yesterday she informed her DD (my saint of a SIL) that she wasn't attending the BarBQ sunday for Mothers day!
SIL's son has both his mom and MIL and BOTH grandmothers and us and kids etc-a fun gathering
MIL complains its hard to get around over there with her walker...her walker wont fit in their bathroom door (??) the seats are hard in the dining room. (They have a lovely one story BIG home on a huge lot with lots of big trees and shade) She'd rather sit in her dark living room ALONE all day than go

Then I called her-and she told me her DD (my sil) is upset....I kept trying to explain she is turning into a hermit

THEN she gives me the bombshell-she WONT go to my son's Engagement Party or to ANY OF THE OTHER EVENTS in the next 6 months-like the bridal shower!!!...she will only go to the wedding. And I am willing to bet she cancels on the wedding too........I am really hurt, and trying not to get angry with her.

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I feel your pain! That describes my mom perfectly. She can only sit in certain chairs, ride in certain vehicles, go to certain places because anything else would be uncomfortable (or so she perceives). If anyone was a fan of the TV show Fraser, we have the Martin Crane chair in our house! She brought her own recliner eleven years ago and here it sits in my family room. As soon as she leaves, we put it in her bedroom to get it out of here. We bought new furniture this winter and we have one of our new chairs stuffed in our office because it would go where the Martin Crane chair resides and there isn't enough room for both.

I wish I could offer you some advice, but I have none. I am actually getting ready to take my mom to the airport to head back up north in a couple hours. Another summer of sitting alone, doing nothing, allowing the body and mind to rot away. Ugh!

Wishing on a star said:

Well, I know that these comments might not be popular, and not what one likes to hear.
But, here are my thoughts, based on our experience with my MIL.

They say you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.
I think that this is true.
And, the OP states that 'she is a stubborn old thing', who says "Why the hell would I do that...".
That is not just a horse, but a stubborn old mule.

My MIL lived, basically, out in nowhere.
Lake property, 10 miless from her community, and at least 45 minutes from the closest main town/city with a good hospital, etc.
And almost an hour from us (in the opposite direction)
So, for us, two hours, at least, each way, to take her get medical care.

My FIL died years ago.
She basically sat there, in her home, like the OP has described, for years, until she passed away last year.
NOTHING at all we could have done about that.
Not unless she became more mentally incapacitated and was not of sound mind.

She INSISTED and DEMANDED that she was not going to go anywhere, but right back home.
When she was hospitalized, she refused any additional treatment, or suggestions for going somewhere that she could get adequate medical care and assistance, and just said 'I WANT TO GO HOME'. Period, end of story.
The doctors were also frustrated.

We were only able to get her into care when she became fully incapacitated and almost paralyzed, physically.

She lived 'out in nowhere'...
And all she would say is "I wish I had family who could come take care of me."
My husband is not retired, He has to work full time, we have a son. And I am barely capable of taking care of things here.
That was just not going to happen.
Yet, there was that guilt trip.

The OP's mother is an 85 year old woman.
She is basically physically incapacitated.
It does sound like she is depressed, as she is not able to deal with her age and mortality.
She is barely ambulatory.

I, myself, have health concerns.
I have had surgery on my foot, and was not really able to walk.
I know how this is.
But, with an elderly woman, hings, physically, are NOT going to get any better for her.

And, OP, this is actually pretty common.
You are not alone.
Have seen the posts here on the DIS on similar threads.

OP, here are my thoughts.
You are fortunate in that she concedes the absolute need to come and live with you during the winter months.
I know it is just MAY, But, perhaps you can see what you can do to get thru this summer.
Can you visit her at all.
Could you try to set up some kind of weekly elderly wellness check, or meals on wheels...
Just do-it, and see how it goes. If she might, even with a lot of moaning and groaning, accept it.
THEN, come this fall, get her back into your home, and go from there.
Maybe look into all options and have some things set up???

My heart goes out to you.
These situations with elderly parents are SO HARD!!!

Click to expand...

I last updated that my mom was willing to go out to eat with someone a few times a week. I have called dozens of places and have yet to find a service that does that OR that is reasonably priced by her standards. 99% of the places will run errands for you or they will run errands with the elderly person to places like the grocery store or doctor, but very few offered a companion service where they would take her out to lunch/dinner. The one place I found that came with a positive referral from a friend was $30 an hour with a 3 hour minimum. Let me quote my mother: "If I do that three days a week, that's $270 a week plus the cost of the food. At that price, I might as well move into assisted living where I'll get three meals a day and won't have to pay anyone to be my companion!" HELLO???? YES!!! Of course, that was followed up with. "That ain't happening!"

As I mentioned above, we are heading to the airport in a few hours and she'll go back up north. I'll visit a few times for a weekend while she is there. My sister will do the same. My DH has to travel up there for business a couple times and he stays with her when he goes up there. I'm in a better place compared to when I posted this and was so mad and frustrated. I still am, but I now recognize that I have done everything I can do. She needs to do the right thing. She is that stubborn horse! I don't have the ability to change that and I realize I can't beat myself up over this anymore.