Take the car seats on the plane or not?

[stephie1012]

Thanks for saying it so I didn't have too.I am so tired of people with their out of date or made up information that they try to pass on.Btw stephie1012 how many flights have you been on that people were injured during a flight....my guess is none.Odds are we will be injured or killed going to the airport then during the flight so lets worry about seatbelting the kids in the car....

well from everything i have read about it and heard it from flight attendants mouths thats what has to happen...and if there is any thing i can do to make sure my kids are as safe as they can be im going to do it. it doesnt matter if i have been on a flight where someone was injured...it has happened to others and i dont want it happening to my kids...to each their own some families do things that i will never understand, but im keeping my kids as safe as possible. And my kids are ALWAY seatbelted in the car properly and beyond what the law says. According to the FAA the regular seatbelt is good for children beyond 40lbs and its not just some number they had to put there, i cannot see the seatbelt tightning enough for a two year old to actually stay put in it.

 

[frtchr]

We take our seat - a britax marathon - for our 13 month old and while it's a pain it's worth it to us. For the airport we generaly put the seat in the stroller and one of us carries him.

For those who want to rear face your child who is not in a bucket (infant carrier) please please please read up on the FAA rules and regulations and take a copy with you. We were almost removed from a flight on Delta 2 months ago because we rear faced our 11 month old. We had a choice to forward face or get off the plane. Delta in the end agreed that we were correct and actually issued us each a credit - but it was horrible that flight with him forward facing.

How was the forward facing horrible? I'm not being snarky, just curious.

 

[jodifla]

We take our seat - a britax marathon - for our 13 month old and while it's a pain it's worth it to us. For the airport we generaly put the seat in the stroller and one of us carries him.

For those who want to rear face your child who is not in a bucket (infant carrier) please please please read up on the FAA rules and regulations and take a copy with you. We were almost removed from a flight on Delta 2 months ago because we rear faced our 11 month old. We had a choice to forward face or get off the plane. Delta in the end agreed that we were correct and actually issued us each a credit - but it was horrible that flight with him forward facing.

Oh, please! Why was it "horrible" with him being forward facing?

Frankly, I think you are really asking A LOT of the person in front of that car seat who now can't recline his seat.

On a plane, the benefits of having a child rear facing aren't the same as in a car. It's just overkill.

 

[kevschickee]

Oh, please! Why was it "horrible" with him being forward facing?

Frankly, I think you are really asking A LOT of the person in front of that car seat who now can't recline his seat.

On a plane, the benefits of having a child rear facing aren't the same as in a car. It's just overkill.

I would have been angry if I couldn't put my seat back. I can totally see rear facing in the car but on a plane not so much.

 

[Hannathy]

I would have been angry if I couldn't put my seat back. I can totally see rear facing in the car but on a plane not so much.

I agree! for those that insist on rear facing I certainly hope if there are 2 adults or another older child with you that one of you sit in front of the child and have the seat that can't recline! That is quite rude to inconvenience a total stranger for your child.

 

[Mrs.Toad]

Oh, please! Why was it "horrible" with him being forward facing?

Frankly, I think you are really asking A LOT of the person in front of that car seat who now can't recline his seat.

On a plane, the benefits of having a child rear facing aren't the same as in a car. It's just overkill.

I'm a big proponent of car seats (or CARES restraints) on planes for kids under 40 pounds, but I agree, this is overkill. Seat belts/car seats on planes protect against sudden drops due to turbulence, FF or RF isn't going to make the difference it does in a car.

That said, though, everything I've read on the subject says the regular seat belts sit too high up on the waist of the average 2-3yo, and can actually cause internal abdominal injuries in case of a sudden drop, or the child can slip out of it because it can't tighten tight enough.

I know the risk is slight, I have flown a lot and have only once experienced the kind of turbulence that sent stuff flying around the cabin, but lugging the car seat onto the plane wasn't that big of a deal for us, we always bought our kids seats and brought their car seats until they were 40 pounds. The CARES system was just coming out as dd2 approached that milestone, so we never used it. If I had a 1-2yo now, I might buy one.

OP, since you have two little ones, and two car seats to carry around, if I were you, I'd probably get a couple of CARES harnesses.

 

[waltskids]

I agree! for those that insist on rear facing I certainly hope if there are 2 adults or another older child with you that one of you sit in front of the child and have the seat that can't recline! That is quite rude to inconvenience a total stranger for your child.

I agree that it is rude to make someone else unable to recline b/c of your child. And what is the point of rear facing on a plane anyway? Back to the OP's question, we took our carseat on the plane for our DS 2.5 this trip and he did very well. DD flew as a lap child (10 weeks old). I don't think I would use the carseat anymore though. DS is very tall for his age and his legs were cramped. Eventhough he is 31 pounds and could still use the carseat on the plane, we won't be using it on our trip in October b/c he behaves well, and usually just likes to sleep. DD will also fly lap again.

 

[Bren's Mom]

You can rent carseats when you rent the car.

Renting car seats is as dengerous as purchasing a used one from a consignment shop, tag sale or craig's list. You can never be sure if the seat was in an accident nor can you be sure the seat was treated properly, has all of the appropriate parts and pieces, etc. Not a good idea to rent a car seat.

Coleen
CPST

 

[Erica09M]

http://www.cpsafety.com/articles/airplaneRF.aspx

 

[eyor44]

I always took a car seat on the plane for DD and did so up until she was five and switched to a booster. (boosters aren't allowed on planes) The only issue we had was the time DD wanted to sit in the middle. The flight attendant watched me install the seat, put DD in it and then sat down myself by the window. After we were settled, she came over and said DD wasn't allowed in the middle as if there was an emergency I wouldn't be able to get out. I assured her that in the event of an emergency I would very easily be able to get up and over the car seat. (I was small at the time and a great climber)

 

[SlightlyocdDisneyfan]

We have flown often with kids both in car seats and without car seats. Even with newborn twins and a toddler we piled our stroller high with three car seats and slowly made our way to the gate. Yes, we looked a bit like a circus routine, but it works for us.

For us, if the flight is long (over 1.5 hours) or timed when we expect our kids to sleep, the car seat is perfect. Our kids are content, relaxed, and we parents have an easy flight. For shorter trips, we don't typically bring the seats on the plane, and although it's REALLY nice not to drag the seats on the plane and scratch my arms installing them quickly, we find ourselves MUCH more haggard when we arrive. Without the car seats, we (as parents) are exhausted by entertaining and containing the kids. The car seats are familiar and calming -plus they boost the kids high enough up to see out the window.

Our next trip will be our first cross-country trip without car seats (my twins are now 3 and are too tall for the car seats anymore). We're allowing ourselves a "recovery day" from the flight this time since we expect a much rougher trip for everyone.

 

[NotUrsula]

As for safety...if the plane goes down I don't care if you are in a seat belt,car seat or strapped to the wing 99 out of 100 times your dead so the safety factor is null and void.Thats why the FAA only "recommends" to use a car seat,its to cover their rear end legally otherwise the liberals will cry foul....

All comments about peoples' political persuasions aside, no, this is NOT why the FAA has not chosen to make carseat use mandatory for children under 40 lbs.

The reason is twofold, and has to do with the issue of how much that extra ticket costs.

This goes back to those days when the FAA had a dual mandate to insure flight safety AND promote the aviation industry. (The promotion mandate was dropped after the Valujet crash in 1997.) Extensive testing with dummies proved conclusively that the use of carseats (particularly rear-facing carseats) lessened injuries from turbulence and sudden decelleration on the ground, but the FAA chose to downplay the data on severity of injury in favor of the data on likelihood of fatality. That this also happened to be a more favorable resolution from the airlines' POV was not coincidental.

The FAA came to the conclusion that if parents of younger children were required to buy that additional ticket, then there was a good chance that they would choose to drive rather than fly, thus depriving the airline of the entire family's revenue. Citing the statistics for safety of commercial aircraft travel vs. private automobile travel, they chose to give greater consideration to data that shows that commercial airline travel is the safest form of transport currently available. Statistically speaking, a child who is lap-carried in an aircraft is still less likely to die in the course of the journey than a child who is properly secured in a carseat in a private automobile.

It is noteworthy that the NTSB vigorously disagreed with the FAA's decision.

Feel free to read it all for yourself:

CAMI study: http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ADA285624&Location=U2&doc=GetTRDoc.pdf

Article commenting on the FAA's final ruling on the subject (the ruling itself is no longer up on the DOT's website): http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0UBT/is_2005_Sept_12/ai_n15403615/

Current full FAA recommendations and regulations regarding child restraints: http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_G...cf679d5a8625723b007841e7/$FILE/AC 120-87A.pdf

I don't think that I should tell anyone how to decide on this issue, but I do believe in deseminating accurate data on which to base that decision.

 

[Erica09M]

We have flown often with kids both in car seats and without car seats. Even with newborn twins and a toddler we piled our stroller high with three car seats and slowly made our way to the gate. Yes, we looked a bit like a circus routine, but it works for us.

For us, if the flight is long (over 1.5 hours) or timed when we expect our kids to sleep, the car seat is perfect. Our kids are content, relaxed, and we parents have an easy flight. For shorter trips, we don't typically bring the seats on the plane, and although it's REALLY nice not to drag the seats on the plane and scratch my arms installing them quickly, we find ourselves MUCH more haggard when we arrive. Without the car seats, we (as parents) are exhausted by entertaining and containing the kids. The car seats are familiar and calming -plus they boost the kids high enough up to see out the window.

Our next trip will be our first cross-country trip without car seats (my twins are now 3 and are too tall for the car seats anymore). We're allowing ourselves a "recovery day" from the flight this time since we expect a much rougher trip for everyone.

Can you clarify what you mean? Too tall for the car seats? What do they ride in in the car? At 3 years old, they still need to be in a 5 point harness, and nearly all of those seats are FAA approved.

 

[NotUrsula]

Can you clarify what you mean? Too tall for the car seats? What do they ride in in the car? At 3 years old, they still need to be in a 5 point harness, and nearly all of those seats are FAA approved.

I'm not the PP, but I may be able to answer. Unlike in an automobile, aircraft seats in coach have a very tight pitch: in the US it is normally somewhere between 30 and 32 inches. (Pitch being defined as the distance between a designated point on the back of the seat to the same point on the seat behind it, measured through the cushion.) The use of a carseat not only raises the child's seating position, but sets it forward by a few inches as well; how much will depend on the design of the carseat.

Situations vary depending on a) the thickness of the back of the carseat and b), whether the child carries more of his height in his legs or in his torso, but IME, children who are more than 48" tall cannot be seated in a carseat in coach, as there is literally no space for their legs. They end up with their knees very uncomfortably jammed into the back of the seat in front. A child who is seated in a thick-backed carseat or who has the distinction of being very long-legged may end up in this position well before he is 48" tall.

Also not as in ground vehicles, in aircraft, there is no safe seating requirement that is based on height. The only thing that counts on a plane in terms of whether or not a carseat is recommended is weight. As long as the child weighs at least 40 lbs., tests by the FAA's Office of Aerospace Medicine have shown that the lap belt conveys the same degree of protection from turbulence and decelleration that it does for an adult.

 

[Erica09M]

I'm not the PP, but I may be able to answer. Unlike in an automobile, aircraft seats in coach have a very tight pitch: in the US it is normally somewhere between 30 and 32 inches. (Pitch being defined as the distance between a designated point on the back of the seat to the same point on the seat behind it, measured through the cushion.) The use of a carseat not only raises the child's seating position, but sets it forward by a few inches as well; how much will depend on the design of the carseat.

Situations vary depending on a) the thickness of the back of the carseat and b), whether the child carries more of his height in his legs or in his torso, but IME, children who are more than 48" tall cannot be seated in a carseat in coach, as there is literally no space for their legs. They end up with their knees very uncomfortably jammed into the back of the seat in front. A child who is seated in a thick-backed carseat or who has the distinction of being very long-legged may end up in this position well before he is 48" tall.

Also not as in ground vehicles, in aircraft, there is no safe seating requirement that is based on height. The only thing that counts on a plane in terms of whether or not a carseat is recommended is weight. As long as the child weighs at least 40 lbs., tests by the FAA's Office of Aerospace Medicine have shown that the lap belt conveys the same degree of protection from turbulence and decelleration that it does for an adult.

When I read it, I thought she was saying her children were too tall for harnessing car seats in the car, not for car seats on the plane.... which is why I stated that at 3 yrs old they should still be harnessed.

Which is why I wish the PP would respond.

I don't need a detailed description about car seat usage on an airplane. I'm well versed in car seat usage. Thanks though!

 

[frtchr]

Hey, OP, are you glad you asked the question?

 

[Fall1]

Hey, OP, are you glad you asked the question?

I am learning something

 

[SewSweetMama]

I am learning something

I have a not quite 2yo and 3 yo that both have seats on the plane. Since we are not getting a rental car, I am using CARES harnesses for both kiddos on the plane. If we had a rental car, I would have brought both of our own car seats on the plane. I have no idea how we would have maneuvered it LOL, but DH insisted he could manage. Luckily I don't have to find out how he planned on doing that

Like you had stated, I think my kiddos will be more willing to stay in their seats if they think it is just like being in the car.

 

[chipscinderelly]

How was the forward facing horrible? I'm not being snarky, just curious.

Because it put him in danger - he was not legally OLD enough to ride forward facing. Would you put your under 1 year old forward facing in a car? By law we could not.

Oh, please! Why was it "horrible" with him being forward facing?

Frankly, I think you are really asking A LOT of the person in front of that car seat who now can't recline his seat.

On a plane, the benefits of having a child rear facing aren't the same as in a car. It's just overkill.

Thanks for sharing your opinion! I never said I was asking anyone to not recline their seat.

I agree! for those that insist on rear facing I certainly hope if there are 2 adults or another older child with you that one of you sit in front of the child and have the seat that can't recline! That is quite rude to inconvenience a total stranger for your child.

Thanks for sharing your opinion! I didn't inconvenience anyone and to be honest, while I know this is not the transportation board, purchasing a seat on an airplane does NOT guarantee you that the seat reclines. As a parent I was protecting my child and following the law. He wasn't old enough to sit forward facing. I'm guessing you MISSED that in your comment.

I agree that it is rude to make someone else unable to recline b/c of your child. And what is the point of rear facing on a plane anyway? Back to the OP's question, we took our carseat on the plane for our DS 2.5 this trip and he did very well. DD flew as a lap child (10 weeks old). I don't think I would use the carseat anymore though. DS is very tall for his age and his legs were cramped. Eventhough he is 31 pounds and could still use the carseat on the plane, we won't be using it on our trip in October b/c he behaves well, and usually just likes to sleep. DD will also fly lap again.

Thanks for your opinion! Again, I didn't state that anyone was forced not to recline their seat but I do appreciate the feedback. Our son was not old enough to forward face at the time. I was simply offering the OP an option if she wanted her child to rear face. The FAA says that we have that right.

 

[frtchr]

Gotcha, chips. I misread your first post and thought your child was 17 months. When I read again, I saw 11 months.