Who is having 2nd thoughts about upcoming WDW trip?

[dansamy]

We can use single rider if necessary.

I wonder if we could head to Soarin', get fastpasses for that evening and then get in the regular line at Test Track? Do the crowds seem to head to both or is Soarin' in more demand at rope drop? We can use single rider but it is more fun to ride together if possible.

Send one person to Soarin to get fast passes. The rest of the group can wait near the entrance to Test Track.

 

[daytondisney]

I do think it's funny that so many people are in favor of FP+ because they used to miss Soarin and TSMM. Yet all this new system has done is change WHICH GROUP of people misses those rides.

Who, and how/why?

 

[dansamy]

Who, and how/why?

It switches to the off site visitors. Even arriving well before rope drop, they may or may not get a fast pass. The line at rope drop may be quite long. If they get a fast pass, it may be for near park closing when they had intended to hop or attend a party.

 

[daytondisney]

It switches to the off site visitors. Even arriving well before rope drop, they may or may not get a fast pass. The line at rope drop may be quite long. If they get a fast pass, it may be for near park closing when they had intended to hop or attend a party.

It does now, but only because both the new and old system are operating concurrently and off-site visitors can only access one of the systems. But when fully implemented, everyone will have equal access.

And with the original FP, the only people who missed out were those who chose to by not arriving early, regardless of whether they stayed on or off.

It's part of what I fail to grasp. What advantage/disadvantage existed under the old system with respect to resort/non-resort guests? Same question for the planned FP+ system.

 

[sunshine girl]

I'm going in January for marathon weekend. I'm not having second thoughts, because I'm definitely doing those races. Also, I used to live in Florida, I have an AP, and I have been to Disney countless times. So I'm ok with being part of the testing.

BUT, I'm not a big planner. I rarely do ADRs. I sat down last night -- 70 days out from my trip -- to try and begin to map out each day's parks and ride times, in conjunction with my runDisney schedule, and possibly an ADR or two if anything's left, comparing with the crowd calendar, and EMH schedule.... SCHEDULING OVERLOAD!! It was like Disney Planning Tetris.

I am concerned about whether AP holders will be allowed to reserve FP+ in advance at all, but I'm trying to be prepared. I am checking MDE constantly. My AP is linked to my account.

I've had to call Disney tech twice due to problems with having multiple MDE accounts/logins/passwords (the issues were their fault, but required 2 phone calls for me to fix).

Anyway, I'm excited for my trip even if fastpass+ doesn't suit me as well as the old system did. I'm fairly tech savvy and very attached to my iPhone, so that should serve me well. But I've already spent more time prepping for this trip than my last 10 trips combined!

If I can't get on the rides, I'll just be hanging out by the frozen margarita bar even more than usual ...

 

[mom2rtk]

Who, and how/why?

It favors the people who like to sleep late. And it disadvantages the people who do rope drop, as a big chunk of that advantage is disappearing. It used to be that you could do a lot of rides if you arrived at RD and gathered fastpasses, even after they stopped taking late FPs. Now it appears that 3 will likely be the limit regardless, and with FP returns starting at 9 AM it's unclear if morning standby lines will stay short or start backing up much sooner.

Additionally the new system disadvantages the people who aren't tech-savvy or don't carry smart phones. And those with poor battery performance.

I don't believe there was an advantage or disadvantage with the old FP system for resort vs. non-resort guests, nor do I believe there will be once the new system gets up and running fully. Unless you count having Stacy remind you incessantly on resort TV to get your FPs. I actually will be quite interested to see if they have Stacy hyping FP+ on resort TV once this gets up and going. By the time folks arrive onsite all the headliner spots could easily be gone, and it's probably too late to get one. At least that's what I think. YMMV.

 

[redsbe]

It favors the people who like to sleep late. And it disadvantages the people who do rope drop, as a big chunk of that advantage is disappearing. It used to be that you could do a lot of rides if you arrived at RD and gathered fastpasses, even after they stopped taking late FPs. Now it appears that 3 will likely be the limit regardless, and with FP returns starting at 9 AM it's unclear if morning standby lines will stay short or start backing up much sooner.

Additionally the new system disadvantages the people who aren't tech-savvy or don't carry smart phones. And those with poor battery performance.

I don't believe there was an advantage or disadvantage with the old FP system for resort vs. non-resort guests, nor do I believe there will be once the new system gets up and running fully. Unless you count having Stacy remind you incessantly on resort TV to get your FPs. I actually will be quite interested to see if they have Stacy hyping FP+ on resort TV once this gets up and going. By the time folks arrive onsite all the headliner spots could easily be gone, and it's probably too late to get one. At least that's what I think. YMMV.

Once FP+ is fully operational the only change is compared to current FP when and how a visitor can secure their FP+, which can also be changed after booked and while in the park (and also at a kiosk not just your smartphone). And with current FP you could only hold one FP until ride window opened, making it hard to hold that many FP throughout the day, especially when WDW started to enforce the FP times, there was always a limit based on time blocks as to how many FL one could hold at a given time/day.

The advantage with RD was not to get FP early, but be able to ride most popular attractions before crowds arrived, sometimes multiple times without even using FP - a strategy that will remain even with FP+. Right now being able to use FP+, FP, KWWC is allowing some visitors to stockpile FP for the day - a loophole I believe to soon be closed by WDW when FP+ becomes the only option for FP access. Technologies like internet access, smartphones to check wait times already create usual advantages to those who use them as to taking advantage of the many pre-trip planning tools.

 

[mom2rtk]

Once FP+ is fully operational the only change is compared to current FP when and how a visitor can secure their FP+, which can also be changed after booked and while in the park (and also at a kiosk not just your smartphone). And with current FP you could only hold one FP until ride window opened, making it hard to hold that many FP throughout the day, especially when WDW started to enforce the FP times, there was always a limit based on time blocks as to how many FL one could hold at a given time/day.

The advantage with RD was not to get FP early, but be able to ride most popular attractions before crowds arrived, sometimes multiple times without even using FP - a strategy that will remain even with FP+. Right now being able to use FP+, FP, KWWC is allowing some visitors to stockpile FP for the day - a loophole I believe to soon be closed by WDW when FP+ becomes the only option for FP access. Technologies like internet access, smartphones to check wait times already create usual advantages to those who use them as to taking advantage of the many pre-trip planning tools.

My personal belief is that the bolded part is not true. The mere fact that you will no longer need to be in the park to get a FP, or be willing to walk across the park to pull the piece of paper, removes a couple of very big barriers to maximum usage. When you remove barriers you get more of it. So I believe most headliners will be nearly fully booked most days ahead of time in the parks. Many believe differently. To each his own. They are plowing through this though, so I guess we'll start to figure that out soon enough.

I understand the RD advantage, as it has been a staple of our touring for years. But I'm still unclear what happens when people start having return times AT park opening. And what happens to the standby wait on attractions like HM, ETTWB and Pirates, that never had FP before. I do know from very limited experience in the parks last December that the mere presence of FP+ on a ride that didn't have it before did a number on the wait times for ETWB. It slowed the standby line substantially.

I suppose my ultimate hope is that the people who log in to MDE and only find headliner FP times at 9 AM will take those, but decide later that their sleep is more important. And that the people with FPs for the second tier rides will decide to do them when they are in the area earlier in the day and just not show up for their FP+ return time. But nobody really knows yet how the crowds will really react to these things.

 

[daytondisney]

My personal belief is that the bolded part is not true. The mere fact that you will no longer need to be in the park to get a FP, or be willing to walk across the park to pull the piece of paper, removes a couple of very big barriers to maximum usage. When you remove barriers you get more of it. So I believe most headliners will be nearly fully booked most days ahead of time in the parks. Many believe differently. To each his own. They are plowing through this though, so I guess we'll start to figure that out soon enough.

I understand the RD advantage, as it has been a staple of our touring for years. But I'm still unclear what happens when people start having return times AT park opening. And what happens to the standby wait on attractions like HM, ETTWB and Pirates, that never had FP before. I do know from very limited experience in the parks last December that the mere presence of FP+ on a ride that didn't have it before did a number on the wait times for ETWB. It slowed the standby line substantially.

I suppose my ultimate hope is that the people who log in to MDE and only find headliner FP times at 9 AM will take those, but decide later that their sleep is more important. And that the people with FPs for the second tier rides will decide to do them when they are in the area earlier in the day and just not show up for their FP+ return time. But nobody really knows yet how the crowds will really react to these things.

You touch on a concern I raised in another thread - commitment. While some bemoan the fact that FP+ sets a maximum of 3 per day, my concern is that it sets a minimum of 3 per day. Choices made outside of the park months in advance are more easily dismissed than same-day choices made inside the park. Dead FPs may under-promise/over-deliver for stand by liners but they are the same as FPs used in terms of planning.

 

[daytondisney]

It favors the people who like to sleep late. And it disadvantages the people who do rope drop, as a big chunk of that advantage is disappearing. It used to be that you could do a lot of rides if you arrived at RD and gathered fastpasses, even after they stopped taking late FPs. Now it appears that 3 will likely be the limit regardless, and with FP returns starting at 9 AM it's unclear if morning standby lines will stay short or start backing up much sooner.

Additionally the new system disadvantages the people who aren't tech-savvy or don't carry smart phones. And those with poor battery performance.

I don't believe there was an advantage or disadvantage with the old FP system for resort vs. non-resort guests, nor do I believe there will be once the new system gets up and running fully. Unless you count having Stacy remind you incessantly on resort TV to get your FPs. I actually will be quite interested to see if they have Stacy hyping FP+ on resort TV once this gets up and going. By the time folks arrive onsite all the headliner spots could easily be gone, and it's probably too late to get one. At least that's what I think. YMMV.

Planners, tech-savvy, early risers will always have an advantage. Disney can't eliminate that. What it can do is provide greater opportunity to a greater number of guests.

Snoozers now won't choose 9am FPs and become rope droppers based on a decision made months before.

And I wouldn't call having an previously held advantage reduced to a lessor advantage "missing out."

jmo

 

[Mrs. Ciz]

Sounds like a loophole that will be closed right after they fix the double dipping thingie. But at the same time.....it could make for a cool spreadsheet that shows their hotels are booked at 80% capacity. Corporate loves positive spreadsheets.

Nothing gets corporate-types giddier than pointing to spreadsheets and charts while discussing their "metrics" (I really hate that word).


Anyway, I agree that loophole probably will not last that long.

I actually don't think it is a loophole. FP- was always tied to your park ticket not your resort stay. Disney has said FP+ will be available to everyone - both on site and off site. As FP+ is currently working, it is linked to the park ticket, not the resort stay. During the brief testing period a resort stay only triggers your invitation to make the FP+ reservations. During testing every on site visitor gets a 14 day FP+ reservation window no matter how short/long their trip is. The number of days they can book FP+ is tied to their ticket length, not how many nights they are staying on property. Say a person books one night in a Value hotel but has a 10 day park ticket. They can book 10 days of FP+ during the 14 day window, no matter where they stay the next 9 nights.

It makes sense that IT linked FP+ to the ticket and not the resort stay. They need it to work for offsite guest in a couple of months too.

 

[mom2rtk]

You touch on a concern I raised in another thread - commitment. While some bemoan the fact that FP+ sets a maximum of 3 per day, my concern is that it sets a minimum of 3 per day. Choices made outside of the park months in advance are more easily dismissed than same-day choices made inside the park. Dead FPs may under-promise/over-deliver for stand by liners but they are the same as FPs used in terms of planning.

I'd like to think that after the full system is rolled out for a while, Disney will have reliable enough data on no-shows to overbook to the right level. But then one would have thought they had enough history of ADR no-shows to overbook those to the right level. Yet I saw post after post about empty tables in the restaurants when there were no ADRs available and walk-ups were being turned away.

Planners, tech-savvy, early risers will always have an advantage. Disney can't eliminate that. What it can do is provide greater opportunity to a greater number of guests.

Snoozers now won't choose 9am FPs and become rope droppers based on a decision made months before.

And I wouldn't call having an previously held advantage reduced to a lessor advantage "missing out."

jmo

I'd like to think snoozers won't book a 9 AM fastpass, but when you log on and that's all there is, what else do you do?

Call it all whatever you like, but I call it a huge takeaway if I go from getting an average of 6 FPs a day (MK and DHS) down to 3, with no duplications.

 

[Mrs. Ciz]

I'd like to think that after the full system is rolled out for a while, Disney will have reliable enough data on no-shows to overbook to the right level. But then one would have thought they had enough history of ADR no-shows to overbook those to the right level. Yet I saw post after post about empty tables in the restaurants when there were no ADRs available and walk-ups were being turned away.



I'd like to think snoozers won't book a 9 AM fastpass, but when you log on and that's all there is, what else do you do?

Call it all whatever you like, but I call it a huge takeaway if I go from getting an average of 6 FPs a day (MK and DHS) down to 3, with no duplications.

And I think that is why so many people are not happy about the FP+ system. It is being sold as a big improvement - the newest, latest, greatest. But folks feel like it's a "bait and switch" ploy, because when they actually look at the new program, they are losing something rather than gaining something.

I guess we all just have to wait and see.

 

[jensen]

It used to be that you could do a lot of rides if you arrived at RD and gathered fastpasses, even after they stopped taking late FPs.

How did one "gather" fastpasses? I recall that there was a block so that you could really only have one or maybe two fastpasses at a time.

 

[daytondisney]

Call it all whatever you like, but I call it a huge takeaway if I go from getting an average of 6 FPs a day (MK and DHS) down to 3, with no duplications.

I didnt call it anything. I asked which group would be missing out under the new system and how. Looks like current rope-drop-loving, touring-plan advocates obtaining a lessor number of FPs.

 

[mom2rtk]

How did one "gather" fastpasses? I recall that there was a block so that you could really only have one or maybe two fastpasses at a time.

I didn't say they gathered them all at once. It was more a case of watching and being aware of the first opportunity you had to get another, then pulling that next one right when the window opened, then going to the prior one. And knowing which FPs were disconnected and getting those at the same time. I was always aware of when I would be FP eligible again, and seldom let those opportunities pass.

 

[jensen]

So I believe most headliners will be nearly fully booked most days ahead of time in the parks.

And what happens to the standby wait on attractions like HM, ETTWB and Pirates, that never had FP before.

These are EXACTLY my concerns.

 

[daytondisney]

And I think that is why so many people are not happy about the FP+ system. It is being sold as a big improvement - the newest, latest, greatest. But folks feel like it's a "bait and switch" ploy, because when they actually look at the new program, they are losing something rather than gaining something.

I guess we all just have to wait and see.

It's Disney's best educated guess at what will appeal to the most guests. I like not worrying the night before whether or not we'll get on headliners the next day, even though I know we'll be there near rope drop time. Guess a lot of others do, too. Hello FP+

 

[redsbe]

"How did one "gather" fastpasses? I recall that there was a block so that you could really only have one or maybe two fastpasses at a time. "

I had the same question, once WDW started enforcing the FP ride times how could anyone stockpile more than 3 or 4 fastpasses in one day, collected all early to use later?

 

[Mad Hattered]

"How did one "gather" fastpasses? I recall that there was a block so that you could really only have one or maybe two fastpasses at a time. "

I had the same question, once WDW started enforcing the FP ride times how could anyone stockpile more than 3 or 4 fastpasses in one day, collected all early to use later?

If you pulled one at rope drop you could get another one typically 30 minutes later. So there is two in the first half hour of the park opening. Then you can pull one every 2 hours afterwards. We easily used 6 or 7 or 8 in a day when park hopping.