Universal's Epic Universe - News and Discussion

[Minnie1222]

A decrease at Walt Disney World Resort reflecting a modest decrease in revenues and higher costs. These impacts were due to:
Lower volumes due to decreases in attendance and occupied room nights, both of which reflected the comparison to the 50th anniversary celebration in the prior-year quarter
Higher costs due to inflation, partially offset by cost saving initiatives and lower depreciation
Increased guest spending due to higher average ticket prices, partially offset by lower average daily room rates

That's from yesterday's earnings report. Yes WDW attendance was down.

Yes, but the same report also said that there was "attendance growth" at Disneyland. Overall lead to the 4% revenue increase in the domestic parks. Forget about the fluctuation in attendance number, I'm more concerned about why people kept saying that Disney parks have low attendance and poor performance.

 

[Scalemaster34]

This is my opinion as well. I think EU will draw some attendance from Disney but it will have a bigger effect on UO/IOA. I usually take a day or two to hit up both parks while I'm in Orlando for the week but will instead use those days and go to EU.

Disney will continue reporting record high revenue and profit at the parks. They have already stated plans for expansion and have stated a ton of investment into the parks over the next ten years. I understand people want but I would rather enjoy EU for a few years and than enjoy whatever Disney does in Dinoland or behind Big Thunder.

Problem is how long before we see any of that opening in the parks? Lands are five or six year projects, and stand along attractions can take as much as three years.

And I don't count retheming of existing attractions, as a reason to visit.

But in the end I think they need lower attendance anyway... in order to make a new form of Genie+ work that doesn't frustrate and disappoint guest.

 

[weather_lady]

But in the end I think they need lower attendance anyway... in order to make a new form of Genie+ work that doesn't frustrate and disappoint guest.

Off-topic, but I don't think Disney's problem is that attendance is too high: not when they're still routinely running major attractions at half-capacity, and half-staffed, with shorter hours of operation than in pre-COVID years, even during times of year that are more crowded than normal.

The problem is that Disney has decided that making guests wait longer for everything is acceptable, because it is so profitable (as a driver of G+ sales, and a way to keep operating costs down), regardless of whether the longer waits, and/or the inadequacy of the skip-the-line system (which I completely agree needs to be revamped, or better yet, scrapped entirely), lower guest satisfaction.

 

[tony67]

Off-topic, but I don't think Disney's problem is that attendance is too high: not when they're still routinely running major attractions at half-capacity, and half-staffed, with shorter hours of operation than in pre-COVID years, even during times of year that are more crowded than normal.

The problem is that Disney has decided that making guests wait longer for everything is acceptable, because it is so profitable (as a driver of G+ sales, and a way to keep operating costs down), regardless of whether the longer waits, and/or the inadequacy of the skip-the-line system (which I completely agree needs to be revamped, or better yet, scrapped entirely), lower guest satisfaction.

I'd agree.

I feel Universal is also making some bad choice as well though.
Later opening for things for example.
It feels like there were budget cuts at HHN this year - and that is just a cash cow.

The mess at The Cursed Coconut club for Mardi Gras really annoys me.
They are charging 18-20 for a drink + tip, and they are skimping from everything I have seen.
The event drinks don't even seem all that good. I was looking forward to it, but not so much now.
If you did this right, and let the folks on the ground, dealing with the customers every day plan the drinks, it would be so much better.

The decor looks like a bunch of random junk, one of the chairs broke on opening night, I guess it was a prop and not a proper chair. The menu is just a piece of paper and not the highly detailed and well designed thing they had at HHN.

I get that they are spread too thin and lots of folks are busy with Epic and the money goes to Epic.
May have been better to just do nothing at all than to provide a poor quality product.
Maybe it will improve, but not so sure.

 

[weather_lady]

To be consistent, that's true of Disney as well. You have to get on a boat, a gondola, a bus, a monorail, or POV to at least two of the parks, regardless of where you stay.

Some Uni folks may split stay at Royal Pacific/Helios and just plan their park days around that. I'm bound and determined that our first visit will include a stay at Helios. The price point will determine whether it is for one, two, or three nights. I love the idea of walking right into the new park from the hotel. All four lands have interest for my family and I, but I am personally most excited about Universal Monsters (I know they are calling it Dark Universe).

Now Universal is introducing a new major Park (the first since 2000's IoA) in Orlando. And it was announced YEARS ago. And Disney's plan to compete was: a Tiana retheme of Splash Mountain and some Blue Sky presentations at D23?!? I love Disney, but I think 2025 and 2026 are going to be VERY hard years for them wrt shareholders. Disney is still Disney, but the trendlines are all going to go some bad directions, and with how long it takes them to introduce and build new attractions, Universal is going to get a few YEARS to eat away at market share. As someone who loves Disney, that THRILLS me. Competition breeds innovation and value.

Totally agree with all of this.

...and we've already booked a stay at Royal Pacific for a week in August 2025, with a plan to shorten it into a split stay with Helios Grand (if we can afford it -- if not, at least we're already locked into a good SMSM rate at RPR) once it becomes bookable.

We even went ahead and bought 2-park seasonal annual passes for that trip (while the 15-month promotion was still active). Best case scenario, we'll eventually be able to price bridge and add Epic Universe as part of a [hypothetical] 3-park seasonal annual pass. And if we can't price bridge and just have to pay the difference to upgrade to a 3-park pass (or if Epic Universe will be a standalone ticket we have to purchase separately in any case), we'll be in the same position we'd have been otherwise.

As for Disney? We were there last August, had a nice time but absolutely hated everything about G+ and its effects (both on days we had it, and on days we didn't), and for the first time ever, have no plans or inclination to return. Also, I know that people's feelings about IPs and attraction announcements are entirely subjective, depending on their taste, but my family's reaction to every Disney announcement over the past couple years ("Educational Moana Walkthrough!" "Splash Mountain rethemed to... a Produce Co-op with Childish Mural!" "Country Bears Now Singing Disney Songs!" "More Event Space in EPCOT!") has been "meh" or "why on earth!??!", while our reactions to everything we've heard about Epic Universe have been "What a cool concept!" and "I can't wait to see that!" Disney isn't used to having to step up its game, but it's long overdue.

 

[Lashed34]

Totally agree with all of this.

...and we've already booked a stay at Royal Pacific for a week in August 2025, with a plan to shorten it into a split stay with Helios Grand (if we can afford it -- if not, at least we're already locked into a good SMSM rate at RPR) once it becomes bookable.

We even went ahead and bought 2-park seasonal annual passes for that trip (while the 15-month promotion was still active). Best case scenario, we'll eventually be able to price bridge and add Epic Universe as part of a [hypothetical] 3-park seasonal annual pass. And if we can't price bridge and just have to pay the difference to upgrade to a 3-park pass (or if Epic Universe will be a standalone ticket we have to purchase separately in any case), we'll be in the same position we'd have been otherwise.

As for Disney? We were there last August, had a nice time but absolutely hated everything about G+ and its effects (both on days we had it, and on days we didn't), and for the first time ever, have no plans or inclination to return. Also, I know that people's feelings about IPs and attraction announcements are entirely subjective, depending on their taste, but my family's reaction to every Disney announcement over the past couple years ("Educational Moana Walkthrough!" "Splash Mountain rethemed to... a Produce Co-op with Childish Mural!" "Country Bears Now Singing Disney Songs!" "More Event Space in EPCOT!") has been "meh" or "why on earth!??!", while our reactions to everything we've heard about Epic Universe have been "What a cool concept!" and "I can't wait to see that!" Disney isn't used to having to step up its game, but it's long overdue.

We will never return to Disney until Genie+ is completely scrapped and genuine benefits of staying at an on site hotel are resumed.

I hear arguments about the cost of Universal Express pass, but the benefits of staying at a premier hotel with Unlimited Express, plus early admission is a massive plus for us - it's win win and saves so much time and money. We have booked 15 nights at RP, flights from UK and 2 week 3 park admission for £7500 - we wouldn't get that staying at an All Stars resort at Disney, without any further benefits other than 30 minute early entry.

Of course Universal get some things wrong - no theme park is perfect, but Universal seems absolutely determined to give people value for money, whereas Disney seems intent of taking as much money as possible from you and give you back the least it possibly can.

I want to experience as many attractions as possible, in order to do that with Disney is almost an impossibility now, even if you have bottomless pockets.

 

[Smugpugmug]

I'd agree.

I feel Universal is also making some bad choice as well though.
Later opening for things for example.
It feels like there were budget cuts at HHN this year - and that is just a cash cow.

The mess at The Cursed Coconut club for Mardi Gras really annoys me.
They are charging 18-20 for a drink + tip, and they are skimping from everything I have seen.
The event drinks don't even seem all that good. I was looking forward to it, but not so much now.
If you did this right, and let the folks on the ground, dealing with the customers every day plan the drinks, it would be so much better.

The decor looks like a bunch of random junk, one of the chairs broke on opening night, I guess it was a prop and not a proper chair. The menu is just a piece of paper and not the highly detailed and well designed thing they had at HHN.

I get that they are spread too thin and lots of folks are busy with Epic and the money goes to Epic.
May have been better to just do nothing at all than to provide a poor quality product.
Maybe it will improve, but not so sure.

Adding on that similar to Disney, some rides at Universal need some massive TLC. I assume the budget isn't there for that at the moment since they're focusing on Epic but at some point it needs to be done. River Adventure is hanging on by a thread and a dream.

 

[thanxfornoticin]

We will never return to Disney until Genie+ is completely scrapped and genuine benefits of staying at an on site hotel are resumed.

I hear arguments about the cost of Universal Express pass, but the benefits of staying at a premier hotel with Unlimited Express, plus early admission is a massive plus for us - it's win win and saves so much time and money. We have booked 15 nights at RP, flights from UK and 2 week 3 park admission for £7500 - we wouldn't get that staying at an All Stars resort at Disney, without any further benefits other than 30 minute early entry.

Of course Universal get some things wrong - no theme park is perfect, but Universal seems absolutely determined to give people value for money, whereas Disney seems intent of taking as much money as possible from you and give you back the least it possibly can.

I want to experience as many attractions as possible, in order to do that with Disney is almost an impossibility now, even if you have bottomless pockets.

I respect what you're saying and hope you have a wonderful trip. But 15 nights at Universal Orlando would end up boring me beyond words and running out of stuff to do there. When EU opens next year, perhaps it becomes a 4-5 night stay for us. Right now it's 2-3 nights max to do most everything - just our opinion, not for all. Again, I hope you have a safe and fun trip.....

 

[Jrb1979]

I respect what you're saying and hope you have a wonderful trip. But 15 nights at Universal Orlando would end up boring me beyond words and running out of stuff to do there. When EU opens next year, perhaps it becomes a 4-5 night stay for us. Right now it's 2-3 nights max to do most everything - just our opinion, not for all. Again, I hope you have a safe and fun trip.....

We could easily do 7 days at Universal. Spend days at the resort and riding things multiple times. Last time I did the Mummy 15 times over the week.

 

[tony67]

I respect what you're saying and hope you have a wonderful trip. But 15 nights at Universal Orlando would end up boring me beyond words and running out of stuff to do there. When EU opens next year, perhaps it becomes a 4-5 night stay for us. Right now it's 2-3 nights max to do most everything - just our opinion, not for all. Again, I hope you have a safe and fun trip.....

I do 10-15 nights about twice a year at Universal. Tend to skip Disney most years. I am not even a HP fan.
I do plan it around HHN and Mardi Gras as those events add to it.

I enjoy the weather, walking around, people watching, drinking etc... better hotels for far less and a reasonably priced AP.

Price of food and drink has made it a bit more difficult though, but compared to Disney....

 

[Minnie1222]

This is quickly turning into another Genie+ and Disney dissatisfaction thread.

Back to Epic Universe, go enjoy and let Disney burn or thrive in your absence. It shouldn't matter to you.

Anyway, I'm happy to see the concept for Starfall Racers although I'd be too rickety to ride it. It reminds me of Dueling Dragons, one of my favorite rides when I was young. The carousel looks amazing and I hope it doesn't move too fast. Can't wait to eat at the Aquarium restaurant.

 

[New Mouse]

Off-topic, but I don't think Disney's problem is that attendance is too high: not when they're still routinely running major attractions at half-capacity, and half-staffed, with shorter hours of operation than in pre-COVID years, even during times of year that are more crowded than normal.

The problem is that Disney has decided that making guests wait longer for everything is acceptable, because it is so profitable (as a driver of G+ sales, and a way to keep operating costs down), regardless of whether the longer waits, and/or the inadequacy of the skip-the-line system (which I completely agree needs to be revamped, or better yet, scrapped entirely), lower guest satisfaction.

This is spot on. Disney has come up with a paid solution so there is no benefit to them speeding up the lines.

It generates revenue on purchase and saves budget by letting you cut staffing. Win-win.

 

[Jessem1133]

I respect what you're saying and hope you have a wonderful trip. But 15 nights at Universal Orlando would end up boring me beyond words and running out of stuff to do there. When EU opens next year, perhaps it becomes a 4-5 night stay for us. Right now it's 2-3 nights max to do most everything - just our opinion, not for all. Again, I hope you have a safe and fun trip.....

We just got back from a week stay at RP, which we do three times a year. We hit the parks first thing in the morning, pool all day, then maybe a quick ride after dinner. We never get bored!

 

[tony67]

Back to Epic Universe, go enjoy and let Disney burn or thrive in your absence. It shouldn't matter to you.

Agree, but I think most of us would like to see Disney be successful so we could return. Most of us don't hate Disney, we hate what it has become.

Anyway - I am also looking forward to that coaster myself and well as the Aquarium restaurant and Nintendo.

I am somewhat mixed on the monsters, re-imagining is usually not a good thing.

 

[Lashed34]

I respect what you're saying and hope you have a wonderful trip. But 15 nights at Universal Orlando would end up boring me beyond words and running out of stuff to do there. When EU opens next year, perhaps it becomes a 4-5 night stay for us. Right now it's 2-3 nights max to do most everything - just our opinion, not for all. Again, I hope you have a safe and fun trip.....

Thank you. 15 nights gives us unlimited entry to the parks, plus gives us time by the pool, Citywalk, the other hotel bars and restaurants, visiting a couple of malls, and we can also venture off into I-Drive and visit Sea World, so the time goes very quickly.

Personally I adore waking myself up by riding Hulk....though this time around it may well be Velocicoaster.

The added Express Unlimited also gives us the time to queue for Hargrids without seriously denting our time.

I appreciate 2 weeks would be too long for many people, but we just relish all the time there in Florida.

I would absolutely return to Disney if Genie+ was scrapped, I love the parks at WDW, especially EPCOT, but there is no value there for us at present.

 

[saskdw]

This is quickly turning into another Genie+ and Disney dissatisfaction thread.

Back to Epic Universe, go enjoy and let Disney burn or thrive in your absence. It shouldn't matter to you.

Anyway, I'm happy to see the concept for Starfall Racers although I'd be too rickety to ride it. It reminds me of Dueling Dragons, one of my favorite rides when I was young. The carousel looks amazing and I hope it doesn't move too fast. Can't wait to eat at the Aquarium restaurant.

It's because there was a couple of Disney cheerleaders saying Epic would have zero effect on WDW's business and then the conversation went sideways from there.

 

[Chuck96]

For myself and my family, EU will make the Universal experience a multi-day component of future trips. It had previously been a one (looong) day experience we enjoyed during a multi-day vacation at WDW (driving over from our Disney resort), but now I believe we'll end up splitting the time (both parks and resorts). It's that simple.

 

[Kit Jackson]

Disney isn't used to having to step up its game, but it's long overdue.

From my perspective, Disney did this but it was a real swing and a miss. From Disney's perspective, Galaxy's Edge was supposed to compete with the immersive Harry Potter themed sections at Universal Orlando, but the new Star Wars land didn't quite work for me or other fans.

I'm excited for Epic Universe. I'll probably go a few years after it's opened when the crowds have calmed down a little and any opening day/early days glitches or issues have been worked out.

 

[Minnie1222]

I had the opportunity to see Nintendo World in CA last year. So cute. Even the food is adorable. I read that it's going to be bigger and have more rides in Orlando. Very excited.

 

[Suger Mag]

Excited to visit Epic. I always find these threads funny, It is always so much an US or THEM, like you have to choose one or the other and cannot enjoy aspects of both.

Oh for sure! This is also my least favorite aspect of Disney and part of the reason I prefer Universal. I really value walkability. I went to Disneyland beginning of January and was amazed at how much less stressful it is to do Disney when you don't have to wait an hour and a half to get on a boat to go home after Magic Kingdom closes.


I really think Universal is going to clobber Disney with the opening of Epic Universe, and this has been building for a long time, ever since they opened Hagrid's and Velocicoaster.

Orlando is a bit city and strong theme parks will benefit everyone. Sadly I am starting to show my age and super thrill coasters are starting to not be compatible with my aging joints (looking at you Hulk who threw out my back for several days). I am excired to see what they do with Epic, although the IPs at EPic are not that much of a personal interest to me, I am not a Mario gamer fan... I did not see How to Train your Dragon, and while Harry Potter is my fav of them, It is not my super jam like it is for others.

We could easily do 7 days at Universal. Spend days at the resort and riding things multiple times. Last time I did the Mummy 15 times over the week.

(Edited as I had the wrong ride) I always say how about a resort day... and then get impatient and look for something else. Same thing with sitting on a beach. When the kids were younger they would do a lot of pool time and then hotel days were more fun, now they are young adults and a different beastie. Overall my biggest complaint about rides are the screen 3d rides. This oldie just cannot focus and wear the glasses on top of my actual bifocal glasses. Same with Remy at WDW. I enjoy going for a day, but so far have not been woo'ed in for more than a single day visit. We had a good time last time using express pass. Now planning at least two days at Uni for HHN this October so see if I become a convert.

This is quickly turning into another Genie+ and Disney dissatisfaction thread.

Back to Epic Universe, go enjoy and let Disney burn or thrive in your absence. It shouldn't matter to you.

Anyway, I'm happy to see the concept for Starfall Racers although I'd be too rickety to ride it. It reminds me of Dueling Dragons, one of my favorite rides when I was young. The carousel looks amazing and I hope it doesn't move too fast. Can't wait to eat at the Aquarium restaurant.

It's because there was a couple of Disney cheerleaders saying Epic would have zero effect on WDW's business and then the conversation went sideways from there.

well also because Universal does not have its own discussion board for whatever reason (convenience?) there is not enough demand to drive a Universal discussion board all on its own, it is always a piggy back on a Disney fan boards. Disney Cheerleaders on a a Disney Fan board should kinda be expected...

I will say, I am most excited for the DOnkey Kong coaster, the skip the track thing looks way fun.