Should DVC eliminate walking?

[Sandisw]

Since the ability to book multiple days ahead of the 11 month window was not in the POS at the time of sale, any restrictions that are a attached to that that "privilege" should be OK without impeding base POS rights, as long as they follow the FL statutory requirement that DVC be managed in the best interest of the majority of members.

If this was a base POS "right" if could not be infringed

No one is booking nights ahead of an 11 month window, They may be changing the date once booked, but it’s misinformation to say someone is actually getting any night prior to 11 month plus 7.

You are right...the POS alows only for a 1 month home resort advantage...that could be changed as the 11 month rule is not listed that way,

It is the suggestion that you can add penalties or restrictions to the use of points that I think is the issue and may not be allowed under Florida Law, as that is a big change from the way DVC was set up.

Ive been reading a lot and the more I read, the more I think that it wouldn’t be that easy, and that if they did find a way to implement a change, it will be to all reservation changes, as anything else would be way too difficult to define every single situation for a change.

But, that’s my opinion and to be honest, anything that makes the system worse would be a tough sell to new buyers. The change in points for those rooms is where they need to go first, which they are on the way to that.

 

[sethschroeder]

You think a better system would be to have large point holders hold rooms for a long time vs. walkers dropping rooms every few days?

The WL idea you came up with can be done now, so if someone goes on to book at the real 11 month window and its not there, they can put in a waitlist for all 7 nights...or how many they want. It would then fill when nights get dropped.

No the WL can't be done right now.... What is the #1 rule when doing a WL? Splitting up longer stays for the best chance to get a room.

With someone dropping 30 days in a row all at the same time it actually would open up full availability so your full stay would hit the WL system and be assigned out. Hence its actually better than people dropping 1, 2, 3 days at a time.

 

[Sandisw]

No the WL can't be done right now.... What is the #1 rule when doing a WL? Splitting up longer stays for the best chance to get a room.

With someone dropping 30 days in a row all at the same time it actually would open up full availability so your full stay would hit the WL system and be assigned out. Hence its actually better than people dropping 1, 2, 3 days at a time.

I wouldn’t see anyone dropping 30 days at a time, though, under your original situation,,,I think that is why I was confused,

It still keeps one owner from holding rooms they may not want to use...so, I’m not sure how it helps.

With one day at a time, wouldn’t someone who reall wants that night be able to pick it up sooner via just booking it the next day?

Granted person A might have tried but person B actually gets it the next day, but someone who wants it is getting it, just one day late.

 

[sethschroeder]

I wouldn’t see anyone dropping 30 days at a time, though, under your original situation,,,I think that is why I was confused,

That was your argument against someone unable to modify to drop days until 10 months. You said you could walk November 4th to December 3rd.

I am saying thats not a bad thing its actually a good thing as it helps those who waitlist not have to monitor every morning.

 

[Sandisw]

That was your argument against someone unable to modify to drop days until 10 months. You said you could walk November 4th to December 3rd.

I am saying thats not a bad thing its actually a good thing as it helps those who waitlist not have to monitor every morning.

Okay, now I see where I confused you!

I wouldn’t be dropping all of those days, I’d be keeping some of them for my actual trip. I’d just not have to worry about my actual dates until much later,

I could still decide to drop a few days at first, and then drop what I don’t need much later, after the restrictions were lifted.

So, I could lock in a month of nights, and then months later, decide when I might want to go, and drop nights whenever makes the best sense,

It wouldnt be a full drop..it’d still be days here and there.

 

[sethschroeder]

Okay, now I see where I confused you!

I wouldn’t be dropping all of those days, I’d be keeping some of them for my actual trip. I’d just not have to worry about my actual dates until much later,

I could still decide to drop a few days at first, and then drop what I don’t need much later, after the restrictions were lifted.

So, I could lock in a month of nights, and then months later, decide when I might want to go, and drop nights whenever makes the best sense,

It wouldnt be a full drop..it’d still be days here and there.

Which I still say is fine. If you held all those days it means you cant book and walk other things.

You also could do exactly what you are saying today so it wouldn't change anything negatively.

 

[Sandisw]

Which I still say is fine. If you held all those days it means you cant book and walk other things.

You also could do exactly what you are saying today so it wouldn't change anything negatively.

Yes, true. But walking isn’t needed really other than the fall and early December .

So it doesn’t impact the ability to book all other trips for large point owners. I have plenty to cover everything f I need for the year.

Right now, I do figure out my dates to book close to what I need. So, in that sense, the current system with no penalty keeps me from booking more than maybe 5 or 6 nights extra.

I just don’t see how holding lots of nights during the most busiest time, even if it means not booking more during less busy times, makes things better for those who are already struggling.

 

[Memorymakerfor4]

The best solution for walking that I've seen is to have fewer owners at a resort competing for rooms, therefore requiring people to hold more points. Disney recently increased the minimum buy in to 100 points, so perhaps they are testing to see at which point people will still buy, but also provide a better customer experience for owners. It follows the model they've followed with ticket prices at parks.

 

[RescueRanger]

There really is a simple answer because walking is cheating. If your reservation has several changes, it would be flagged for review. A CM would then check and see if the person was walking or just changing a few dates. If it was found to be a walked reservation, the reservation would be cancelled and a 48 hour hold would be placed on the member account, so that they could not make reservations during that period. Notice would have to be sent out to outline the new policy beforehand. There is no one that can deny that walking is used to bypass the 11 month window. That is a fact, and I would say that Disney has a legal obligation to enforce it.

 

[Sandisw]

There really is a simple answer because walking is cheating. If your reservation has several changes, it would be flagged for review. A CM would then check and see if the person was walking or just changing a few dates. If it was found to be a walked reservation, the reservation would be cancelled and a 48 hour hold would be placed on the member account, so that they could not make reservations during that period. Notice would have to be sent out to outline the new policy beforehand. There is no one that can deny that walking is used to bypass the 11 month window. That is a fact, and I would say that Disney has a legal obligation to enforce it.

Actually Disney has an obligation to make sure that they adjust things, per Florida Timeshare Law to adjust to high demands times to keep a balance for the year,

They do not have to put in a system that changes first come, first serve, because that is what a vacation club is all about, and how it is defined under the law,

So, from Disneys standpoint, no matter how they look at it, reservations are being booked at 11 months plus 7 nights, by owners legally allowed to book them, regardless if they are changed,

Setting up a system like you describe changes the first come, first serve rule and that nothing is guaranteed.

Yes, booking and changing reservations weekly does help eventually get days later, No question. But they are not booking them ahead of time because when they change, they can still only have reservations that are no more than exactly 11 months plus 7 days.

 

[DougEMG]

Possible as it’s first come, first served. Someone could beat you to the phone. But never happened in my years of booking. Plus, as I’ve said before, if that were to happen that room would likely be gone anyway with walking under the new system.

I don't think you are aware of how bookings have changed since you were an owner. For example when I was booking my trip for next year, right at 11 months for BLT and BWV standard views, it took me 5 mornings of before I was able to secure the reservation. Now once I had the reservations I was able to keep adding on to make a 3 week trip. Under the old system, the odds of me getting those rooms for 3 weeks would be practically zero.

So while the old system does eliminate walking, the side effect of the system is far worse.

 

[DougEMG]

I never said there is no need to walk with today’s system. I’m simply saying the old system will fairly eliminate walking.

You are correct that the old system eliminates walking. The problem is that it's side effect is far far worse than the problem that walking causes.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

You are correct that the old system eliminates walking. The problem is that it's side effect is far far worse than the problem that walking causes.

What is the side effect?

 

[DougEMG]

There really is a simple answer because walking is cheating. If your reservation has several changes, it would be flagged for review. A CM would then check and see if the person was walking or just changing a few dates. If it was found to be a walked reservation, the reservation would be cancelled and a 48 hour hold would be placed on the member account, so that they could not make reservations during that period. Notice would have to be sent out to outline the new policy beforehand. There is no one that can deny that walking is used to bypass the 11 month window. That is a fact, and I would say that Disney has a legal obligation to enforce it.

This requires more more from CM meaning higher costs meaning increased MF. How many members would be willing to pay higher MF in order to eliminate some walking? I bet not many.

 

[DougEMG]

What is the side effect?

The side effect of being able to get continuous nights in the room you want.

This has been explained here in multiple posts. You seem unable to believe or accept that this would happen, so there is really no point in discussing this with you, so let's leave it at that and we can agree to disagree.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

The side effect of being able to get continuous nights in the room you want.

This has been explained here in multiple posts. You seem unable to believe or accept that this would happen, so there is really no point in discussing this with you, so let's leave it at that and we can agree to disagree.

Because that was NEVER a problem. I consistently booked the hardest reservations there were and was never shut out.
Regardless, if you can’t get them day by day, you would never get them with the current system of walking.

 

[RescueRanger]

This requires more more from CM meaning higher costs meaning increased MF. How many members would be willing to pay higher MF in order to eliminate some walking? I bet not many.

Once word got out that reservations were being cancelled, the cheaters doing this would stop. Therefore, there wouldn’t be that many to check. It’s amazing how many excuses are made when someone wants to put a stop to their cheating. If people were honest and not self centered we wouldn’t even have this conversation.

 

[Sandisw]

Once word got out that reservations were being cancelled, the cheaters doing this would stop. Therefore, there wouldn’t be that many to check. It’s amazing how many excuses are made when someone wants to put a stop to their cheating. If people were honest and not self centered we wouldn’t even have this conversation.

But it’s not cheating. Thst is what you fail to understand. You may not like it, but no one is actually Violating the rules.

You are allowed to book a reservation for every day of the year, 11 months prior to that date. You are allowed to add an additional 6 nights at the same time. You are allowed to add days to a reservation as soon as you get into the window for that day. You are allowed to change reservations as many times as you want without penalty as long as it is 31 days or more,

Nothing in the POS says the date you want to actually show up. It says “check in date”. So, if I book November 1st, on a December, 1st, I have not violated any rule. If I change my mind, I’m allowed.

So, please tell me exactly what rule is being broken, People are not cheating. They are booking and change reservations within the current rules,

Now, you obviously don’t like the rules, and want them changed. Fine, Argue you want a system that doesn’t allow changes to reservations.
But, it is a fact that not one person, including those changing reservations multiple times are cheating and breaking rules.

 

[Sandisw]

Because that was NEVER a problem. I consistently booked the hardest reservations there were and was never shut out.
Regardless, if you can’t get them day by day, you would never get them with the current system of walking.

The difference is that now, as soon as you can get one night, you can get 6 additional nights going forward, not backward.

I go on trying to book December 1st,,,if thst is there, I get to also book at the same time, 2nd to 8th. I only need to get thst one day to guarantee I get the next 6 Because the 11 month window for check in Dec 2nd and on hasn’t happened yet. I only get it because of the 11 months PLUS 7 nights Allowed

Wihen booking backwards, the nights you want we’re already open for booking. So, to get Dec 1 to 8, I had to book every day, at 8 am, as single reservations, and nope I get them, OR I waited until December 8th to book and hope the nights of the 1st to the 7th were still there, because those nights were already available for others to snatch up,

So, we agree that backwards booking eliminates walking, but it creates a system where if you want to ensure you get all your nights, you have to compete every single day...so that is far worse than what we have,

And, since DVC changed it to book forward, and got rid of backward, they knew at the time it didn’t work

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Only multiple changes during the 11 month window fall into that category. If you don't know what you want or when you want it but book a bunch of dates anyway, that should be on you not on the rest of us.

Except that IS NOT the DVC system that is sold. One should buy into a fixed week system or now a DVC fixed week if they are not accepting of the flexibility of the system and the possibility that it means you might not get the exact room you would most like to book.

The main point that I think gets lost in the "walking is bad" threads is that other than fixed week purchasers we all agree that no particular room nor date is guaranteed to any of us. And it's the same story now as before - there are room categories where availability exceeds demand at times. Nothing's changed except there are more owners booking earlier than in earlier times of DVC.

Because that was NEVER a problem. I consistently booked the hardest reservations there were and was never shut out.
Regardless, if you can’t get them day by day, you would never get them with the current system of walking.

You certainly have an obstinence to defend an old booking system and either aren't reading entire posts or don't recall all the posts from those days concerning all the difficulties in booking. I've already responded once in this thread of at least 2 times having issues when it was day by day. I've also done the same in other threads where you state there were no issues with day by day. I'm kind of thinking the rooms you were booking didn't require it but honestly back then booking demands weren't anywhere near the levels they are now and still most rooms don't need to be walked. FYI, I detested day by day booking. Stressful, time consuming and overall awful as well as it not being how owners were supposed to book.