Why not buy the cheapest home resort??

[dianeschlicht]

Is the difference in point requirements between DVC resorts a reflection of the desirability of the resorts? Even with higher point requirements, other resorts seem less available (I know they are smaller).

The fact that OKW is the first DVC resort and that it is so large has more to do with the point requirements than desireability. I for one, find it HIGHLY desireable. Each person will have different views on which is their favorite. That is why I think it is best to own where you are most comfortable staying MOST of the time.

When we first purchased at OKW, we had a choice of OKW or BWV. We did look at the point values and decided if we purchased BWV, we would have to book at the 11 month window to get standard view and have the points similar to OKW. We had stayed at OKW twice and loved the resort, so we decided we would reserve judgement until after we saw the BWV units. Our visit to the preview center was underwhelming to us. We didn't care for the setup or size and hated the hotel feel rather than the vacation home style at OKW. We purchased at OKW, not for the lower dues (didn't even ask that question), but because we knew that was where we wanted to stay most and where we could get the most nights for our points. When it came time a year later to add on, we had the same discussion. Again, we opted to add on at OKW so all of our points would be available each year at our preferred resort. I agree that BWV and BCV have a GREAT location, but they are far too urban for us, and VWL looks like our new log home, so not much point in that!

 

[joepoe]

Originally posted by tjkraz

...This, I believe, is a key point in the entire Home resort debate. Right now there are about 80,000 DVC members. All who do not own at BCV must compete for a fixed number of available rooms at the 7 month window. Therefore, one can assume that booking at BCV at 7 months will only get more difficult at DVC membership grows to 100,000 and beyond. The number of rooms at BCV will not increase, but the number of DVC members who do not own at BCV will grow ever larger.

So that brings us back to the cardinal rule of DVC: Buy where you want to stay. ...

The gist of the reason as to why it is important to carefully choose your home resort. Well said.

 

[gopherit]

Interesting. We bought at BWV, but NOT because we were anxious to stay there -- it's all they were offering in '99 and we weren't savvy enough to know the word "resale". We have yet to stay there -- we always make our 11 mos ressie at BWV, but then switch at 7mos. Thus far, we've always gotten what we want. However, we always look for a 2br (which I think are in less demand). If we hadn't gotten what we wanted at the 7 mos window, we would have been happy with BWV, I'm sure -- we haven't been disappointed yet with any resort we've stayed in! So color us flexible.

That said, however, I will admit we also haven't stayed again in OKW since we bought in 99. Why? We have kids... and kids want slides. We love the space, we love the tranquility, Olivia's is a good restaurant, our car is right there for a hop to anywhere, and personally, the buses at OKW were better than at anywhere else we have stayed. And I don't know why anyone says it's "remote". It's only remote depending upon where you want to go. After all, BWV can be "remote" from MK, looking at the bus situation. And VWL may be close to MK, but it's a looong ride to AK.

In our case, pure and simple, we don't do OKW anytime recently because the kids like having a happenin' pool. I realize that OKW owners have been asked about a raise in dues to pay for slides and lifeguards but have rejected the ideas.

SO here's my comments for thought -- if folks buy OKW (for the low dues) and then use their pts to stay elsewhere, it's no big mystery where there's always availability. If OKW were suddenly to build (or add on to an existing pool) a slide-o-rama pool and liven up the swim options a bit (but still in keeping with the resort theming!) would more of those OKWesters go back "home?" Or is it purely location that keeps folks away? And if the pools were beefed up (and lifeguards installed) and dues raised -- would people stoip buying OKW as a bargain and instead buy it for love (again resulting in more OKWesters taying home instead of using pts for other resorts?) I'm not bashing resort-hoppers -- Lord knows I'd be bashing myself!! I'm just curious what the response would be on these ideas, because it certainly does seem that OKW is always available -- and as a huge resort, that means those pts owners are staying elsewhere. Just some food for thought.

 

[crisi]

NCRedding -

I'm glad you don't stress over such things. The home resort situation is exactly the type of thing that I do one of two things with:

1) I don't bother to switch because - push comes to shove - its too much work and not that important. So I'm best off buying where I'll be happiest, rather than letting my laziness make me discontent.

2) If I decide its important enough to switch, I stress over it. It has to be pretty important for me to overcome my natural inertia.

Of course, I doubt I'm typical - plenty of people don't have my own personal neurosis.

KANSAS,

Money means different things to different people and we all value a dollar a little differently. I think OKW is, hands down, the best value of the DVC resorts, and if value is an consideration to you, it makes sense to own your points there. But not everyone places the same importance on value. Likewise, there are other reasons OKW may appeal - as Diane said - its rural townshousy feel, its bigger units, lots of GVs, lower points - maybe you picked because you like the color scheme. And reasons other than location and pool slide that you might choose a different resort (i.e. that's what Disney was selling at the time and you didn't want to do resale). It isn't like the difference between buying a Ford Escot and a Lexus SUV - its the difference between buying a Lexus sedan and a Lexus SUV - some people will make the decision that the SUV guzzles too much gas - but for those people wanting not wanting to drive an SUV, the gas cost doesn't even factor into the decision. And some people walk onto the lot and want whatever is available in blue.

 

[Desperado]

Originally posted by JimC
I believe that OKW has such a great point chart because it was the first resort and they were very competitive in getting the program underway. Then they realized that they could improve the program's economics with higher point charts and still make it a great deal for the members (just not quite so great as OKW).

Certainly, they were the first and thus the lowest, but even with the other resorts having higher point values, there is still more availability at OKW than at the other resorts during the year after the 7 month window (as long as your not talking GVs). Certainly this works out wonderfully for those who really like the resort, but you'd think that given all the advantages, even though it is larger, it would fill up faster than all the other DVC resorts, and it seems to work the opposite. There is less demand per number of rooms for OKW stays than for other DVC resort stays. I presume location is the biggest factor and drawn to the other resorts, it can't be the lower point structure. I'm not trying to pick on OKW, I hope owners do love thier resort, there is just more availability there. Poeple are staying at other DVC resorts to a great extent than OKW given it's size, including the offsite. I guess more availability means more OKW members are choosing to stay at other DVC resorts than thier own OKW home resort.

 

[MiaSRN62]

If OKW were suddenly to build (or add on to an existing pool) a slide-o-rama pool and liven up the swim options a bit (but still in keeping with the resort theming!) would more of those OKWesters go back "home?" Or is it purely location that keeps folks away? And if the pools were beefed up (and lifeguards installed) and dues raised -- would people stoip buying OKW as a bargain and instead buy it for love (again resulting in more OKWesters taying home instead of using pts for other resorts?) I'm not bashing resort-hoppers -- Lord knows I'd be bashing myself!! I'm just curious what the response would be on these ideas,

Interesting thought Gopherit. Here's my personal standpoint. I think a beefed-up pool might make a difference---along with room service for alot of folks. I do have kids (11, 13, 16) and they decided they wanted to try SAB this summer. Well, we couldn't secure a BCV ressie for all the days we were staying and didn't feel like switching so we went with BWV for the slide there. The kids specifically said they thought the pool area looked cool. After so many trips to WDW over the years, we do spend more time just hanging around the resort than we used to. The kids love OKW, but really the pool was the deciding factor this year. That said, the kids, when asked which resort they preferred overall, said it was a tough decision. The three of them mutually agreed they like BWV and OKW the same---they couldn't pick one over the other.
Would I pay more in dues to have a slide/lifeguard ? Personally, yes, I would. I guess I'm not one of those "cheap/frugal" OKW owners I'm just kidding with that last comment, but I know most OKW owners would be against this from a previous thread I was in over the summer.

 

[MiaSRN62]

but you'd think that given all the advantages, even though it is larger, it would fill up faster than all the other DVC resorts, and it seems to work the opposite. There is less demand per number of rooms for OKW stays than for other DVC resort stays.

I wonder what the actual occupancy levels are at OKW ? Just because one calls and is told there is availability, that could mean there are rooms available but only a handful ? That's a neglible amount as far I can see. Or rather, is 25% or 50% vacant at any given time. How does one know when they call and get a ressie that they didn't actually secure the very last studio or whatever ?
It was also suggested on another thread that many original OKW owners have owned for more than a decade since it is the first DVC, and these owners are experimenting with trading through II. So this would account for more availability at OKW also.

Poeple are staying at other DVC resorts to a great extent than OKW given it's size, including the offsite.

By "offsite", did you mean trading through II ?

 

[crisi]

Another reason OKW may have rooms available is that the lower point cost makes it difficult to do a "one for one" swap without people believing they are wasting points.

Say I'm a BCV owner. To make sure I have a vacation in hand, I book BCV eleven months out - seven nights 2 bedroom in March - 350 points. I can save 54 points by moving to OKW at seven months. But if I do this once my banking window passes, I have to deal with cancellation and banking rules. I don't think, in this case, its a big deal (i.e. you are far enough out that you can just throw those points back in your account, and haven't hit the banking window yet - and even if you'd wait and miss your banking window, its a small subset of the total contract), but all these rules are confusing to a lot of people (including me, I'm not sure about this). So they "believe" they might lose those points anyway.

 

[KANSAS]

JIMC
I am flattered that you agree with me, on OKW, only time, will tell, if we made the right decision.

 

[Sammy]

Just a few musings from a soon-to-be (hopefully) DVC newbie (waiting to hear on ROFR with a BCV resale):

I truly agonized between buying SSR through Disney or BCV resale. With 3 kids under 13, of course they LOVE SAB and we love the Epcot area, so we want to stay at BCV for the most part. However, I am very value conscious and the extra years on the SSR contract just made better financial sense to me when I broke down the yearly cost comparison (38 vs 50 years). I figured I would just change ressies every year at the 7-month window.

BUT....my resale agent made the exact same point that tjkraz made as far as the number of DVC members increasing once SSR is all up and running. So there will be that many more people vying for the rooms. Plus, she thought that the smaller # of BCV units available would make resale that much more desireable if we ever (god forbid) wanted to sell in the future.

We knew that in our hearts, we wanted to stay in the Epcot area, so even though my "value conscious" head wanted SSR, my heart won out.

That's my story and I'm stickin' to it!

Sammy

 

[dianeschlicht]

I think you were very wise about how you came to your decision, Sammy. I think in the long run, several years down the road, both BCV and VWL could become difficult to get into at the 7 month window for exactly the reasons you mention and because they will be the smallest on-site DVC resorts. If staying at BCV is important to you, that is exactly where you should be buying. I too have worried about what happens when all those SSR members come on board, but I have to assume they will be staying at their home resort most often, just like we stay at ours.

As to occupancy at OKW...We have been there often in January and December and October when they are at capacity.

 

[ilovebwv]

Why not buy the cheapest home resort?

Because you might be stuck staying there! DH & I would rather pay higher dues and stay where we want to stay. We owned at the cheapest home resort and sold that contract to buy where we like to stay.

 

[Dean]

Originally posted by MiaSRN62

It was also suggested on another thread that many original OKW owners have owned for more than a decade since it is the first DVC, and these owners are experimenting with trading through II. So this would account for more availability at OKW also.

Units given to II are not available directly to members so this would not increase available, if anything, it would decrease availability as a larger percent of II deposits are OKW due to the lower points requirement. OKW will be available more than most for a number of reasons. These include the large size, that it's older, the location being out of the action and the like. The members have tried it and now their trying other things to a certain extent.

 

[Desperado]

Originally posted by Sammy
Just a few musings from a soon-to-be (hopefully) DVC newbie (waiting to hear on ROFR with a BCV resale):

I truly agonized between buying SSR through Disney or BCV resale. With 3 kids under 13, of course they LOVE SAB and we love the Epcot area, so we want to stay at BCV for the most part. However, I am very value conscious and the extra years on the SSR contract just made better financial sense to me when I broke down the yearly cost comparison (38 vs 50 years). I figured I would just change ressies every year at the 7-month window.

BUT....my resale agent made the exact same point that tjkraz made as far as the number of DVC members increasing once SSR is all up and running. So there will be that many more people vying for the rooms. Plus, she thought that the smaller # of BCV units available would make resale that much more desireable if we ever (god forbid) wanted to sell in the future.

We knew that in our hearts, we wanted to stay in the Epcot area, so even though my "value conscious" head wanted SSR, my heart won out.

That's my story and I'm stickin' to it!

Sammy

Family vacation time is so precious. I doubt you'll be sitting in one of the swings on the beach looking out across crescent lake or playing in the sand bottom pool with your kids thinking, "I could have saved a couple of extra bucks and picked another resort". I think you made the right choice going with your heart.

These include the large size, that it's older, the location being out of the action and the like.

Yep, each resort has it's advantages and people vote with thier reservations. Perhaps it's time to at least update the pools as some have suggested above. Although for OKW lovers, the additional availability may be another great perk they enjoy along with the large rooms and golfcourse views.

 

[DVCPAT]

Originally posted by KANSAS
DVCPAT&HBCAT
here is the magic question. DVC owners have a history of being loyal to their home resorts?This would mean, I made the right deceision.

does the increasing number of DVC members, make my 7 month option, less available in next 38 years.

The normal comments, I get is not to worry about about 50 cents per point, per year in annual dues, difference between BCV AND OKW because it is your vacation time with your family and DVC is so nice, why worry about 50 cents per point in annual dues difference, between BCV AND OKW.

50 cents per point x 38 years is $19.00 per point

I bought BWV & VWL so I can make reservations 11 months in advance. My family loves these two resorts so our BWV & VWL vacations are guaranteed, no surprises, no guessing at seven months. I don’t want to risk staying somewhere my family doesn’t prefer.

Our kids are reaching the age where we give them a little freedom. OKW is a great resort but my kids enjoy swimming, walking around the lobby areas and shopping within the resort.

KANSAS, if you enjoy BCV, think about all the money your saving. Think about how DVC has appreciated over the years. Most people take a beating on timeshares.

 

[DeeP]

I know I am going to get called out for these statements, but I get called out for a lot of statements I make on this board, so what the heck! LOL!!
Start up the flames, but I am sorry, using a DVC membership with the pattern that Kansas is using theirs is not right. You do not buy a membership purposely at the resort with the lowest dues knowing full darn well you will mostly always be reserving rooms at the other higher priced dues resorts. I don't care if you are legit in getting the rooms at 7 months or not, if you mainly wanted to stay at the higher priced DVC resorts, which are priced that way because they offer more to their guests in terms of location and amenities, pools, restaurants, etc., I don't care how you slice the pie, if you want to stay in these resorts for the majority of your trips then you should be paying the higher dues.
I feel the same way about people that constantly pool hop because they are not happy with OKW's pool or that regularly park at the Epcot and MK resorts so they do not have to park in the lots at the parks. I am sorry if you want those things and intend to make this your resort choice the vast majority of the time due to these things, location, etc., then you should have bought at one of these resorts and should be paying the higher dues that support these extended amenities.
Kansas is only one person from a very small number of DVC members that we see on these boards that employs this money saving technique, I wonder how many other members do the same thing. I know OKW has the largest amount of rooms but it would be very intersting to see the actual % of OKW owners that trade out on a regular basis to other WDW DVC resorts or how many on a regular basis pool hop, valet park or even self park for park access etc. Again I know OKW has the largest amount of rooms about double of BWV, but come on OKW is always available. I have never been told there was not at least something at OKW no matter what time of the year I have tried to make reservations and no matter how close to the trip. I go to WDW every 3 months or less so I have been there alot and I will admit I hardly ever make reservations at 11 months--I can't, I am there too often, and I am never sure of excat dates. As an owner at BWV and gladly paying the highest of the DVC WDW dues, I will admit it does get frustrating when I have to juggle my dates to get into my own home resort and yet OKW is always available.
It would be very interesting if DVC could some how keep track of the % of owners that trade out of their home resort on a regular basis to stay at other WDW DVC resorts.
Ok, flame away!

 

[Happy Birthday Cat]

if you want to stay in these resorts for the majority of your trips then you should be paying the higher dues.

I feel the same way about people that constantly pool hop because they are not happy with OKW's pool or that regularly park at the Epcot and MK resorts so they do not have to park in the lots at the parks.

While I disagree with Kansas on the thinking behind being able to book at 7 months at any resort he wants, he is following the rules as they presently exist. So are people that pool hop. Those who park in the wrong lots to get an advantage are breaking the rules that all of us should live by.

As long as KANSAS or anyone else for that matter follows the rules, I'm not going to judge whether he is right or wrong. I will judge on whether what is said is accurate though and in that case it can even be a matter of opinion or educated guess.

For example: my New Year's reservation this year at the BCV and for the VWL at Christmas could not have been booked at the 7 month window. But if KANSAS or anyone else wants to try, I wish them all the luck in the world.

HBC

 

[Nick@ VB+OKW]

Originally posted by DeeP
Ok, flame away!

DVC members can reserve anywhere they want at the 7 month window. I don't have a problem with members buying at 1 resort and staying at another.

I have a problem with members reserving prime holiday weeks.....and renting them out to the highest bidder on e-bay and the rent boards.

 

[DeeP]

For example: my New Year's reservation this year at the BCV and for the VWL at Christmas could not have been booked at the 7 month window. But if KANSAS or anyone else wants to try, I wish them all the luck in the world.

This is true, but these times are really the minority of the year not the majority of the time each year. As the system remains now, someone could realistically buy at the cheapest priced dues DVC resort and always stay at another higher priced WDW DVC resort utilizing all the advantages that cause the higer dues and not paying the higher dues, while technically remaining within the rules. Yes it is within the rules but talk about walking a fine line!

 

[AZKathy]

Don't worry about me using the 7 mont window to book elsewhere. I am fully content to stay at OKW.