"We reap what we sow -- are you thinking?"

Rajah

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Aug 17, 1999
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Billy Graham's daughter was interviewed on the Early Show and Jane Clayson asked her "How could God let something like this happen?" ( regarding the attacks on Sept. 11 ).
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Anne Graham gave an extremely profound and insightful response. She said "I believe God is deeply saddened by this, just as we are, but for years we've been telling God to get out of our schools, to get out of our government and to get out of our lives. And being the gentleman He is, I believe He has calmly backed out. How can we expect God to give us His blessing and His protection if we demand He leave us alone?"
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In light of recent events...terrorists attack, school shootings, etc. I think it started when Madeleine Murray O'Hare (she was murdered, her body found recently) complained she didn't want prayer in our schools, and we said OK.
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Then someone said you better not read the Bible in school... the Bible says thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not steal, and love your neighbor as yourself. And we said OK.
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Then Dr. Benjamin Spock said we shouldn't spank our children when they misbehave because their little personalities would be warped and we might damage their self-esteem (Dr. Spock's son committed suicide). We said an expert should know what he's talking about. And we said OK.
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Then someone said teachers and principals better not discipline our children when they misbehave. The school administrators said no faculty member in this school better touch a student when they misbehave because we don't want any bad publicity, and we surely don't want to be sued. There's a big difference between disciplining, touching, beating, smacking, humiliating, kicking, etc.).
And we said OK.
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Then someone said, let's let our daughters have abortions if they want, and they won't even have to tell their parents. And we said OK.
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Then some wise school board member said, since boys will be boys and they're going to do it anyway, let's give our sons all the condoms they want so they can have all the fun they desire, and we won't have to tell their parents they got them at school. And we said OK.
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Then some of our top elected officials said it doesn't matter what we do in private as long as we do our jobs. Agreeing with them, we said it doesn't matter to me what anyone, including the President, does in private as long as I have a job and the economy is good.
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Then someone said let's print magazines with pictures of nude women and call it wholesome, down-to-earth appreciation for the beauty of the female body. And we said OK.
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And then someone else took that appreciation a step further and published pictures of nude children and then further again by making them available on the Internet. And we said OK, they're entitled to free speech.
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Then the entertainment industry said, let's make TV shows and movies that promote profanity, violence, and illicit sex. Let's record music that encourages rape, drugs, murder, suicide, and satanic themes. And we said it's just entertainment, it has no adverse effect, nobody takes it seriously anyway, so go right ahead.
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Now we're asking ourselves why our children have no conscience, why they don't know right from wrong, and why it doesn't bother them to kill strangers, their classmates, and themselves.
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Probably, if we think about it long and hard enough, we can figure it out. I think it has a great deal to do with "WE REAP WHAT WE SOW."
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Funny how simple it is for people to trash God and then wonder why the world's going to hell. Funny how we believe what the newspapers say, but question what the Bible says.
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Funny how you can send 'jokes' through e-mail and they spread like wildfire, but when you start sending messages regarding the Lord, people think twice about sharing.
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Funny how lewd, crude, vulgar and obscene articles pass freely through cyberspace, but public discussion of God is suppressed in the school and workplace.
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Are you laughing?
Funny how when you forward this message, you will not send it to many on your address list because you're not sure what they believe, or what they WILL think of you for sending it. Funny how we can be more worried about what other people think of us than what God thinks of us.
Pass it on if you think it has merit. If not then just discard it... no one will know you did. But, if you discard this thought process, don't sit back and complain about what bad shape the world is in!
Are you thinking?
 
Rajah--That has to be one of the BEST posts I have ever seen!

Thank you so much for sharing:D


God Bless America!



And, yes I am thinking...and I have been for quite a while
 
Yes, I'm thinking.

I'm thinking what a crock.

God did not 'back away' and let those psychopaths hijack those planes. He had NOTHING to do with it. Anyone who thinks so, even Billy Grahams daughter, is mistaken.

If what you are saying is true, then my friends son who has Leukemia, is reaping what he sewed? He goes in for a bone transplant tomorrow. I'll pass that on to him. He's 9 years old.

Dr. Spock first came out, what, 50 years ago? Back in the 50's. Back in the good old days when everything was wonderful. When kids could pray in school, when corporal punishment was okay, back when the threat of nuclear war was much higher than it is, even today. I remember having to crouch under my desk during air raid drills. Was God calmly backing away then?

How about going back even further, to the 18th century? Slavery was common. Did black people do something to anger God to make him back away then? People died of diseases that have since been eradicated. Did God back off and allow those people to die, but came back and allowed us to make vaccines?

We have been shooting each other since the invention of guns. Before that we stabbed each other and stoned each other. IF this theory is true, then please answer me this. When in time has God EVER been here?


Are you thinking?
 
That is the thing about freewill.. God never steps away, people do.

God is in control all the time, guiding. If didn't stepped away, the whole belief system would be shaken. He wouldn't be omnispresent then. God doesn't take vacations, or leave the scene when things get tough...


And also I cant think of the last time when child pornography was considered ok...


Just because someone is a family member of a prominent person doesn't mean they are the same...
 

Lucky4me truer words have never been spoken. I agree with you 100%.

Anyone who believes that God was punishing us should go back and read the bible again.

God gave us a free will, a will to choose right or wrong. Some choose the right paths others choose the path of distruction.

I have been through a lot in my life and never once have I ever thought God didn't care, or was responsible. Never did I think it was some punishment for something in the past.

Sadly our world will never have peace. As long a one religion thinks their god is the true, most powerful. Until we learn to respect each others beliefs, and not try to push our own religion on another person, there will always be religious wars.
 
Yeah - I'm thinking - I'm thinking I just read a exerpt from a Rush Limbaugh book or something......

Clapping for Lucky - Thank you - You said better than I could have, some of my thoughts.....I agree with Cindy B - I never knew child porn was considered ok, in ANY society...

I'm also thinking that this is the kind of club weilded over people with AIDS, which prevented research & treatment for so long - "You reap what you sow" Too bad, we lost so many wonderful, vibrant friends, lovers, parents, siblings, who died in fear, shame & loneliness... Turns my stomach to even think about it!
Somehow, I don't think if The Christ was walking this Earth today, he would appreciate those kinds of statements - I believe MY Higher Power is about Love & Compassion, Forgiveness & Empathy - not judgement & condemnation....
 
I believe MY Higher Power is about Love & Compassion, Forgiveness & Empathy - not judgement & condemnation....

You've just described my God. :)

Well said, Leota.
 
Mankind has had to endure the same FIRE AND BRIMSTONE claptrap for centuries BEFORE the Internet, Playboy Magazine, and the founding of the USA. It has come from preachers and "the Righteous" who wish to believe that "it's GOD's way or the highway". I don't get angered by their ignorance; I'm saddened by their narrowness and intolerance. I've seen the same qualities in certain members of the DIS who accept such rhetoric with hook, line, and sinker.

Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson would lovvvvvvvvvvvvvve this thread . It embodies the arrogance which they demonstrated after 9-11 in supposing that we were being "punished" by GOD for "straying". :mad: :mad: :mad:
 
The first post is a lot of 'clap-trap" in my opinion.

But I want to clarify something.....did Billy Graham 's daughter SAY all that on the interview,or was it all tacked on by some religious nutcase?:rolleyes:
 
Pollyanna,
I saw the interview. I do believe she said the first paragraph. The other is just email stuff that I have read many times since I have gotten a computer. You know, like why didn't God help Columbine? Because God isn't allowed in schools...:mad: We may think God isn't allowed in schools but God is everywhere. Kids pray in school everyday--even if it is just "help me with this test."
I think it is nutty for people to say God isn't allowed somewhere. Once you accept Christ, the Holy Spirit lives within you and God is with you always. Whether you are at school or jail or at the mall.:D

I read her comment and cringe but at the same time if you read the Bible and see the history of God and people, you do see that God does allow judgements when people turn their back on Him. I know God didn't cause Sept.11 to happen or cause Lucky4me's friend to have cancer or anything bad to happen to anyone. But, I do think that our country has been slowly slipping away from recognizing Him as God & I do wonder what our future holds.
 
Buckalew while I do agree with you on most of your views. I feel our country is no different today then yesterday.

I look around me and see good people. In my neighborhood, my town, my state, my country and the world.

I believe there is nothing new about the things that are happening. They have been happening since the beginning of mankind.

The only thing thats different is the press has opened the door to knowledge of the evils. Where they were kept in the dark they are now brought out into the light. The only way to make changes is to open Pandora's Box.
 
I'm thinking more along the line of to be free to choose good we humans have to be free to choose evil. Some do.

To be free to choose to do good we have to be in the freedom to choose not to be good.

What we can do is make choices in our lives and live them as well as our understand of right and worng leads us.

Right now I am trying to choose not to be intolerant toward others; Muslims, Arabs, other appreciations of religions - including those who choose no organized religion because the are reacting against the evil of men who act in the name of a church.

This is what my understanding of good or God leads me to.


End of my seriousness.
 
Anne Graham gave an extremely profound and insightful response. She said "I believe God is deeply saddened by this, just as we are, but for years we've been telling God to get out of our schools, to get out of our government and to get out of our lives. And being the gentleman He is, I believe He has calmly backed out. How can we expect God to give us His blessing and His protection if we demand He leave us alone?"


I agree 100%.

Why is it that non believers/atheist deny God, does not believe in God, but yet when something happens such as 9/11 they want God to bless them. I'm just curious.

BTW, this is JMHO if a person think God will not take his hand off of you than you are sadly mistaken. He is not a vengeful God, but he is jealous God. He is an AWESOME God yet he will stepback when you deny him. AGAIn this is JMHO
 
Funny how you can send 'jokes' through e-mail and they spread like wildfire, but when you start sending messages regarding the Lord, people think twice about sharing.

I wish they would. I've gotten this particular piece of Spam email more times than I can count over the past couple of years.

Some of the points made in here would make great Debate Board topics, but probably not real good CB board material.
 
When Bad Things Happen to Good People by Harold Kushner

From the Publisher
As a Young Theology Student, Harold Kushner puzzled over the Book of Job. As a small-town rabbi he counseled other people through pain and grief. But not until he learned that his three-year-old son, Aaron, would die in his early teens of a rare disease did he confront one of life's most difficult questions: Where do we find the resources to cope when tragedy strikes?

"I knew that one day I would write this book," says Rabbi Kushner. "I would write it out of my own need to put into words some of the most important things I have come to believe and know. And I would write it to help other people who might one day find themselves in a similar predicament. I am fundamentally a religious man who has been hurt by life, and I wanted to write a book that could be given to the person who has been hurt by life, and who knows in his heart that if there is justice in the world, he deserved better... If you are such a person, if you want to believe in God's goodness and fairness but find it hard because of the things that have happened to you and to people you care about, and if this book helps you do that, then I will have succeeded in distilling some blessing out of Aaron's pain and tears."

Since its original publication in 1981, When Bad Things Happen to Good People has brought solace and hope to millions. In his new preface to this anniversary edition, Rabbi Kushner relates the heartwarming responses he has received over the last two decades from people who have found inspiration and comfort within these pages.


http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=3HPR7ADKWY&isbn=0380603926
 
Another good one besides the Rabbis' book is Philip Yancey's Disappointment with God...

That is an amazing book with a lot of profound points. I truly enjoyed that book, and made me realize that God is in control, all the time, no matter what.

And since we are referencing the book of Job.. look at the hardship he endured in the beginning of the book, death, poverty, loss of income, etc...

At the end of the book was blessed many times over.
 
"Why is it that non believers/atheist deny God, does not believe in God, but yet when something happens such as 9/11 they want God to bless them. I'm just curious. "

speaking for myself, and the other atheists i know, none of us have "wanted god to bless us" after a tragedy, including 9/11.
 
http://www.gurus.com/dougdeb/Courses/bestsellers/Kushner/BTmain.htm

some quotes from Kushner:

"All the responses to tragedy which we have considered have at least one thing in common. They all assume that God is the cause of our suffering, and they try to understand why God would want us to suffer. … There may be another approach. Maybe God does not cause our suffering. Maybe it happens for some reason other than the will of God."
"If God is God of justice and not of power, the He can still be on our side when bad things happen to us. He can know that we are good and honest people who deserve better. Our misfortunes are none of His doing, and so we can turn to Him for help. … We will turn to God, not to be judged or forgiven, but to be strengthened and comforted." "The world is mostly an orderly, predictable place, showing ample evidence of God's thoroughness and handiwork, but pockets of chaos remain. Most of the time, the events of the universe follow firm natural laws. But every now and then, things happen not contrary to those laws of nature but outside them. Things happen which could just as easily have happened differently." "Laws of nature do not make exceptions for nice people. A bullet has no conscience; neither does a malignant tumor or an automobile gone out of control. That is why good people get sick and get hurt as much as anyone. No matter what stories we were taught about Daniel or Jonah in Sunday School, God does not reach down to interrupt the workings of laws of nature to protect the righteous from harm. This is a second area of our world which causes bad things to happen to good people, and God does not cause it and cannot stop it." "Pain is the price we pay for being alive. … When we understand that, our question will change from, 'why do we have to be in pain?' to 'what do we do with our pain so that it becomes meaningful and is not just pointless empty suffering? How can we turn all the painful experiences of our lives into birth pangs or into growing pains?' We may not ever understand why we suffer or be able to control the forces that cause our suffering, but we can have a lot to say about what the suffering does to us, and what sort of people we become because of it. Pain makes some people bitter and envious. It makes others sensitive and compassionate. It is the result, not the cause, of pain that makes some experiences of pain meaningful and others empty and destructive."
 
aahmom, I cant believe it, but I actually agree with you on something!

I ditto your ditto: "What a crock!"


9/11 happened because prayer was taken out of the schools? Gimme a break!

There is separation of church and state in the country. How is that wrong?
 














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