Sports: Deflate-Gate

[declansdad]

But isn't that what they are saying. The balls were deemed fine when handed to the team and were not fine when collected at the end. I mean how else could they have become not fine?

True but there has been nothing released saying who or how it was done, so far all we have is speculation.

 

[mom2rtk]

I just don't get the why. They did all this for basically nothing. ESPN just did a segment on the science of this. 2 psi reduced weight by less than weight of a dollar bill. Grip compression was improved by less than 1 mm. Lower weight actually reduced the velocity of his throws and changed accuracy by an inch. The extra weight of rain drops actually increased weight of ball by factor of 10 compared to change from psi. So way to further trash your reputation for no reason.

If it's such a small difference, then why have a standard at all? At least why not let the teams have more latitude in how much they inflate the balls? I mean, if it makes such a small difference and all..........

 

[Geoff_M]

Where are these many? Why do they feel that's not a coincidence, but that the Patriots' lone appearance (and thrashing) in the first 35 years of the Super Bowl is explainable?

I think it's more of a commentary about their relative lack of playoff success once they weren't stealing the other teams' signals... which reportedly dated back to 2000.

website and don't see any story saying that they have found that 11 out of 12 balls were found to be deflated. From where I sit, the NFL has said nothing publicly? The news stations are saying it, but where did that number actually come from?

Until an "NFL" official publicly tells us what they have found, I'm not going to believe it. Innocent until proven guilty.

From the Boston Globe:

According to a National Football League letter about the investigation into the controversy that was shared with the Globe, the Patriots were informed that the league’s initial findings indicated that the game balls did not meet specifications. The league inspected each of the Patriots’ 12 game balls twice at halftime, using different pressure gauges, and found footballs that were not properly inflated.

The NFL hasn't officially commented, because their investigations are still on-going.

 

[Dan Murfman]

If it's such a small difference, then why have a standard at all? At least why not let the teams have more latitude in how much they inflate the balls? I mean, if it makes such a small difference and all..........

Well the do have a latitude 12.5 & 13.5. I found this a little interesting But different ball but balls used in the World Cup can be between 8.5 psi and 16.5 psi.

 

[Dan Murfman]

I think it's more of a commentary about their relative lack of playoff success once they weren't stealing the other teams' signals... which reportedly dated back to 2000.

From the Boston Globe:The NFL hasn't officially commented, because their investigations are still on-going.

I wish my team can have that lack of playoff success. Since being caught in spy gate they have been to 3 Super Bowls and the last 4 years have been to the AFC Championship game.

 

[LBIJim]

The NFL found that 11 of the 12 balls used by the Patriots were underinflated by 2 lbs each.

Only 11 out of 12 footballs were deflated? No doubt some ballboy in Foxboro has already been canned for slacking off on the job.

 

[gray52]

So cheating is cheating? Well, Colts fans... How soon you forget about "speakergate"... Yeah... You all remember a few years back when the COLTS got caught cheating... Remember they were piping in artificial screaming/cheering noise through their speaker system during big plays???
Yes... Cheating is cheating. I think I'll call this one even.

 

[JanaDee]

A bit off-topic, but relating to football...as sucky and disappointing as the Packers loss was, it was announced a little while ago that Coach McCarthy's brother passed away today very unexpectedly at 47 years old.

I'm glad he'll be able to be with his family and focus on this rather than the Super Bowl.

 

[Geoff_M]

So cheating is cheating? Well, Colts fans... How soon you forget about "speakergate"... Yeah... You all remember a few years back when the COLTS got caught cheating... Remember they were piping in artificial screaming/cheering noise through their speaker system during big plays???
Yes... Cheating is cheating. I think I'll call this one even.

Um, no they didn't. CBS was the source of the "noise":

The NFL has determined that an irritating sound heard during the telecast of the New England Patriots' 24-20 victory over the Indianapolis Colts Sunday was a broadcast audio glitch.

"CBS has informed us that the unusual audio moment heard by fans during the Patriots-Colts telecast was the result of tape feedback in the CBS production truck and was isolated to the CBS broadcast," NFL spokesman Greg Aiello said. "It was in no way related to any sound within the stadium and could not be heard in the stadium."

 

[kaytieeldr]

I wish my team can have that lack of playoff success. Since being caught in spy gate they have been to 3 Super Bowls and the last 4 years have been to the AFC Championship game.

Eleven out of fifteen years of post-season play. Even without winning, even without making it to the Super Bowl, that's still a heck of a lot better record than most other teams.

 

[BlovesC]

Go Seahawks!

 

[Geoff_M]

Eleven out of fifteen years of post-season play. Even without winning, even without making it to the Super Bowl, that's still a heck of a lot better record than most other teams.

My use of the term "relative success" was not an accident.

 

[Missy1961]

Eleven out of fifteen years of post-season play. Even without winning, even without making it to the Super Bowl, that's still a heck of a lot better record than most other teams.

yeah, that's nice. But I'd rather root for a team that may get there less often but wins. In fact, I do. The NY Giants have only made it to the Super Bowl 5 times, but they've won it 4, the last two against the Pats.

 

[leebee]

What I don't understand is how and where any kind of intentional deflation could have happened. IF I have understood this correctly, the current protocol is that the refs test the air pressure of the footballs inside their (warm) locker room 2 hours and 15 minutes before game time. The refs are in charge of the balls after that, until they take them out onto the field where they are then supervised by the respective teams. If those footballs are sitting out in the open on the field (which it seems they are), HOW did someone deflate 11 of them without being seen/noticed? Also, they were all 2 psi under. How do you surreptitiously deflate 11 balls to the same level without some sort of instrument or gauge- which would make it even more difficult to do without being seen? It's easier for me to believe that "something happened" to the gauge in the locker room while the refs were measuring the pressure initially, so either the first 11 or last 11 balls were faultily measured before they every went out on the field. That makes more sense to me than anything else. Interestingly/curiously, although it's purported that the under inflated balls would make it easier for the Pats to hold onto the ball, they scored the majority of their points in the second half, AFTER the balls had been re-inflated. If under inflation is such a benefit, you'd think they'd have scored more in the first half!

It's all quite mysterious, and it'll be interesting to see what the NFL has to say at the conclusion of their investigation.

 

[bcla]

What I don't understand is how and where any kind of intentional deflation could have happened. IF I have understood this correctly, the current protocol is that the refs test the air pressure of the footballs inside their (warm) locker room 2 hours and 15 minutes before game time. The refs are in charge of the balls after that, until they take them out onto the field where they are then supervised by the respective teams. If those footballs are sitting out in the open on the field (which it seems they are), HOW did someone deflate 11 of them without being seen/noticed? Also, they were all 2 psi under. How do you surreptitiously deflate 11 balls to the same level without some sort of instrument or gauge- which would make it even more difficult to do without being seen? It's easier for me to believe that "something happened" to the gauge in the locker room while the refs were measuring the pressure initially, so either the first 11 or last 11 balls were faultily measured before they every went out on the field. That makes more sense to me than anything else. Interestingly/curiously, although it's purported that the under inflated balls would make it easier for the Pats to hold onto the ball, they scored the majority of their points in the second half, AFTER the balls had been re-inflated. If under inflation is such a benefit, you'd think they'd have scored more in the first half!

It's all quite mysterious, and it'll be interesting to see what the NFL has to say at the conclusion of their investigation.

How hard do you suppose it would be to hide an inflation needle under a towel?

As for the pressure level, I've never heard anything saying that they were precisely deflated to a specific pressure. 2 PSI seems to be more of an approximation. I'm also thinking that practiced technique could be accurate enough (like counting 3 seconds of hissing to get it down 2 PSI).

 

[leebee]

How hard do you suppose it would be to hide an inflation needle under a towel?
As for the pressure level, I've never heard anything saying that they were precisely deflated to a specific pressure. 2 PSI seems to be more of an approximation. I'm also thinking that practiced technique could be accurate enough (like counting 3 seconds of hissing to get it down 2 PSI).

I don't know how you'd deflate a ball (sorry, non-sports family here). Do you just stick the needle into a valve or something? Wouldn't it look suspicious if the ball boy, for example, was covering each ball for a few seconds either as they were transferred into the ball bag, or as he handed them off to a player/ref? Wouldn't that be noticeable? The balls are under the control of the referees until they are out on the field. I guess if the balls go out to the field in a box someone might be able to deflate them as they put them into the ball bag (I read that the balls were on the sideline in a bag, and although I didn't notice it on Sunday I have seen the balls kept that way at other games) but I still think it'd be noticeable, especially if you are doing this to 11 balls. (and why not all 12?) If the balls go out onto the field in the ball bag, how do you keep track of all the balls you are deflating, without being noticed? I think it's all curious, and odd.

 

[kaytieeldr]

How hard do you suppose it would be to hide an inflation needle under a towel?

As for the pressure level, I've never heard anything saying that they were precisely deflated to a specific pressure. 2 PSI seems to be more of an approximation. I'm also thinking that practiced technique could be accurate enough (like counting 3 seconds of hissing to get it down 2 PSI).

Nothing in this article indicates an estimate or approximation http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl...-underinflated/ar-AA8pFcj?ocid=ansUSAsports11
ABC News reports ESPN stating the identical psi http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/deflat...w-england-patriots-inflated/story?id=28365105

So how do you remove the exact s ame amount of air from eleven footballs, even with the baseless allegation of towel coverage? How do you do it without raising suspicion?

 

[jdb in AZ]

Nothing in this article indicates an estimate or approximation http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl...-underinflated/ar-AA8pFcj?ocid=ansUSAsports11
ABC News reports ESPN stating the identical psi http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/deflat...w-england-patriots-inflated/story?id=28365105

So how do you remove the exact s ame amount of air from eleven footballs, even with the baseless allegation of towel coverage? How do you do it without raising suspicion?

I saw a demo on the news tonight. It only takes a few seconds.

 

[LBIJim]

Eleven out of fifteen years of post-season play. Even without winning, even without making it to the Super Bowl, that's still a heck of a lot better record than most other teams.

Yeah, but channeling Janet Jackson, what have you done for me lately, Tom Brady?

Might as well be the Buffalo Bills of the early 90s.

 

[bcla]

Nothing in this article indicates an estimate or approximation http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl...-underinflated/ar-AA8pFcj?ocid=ansUSAsports11
ABC News reports ESPN stating the identical psi http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/deflat...w-england-patriots-inflated/story?id=28365105

So how do you remove the exact s ame amount of air from eleven footballs, even with the baseless allegation of towel coverage? How do you do it without raising suspicion?

I wouldn't say baseless. I've taken the air out of balls with an inflation needle. It's not that hard.

Maybe speculative, the question basically opened up speculation.

In any case, it's pretty obvious that it was done intentionally by someone with access to the balls. Only the officials and equipment personnel for the offense have access to them. So do you need a slide rule to figure out who did it?