What are your thoughts on Child Beauty Pageants?

[ms.yt]

Same with my DD. She cheers, so we also have to deal with the skimpy and very expensive uniforms (although ours were only $350.00 + $100 for shoes) and hours applying the "hooker" makeup and hair. Thank goodness it seems the trend for allstar cheer seems to be moving slowly towards more natural "stage" makeup than all the layers of glitter that were so popular for years and years. But since I don't approve of it, but allow gobs of glitter eyeshadow, bright red lipstick and stock in hair products because that is how it is done, I cannot fault other activities that have "hooker" makeup

Bt like your daughter...my child spends a minimum of 2 hours, 3x per week doing incredibly aerobic and athletic activities. And that is on a slow week - usually it is much, much more. She has to be able to tumble like an Olympic gymnast, dance like a pro, be able to lift another person in the air balancing on one foot, and perform an intense aerobic exercise for 2 and a half minutes without stopping over and over again during practice.

She is not just going out on stage, flirting with the judges and being judged on her smile and how "cute" she is. She is a part of a team and they are judged on skill.

As for pageants, I would never have my daughter do it, but I don't have as much problem with the all natural pageants. I still think it teaches young women the wrong values, but at least the little girls are not strutting around like little prostitutes.

But the Glitz ones -those are disgusting. To tell a 6 year old that they are not good enough because they have some imperfection like a natural gap where they lost their front tooth, and now have to wear flippers (fake teeth), is abhorrent.

To teach a young child how to bat their eyes and flirt with grown men (judges) to win their approval (and the trophy) is abhorrent.

To teach a young child that their pictures they take are not good enough, they have to be retouched to be "acceptable" is abhorrent. Have you ever seen the "glitz" pictures with the altered eyes and smiles that make them look like little aliens? They are soooo creepy.

To teach young women that their self worth should be based solely on how they look and how they present themselves to those judging them is abhorrent.

And don't bring in they are being judged on talent too - the talent and question portion of the glitz pageants is a joke.

While I am sure there are many good parents involved in both types of pageants, the majority of the ones I have met are the over-the-top ones, the ones that cause you to mutter under your breath "you have to have a license to have a dog, but anybody can have children" as you shake your head in disbelief.

I have seen many of these young cheer squad and dance competition, and it's really generous to say that they are not being judged on cuteness, just talent. Like one poster said, competitions under age 6 really are kind of a stretch in the parents' and people who are making money from the parents' minds. Pageants, dance and cheer for very young girls is all grouped in the same boat for me. It's pretty much all a way for parents to show off their adorable little girls in a very bizarre and expensive way. For some reason, though, dance and cheer has been virtually immune to the kind of criticism that pageants typically receive. From what I've seen, the outfits are just as skimpy and they wear way too much makeup. Why do people who think pageants are gathering places for pedophiles not think the same is true for dance & cheer competitions?

 

[Mickey's Minion]

I have seen many of these young cheer squad and dance competition, and it's really generous to say that they are not being judged on cuteness, just talent. Like one poster said, competitions under age 6 really are kind of a stretch in the parents' and people who are making money from the parents' minds. Pageants, dance and cheer for very young girls is all grouped in the same boat for me. It's pretty much all a way for parents to show off their adorable little girls in a very bizarre and expensive way. For some reason, though, dance and cheer has been virtually immune to the kind of criticism that pageants typically receive. From what I've seen, the outfits are just as skimpy and they wear way too much makeup. Why do people who think pageants are gathering places for pedophiles not think the same is true for dance & cheer competitions?

I guess we will have to disagree on that. I don't know anything about dance competitions, as cheer and dance are similar but also completely different. But the score sheets for cheer are based on skills performed, not how "beautiful" they are. There are uniform rules, such as no jewelry, no nails that can be seen when looking at the palm of the hand, no painted nails of any kind, no piercings. The hair and makeup have to be uniform across the team, but there is nothing that says it has to be "hooker" makeup. That is just the trend now a days. There is a small section for point on overall presentation, but that is again, not how cute, but how entertaining the routine is. Yes, you will lose points if you go out on the floor looking slovenly, but there is no place to score "beauty", for the most part it is skills.

I agree with you that with some teams, they way over do the makeup. The gobs of makeup just serves to perpetuate the stereotype that it is based on cute (which was true in the past) and not on athleticism. While the sport has changed drastically in the past 10 years, the stereotypes have not and the makeup is not helping change the image.

And with regards to uniforms, I agree there are gyms that go overboard. I hate to see the minis (the young kids) in the barely there crop top uniforms with cutouts. Thank goodness our gym and many others believe in appropriateness and the younger kids never compete in anything too revealing and their bellies are not exposed.

But this isn't about cheer, which can be as much a hotly debated topic as pageants. They only thing we were saying is that our kids have to be amazing athletes to do cheer or Irish dance, unlike pageants that base their judgment on outer looks.

I have no problems with children under 6 participating in some sort of sport as long as it is something they asked to do. I think you are underestimating young children and their abilities to know what they want. I see many of our 6-under teams beg their parents to go to the gym and to compete. They are completely capable of comprehending what they are doing, why they are doing it and the concept of team placings.

As for pedophiles in kid's sports, my kids swim competively as their main sport. While I have never heard of pedophile problems in cheer, we have had numerous ones in swimming. Just a few weeks ago we had to call the police on a guy taking pictures of the young boys in the heating area. We caught another guy standing behind the blocks watching the kids with his hands deep in his pockets - and you could tell what his hands were doing.

Boys/young men in wet swim suits that are usually 3 sizes too small are huge draws for pedophiles.

 

[NotUrsula]

... She is not just going out on stage, flirting with the judges and being judged on her smile and how "cute" she is. She is a part of a team and they are judged on skill.

... AND hair.

It's OT, I know, but as someone who was a step dancer long before it was fashionable in the US, the hair thing bothers me. In fact, the whole "curls" issue is causing me to question whether or not I want my daughter to participate in step dancing at all.

WHAT IS IT WITH THE HAIR? Girls who cheer can't have short hair because they have to have the ponytail with the ribbon, and step dancers have been reduced to wearing wigs because some band of twits has decided that "Irish" hair must naturally be curly. WTH?

I'm older than dirt, and I've got to tell you that I danced in my own stick straight hair and did quite nicely 40 years ago. AND I knew champion cheerleaders who had short hair! This hair criterion is new, and it really needs to go away. If more participants simply refused to pander to it, it would.

If it is really about skill, then the hair shouldn't matter, now should it?

I've pretty much decided that if I cannot find a scoil that does not require curls, then DD won't be participating in step dancing classes. I'll just teach her at home.

OK, rant over -- back to the regularly scheduled thread topic.

PS:

I have no problems with children under 6 participating in some sort of sport as long as it is something they asked to do. I think you are underestimating young children and their abilities to know what they want. I see many of our 6-under teams beg their parents to go to the gym and to compete. They are completely capable of comprehending what they are doing, why they are doing it and the concept of team placings.

I have no issue at all with younger children taking classes and learning the skills of a dance or sport, and even participating in exhibition performances, but I'm holding to my position that they should not be competing at that age. If they want to participate, it should be because they find the skill fun to practice, not in order to win. An emphasis on competition at that age is mentally unhealthy, IMO. IME, kids that age only care about winning (at whatever pursuit) because they know that the adults in their lives will give them more praise or "stuff" if they win than if they lose, and they tend to translate that status into a reflection of their own self-worth -- they just take it too much to heart.

 

[Mickey's Minion]

... AND hair.

It's OT, I know, but as someone who was a step dancer long before it was fashionable in the US, the hair thing bothers me. In fact, the whole "curls" issue is causing me to question whether or not I want my daughter to participate in step dancing at all.

WHAT IS IT WITH THE HAIR? Girls who cheer can't have short hair because they have to have the ponytail with the ribbon, and step dancers have been reduced to wearing wigs because some band of twits has decided that "Irish" hair must naturally be curly. WTH?

I'm older than dirt, and I've got to tell you that I danced in my own stick straight hair and did quite nicely 40 years ago. AND I knew champion cheerleaders who had short hair! This hair criterion is new, and it really needs to go away. If more participants simply refused to pander to it, it would.

If it is really about skill, then the hair shouldn't matter, now should it?

I've pretty much decided that if I cannot find a scoil that does not require curls, then DD won't be participating in step dancing classes. I'll just teach her at home.

OK, rant over -- back to the regularly scheduled thread topic.

Actually not true in cheer. You can have any kind of hair you want. The days of long hair in ponytails and attaching fake "cheer curls" are long gone. If you have short hair, you wear a headband that is made of the same ribbon as the bows. We had a girl on DD's team with a short, short boys hair cut. She just wore a headband.

Here is a picture of a matching headband with the bows:

There are specific hairstyles so the teams present themselves looking like a unified team. But length of hair does not matter. It really is first and foremost about skill.

Our gym last year had three different competition hairstyles for different lengths hair. Short pixies wore headbands, hair that was long enough to bring up the sides, but not long enough for a high ponytail wore a half up/half down with the bow in the pulled back part, and the longer hair had the traditional ponytails with the bows up top.

I am contemplating encouraging my daughter to cut her hair very short so she can wear a headband too. It would cut down on the hours of straightening and getting the ponytail just right. Just brush and pin the hairband in.

Hairbands are a huge trend with most teams now due to the varying lengths of hair of young girls.

Back to bashing pageants......

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I don't think they are bad in and of themselves. The natural pageants come to mind.

The gaudy pageants have parents with really messed up priorities. The ROI is low. They spend upwards of thousands of dollars in the hope that their little princess will get the one and only $1000 cash prize. It makes no sense.

Hair pieces, clippers, spray tans et al---just wow!

And the gaudy bikinis they put on pip squeeks. Wow!

I think every little girl wants to be a princess. But it looks like the parents missed the memo and dressed their little princess like a drag queen.

As for dance and cheer--when they look like drag queens doing cart wheels, I may agree.

But makeup for the stage--and dressing like a grand slam princess (drag queen) are two entirely different animals.

 

[Mickey's Minion]

BTW OP - I forgot to mention it, but your DD in your siggie is absolutely beautiful in her own right. I saw her other pictures in your other thread and she is precious.

It would be a shame to cover up all that beauty with drag queen makeup and fake hair.

 

[WeLoveLilo05]

I watched one a few nights ago and the little girl I believe was only 4. She sat in the chair CRYING because she did not want to get the hair all done up and the make up done and did not want to take those pictures that go in the portfolio. The mother then says that she has a fever and isn't really feeling that good today. Well if my kid had a fever she would have seen the doc and then rested up on the couch and watched some TV. Seriously, I do NOT know what some of the mommies on these shows are thinking?!?!

 

[joyjoy]

Those pageants are freaky and so are the moms. I think it's hilarious to see the moms swinging their pretend lassos and putting their hands on their hips and strutting along with their little one on stage.

My daughter was a Jr. Olympic gymnast and they wore matching team leotards and NO makeup; they weren't allowed. She retired at 16 due to injuries but the older girls and college teams had a little makeup going on. As gym moms, we always thought the cheerleaders were dancers that could do a round-off. The gymnasts were working out 4 hrs/day Mon - Sat and I think the cheerleaders put in about 6 - 8 hours a week. A lot of ex-gymnasts become cheerleaders, lots of her friends did that. They loooooooved getting to wear hooker makeup!

 

[mjkacmom]

... AND hair.

It's OT, I know, but as someone who was a step dancer long before it was fashionable in the US, the hair thing bothers me. In fact, the whole "curls" issue is causing me to question whether or not I want my daughter to participate in step dancing at all.

WHAT IS IT WITH THE HAIR? Girls who cheer can't have short hair because they have to have the ponytail with the ribbon, and step dancers have been reduced to wearing wigs because some band of twits has decided that "Irish" hair must naturally be curly. WTH?

I'm older than dirt, and I've got to tell you that I danced in my own stick straight hair and did quite nicely 40 years ago. AND I knew champion cheerleaders who had short hair! This hair criterion is new, and it really needs to go away. If more participants simply refused to pander to it, it would.

If it is really about skill, then the hair shouldn't matter, now should it?

I've pretty much decided that if I cannot find a scoil that does not require curls, then DD won't be participating in step dancing classes. I'll just teach her at home.

OK, rant over -- back to the regularly scheduled thread topic.

PS:


I have no issue at all with younger children taking classes and learning the skills of a dance or sport, and even participating in exhibition performances, but I'm holding to my position that they should not be competing at that age. If they want to participate, it should be because they find the skill fun to practice, not in order to win. An emphasis on competition at that age is mentally unhealthy, IMO. IME, kids that age only care about winning (at whatever pursuit) because they know that the adults in their lives will give them more praise or "stuff" if they win than if they lose, and they tend to translate that status into a reflection of their own self-worth -- they just take it too much to heart.

I hate the wigs, too, but the "bouncing" is now part of the performance. Our neighbor is 18, and danced when she was younger, and instead of wigs, she had to put rollers in her hair the night before (and some girls do curl their hair - depends on the school - ours won't even let us pick out our own style of wig). I bet the irish dancing stores make big $ on those wigs!

 

[Mickey's Minion]

Those pageants are freaky and so are the moms. I think it's hilarious to see the moms swinging their pretend lassos and putting their hands on their hips and strutting along with their little one on stage.

My daughter was a Jr. Olympic gymnast and they wore matching team leotards and NO makeup; they weren't allowed. She retired at 16 due to injuries but the older girls and college teams had a little makeup going on. As gym moms, we always thought the cheerleaders were dancers that could do a round-off. The gymnasts were working out 4 hrs/day Mon - Sat and I think the cheerleaders put in about 6 - 8 hours a week. A lot of ex-gymnasts become cheerleaders, lots of her friends did that. They loooooooved getting to wear hooker makeup!

You have to have more than a round off now

Back handsprings are pretty much mandatory for anything over a level one, back tuck for level 3 and going into level 5, you need a tumbling pa ss that would rival anything that a gymnast puts on the floor. Depending on the competitive level of the gym, there is way more than 6-8 hours a week put in.

But that is why we get so many gymnasts - they are burned out doing gymnastics, but they can still use their skills and advance up to higher teams pretty quickly because they have the basics. A friend of ours just had their daughter try out last year. She was an upper level gymnast, I believe she was competing on a national level, and she still only made a level 3 (out of 5) team because her tumbling pass just wasn't quite there yet. Having to do your tumbling, for instance three jumps in a row directly into a tuck, all synchronized to the hundredth of a second with 32 other teammates and the music, requires different skills than gymnastics. She had a ton of privates and this year she made a level 4 team.

But the older girls do love all that glitter and hooker makeup. I find it hilarious to see the teens with spray cans of glitter spraying it on themselves because they don't sparkle enough. But it is a completely different mindset than dolling up for pageants.

 

[karenos]

What gets me (besides the obvious - dress, makeup, crazy stage moms) is the cost of these pageants. One woman said she spent about $25,000 on expenses for the pageants - one has to wonder whether she also has that much money set aside for the kid's college fund.

Also, I could be wrong, but are pageants a regional thing? I've never seen one where I live - Northern NJ.

Just my 2cents-
karenos