Student Loans

[punkin]

I wonder how you prove income if you have no job and didn't file taxes and were a dependent because you were in school.

 

[Moliphino]

They DIDN’T have to take them. There are always other options like night school, community college,etc.

If they are going to forgive debt, it should be medical debt. No one can plan for getting sick and being buried alive because treatment that can save your life costs hundreds of thousands of dollars. That I can get behind. Student loans are a choice. People make the choice they should own that choice.

I would also agree with canceling medical debt. We really need to catch up to the rest of the developed world when it comes to a lot of things (socialized medicine, inexpensive public college, paid parental leave, etc., etc., etc.).

 

[HeatherC]

It is so disheartening to read so many judgmental responses. I am surprised that so many assumptions and labels are cast upon those with student debt. It saddens me that people can make generalizations about groups of people, as if they are true.

Opportunity is not equal. Hard work does not change that. It is not that simple. Just because someone's path is different than yours, doesn't mean that they don't deserve what you do.

Education, healthcare, and a clean environment are human rights that everyone deserves.

This thread is unproductive and is only going to get worse.

I would recommend that the moderator close it.

It is not unproductive and because you may not agree with people, doesn’t make it a topic not worth discussing. Everyone who has replied has been reasonable when explaining what they are thinking. No one has been insulting or name calling, etc.. Just because someone doesn’t agree with a topic is not a reason to have it shut down as long as posters are being reasonable…which they are.

 

[Mle8308]

Opportunity is not equal. Hard work does not change that. It is not that simple. Just because someone's path is different than yours, doesn't mean that they don't deserve what you do.

Education, healthcare, and a clean environment are human rights that everyone deserves.

This thread is unproductive and is only going to get worse.

I would recommend that the moderator close it.

So someone who drops out of high school, doesn't work and has no desire to do so, deserves what I have? I don't think so.

 

[Allison]

They will continue to be able to charge exponential sums of money for questionable borrowers in questionable degrees without needing to worry about how borrowers will pay it off (and if they will start to resent their degrees) b/c the feds will have shown they will cover the borrowers - once you set the precedent, it will continue again and again. And the borrowers will know the feds will bail them out, so they won't worry about running up a huge student debt, so the pool of people willing to pay for the questionable at the questionable cost will skyrocket. And they won't have contributed more than a dime to the solution. They are non-profit, so they don't pay anything to governmental solutions except for a trifling amount of tax that the last administration finally put against their endowments (and it's trifling).

So, everyone wins - except the American tax payer and America, b/c with the LOADS of debt we have built up, we are starting to creak under it. It's always a great idea to bail people out, til you run out of money in your own pocket...

It's the same philosophy why we can't have "too big to fail" businesses b/c then those businesses take risks they never should...and b/c they are too big to fail, the American taxpayer has to bail them out, so it's lose/lose for the taxpayer and consumer...

That isn't how it is going to work.

 

[dreamer17555]

Stop and think for a moment. All of you parents... what would you tell your child if the child came home and said his teacher wasn't fair, that Johnny got two cookies and he only got one?

I would tell my kid what I always tell my kids which is we only look in other people’s bowls to make sure that they have enough. We don’t worry if people get more than us we worry about the people who are not getting enough. It is our job to help lift other people up and make sure they are OK. Maybe I only got one cookie but say little Susie got none so while the best thing would be for everybody to get one cookie if I can’t make that happen what I can do is take my cookie split it in half and share it with her.

 

[TwoMisfits]

That isn't how it is going to work.

So, the colleges where the loans were taken out to attend ARE going to pay $10K to each person to wipe out that part of their debt? If it's not the colleges, then nothing changes and they continue their financially lucrative ways to the detriment of everyone else.

It's an industry that needs to fix itself. Any help to the consumer should be paid for by the business who incurred the cost to the consumer and no one else...

Edit to Add: And this would be exactly what hospitals do with medical debt - write it off. Except since the colleges already got the money from the banks/government when the degree was earned, they'd have to give it back and write it off. Same concept though, so we know it works...

 

[dreamer17555]

Student financial aid dependency is complicated. In America many families will absolutely do what they can to help their student go to college. However that is not all families. Even those that can afford it sometimes choose not to help at all. Or they can’t help because they have what looks to be money on paper but a bunch of debt or they need to fund their retirement.

It is complicated. If they were simply to give a Pell grant to every student in America as soon as they turned 18, schools would just raise tuition that much. I personally think the federal student loans need to be fully subsidized or set at a much lower interest-rate but that’s just me.

My daughter is taking out the full federal student loans to get through college. I am not cosigning anything above that and she picked her school based on a combination of merit, finances, and fit. That being said while the field she’s going into is needed it doesn’t pay well. Graduating with $27,000 in debt is going to be difficult. I’m not sure how people are graduating and dealing with hundreds of thousands of dollars in cosigned debts or worse, their parents put it on parent plus loans.

That being said I am absolutely willing to pay more in taxes to help lower the federal interest rate on student loans. And something needs to be done retroactively about the loans that were set up during the most predatory time before the new federal student loan program came to be.

 

[Lumpy1106]

TL : DR the thread, but as someone who literally washed dishes and bussed table to pay for college as I went, I am deeply offended by anyone who didn't do that and now thinks I should be paying off their student loans. Pretty sure I speak for the bartenders and waitresses who served you drinks so you could party it up while we worked feel the same way. That 20-30 hours a week we worked is time we're never getting back. It would have been nice not having to work through the night after my shift to finish those term papers too. Not complaining; that's the decision we made so we wouldn't have all that debt. You made your decision if you took on the debt instead. Now it's time to do some adulting and pay that debt off, don't you think? Seems only fair.

 

[dreamer17555]

Also I’m never going to agree with the idea that I did it the hard way so you should too mentality. If we all did that we wouldn’t move forward we all wouldn’t have the Internet we would just let people die of cancer versus new treatments that come out. I have an easier life than my grandparents did and they had an easier life than their parents. And I’m hoping that my children will have an easier life than I do. I have a daughter who works extremely hard. I’m not suggesting that everybody just blow off contributing to society. But I am saying the fact that I suffered does not mean I want her dealing with the same pain I went through

Example- I was hit a lot as a kid. My parents were absolutely hit more than I was. Guess what? That doesn’t give me the right to lay a hand on my children. I could easily say hey that’s fair- I was hit as a kid so my kids have to deal with being hit too. But that wouldn’t make it right. That wouldn’t stop the hardship. It would just push it down to the next generation to deal with.

 

[mom2rtk]

Also I’m never going to agree with the idea that I did it the hard way so you should too mentality. If we all did that we wouldn’t move forward we all wouldn’t have the Internet we would just let people die of cancer versus new treatments that come out. I have an easier life than my grandparents did and they had an easier life than their parents. And I’m hoping that my children will have an easier life than I do. I have a daughter who works extremely hard. I’m not suggesting that everybody just blow off contributing to society. But I am saying the fact that I suffered I wouldn’t want her dealing with that.

Example- I was hit a lot as a kid. My parents were absolutely hit more than I was. Guess what? That doesn’t give me the right to lay a hand on my children.

Not even remotely close to the same thing.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

TL : DR the thread, but as someone who literally washed dishes and bussed table to pay for college as I went, I am deeply offended by anyone who didn't do that and now thinks I should be paying off their student loans. Pretty sure I speak for the bartenders and waitresses who served you drinks so you could party it up while we worked feel the same way. That 20-30 hours a week we worked is time we're never getting back. It would have been nice not having to work through the night after my shift to finish those term papers too. Not complaining; that's the decision we made so we wouldn't have all that debt. You made your decision if you took on the debt instead. Now it's time to do some adulting and pay that debt off, don't you think? Seems only fair.

Hi from someone who worked throughout college and at times full time while being a full time student and commuted 30miles to do so at times. I don't begrudge my mom not helping financially but I do wish the government cared about that. I don't want handouts, or my loans to be forgiven. I just want the system refreshed because even when I was first starting college things were not the same as they were before when so many of these things were created. Our entire system is largely stuck in the past when time moved on. I also want at least more oversight onto many of these trade schools and for profit ones. People harp about "no need for a 4 year school go to trades" but don't often truly care how those schools are run.

 

[amylevan]

I get it though. Each situation is different and has a different calculus. Normally I would just say you do you, and guide your kids to make the best decision for them. And we'll do us. But once this moves to tax dollars forgiving someone else's loans, that calculus shifts greatly.

This is where I sit. I chose my college largely based on money. It was not my first choice. But I spend enough time with high schoolers to know that some pick their college for every reason BUT price and consideration for their career choice wages. Want to be a teacher? Great!!!! We need more educators. No, you don’t need to go to the most expensive school to come out with a modest earning career that will make it difficult to pay back those loans.

No, not every loan owner made bad choices or unsound decisions, but once it falls on the taxpayers, you’re now inviting critique on how and why you got there.

The system does need to be fixed. I just don’t think loan forgiveness without reform is the way to go.

 

[dreamer17555]

Not even remotely close to the same thing.

Honestly how is it different? The current set up does limit what the students can take for loans but this was not the set up that my generation had. The set up is a little bit better but it’s still a far away from perfect.

Shouldn’t we do something to overhaul the system to make it a little more just a little more fair and to stop all the predatory loans? And if that means I do pay a predatory lender for my loans and my children don’t isn’t that a good thing or if it doesn’t even impact my children if it just impacts the generation behind them isn’t that still better that somebody didn’t have to deal with the messed up system that I did ?

 

[Colleen27]

TL : DR the thread, but as someone who literally washed dishes and bussed table to pay for college as I went, I am deeply offended by anyone who didn't do that and now thinks I should be paying off their student loans. Pretty sure I speak for the bartenders and waitresses who served you drinks so you could party it up while we worked feel the same way. That 20-30 hours a week we worked is time we're never getting back. It would have been nice not having to work through the night after my shift to finish those term papers too. Not complaining; that's the decision we made so we wouldn't have all that debt. You made your decision if you took on the debt instead. Now it's time to do some adulting and pay that debt off, don't you think? Seems only fair.

It is interesting that there's an assumption of either/or being made by so many. I don't know a single college student who doesn't work. And I know very few who aren't taking loans. With the cost of college right now, it typically takes both AND help from parents/family or scholarships to get through. Even the two kids I know who have so-called full rides still have to either work or borrow to cover books, personal expenses, and other odds and ends not included in their aid package. One of them is going to graduate with about $20K in loans despite her scholarship covering 100% of her tuition, room & board because her program demands internships and lab experiences (all unpaid, of course) that preclude working during the school year to pay for car insurance and shampoo and ridiculously marked-up science textbooks and lab supplies.

 

[Brett Wyman]

It is so disheartening to read so many judgmental responses. I am surprised that so many assumptions and labels are cast upon those with student debt. It saddens me that people can make generalizations about groups of people, as if they are true.

Opportunity is not equal. Hard work does not change that. It is not that simple. Just because someone's path is different than yours, doesn't mean that they don't deserve what you do.

Education, healthcare, and a clean environment are human rights that everyone deserves.

This thread is unproductive and is only going to get worse.

I would recommend that the moderator close it.

Its like our country is split right down the middle ideologically or something

 

[mjkacmom]

TL : DR the thread, but as someone who literally washed dishes and bussed table to pay for college as I went, I am deeply offended by anyone who didn't do that and now thinks I should be paying off their student loans. Pretty sure I speak for the bartenders and waitresses who served you drinks so you could party it up while we worked feel the same way. That 20-30 hours a week we worked is time we're never getting back. It would have been nice not having to work through the night after my shift to finish those term papers too. Not complaining; that's the decision we made so we wouldn't have all that debt. You made your decision if you took on the debt instead. Now it's time to do some adulting and pay that debt off, don't you think? Seems only fair.

My kids who have loans have worked part time since 14 and full time every summer, and worked multiple jobs in college (cashiers, hostess, server, bartender, garden center, athletic center). My 21 year old walks home from her bartending job where rats run over her feet all night at 4 am with her mace in Boston so she can eat. She worked throughout her undergrad (I can’t imagine my kids not working). My husband’s degree in 1989 cost about $20,000, that same exact degree costs $120,000. He graduated with zero debt because it was manageable. These days unless you are making $30,000 a year you will need to find other ways to pay. Our in state options are $15,000 a year to commute, no housing, hopefully you are close enough to do so.

 

[wvjules]

I don't understand the mindset of "I did it so everyone else has to do it too" or "i don't want to pay for someone else's mistake". What a selfish society we've become. If "we" can afford to bail out banks, airlines, etc. then surely we can help the average citizen, can't we?

I have loans. I need to pay my loans. They will NOT be forgiven and I don't get to deduct interest but I will not begrudge anyone that could get those things.

 

[mom2rtk]

Our country is in the middle or the worst inflationary cycle in 4 decades. More spending will only make that worse.

 

[penn19]

Every time you see one of these people with mega balances, it's always from grad school. The maximum federal student loan for an undergraduate is $31,000. Not nothing, but also not the types of loans that make headlines.

I have zero sympathy for graduate students, who are, by definition, college-educated adults, crying about "predatory lending practices." I can maybe see the case that a 17 year old signing up for their first student loan might not have the financial literacy to make an informed decision, but people going into grad school have no excuse for not knowing better.

All my kids had to watch a video before they could accept a student loan. We are planning on paying off their loans when (if?) payments resume. But the loans are in their name