Time to bring back fast passes!!!

[FCDub]

True but it's a big change from what Walt was aiming to create- a place for whole families to have fun together. I guess I'm crazy though for missing that aspect but I won't ever change my world perspective to everyone one should make all the money they can and forget about kindness for others.

Disneyland was NEVER egalitarian. Want better rides? Buy more ticket books. It’s been capitalistic since day one. Too much rose-colored revisionist history about “Walt’s vision.”

 

[JakeAZ]

Disneyland was NEVER egalitarian. Want better rides? Buy more ticket books. It’s been capitalistic since day one. Too much rose-colored revisionist history about “Walt’s vision.”

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't creating Club 33 one of the last things Walt did?

 

[TLSnell1981]

We did DW last August for the first time with No FP's. We were thinking it would be a big problem. It wasn't. Avg wait times were shorter across the board. Significantly. So we still rode all we wanted to and waited less time that day. I think each day we had hours at the end where we could go back and ride again things we loved.

They will come back, but it's not a bother to us that they are gone for now.

We were there a month later and the wait times were long we ga e up the last day because so many were over an hour wait.

 

[Upatnoon]

Disney could eliminate lines and teach economics at the same time.

Guests would be randomly issued a few fastpasses for attractions. Guest would then be allowed to buy and sell them like stocks via their phones or special kiosks.

For example, say you have a fastpass to go on Seven Dwarfs Mine Train. Another guest really wants to go and offers $20 for it. You agree to sell and then use the profits for a $5 Buzz ride.

All of this could be handled via the Disney app, with Disney collecting a slight commission.

This would increase efficiency as it is unlikely people would buy fastpasses they won't use. People would never have to wait if they paid --- and instead of Disney collecting all the profits, guests would be able to defray some of their ticket costs.

People who ride a lot of attractions would pay more than people who just ride a few times. More people would head to the second-tier attractions as a value play.

This is similar to what they are doing with toll roads, as the rich can ride the Mine Train all day while the rest of us relax in the Hall of Presidents.

 

[Heather07438]

Disney could eliminate lines and teach economics at the same time.

Guests would be randomly issued a few fastpasses for attractions. Guest would then be allowed to buy and sell them like stocks via their phones or special kiosks.

For example, say you have a fastpass to go on Seven Dwarfs Mine Train. Another guest really wants to go and offers $20 for it. You agree to sell and then use the profits for a $5 Buzz ride.

All of this could be handled via the Disney app, with Disney collecting a slight commission.

This would increase efficiency as it is unlikely people would buy fastpasses they won't use. People would never have to wait if they paid --- and instead of Disney collecting all the profits, guests would be able to defray some of their ticket costs.

People who ride a lot of attractions would pay more than people who just ride a few times. More people would head to the second-tier attractions as a value play.

This is similar to what they are doing with toll roads, as the rich can ride the Mine Train all day while the rest of us relax in the Hall of Presidents.

Sounds fun but I don't see that getting rid of lines, unless enough guests are so enthralled standing in a corner of MK all day to play Lottery FP Stock Market instead of each trying to hit 10+ rides

Remember when ebay resellers bought up all the 60th Anni Cinderella Carriage popcorn buckets? Or Splash Mtn stuff?

Could you imagine the field day they'd have playing Lottery FP Stock Market

 

[bloomcruisers]

Sounds fun but I don't see that getting rid of lines, unless enough guests are so enthralled standing in a corner of MK all day to play Lottery FP Stock Market instead of each trying to hit 10+ rides

Remember when ebay resellers bought up all the 60th Anni Cinderella Carriage popcorn buckets? Or Splash Mtn stuff?
View attachment 560318View attachment 560314
Could you imagine the field day they'd have playing Lottery FP Stock Market

Do they actually allow people to buy all the available stock of a limited production product with no limits? That's a terrible business decision.

 

[Upatnoon]

Sounds fun but I don't see that getting rid of lines, unless enough guests are so enthralled standing in a corner of MK all day to play Lottery FP Stock Market instead of each trying to hit 10+ rides

Remember when ebay resellers bought up all the 60th Anni Cinderella Carriage popcorn buckets? Or Splash Mtn stuff?
View attachment 560318View attachment 560314
Could you imagine the field day they'd have playing Lottery FP Stock Market

A thunderstorm is rolling in and Tiki room is up to $40, sell, sell, sell!

 

[Pats Dragon]

Everybody has their own perspective about what is good or not. Our family prefers no more than 15 or 20 minute lines. In November that was only the case when the park first opened. We do not see an hour as great and normal. For those who sleep in and arrive late that may be the norm. For us frequent visitors we preferred the old "get there at park opening" and use fast passes and rides that never have lines. As I said in my post, there are no rides without lines. Thanksgiving, we rode one ride and then the lines were too long for us but you who think an hour is good you would have been at home. The problem is 35% with fewer open rides and shops and food places and character greets means packed lines. It is a different experience and not what we will want to repeat.

 

[slpybeartx]

Take the cartoons off the walls and put any of those "value" hotels outside of a Disney property and they would be $50-75 / night properties. Take the Grand Floridian and put it in on Maui, if it charged the same prices as say the Four Seasons or Grand Wailea, it would sit empty.

#Truth.

 

[nickg420]

I don't know why everyone is saying hour-long lines. I have been back several times since opening and 2 days I was there in Dec parks were at capacity. Not once did I stand in any line longer than 45 minutes and that was due to hitting a cleaning cycle.

My kids are 9 and 12 so yes it's likely easier for them, but my 9-year-old has some issues that make it very hard for him to do "nothing" for 45 minutes while waiting to get on a ride. Thank god for Power Banks and Apple products.

If you are judging the wait times by what is posted or in the app you can likely shave about 20min off that time. So if it says 60 minutes it is likely a max of 40 and most likely 30 tops. This has been not only my experience but also the experience of most of my Disney friends.

We will be back next Friday for an extended weekend I'll be happy to report actual wait times during my visit.

 

[JLTraveling]

I'm wondering where the whole idea that kids can't stand in lines comes from (special needs excluded). I don't have kids, but have things changed that much since I was in school? I remember lining up to go to lunch, recess, the book fair, etc. etc. Out of anyone, any age, I would think kids would be the line pros. And WDW opened in 1971. Legacy FP didn't start until 1999. Kids stood in line. So did adults. We all survived.

I get that a lot of people prefer not to stand in line, especially if you only started going in the FP era. But I miss the pre-FP days. Even when we used to only go one day a year on my birthday, we picked a direction and went around the park in order. No criss-crossing. Ate wherever was nearby whenever we got hungry. Lines moved continuously, and I believe there was a lot more immersion and appreciation for theming when we weren't running from Adventureland to Tomorrowland to Frontierland and back to Adventureland chasing FPs. I'd be thrilled if they never came back at all.

 

[atomik_momma]

True but it's a big change from what Walt was aiming to create- a place for whole families to have fun together. I guess I'm crazy though for missing that aspect but I won't ever change my world perspective to everyone one should make all the money they can and forget about kindness for others.

I was just rewatching the Imagineering series on Disney+ last night, and when asked what his biggest problem was Walt replied, "I'd say it's been my biggest problem all my life... it's money. It takes a lot of money to make these dreams come true." We're a family of 8 on a single income and I guarantee you it is not a six-figure salary. We still go to Disney and have always stayed on property. We just save up and look for every discount possible. If the costs go up or there are things we want to add on that cost extra like park hopper tickets, we save up for longer and go longer between visits. Disney isn't a charity, it's a business. It has always been a business and in order to stay in business they have to make money.

 

[nickg420]

I'm wondering where the whole idea that kids can't stand in lines comes from (special needs excluded). I don't have kids, but have things changed that much since I was in school? I remember lining up to go to lunch, recess, the book fair, etc. etc. Out of anyone, any age, I would think kids would be the line pros. And WDW opened in 1971. Legacy FP didn't start until 1999. Kids stood in line. So did adults. We all survived.

I get that a lot of people prefer not to stand in line, especially if you only started going in the FP era. But I miss the pre-FP days. Even when we used to only go one day a year on my birthday, we picked a direction and went around the park in order. No criss-crossing. Ate wherever was nearby whenever we got hungry. Lines moved continuously, and I believe there was a lot more immersion and appreciation for theming when we weren't running from Adventureland to Tomorrowland to Frontierland and back to Adventureland chasing FPs. I'd be thrilled if they never came back at all.

TBH, some of it is the parent's fault and some of it is just a generation that has grown up with many things that provide instant gratification. Want to watch a certain show? No you don't have to wait until it comes on at a specific time, just stream it now...Oh and you can watch the entire season/series at once...Need to know a certain fact just ask Alexa, Google, or Siri...Want to listen to that new record or song? You don't even have to "steal" it on Napster...Just open Spotify, Apple Music etc....Not to mention you can learn ANYTHING from the internet if you spend enough time and find the right resources.

So it's no surprise that kids are not keen to stand around and wait for anything.

That said, it's the responsibility of the parents to instill a bit of patience, appreciation, and the ability to stop, live in the moment, and take it all in. One thing I always point out to my kids is the number of people filming everything at Disney....I get you filming certain things your kids are participating in...Character meets, the first time they ride something etc...But filming HEA, every single parade....I always say "It's literally happening right now...Why look at it through a phone screen? So I do what I can to help curb some of that, but it's hard and frustrating in this generation.

 

[redrosesix]

Everybody has their own perspective about what is good or not. Our family prefers no more than 15 or 20 minute lines. In November that was only the case when the park first opened. We do not see an hour as great and normal. For those who sleep in and arrive late that may be the norm. For us frequent visitors we preferred the old "get there at park opening" and use fast passes and rides that never have lines. As I said in my post, there are no rides without lines. Thanksgiving, we rode one ride and then the lines were too long for us but you who think an hour is good you would have been at home. The problem is 35% with fewer open rides and shops and food places and character greets means packed lines. It is a different experience and not what we will want to repeat.

I agree with you but I think my family's problem is that our first year was 2008 and they were trying really hard to make things magical so guests would come back after the recession. We never had long wait times because we got there early and grabbed fast passes when necessary, and stayed for EMH because we always stayed onsite. But we were also were busy spending money -- back in the day when the merch wasn't the same at all parks and it changed every year so if you really liked something you just had to buy it (and have it shipped to the resort, so you could buy even more stuff).

So then the parks filled up and many rides were often down and the parks became crowded and not so much fun. Wait times for buses became ridiculous and it was really beginning to feel less magical...and then because it was crowded the prices went up. I was never a fan of FP+ because it made the stand by lines take even longer, and the FP+ line were just as long as the stand by lines used to be for us.

Ok. So we're spoiled because we experienced what it was like when they really wanted us to love Disney, and we were only 1 day into our first trip when we realized we would be coming back every year. They don't care about repeat business anymore. Families will still take one trip to Disney and pay too much and stand in lines that are too long, and go somewhere else on their next trip. But Disney will make a lot of money on those first timers so they aren't going to do anything to make people stay onsite or to come back.

 

[JakeAZ]

I remember lining up to go to lunch, recess, the book fair, etc. etc

How many of those lines were 60, 90, 120 min plus?

My kids can line up, but who doesn't get bored in long lines?

 

[JLTraveling]

How many of those lines were 60, 90, 120 min plus?

My kids can line up, but who doesn't get bored in long lines?

Sure, the school lines aren't that long. But they're still practice. And pre-FP lines certainly could be that long on busy days.

So you get bored in long lines...first, WDW has plenty of stuff to entertain you in the queues. Second, being "bored" at a theme park is kind of a first world problem, isn't it? We survived lines pre-smart phones. Surely you can manage to play phone games for an hour, can't you?

 

[JLTraveling]

Adding on...without FP, you're talking about maybe two or three lines all day that are an hour plus, for the headliners if you're unlucky with your timing. Everything else, under 30 minutes except on REALLY crowded days.

 

[Pats Dragon]

Sorry J but not our experience with the lines. Some people like to climb mountains on their vacation and sweat and ache and risk injury. Long Lines are unpleasant and I can work and have unpleasantness.

 

[mamaofsix]

Sure, the school lines aren't that long. But they're still practice. And pre-FP lines certainly could be that long on busy days.

So you get bored in long lines...first, WDW has plenty of stuff to entertain you in the queues. Second, being "bored" at a theme park is kind of a first world problem, isn't it? We survived lines pre-smart phones. Surely you can manage to play phone games for an hour, can't you?

To me, it has nothing to do with being bored. With a family of 8, I don't want to pay $800 a day to spend most of it in line. That's not a fun vacation and it's a waste of money. The kids can sit around all day and play games on a phone at home for free. I'll take my money to Universal, or we'll spend a day at the beach or a local 6 flags instead.

When I was a kid in the 80s and 90s, pre-smart phone and pre-fp, we didn't stand bored all day in lines at Disney either. My first few trips we walked onto almost every ride. Maybe the longest wait was 60 minutes when Splash first opened. Most other lines were short.

I'd say Disney better watch itself - with such a reduced experience right now, people can and will take their money elsewhere. It's not a fp problem, it's that so many of their attractions, shows and restaurants are closed when you can easily go to another theme park where everything is open and lines are minimal.

 

[2012Figment]

From what I read, this was what Disney wanted, but not what actually happened. I have read quite a bit on the history of FP, so maybe that was just one opinion, but I seem to remember it coming up quite a bit. D* invested billions in the system (FP, Magic bands etc) and it just wasn't the cash cow they had hoped for.


But your point is very valid. Where do people go if they are not in lines?

I would also argue (not with you, but in general) that social distancing is non-existent at the parks based on the pictures I've seen of holiday weekends. Sure, maybe it's somewhat there in the lines, but nowhere with crowds walking around.

Things are closed for one reason only...to save money.

Those pictures can be deceiving. I was there in January and found it very easy to stay in my own 6 foot bubble almost all the time.