I'm sorry, but I don't think I ever said that anyone was being negative. I said that it was the same bunch of people discussing and restating the points they'd made on page one (which I think is basically true) and that perhaps the uphill people had made their points and moved on. I didn't say anything was negative, nor did I say that you guys "couldn't" move on, only that perhaps the others did.
I also don't agree that "people move on because they get easily bored". Some people, sure. But a lot of people move on because they've made their point and choose to not continue the discussion once they've done so. It doesn't mean they're "easily bored" -- it just means that they've made their point and they're satisfied with that.
Sorry if I misunderstood, but the way you worded that post seemed to imply that we were just discussing the same points, and so it has made for an old and tired discussion that is no longer valid or relevant.
On the contrary...we are still discussing as we have ideas to share, trip reports or new policy changes (monorail closure, addition of wifi in deluxe resorts), for example. For those of us who have read each and every post in this thread, it is still a relevant discussion, so why not continue to discuss with each other?
Sure there is some overlap or duplication, but that is bound to happen when people are very passionate about something.
We will have to disagree about people becoming bored - so many DIS members don't read the threads they are posting on, and many of them don't continue on if the discussion gets too long. Sure some people move on once they've made their point, but so many get bored of topics very easily and move to another discussion. This thread is huge, so that will scare so many people away from it, which is sad, because there is lots of good info and opinions in here!
I disagree, I think Disney is competing just as off sites and the bright example is all those discounts they run. When there are so many hotels just outside the property, there is competition and they should be very careful about what they do. I do not believe there are many people who will pay anything just to be onsite. Lets not forget that onsite hotels are not that amazing and onsite perks can be easily skipped by many. I do believe there are some hard core fans of onsite but not to the point of Disney relying on them when raising prices. Everything got a price and I know many people with high income who will not pay extra unless they absolutely have to even so they can easily afford it
Bottom line, situation with Orlando hotels is very different from what it used to be 40 years ago and closing eyes on it is a huge mistake.
I am not saying that Disney should be complacent and arrogant and not offer discounts, but what I am saying is that Disney is the competition that the other hotels are competing with. All of the off-site hotels are trying to secure business from Disney, and they must secure business from Disney as there are far fewer hotels within each brand. The off-site hotels will suffer more with empty rooms than Disney, as Disney has far more rooms, and many different price points for guests to choose. Plus Disney has a pretty much 100% occupancy Vacation Club, which is great for their business.
Your opinion is that on-site hotels are not that amazing, but for millions of guests, on-site is very amazing. Like I said, we know people who only stay on-site, and pay whatever price Disney is asking. Brand loyalty and brand integrity is still pretty high for many guests. This is why we, and many others we know purchased DVC.
You are correct that the Orlando market is vastly different than it used to be, but Disney is still the leader in Orlando. Sure there are lots of other hotels and houses to choose from, but Disney is the competition that all of the other hotels are trying to topple. Honestly, despite what people on this thread believe, it would take a lot to topple Disney in terms of hotel occupancy. So many people will stay at Disney, and only Disney, although there are more empty rooms than before, but that is also because there are more Orlando off-site rooms than ever before too. I wonder when Orlando, including Disney, will reach its hotel saturation point?
Despite all of the competition in Orlando, Disney's hotel rates continue to climb, and I firmly believe that is because they are still getting a huge number of guests staying on-site. We go for 2 weeks each July during peak season, and being DVC, we have stayed everywhere, especially Deluxe resorts that are both cash/DVC, and they are always sold out both cash and DVC. Guests are staying on-site especially during peak seasons. The past few years they have been securing these guests with lots of promos, especially Free Dining, but it works! Just visit the Resort forum when FD comes out, and you'll see the hysteria, and read about sold out resorts within a few days of the FD promotion starting.
Competition makes for a better consumer experience, so it's great that there are lots of Orlando hotels, including Disney, at varying price points. It would be great if Disney room rates were lower across the board, all year round as a direct result of off-site rooms, but there doesn't seem to be a direct correlation during certain times of the year, eg. peak seasons, as Disney still gets guests to pay astronomical rates for Christmas or NYE.
It's all so interesting, and I would love to see the actual numbers! Tiger