Tipping for bad service

[jenelope]

I have very rarely received service that I considered poor. Only one was poor enough to remember and, ironically, it was at Disney. That was also the experience that taught me to speak up if I have concerns. There's no use dwelling on something I could change by asking. I usually get great service, so my standard is 20%. Average or "not great" service is usually around 18%. Poor service merits a talk with whoever's in charge to express my concerns and find out if there's some circumstance I can't see, and then some additional thinking about the tip.

I don't consider slow service alone to be a reason for a lower tip. If the kitchen staff is shorthanded, or a busful of senior citizens unexpectedly stops by the Big Boy and the restaurant is unprepared for that, it's hardly something the waitstaff can control. Yes, it would be nice to have them stop by and explain, but if they took the time to do that with every table, that's a whole bunch of minutes better spent delivering orders. So if service is slow, but otherwise good, I'll tip the usual amount. In fact, I may even tip more if the restaurant is busy, or I'm part of a large group. After all, more tables doesn't decrease their workload per table at all, and big groups usually come with big demands.

 

[diskid@heart]

According to Emily Post Etiquette, tipping in an ordinary family-style restaurant 15% BEFORE TAX is the norm and is according to merit.

To quote from Emily Post Etiquette: "If everyone continues to tip at the same rate, regardless of the effort made to please, there is no incentive to make any extra effort at all."

I was doing our Disney budgeting just last night - and figuring tips into our dining expenses. My husband asked why? And said "unless he gets good service he isn't tipping." Now don't think of him as a scrooge, both of us have worked in the food industry and relied on tips. Today- it seems that servers think it is your duty to give them a tip when actually the meaning of tips is : To Insure Prompt Service. If that is not met it should be your decision on how much of a tip the server should receive. With respect to the fact that most servers are dependant on this "reward" for good service as an addition to their salaries. So, my suggestion is if you have bad service tip accordingly.

 

[C.Ann]

I was doing our Disney budgeting just last night - and figuring tips into our dining expenses. My husband asked why? And said "unless he gets good service he isn't tipping." Now don't think of him as a scrooge, both of us have worked in the food industry and relied on tips. Today- it seems that servers think it is your duty to give them a tip when actually the meaning of tips is : To Insure Prompt Service. If that is not met it should be your decision on how much of a tip the server should receive. With respect to the fact that most servers are dependant on this "reward" for good service as an addition to their salaries. So, my suggestion is if you have bad service tip accordingly.

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Sounds perfectly logical to me.. My expectations are very low and if someone can't meet them, they definitely need to be in another line of work as I'm not going to tip them "just because".. That's ridiculous.. Good service = good tip.. Great service = great tip.. Lousy service = lousy tip.. Lousy service AND lousy attitude = NO tip..

 

[Lewisc]

Of course you should be budgeting 15% for tips. If you're not then you're either planning on stiffing the waiters or are planning on eating in restaurants that you already know offer horrible service. No one should be tipping for horrible service but I question the motives of someone who decides in advance not to budget enough money for tips.

I'd expect there'd be more occasions to tip more than 15% than less.

I was doing our Disney budgeting just last night - and figuring tips into our dining expenses. My husband asked why? And said "unless he gets good service he isn't tipping." Now don't think of him as a scrooge, both of us have worked in the food industry and relied on tips.

 

[diskid@heart]

Guess I should have been more clear on exactly where we are planning on eating - more counter service and buffets. Buffet wait staff should receive approx 10% of bill. And we normally do tip between 15-20%, even more if warranted. He just didn't understand why we would be tipping at a counter service. Sorry, but unless someone is actually bringing my food or giving refills, taking used plates - I'm not going to tip. And busboys in cafeteria settings are not to be tipped unless he/she carries your tray to your table.

 

[zurgswife]

I waited tables for many many years....and while I'm sure a few of the low tips might have been for poor performance everybody has different expectations....I'm pretty positive that most low tips were just cheap patrons. I would prefer to have someone speak up to a manager and let them know that there was a problem. Then try to send me a message with a small tip.

I rarely got complaints and usually got rave reviews...but just like a lot of servers I recieved a poor tip every now and again. I chalked it up to poor social habits of the patron.

If you recieve subpar performance get a manager!!!!!!


I'm usually a very good tipper....but if you do something that I feel is not up to par I have no problem speaking up...

 

[C.Ann]

I waited tables for many many years....and while I'm sure a few of the low tips might have been for poor performance everybody has different expectations....I'm pretty positive that most low tips were just cheap patrons. I would prefer to have someone speak up to a manager and let them know that there was a problem. Then try to send me a message with a small tip.

I rarely got complaints and usually got rave reviews...but just like a lot of servers I recieved a poor tip every now and again. I chalked it up to poor social habits of the patron.

If you recieve subpar performance get a manager!!!!!!


I'm usually a very good tipper....but if you do something that I feel is not up to par I have no problem speaking up...

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Certainly you're not saying that if you receive poor service from the server they should still get a nice tip just because you have also voiced your concerns to the manager - right? Speaking to the manager does nothing more than put him or her on notice that they have an employee who is delivering substandard service..

 

[zurgswife]

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Certainly you're not saying that if you receive poor service from the server they should still get a nice tip just because you have also voiced your concerns to the manager - right? Speaking to the manager does nothing more than put him or her on notice that they have an employee who is delivering substandard service..

No you missunderstood my post. I'm saying that just leaving a poor tip really doesn't let the server know that there was a problem. You need to speak up so the server and the manager is aware of why you are not tipping or tipping below the norm. Usually I will speak up and leave a lesser tip...as I feel just because a server is poor it shouldn't cost them money to wait on me which is the case if you leave no tip at all. If you leave less then 8% (which when I was a server was the percentage you must claim of your sales as tipped income) then it is costing that server money out of there pocket to wait on you....And poor service or not I don't think that is right.

 

[C.Ann]

No you missunderstood my post. I'm saying that just leaving a poor tip really doesn't let the server know that there was a problem. You need to speak up so the server and the manager is aware of why you are not tipping or tipping below the norm. Usually I will speak up and leave a lesser tip...as I feel just because a server is poor it shouldn't cost them money to wait on me which is the case if you leave no tip at all. If you leave less then 8% (which when I was a server was the percentage you must claim of your sales as tipped income) then it is costing that server money out of there pocket to wait on you....And poor service or not I don't think that is right.

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Got it! However, I have to disagree with your last statement.. If the service is lousy and the attitude is lousy, the server doesn't deserve any tip whatsoever.. I've only had to do that once in my life - but if I had my way, she would have been fired as well..

 

[LoveWDW]

The worst service we ever received was about 15 minutes from home. It took a while before our order was taken. It took a long time for the food to arrive. My baked potato was rotten in the middle, our server was nowhere to be found. My steak was rare- I'd ordered well-done. We finally flagged down another server and asked her to locate ours. She appeared and took my plate back to the kitchen. Meanwhile I told my husband to go ahead and eat. My meal didn't come. Didn't come. I asked another waitress to find our server or bring my food. The server finally appeared with my food. Our coffee and water was never refilled. We had to find another server to find our server so we could get the bill. We left about 10%. Now I know that I should have requested the manager the first time we couldn't find the server. What we did was never go back to that restaurant.

 

[Maleficents_Revenge]

Here is my opinion. It is important to realize what part of the restaurant has given you bad service. If you order a steak medium rare and it comes out well done, that should not be held against the server. If the food is cold when it is brought to the table, that is a server issue.

From working in the food industry I have noticed little things and I remember them. Those folks that wait on tables make about half of minimum wage and rely on tips to pay bills, car payments or anyhting else they may need or want.

Try to remember the next time you receive bad service to stop and think about what is wrong and then decide if it was a server issue or a cook issue etc.

 

[jann1033]

cheap patrons. I would prefer to have someone speak up to a manager and let them know that there was a problem.

my husband always does this if the meal or service is either exceptionally bad or good....90%of the time the reaction by the management is HUHHHHH??????? as an example....( probably our worst ever experience, not at wdw)once we waited 30 mins to get our order taken( should have just left but we were idiots) another hr for our food,1order ( of 3)was the wrong meal but we never did see the waitress again so we ate it, ( she was still there and had 2, count em 2 other tables, she was not new)someone else finally gave us a bill after another long wait. we had a coupon which the manager/owner would not accept as she said it wasn't good "that day", not being psychic we didn't know , this even after we had told her about the the problems we had, the coupon was like 50% off 1 meal ( would be like $7 off of a $50+bill) and would have at least covered part of the wrong meal...but hey, no dice. we left no tip ( only time i can think of we did this) and told the manager/owner we would not be back. she couldn't have cared less.

 

[C.Ann]

Try to remember the next time you receive bad service to stop and think about what is wrong and then decide if it was a server issue or a cook issue etc.

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Very good advice.. I would never penalize a server for a problem that was created by the cook - and some of those cooks can be pretty darn nasty!!

 

[zurgswife]

cheap patrons. I would prefer to have someone speak up to a manager and let them know that there was a problem.

my husband always does this if the meal or service is either exceptionally bad or good....90%of the time the reaction by the management is HUHHHHH??????? as an example....( probably our worst ever experience, not at wdw)once we waited 30 mins to get our order taken( should have just left but we were idiots) another hr for our food,1order ( of 3)was the wrong meal but we never did see the waitress again so we ate it, ( she was still there and had 2, count em 2 other tables, she was not new)someone else finally gave us a bill after another long wait. we had a coupon which the manager/owner would not accept as she said it wasn't good "that day", not being psychic we didn't know , this even after we had told her about the the problems we had, the coupon was like 50% off 1 meal ( would be like $7 off of a $50+bill) and would have at least covered part of the wrong meal...but hey, no dice. we left no tip ( only time i can think of we did this) and told the manager/owner we would not be back. she couldn't have cared less.

I think this is the exception...most managers are most eager to hear about issues with meals or service. If they don't care then I definatley won't go back..

 

[wellesleyprincess]

According to several servers with whom I've been acquainted, leaving two or three cents tells the server that his/her efforts were severely lacking. It also assures them that you didn't simply forget to leave a tip.

That's what my best friend who is a waitress told me too. She says b/c some people just don't tip, if no tip is let a server may not always catch the drift but if some leaves say $.05 on a $50 check then they no they are not doing something right.

If you did get your food (albeit slowly), did get refills (though with a few urgings), and had basic needs filled (however slowly), then those are actions for which you didn't have to get up out of your seat to do.

I have been in restaurants where the service has been so bad that I've had to go refill my own drink. After such instances I definitely talk to management, but sometimes the management at such restaurants is as bad and rude as the waitstaff.

 

[dizfanz]

Out of curiosity, what do many of you think would be a fair flat hourly wage for a server to make for them to do the job? I am a bartender/server and I bet my hourly equivalent would floor some of the posters here. Keep in mind, the tipping system is good. Sure it keeps food prices down. But to be honest, serving can be a very frustrating/thankless job some nights. I work for that tip. I have to provide good service to put food on the table. If I was paid a higher hourly wage and did not work for tips, what would be my incentive to provide excellent service versus just good service.

 

[SDRocKGirL]

Out of curiosity, what do many of you think would be a fair flat hourly wage for a server to make for them to do the job? I am a bartender/server and I bet my hourly equivalent would floor some of the posters here. Keep in mind, the tipping system is good. Sure it keeps food prices down. But to be honest, serving can be a very frustrating/thankless job some nights. I work for that tip. I have to provide good service to put food on the table. If I was paid a higher hourly wage and did not work for tips, what would be my incentive to provide excellent service versus just good service.

That is a REALLY good point!

The thing is, I've been seeing a lot of posts mainly focusing on service, and if anyone read my previous spiel, I talked about good service vs. bad service. I hope I don't ramble again... But, honestly, I think providing superb service always ties in hand in hand on how diners treat their servers as well.

For example, I have had a lot experience with various different types of guests. You'll have PATIENT guests who understand that the restaurant industry is stressful, won't demand much, will leave a good tip OR you'll have the tables who will demand for everything, right then and there, or who get upset at menial little things, and in the end still leave a poor tip after you wait on them hand and foot. These are both far extremes but I feel that the second example is the main reason why bad service even occurs in the first place, because the server will be held up at that table and other tables are directly affected. In this sense, that doesn't mean that the server is giving BAD service, it means that someone else could be [selfishly] taking up his/her time. My main pet peeve is when I see tables who think that they're the only table the server is responsible for.

From my previous post, I talked about good service is important, but then I forgot to mention is that I found the majority of the time, the way the diners treat the server initially is the way the whole meal might go.

Am I making any sense at all? I hope everyone understands I'm on both sides of the boat, that I'm not solely trying to defend all servers and vice versa. Cuz I like to dine out too!

Oh and may I add, Pleases and Thank yous are greatly appreciated when dining out... I feel that people don't do it as often as before.

 

[mlwear]

Out of curiosity, what do many of you think would be a fair flat hourly wage for a server to make for them to do the job? I am a bartender/server and I bet my hourly equivalent would floor some of the posters here. Keep in mind, the tipping system is good. Sure it keeps food prices down. But to be honest, serving can be a very frustrating/thankless job some nights. I work for that tip. I have to provide good service to put food on the table. If I was paid a higher hourly wage and did not work for tips, what would be my incentive to provide excellent service versus just good service.

I prefer tipping, but since you asked..
I think your incentive should be to keep your job and receive raises, bonuses and the like. Same as most other jobs.
As far as a fair flat hourly wage it would depend, IMO, on the establishment and the quality of service demanded. An upscale establishment would pay more to keep their excellent servers. Vice versa. Also would depend on location's cost of living.
I agree it is a very difficult job. I have never been a server/bartender/whatever but my sister waited tables and was a bartender. I saw how hard it was for her. Since that time I have become a much more generous tipper (I always tip the bartender well .
There is a local better restaurant in our area that treats its servers well from what I hear. They have a pile of applications and never have trouble finding employees. They ensure that no one earns less than $40K/year and provide benefits. They do require extensive training, demand a very high level of service and they only hire full time employees. I love to go there. (Of course, it is pretty pricey and only for special occassions.) EXCELLENT service, every time. I realize this is not typical.
So, I don't know what that works out to per hour, but for a place that demands a server be truly exceptionally excellent and charges a lot for meals, I like the $40K/year (average cost of living here). However, that is a bit higher than a starting teacher's salary--also often a frustrating and thankless job (but not always).

 

[roger_ramjet]

This whole tipping thing gets very confusing. I think I'll stick to 15% and hope that nothing bad happens next time we go out to eat! (I'm in the same boat as you, monty, except now I'm living here!)

 

[Hodder]

I am always super nice to waiters/tresses since they do have my food and I don't want any surprises in it or on it.

LOL I am the same way. I wait untill the end of the meal and then complain to the manager, or if my meal itself was really bad and not the service I tip the waiter/ress and complain to the manager.