New Twist on a 5th Vessel

[Tonka's Skipper]

In today's Walt Disney World Update on Mouseplanet they briefly talked about the fifth and sixth ship rumor. However... in the comments at the bottom was this comment by author Jeff Kober --

http://www.mouseplanet.com/10319/Walt_Disney_World_Resort_Update

"By Jeff Kober on Mon, 15 Apr 2013 03:42:08 -0700
Actually, my inside sources have not confirmed a sixth ship, but have confirmed a fifth ship, and that one is to be a much smaller ship that will allow Disney Cruise Line to charter smaller river itineraries like the Columbia or the Rhine. But it wouldn't surprise me that they would get a bigger bang for their investment to have two ships made, as it will reduce some of the overhead when shared."

What does every one think?

 

[OKW Lover]

Not seeing that happening. I think DCL needs the larger size of ship to spread some fairly significant costs out over more passengers. Costs like building in the Disney "magic" touches that guests will expect.

 

[Lynne G]

hmm,
All rumors seem to peg the new ships as being larger and smaller than the existing ships. Why river travel? Would think Alaska, Pacific, and Europe would be more interesting, but not on a river. Wonder which port this 1 or 2 ships will call home. Florida? More to PC? Would they consider LA again, with DL so close? With Mexico a no go, then maybe Northern Pacific or Alaska from Canada. They seem to like the Med, so maybe one to entice the European customers?

 

[rteetz]

Disney needs to go bigger. Just look at the very successful royal carribean every ship they build is bigger and better. I believe that is exactly what disney needs to do. They need to accommodate more as well as offer new and exciting activities on these new ships. Each ship needs to have its own unique things, just like the hotels in Florida. I think disney ships are amazing but to go smaller would just be a bad thing for disney to do.

 

[N365PA]

The only way I see a river vessel working is in conjunction with Adventures by Disney. I would expect another Panama Canal capable vessel in the future if anything at all.

 

[beachclub]

This better be true. Cause if you haven't seen the new ships coming out of Royal carribbean next year and the year after....they are majorly one upping Disney, big time.
I mean, you get a virtual porthole by disney. Royal one ups that with virtual Balconies. Halls that convert to theatres, huge rooms...etc

 

[DRDISNEYMD]

In today's Walt Disney World Update on Mouseplanet they briefly talked about the fifth and sixth ship rumor. However... in the comments at the bottom was this comment by author Jeff Kober --

http://www.mouseplanet.com/10319/Walt_Disney_World_Resort_Update

"By Jeff Kober on Mon, 15 Apr 2013 03:42:08 -0700
Actually, my inside sources have not confirmed a sixth ship, but have confirmed a fifth ship, and that one is to be a much smaller ship that will allow Disney Cruise Line to charter smaller river itineraries like the Columbia or the Rhine. But it wouldn't surprise me that they would get a bigger bang for their investment to have two ships made, as it will reduce some of the overhead when shared."

What does every one think?

~Thanks for the update! But, I really can't imagine, okay I just don't want a "smaller" ship, I want this "girl" to be grand, as in huge!

~Again, for this to be "monstrous" news there needs to be monstrous boats, preferably two -- otherwise it's just news. We'll see.

~As an aside, I can't help but think this "monstrous" news thing may have more to do with something Monsters U -- oh, I don't know, lol.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

This better be true. Cause if you haven't seen the new ships coming out of Royal carribbean next year and the year after....they are majorly one upping Disney, big time.
I mean, you get a virtual porthole by disney. Royal one ups that with virtual Balconies. Halls that convert to theatres, huge rooms...etc

Well when you build a monster sized ship, you have more space. When you build a monster size ship you need to fill them up and copy things other lines have done....EI the virtual effect.

I do think the changeable room space is would be cool.


I am not a fan of the monster size vessel. a personal and professional opinion.to each their own. I would point out that my opinion is shared by many other folks. While RCCL seems to feel they have the cruisers to fill these vessels, there doesn't(to my knowledge) seem to be any other lines looking to build this big.

I am happy to see they enclosed the open stern on the new vessels.


JMHO

AKK

 

[arthuruscg]

One thing to keep in mind, the longer the hull of displacement ships the faster it can go for a given amount of drag.
So, if DCL wants to go to places farther away in less time, the ships will get bigger to save on fuel.
I suspect the new ships will meet the New Panamax sizes. Max ship size to pass thru the Panama Canal, 1,400 ft, beam 180 ft, depth 60 ft and height 198ft . This will place the ships shorter then the 2 new Royal Caribbean ships but will allow DCL to run WDW to Disney California cruises thru the Panama Canal.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

Lots of good points made about the riverboats..........I share your general feeling this is a long shot at best.

There is one steam riverboat running on the American inland rivers.....EI Mississippi, etc...........from what I have read she is well received, and expensive!


http://www.americancruiselines.com/Find-a-Cruise/mississippi-river-cruises


Time will tell!


AKK

 

[beachclub]

Sure they've copied the concept but they made it better, and among other things it actually seems there will be alot more activities than what Disney has to offer. Don't get me wrong, I have always been a disney cruiser but with these 2 new vessels by RC "copies" its enough to peak my interest, Sure i'm not the only one.
Actually the virtual port hole concept is really the only "copied" concept.
It's not like the concept itself was a huge game changer for the disney fleet anyways to claim the king of innovation.
The Quantum will also have what I guess I'll call a sort of thrill ride that Disney will prob copy from them in the future.
I don't think they "feel" the need to build bigger. Usually in business, if the demand is there they they accommodate, I don't think they are building these for the heck of it, the demand must be there, im sure my opinion is shared by many others as well.

Disney can't always be the leader in every business, and it appears Royal Caribbean has a leg up in this one.

This somewhat battle of RC vs DCL reminds me of something that has been slowly and shyly creeping around for a while. Disney "used to be" a very imaginative company, but there is alot of imagination missing and alot of it purposely left at the door in the name of profit greediness.

Well when you build a monster sized ship, you have more space. When you build a monster size ship you need to fill them up and copy things other lines have done....EI the virtual effect.

I do think the changeable room space is would be cool.


I am not a fan of the monster size vessel. a personal and professional opinion.to each their own. I would point out that my opinion is shared by many other folks. While RCCL seems to feel they have the cruisers to fill these vessels, there doesn't(to my knowledge) seem to be any other lines looking to build this big.

I am happy to see they enclosed the open stern on the new vessels.


JMHO

AKK

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

Sure they've copied the concept but they made it better, and among other things it actually seems there will be alot more activities than what Disney has to offer. Don't get me wrong, I have always been a disney cruiser but with these 2 new vessels by RC "copies" its enough to peak my interest, Sure i'm not the only one.
Actually the virtual port hole concept is really the only "copied" concept.
It's not like the concept itself was a huge game changer for the disney fleet anyways to claim the king of innovation.
The Quantum will also have what I guess I'll call a sort of thrill ride that Disney will prob copy from them in the future.
I don't think they "feel" the need to build bigger. Usually in business, if the demand is there they they accommodate, I don't think they are building these for the heck of it, the demand must be there, im sure my opinion is shared by many others as well.

Disney can't always be the leader in every business, and it appears Royal Caribbean has a leg up in this one.

This somewhat battle of RC vs DCL reminds me of something that has been slowly and shyly creeping around for a while. Disney "used to be" a very imaginative company, but there is alot of imagination missing and alot of it purposely left at the door in the name of profit greediness.

I agree the last 5 to 10 years Disney has been run by the bean counters, but it you look at the last 2 or 3 , things are changing.

Seems the imaginers are back in the drivers seat........IE Cars land is excellently done. The many plans drifting around for WDW parks............well will have to see what happens, but its looking promising.

Also it seems the parks management is back doing what they should have been doing, in maintaince and upgrades........many attractions have been closed for Major Refubs....not just limited ones!



As to RCL..........I enjoyed our cruise on the FOS................good cruise, but Disney is the only one that can do Disney..........DreamWorks does not compare at all.

My main point was the size of the monster ships...............I don't like the look or the height at all......I would love to see the stability calculations of the ships.

Just to many people!!!...........now I am sure a lot of people do love the size and activates on those ships.........but there are many that don't

What I find interesting, where RCCL is building 2 more.....no other lines seems to be racing to build these monster ships!


JMHO!..to each their own!

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

One thing to keep in mind, the longer the hull of displacement ships the faster it can go for a given amount of drag.
So, if DCL wants to go to places farther away in less time, the ships will get bigger to save on fuel.
I suspect the new ships will meet the New Panamax sizes. Max ship size to pass thru the Panama Canal, 1,400 ft, beam 180 ft, depth 60 ft and height 198ft . This will place the ships shorter then the 2 new Royal Caribbean ships but will allow DCL to run WDW to Disney California cruises thru the Panama Canal.

Your point on drag is well taken, but there is a lot more to be considered...........mainly..........is there enough interest in the monster size ships to fill them up!

As I just mentioned............RCCL is building 2 more, but other lines seems to be waiting and are not racing to build their own!


PS.............Don't hold your breath on the new locks...I keep hearing the are getting farther and farther behind schedule!


AKK

 

[arthuruscg]

Your point on drag is well taken, but there is a lot more to be considered...........mainly..........is there enough interest in the monster size ships to fill them up!

As I just mentioned............RCCL is building 2 more, but other lines seems to be waiting and are not racing to build their own!


PS.............Don't hold your breath on the new locks...I keep hearing the are getting farther and farther behind schedule!


AKK

I am thinking long term, 5-10years out.
Also the longer and shorter ships would be more stable. It would be interesting for DCL to have normal trans Atlantic cruises. The current ones are just for repositioning the fleet.

I am also assuming that Cast Away Cay was built to handle the new Panamax sizes.

RCCL is building the new ships because they are running close enough to capacity and they are hedging their bets that they will be ahead of the curve when the economy recovers. From the few people at the office that are cruise "regulars" and the few new cruisers, those that had Carnival cruises have re booked for RCCL or DCL.

FYI: The Carnival Ecstacy ship temperately lost power on Wednesday.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

I am thinking long term, 5-10years out.
Also the longer and shorter ships would be more stable. It would be interesting for DCL to have normal trans Atlantic cruises. The current ones are just for repositioning the fleet.

Do you really think there is enough passenger business to run a regular Atlantic service???. That is a interesting thought!

I am also assuming that Cast Away Cay was built to handle the new Panamax sizes.


As to Castaway Cay, if you look at the picture of the dream class there, those vessels pretty well fill up the dock.


RCCL is building the new ships because they are running close enough to capacity and they are hedging their bets that they will be ahead of the curve when the economy recovers. From the few people at the office that are cruise "regulars" and the few new cruisers, those that had Carnival cruises have re booked for RCCL or DCL.

I agree they are doing well with those vessels and getting premium rates as well. But filling up 2 additional vessels is the key!

I have heard all over, many Carnival line cruisers are jumping ship and heading to NCL, RCCL and DCL.

FYI: The Carnival Ecstacy ship temperately lost power on Wednesday.

I read that this morning.......that black rain cloud is over Carnival all the time! However in all fairness it was only for a hour and they were off and running.

Carnival did announce this week they are spending 300mil to make design changes, upgrades and repairs to a number of their vessels. I applaud them, even if it is late in coming and will take a year or so to complete!


AKK

 

[arthuruscg]

As long as the dock can handle the draft and beam, the stern can extend past the end of the dock.

I don't see DCL filling or adding new ships with out expanding to different itineraries. So new home ports or destinations would be needed.

 

[rteetz]

As long as the dock can handle the draft and beam, the stern can extend past the end of the dock.

I don't see DCL filling or adding new ships with out expanding to different itineraries. So new home ports or destinations would be needed.

It not like disney doesn't have the money or people to build a bigger dock either though. I think eventually they will have to but for now the dock thats there will be fine.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

As long as the dock can handle the draft and beam, the stern can extend past the end of the dock.

I don't see DCL filling or adding new ships with out expanding to different itineraries. So new home ports or destinations would be needed.

That is part my point the slip is not that wide nor that deep....a 220,00 tonner would need a lot more space and depth..........


Itinerates???....................Totally agree!


Now another tack..............since RCCL is comfortable with the bookings on the Oasis class....and the prospects for 2 new ships coming out...........where do the sail from?

The only places I would think would have that many passengers would be east coast of Florida?.........however, can they keep 4 ships going?


AKK

 

[MarieLightning]

I haven't heard yet of Disney announcing a 5th ship (I sell cruises for a living so we generally get those news a little ahead of time, like for the newest RCI ships), and definitely not a 6th one.

Personally I do agree Disney needs to enlarge its fleet, because the options they offer are very limited in the market. They *are* one of the few cruiselines who stay in the Caribbean for the summer though, which is to their advantage, and then what they sell is definitely the Disney image more than anything else.

It also wouldn't hurt for them to permanently do some itinerary changes, but is seems to me it very rarely sticks to its new itineraries - its Winter season is basically stagnant and since they position the Wonder in Alaska and keep two ships in the Caribbean for the summer, they have to change it up from year to year if they want to offer different ports of call. It may also have to do with the cost in terms of demand versus the offer not being good enough. They're a fairly expensive cruise line (not surprising considering most of their products are on the higher cost) and the Caribbean is the cheapest destination regardless.


However, RCCL is far from being the only cruiseline to build new ships. NCL had the Epic come out last year and the Breakaway is sailing its inaugural this Sunday. Carnival had the Breeze last year and the Sunshine is set to sail later on this year (or early 2014, can't remember). There's the Royal Princess coming out this June, and the Regal Princess will follow.

The cruise industry is growing extensively. The difference however between regular cruiselines and Disney is that regular cruiselines are just that - a cruiseline, whereas DCL is kind of like a side job to the company. Brings in good money, but by no means the biggest seller of the brand.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

I haven't heard yet of Disney announcing a 5th ship (I sell cruises for a living so we generally get those news a little ahead of time, like for the newest RCI ships), and definitely not a 6th one.

Personally I do agree Disney needs to enlarge its fleet, because the options they offer are very limited in the market. They *are* one of the few cruiselines who stay in the Caribbean for the summer though, which is to their advantage, and then what they sell is definitely the Disney image more than anything else.

It also wouldn't hurt for them to permanently do some itinerary changes, but is seems to me it very rarely sticks to its new itineraries - its Winter season is basically stagnant and since they position the Wonder in Alaska and keep two ships in the Caribbean for the summer, they have to change it up from year to year if they want to offer different ports of call. It may also have to do with the cost in terms of demand versus the offer not being good enough. They're a fairly expensive cruise line (not surprising considering most of their products are on the higher cost) and the Caribbean is the cheapest destination regardless.


However, RCCL is far from being the only cruiseline to build new ships. NCL had the Epic come out last year and the Breakaway is sailing its inaugural this Sunday. Carnival had the Breeze last year and the Sunshine is set to sail later on this year (or early 2014, can't remember). There's the Royal Princess coming out this June, and the Regal Princess will follow.

The cruise industry is growing extensively. The difference however between regular cruiselines and Disney is that regular cruiselines are just that - a cruiseline, whereas DCL is kind of like a side job to the company. Brings in good money, but by no means the biggest seller of the brand.

You misunderstand. I was referring to 220,000 monster ships like the Oasis class..........

Of course other lines are building new ships, just nothing that big!

AKK