Seriously backwards thinking....

[SirDuff]

Re: Bolded - I was quoting A Christmas Carol because this is what people think I should be believing. This is not what I believe.

Total strawman argument. Scrooge was talking to people asking him to donate money not post on a message board.

How much money are you donating for other people's health care? And I don't mean through taxes, I mean actual donations?

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

I do get that people have to make difficult decisions. However, this decision is not a difficult one. Especially if you have children, you need to take care of your health. If you get an abnormal pap smear, you get the further tests and treatment if necessary. You figure out how to get it done. You don't ignore it and hope for the best.

I would do all of these if I were in this situation:
Move to less expensive housing - yes
Sell car and get less expensive car - yes
Nix all kids extracurricular activities - yes
Shop at thrift stores - yes
Stop dining out - yes

There are ways to keep more money so you have it for these types of expenses.

I love that you have all the answers to a person's life you know zero about. Seriously, you're hilarious.

 

[Poohlove]

I'm not saying pick coverage a la carts per se, but yes, there SHOULD be options or levels of insurance. I firmly believe that. This is America, we're supposed to be free, not dictated to.

I agree but I also think we are dictated to over many other things more concerning then level of insurance coverage.

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

I'm not saying pick coverage a la carts per se, but yes, there SHOULD be options or levels of insurance. I firmly believe that. This is America, we're supposed to be free, not dictated to.

Not touching that statement with a ten foot pole. lol

 

[sunshinehighway]

I love that you have all the answers to a person's life you know zero about. Seriously, you're hilarious.

Yup. It's amazing. She neglects to understand so much. Maybe moving to less expensive housing isn't an option. It's not like people just move on a whim. Maybe the woman doesn't have a car so she can't just get a less expensive one. Maybe she does have one but getting a less expensive one won't really do much. Maybe she owns her car outright but selling it to buy a new one wouldn't make a difference. With 4 kids it's not like she can just buy any car.
Maybe she doesn't dine out very often.
Maybe the kids don't do paid extra activities.
Shop at a thrift store? That's great if this woman spend a lot shopping. It's not much help if this woman isn't out spending a lot of money shopping.
It's like the OP is using her own lifestyle to judge this woman.

 

[pat fan]

I agree but I also think we are dictated to over many other things more concerning then level of insurance coverage.

I completely agree. Americans should not be dictated to. We don't like it. See the Boston Tea Party

 

[morgan98]

I do get that people have to make difficult decisions. However, this decision is not a difficult one. Especially if you have children, you need to take care of your health. If you get an abnormal pap smear, you get the further tests and treatment if necessary. You figure out how to get it done. You don't ignore it and hope for the best.

I would do all of these if I were in this situation:
Move to less expensive housing - yes
Sell car and get less expensive car - yes
Nix all kids extracurricular activities - yes
Shop at thrift stores - yes
Stop dining out - yes

There are ways to keep more money so you have it for these types of expenses.

First off, you do not know what she makes. I have heard people say they are nurses, or RNs and really be nursing assistants. So maybe she is only making say $40,000 a year. If she a single mother and (since you are assuming tons, I guess I can too) gets no child support, because of a deadbeat dad. Maybe her youngest child or two need to be in daycare, which is very expensive. Then she has to feed, clothe and provide shelter for four other people.

She may have already cut all extras and there are no extras to cut. You on the other hand think she is living in a McMansion, eating three meals out a day and shopping on the weekends while her kids are at ballet, baseball and gymnastics.

 

[Nancyg56]

A woman (an RN no less) had a pap smear and it came back "very abnormal". Because she has a high deductible health plan, her coverage does not pay for anything until she reaches here deductible. So, she would have to pay for the additional tests. She says she cannot afford them so she chooses to not have the tests. She now wonders if she has an undiagnosed cancer that will take her away from her 4 children.

She's saying she "can't afford to have the tests". She's a mother of 4 and I say how can she afford to not have those tests?

What in the world is she thinking?!?!?

Many years ago I also was faced with an abnormal result. I had no insurance, and had paid for my physical and tests OOP. I did not have money for further tests, so I did not pursue them. Yes, i was scared.

At that time I did not know a lot about the false positives, but thank God 35 years later, I am okay.

It is always easy from the outside looking in to decide what people should do. You base your judgements on your own life and experience and circumstance, so you automatically know what those others shoud do. Unless you know exactly what someone else's circumstances are and what a choose woudl entail, you really should not judge.

 

[Lilacs4Me]

I do get that people have to make difficult decisions. However, this decision is not a difficult one. Especially if you have children, you need to take care of your health. If you get an abnormal pap smear, you get the further tests and treatment if necessary. You figure out how to get it done. You don't ignore it and hope for the best.

I would do all of these if I were in this situation:
Move to less expensive housing - yes
Sell car and get less expensive car - yes
Nix all kids extracurricular activities - yes
Shop at thrift stores - yes
Stop dining out - yes

There are ways to keep more money so you have it for these types of expenses.

I highly doubt that people who cannot afford a yearly health care deductible have the disposable income to move/sell their house/rent a new one or sell the car they already have since most of the time people who have a car payment are underwater on their car loan until the last few months/year of the loan, nor should they as a short term fix to pay for some diagnostic tests that MIGHT come back positive for a disease. That's ridiculous. They have established lives, their kids are tied up in the education system of their district, they likely work relatively near to where they live, etc.

Trust me....I am one of "those" people who pay a LOT in yearly health care costs, have a ridiculously high deductible, and contribute the max every year to my HSA (which just barely covers the deductible IF I don't pay anything toward last years' OOP). Even if I did everything you said above (other than the first two, which are silly suggestions), I still wouldn't have enough to pay everything we have owed in the past 3 years, up front. And, like I said upthread, DH and I make over 6 figures together, but live in a VERY high cost of living area, which we moved to FOR WORK 6 years ago.

Here is why your suggestions won't work for everone, using my family as an example: We spend very little on eating out as it is. I'm talking less than $100/month for 5 people, more often that not, less. I don't buy brand name unless it's off a facebook garage sale site or heavily clearanced at Kohl's (and sometimes that is even more than I am willing to pay), I don't own/buy expensive shoes, purses, or leggings, I don't get my hair or nails done. I have a 2011 Kia that I owe more than it's worth still, and a paid-off 1998 Toyota, and I tell my kids that they can't have or do things they want to do All. The. Time. They don't do expensive "travel" sports and they don't get everything they want. We don't vacation hardly ever, and if we do, it's a budget trip to visit family, 99% of the time. Our son has decided to live off campus and attend a local college in 18 months. He will be getting a scholarship that will cover most of his tuition.

Where else do you suggest people like me cut back? Should I sell my invisible Lexus and get a 1998 Toyota instead? Stop my weekly pretend manicures? Pull my kid out of fake travel hockey?

Oh, wait....

Yup. It's amazing. She neglects to understand so much. Maybe moving to less expensive housing isn't an option. It's not like people just move on a whim. Maybe the woman doesn't have a car so she can't just get a less expensive one. Maybe she does have one but getting a less expensive one won't really do much. Maybe she owns her car outright but selling it to buy a new one wouldn't make a difference. With 4 kids it's not like she can just buy any car.
Maybe she doesn't dine out very often.
Maybe the kids don't do paid extra activities.
Shop at a thrift store? That's great if this woman spend a lot shopping. It's not much help if this woman isn't out spending a lot of money shopping.
It's like the OP is using her own lifestyle to judge this woman.

LOVE x1000000^^^

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

Yup. It's amazing. She neglects to understand so much. Maybe moving to less expensive housing isn't an option. It's not like people just move on a whim. Maybe the woman doesn't have a car so she can't just get a less expensive one. Maybe she does have one but getting a less expensive one won't really do much. Maybe she owns her car outright but selling it to buy a new one wouldn't make a difference. With 4 kids it's not like she can just buy any car.
Maybe she doesn't dine out very often.
Maybe the kids don't do paid extra activities.
Shop at a thrift store? That's great if this woman spend a lot shopping. It's not much help if this woman isn't out spending a lot of money shopping.
It's like the OP is using her own lifestyle to judge this woman.

I believe the saying is "walk a mile in my shoes" not 'walk a mile their own shoes" however the entire conversation is lost on the OP.

 

[sunshinehighway]

I believe the saying is "walk a mile in my shoes" not 'walk a mile their own shoes" however the entire conversation is lost on the OP.

What I find totally amazing is there are posters on this thread that I absolutely never agree with, usually have completely opposite opinions, yet on this thread we all seem to be pretty much in agreement that it's wrong to judge this woman. The OP is wearing some massive blinders.

 

[Christine]

What I find totally amazing is there are posters on this thread that I absolutely never agree with, usually have completely opposite opinions, yet on this thread we all seem to be pretty much in agreement that it's wrong to judge this woman. The OP is wearing some massive blinders.

Agreed. As the OP said way upthread, this is just a discussion. However, in a true discussion, we need to have some facts and we don't have that hear. The RN in question could be an irresponsible, money-blowing, Grand Floridian-staying nurse who doesn't plan for anything. Or the woman could be an RN working 60 hours a week to support 4 children and may already be in debt, live frugally, have a cheap car, and so on. Coming up with the cash up front for a cervical or endometrial biopsy as well as the pathology, I can tell you, is in the thousands.

We can sit here and come up with hypotheticals all day, but the fact is, we don't know a think about this woman. Not sure why the OP is assuming the worst about her.

I enjoy a good discussion as much as the next person, but there are not enough DETAILS about this woman to HAVE the discussion. So we just make things up now?

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

What I find totally amazing is there are posters on this thread that I absolutely never agree with, usually have completely opposite opinions, yet on this thread we all seem to be pretty much in agreement that it's wrong to judge this woman. The OP is wearing some massive blinders.

I think she's pot stirring and that's all. Still it's been fun for most of us to come together for once on a topic.

 

[sunshinehighway]

I think she's pot stirring and that's all. Still it's been fun for most of us to come together for once on a topic.

I hope you are right that it's just pot stirring and she's really not that mean and judgemental
I've been snowed in here for the day so I guess it gave me a distraction.

 

[manning]

Waiting months would be a big improvement over not being able to get tests at all, which is the way our current health system works for many.

Tell that to a veteran's family who lost a family member because they had to wait.

 

[piccolopat]

I agree with what you say. People should be able to tailor their plan to their needs (hysterectomy no maternity coverage or bc coverage, age no maternity). However, proof would have to be provided in order for it not to be abused. I also agree with TC that there needs to be interstate markets. People in WV only have one choice...insurances shouldn't get to choose not to do business in certain states. However, I still fully believe that we need a mandatory coverage if we are going to keep the pre-existing condition clause. You can't have one without the other. It will break the system. Which one do you choose?

Insurance companies have to deal with different regulations and filing requirements in each state. Each state has rules as to what has to be included and what cannot be excluded. In order to write business in each state, companies have to go through a very time consuming and costly licensing process and put up a certain amount of capital. They also need a network of claims adjusters and agents to be able to support their policyholders in each state. It really isn't a simple matter when you say they shouldn't be able to choose the states they do business in.

As far as pre-existing conditions, I believe there is a way to do this without the mandatory coverage requirement. We could use a "take all comers" approach similar to what some states have for workers comp coverage. People who choose not to buy coverage would face an increasing premium penalty based on the number of months uninsured so that they can't wait to get sick to buy coverage and the uninsured should only be able to buy coverage in an open enrollment period. Bankruptcy laws can be changed so they can't avoid their medical bills this way (same as what happens with student loans). The government can create a high risk reinsurance pool so insurance companies can cap their losses for any one patient and keep premiums down for everyone else. States can use their regulatory authority to cap the deductibles and copayments to something most people can afford. If you can't tell, I've put a lot of thought into this. I also work for a property-casualty insurer and while this is different than health insurance, the challenges and solutions can be similar.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

Your premiums pay for more than just your personal insurance, they contribute to the claims of others. You aren't capped for coverage based only on what you pay. Do you really think that insurance would be more affordable if we could order off of a menu the coverages we want. For example, the pennies you would save cutting out maternity care would turn into dollars spent tailoring insurance plans to everyone's individual needs.

Uh, that's what we did before.

 

[piccolopat]

I do get that people have to make difficult decisions. However, this decision is not a difficult one. Especially if you have children, you need to take care of your health. If you get an abnormal pap smear, you get the further tests and treatment if necessary. You figure out how to get it done. You don't ignore it and hope for the best.

I would do all of these if I were in this situation:
Move to less expensive housing - yes
Sell car and get less expensive car - yes
Nix all kids extracurricular activities - yes
Shop at thrift stores - yes
Stop dining out - yes

There are ways to keep more money so you have it for these types of expenses.

You're making a lot of assumptions here. Maybe the only way to reduce her housing costs is to move into a drug and crime ridden neighborhood and that she can't even do that until her current lease expires. Maybe she is underwater on her mortgage. Maybe she has an old but reliable car that has little book vale. Maybe her kids are already not in extracurricular activities. Maybe she doesn't dine out regularly now and only shops the sales at Walmart. Should she sell a kidney?

 

[DizBelle]

No you don't. With each post you are only proving that you don't.

Ok, I'll give a bit. I do not understand a decision that could leave 4 children without their mother and their spouse as a single parent. But I come from a place of "Don't give up" and "You fight". That's just not part of my DNA.

 

[DizBelle]

I love that you have all the answers to a person's life you know zero about. Seriously, you're hilarious.

Never said I had all the answers. But I think my suggestions are valid.