What should Disney do about a Future DVC Availability Problem?

[KAT4DISNEY]

Would you feel the same way if you owned there and the "dent" was in your pocketbook? If only the villas are open, why would the Company pay more than the minimum it is paying now to keep it maintained during the closure?

Here's the probable rub - it wouldn't be the DVC members paying if there was any overage in costs. It would be DVC because that's what they guarantee to do in lieu of paying their own MF's. Sucks in a year where you might have to pay but in most years they don't pay anything as I understand it and if that's what they've done at VGC. Also pay a little more and still get to use it or just pay what your normally do and don't get to use it? Yeah, I'd probably pay a little more. But I am of the belief it actually would be DVC covering any shortage for the rest of this year. However there were costs that weren't occurring for several months to help offset any extra now.

But is it legal for them to do this? That is what I am wondering. Of course they are looking out for their bottom line, but could legal recourse be brought against them? If the owners have no issue that would be fine, but do some have an issue?

I don't think it's legal keeping it closed.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Most likely legal. Someone could try to sue to require DVC to reopen VGC, but there would be a high risk that the plaintiff could end up spending a lot of money on lawyers and coming away with nothing.

"Acts of God" causing damage to the VGC rooms, or raising a health risk if you were to keep the resort or rooms open, is an accepted legal defense that excuses a company like Disney from performing under contracts (including POS's) that would otherwise require VGC to be open). That defense often has a lot of leeway in it, in that it may even be possible, in relation to this pandemic, for Disney to keep VGC closed until the Pandemic is declared over without Disney being deemed in breach of the POS that may require it to provide rooms to members. Moreover, just because other timeshares have opened does not mean Disney must open. Companies in these situations will do what they can to get things open even if there is still a risk as long as it becomes somewhat reasonable to open, but that fact does not require Disney to reopen VGC now. Moreover in considering whether it is reasonable to reopen, Disney can consider the nature of this timeshare, and the fact that the pools, restaurants and parks are not open, as a basis for continuing to maintain the closure.

There's the counter argument though that other timeshares are open.

I'm of the belief that's why everything, including Jambo, did get opened up. And it may be that nobody's pushed them about VGC yet so head in the sand and all that.

 

[Deb & Bill]

Why aren't WL, BC, Polynesian and BWI open yet? Because DVC members are paying for 100% of maintenance, housekeeping and transportation right now.

 

[SL6827]

I wonder if there are any owners out there that would like to use their points there and are becoming more impatient as the days go by with Disney and their bottom line? If not and there is no pressing issue with the owners, then all should be good, right? Is this the only area/resort that Disney seems to possibly be in the wrong legally with the Covid? How long could they keep it closed?

 

[Sandisw]

I wonder if there are any owners out there that would like to use their points there and are becoming more impatient as the days go by with Disney and their bottom line? If not and there is no pressing issue with the owners, then all should be good, right? Is this the only area/resort that Disney seems to possibly be in the wrong legally with the Covid? How long could they keep it closed?

I am not convinced that there is anything that allows DVCM to force Disney to open any part of their hotels and while I have never been to that area, it sounds like VGC are not part of the actual hotel.

It think things are a little different for WDW. CCV is inside the WL so needed to be open. Jambo was opened, but other than the pool, nothing else, and I think they only did that because It may not have been feasible to continue to move guests to Kidani as IMO, that would be the only legal way to keep those rooms offline

So, could VGC open without Disney opening their hotel at all? Sounds like it would be difficult.

 

[starry_solo]

I am not convinced that there is anything that allows DVCM to force Disney to open any part of their hotels and while I have never been to that area, it sounds like VGC are not part of the actual hotel.

It think things are a little different for WDW. CCV is inside the WL so needed to be open. Jambo was opened, but other than the pool, nothing else, and I think they only did that because It may not have been feasible to continue to move guests to Kidani as IMO, that would be the only legal way to keep those rooms offline

So, could VGC open without Disney opening their hotel at all? Sounds like it would be difficult.

well, they’d have to create a substitute lobby in the DVC wing, which is a separate building away from the lobby. It’s accessible via the side of GCH, via a walkway. the most convenient way to get to DTD is through GCH, but it’s not the only way. Going through the same walkway one would use to access VGC, one would have to walk towards PPH, cross the street, go past PPH (side) and walk along DLH to get to DTD.

yes, VGC would be able to open without Disney opening their hotel. parking is the same area (across the street, side of PPH). The substitute lobby would likely just be a kiosk manned by one staff member that could create key cards for incoming guests

 

[Lumpy1106]

Here's a thought;
Right now, Disney has limited borrowing to 50%. That's good - it will spread out the demand somewhat, but I think the OP is right, once the COVID fear subsides you will see the occupancy spike as people try and use their points they weren't really planning on banking. OK, but what if you are like me and you are willing to go and use your points now, but can't because you've hit that 50% borrow limit? Couldn't they relax that borrowing cap if there is availability? Say, within 3 months of your trip. That at least gets my points used in 2021, freeing up availability for people who don't want to go until 2022 (but are planning on a more grandiose trip then to use those banked points). I'd gladly take a trip in 2021 if it means I can avoid the eventual crowds in 2022.

One other thing as I write this though - this problem will eventually solve itself. points are not good forever and they will expire if they do not get used. That may not be the answer you are looking for, but that is how it works.

 

[Sandisw]

Here's a thought;
Right now, Disney has limited borrowing to 50%. That's good - it will spread out the demand somewhat, but I think the OP is right, once the COVID fear subsides you will see the occupancy spike as people try and use their points they weren't really planning on banking. OK, but what if you are like me and you are willing to go and use your points now, but can't because you've hit that 50% borrow limit? Couldn't they relax that borrowing cap if there is availability? Say, within 3 months of your trip. That at least gets my points used in 2021, freeing up availability for people who don't want to go until 2022 (but are planning on a more grandiose trip then to use those banked points). I'd gladly take a trip in 2021 if it means I can avoid the eventual crowds in 2022.

One other thing as I write this though - this problem will eventually solve itself. points are not good forever and they will expire if they do not get used. That may not be the answer you are looking for, but that is how it works.

I do think that allowing more borrowing in short term would be helpful and nice for those willing and able to travel on short notice right now.

As you said, maybe even for last minute trips in 60 days! However, they would then have to find a way to prevent someone from modifying the trip once borrowed to farther out as I could see people using it as a work around. Just not sure the IT is that flexible or how to work it to prevent that.

 

[New Mouse]

People asking about whether dvc owners would want to foot the bill at grand cal without the hotel being open...isnt that exactly what happened at some dvc properties when just disney springs was open?

 

[Sandisw]

People asking about whether dvc owners would want to foot the bill at grand cal without the hotel being open...isnt that exactly what happened at some dvc properties when just disney springs was open?

Disney used DVC rooms to relocate cash guests from their closed properties before parks opened, so there is a chance they are supporting some of the amenities at the WDW resorts as those mixed have continued?

But, not all, as was evident with SAB remaining closed.

It’s a good question though and owners may have insight when new bills come out for 2021.

 

[icc2515]

Here's the probable rub - it wouldn't be the DVC members paying if there was any overage in costs. It would be DVC because that's what they guarantee to do in lieu of paying their own MF's.

Ding Ding Ding I think we have a winner as to why VGC is not open. I forgot all about the no MF for DVC owned points, but they have to cover certain overages. It usually works out for them and when it doesn't they just keep the resort closed apparently. Nice Work @KAT4DISNEY.

 

[Eldon32]

Here's the probable rub - it wouldn't be the DVC members paying if there was any overage in costs. It would be DVC because that's what they guarantee to do in lieu of paying their own MF's.

Today I learned!

 

[AaronEuth]

Watching the most recent DVC show, where both the borrowing restriction and the excess availability was discussed, I wonder if DVC has considered allowing more borrowing for "soon reservations". That would let people willing to go "now" burn their own excess points from the system while filling rooms.

Allow 50 percent borrowing at 11 months and 7 months. Allow reservations for 3 months out use 100 percent. You could even take it a step farther, and allow even further future borrowing for reservations less than 30 days out. Want to burn your 2021 2022 and 2023 to stay in a vacant bungalow next week? Have at it. Every person who does that would remove points from the system, lightening the load in two years.

 

[Sandisw]

Watching the most recent DVC show, where both the borrowing restriction and the excess availability was discussed, I wonder if DVC has considered allowing more borrowing for "soon reservations". That would let people willing to go "now" burn their own excess points from the system while filling rooms.

Allow 50 percent borrowing at 11 months and 7 months. Allow reservations for 3 months out use 100 percent. You could even take it a step farther, and allow even further future borrowing for reservations less than 30 days out. Want to burn your 2021 2022 and 2023 to stay in a vacant bungalow next week? Have at it. Every person who does that would remove points from the system, lightening the load in two years.

It makes sense except then they have to rework the entire online system to prevent someone from booking short term, borrowing, and then modifying later as a work around.

Given Disney IT, it seems a lot of work.