Saving Money Buying a Car

[drakethib]

We buy a new vehicle every year to year and a half for both me and my wife.

I never have really taken a loss; I just usually know when the dealerships are hungry and when they are not.

Not trying to start a flame or anything against what anyone does for a living but I am starting to see where the Car Salesmen/women are starting to be more honest where as the Dealership Mangers and Finance people are not quite as nice as they would like you to think they are.

For instance, I recently bought my wife somewhat of a "luxury type" vehicle only to have the finance guy try to push these stupid road-hazard packages and seal protectant packages for almost a thousand dollars. These packages could be found for a bout 20 bucks for the road hazard and $200 for the sealant package.

I told them no and they pursued. After a tongue lashing for trying to pressure sale they stopped but it really saddens me to see what people will do to try to make a buck.

I am all for making money on a job and I truly think that Sales is a noble profession IMHO, but when I see things like this it really burns me up.

Anyone in this industry care to chime in or comment?

Just wondering.

 

[Cheshire Figment]

I'm not in the industry but they are attempting to do what some financial companies are doing: if they can't make money up front they will try to make it in the back.

They are offering all sorts of deals to come in and buy the car at deeply discounted prices and no matter what they say, they are told what discounts to offer by the manufacturer. The dealership does this to attempt to make a real profit.

 

[Muushka]

I so agree with you. We recently went to a Dodge dealership (Hendrick-here in NC-buyer beware!). We were paying cash for the car we were discussing. They offered a rebate if we financed. We asked if we could finance for a max of 2 months, they said fine. The rebate was for $2000. Worth it, right?

When they presented the numbers, the total at the top of the page was the price of the car we had agreed upon. Then they figured the "monthy payment", which to me is totally useless without knowing:
1. the interest rate
2. the length of time to finance
3. The amount being financed

They had added in GAP insurance to the tune of $500. This is insurance that will give you full replacement value of your car is stolen or wrecked. $500 for a loan that we would have had for 1 or 2 months. Pitiful. They also added $350 for a "Pro-Pack" which are supplies to keep the car looking nice and the Wrap inusrance- for $1500 which is a mechanical warranty. All of these items totalling $ 2350, and there was no where on the sale that stated the cost of these items. The salesman stated that he was going to "give" us these items. It was actually figured into the golden "monthly payment" that is apparently what most people only look at.

Needless to say, we did not buy our car there, or will we ever again.

Buyer Beware!!!

 

[Disneefun]

I so agree with you. We recently went to a Dodge dealership (Hendrick-here in NC-buyer beware!).

OMG -- we had a bad experience with them five years ago when DH bought his car. We were looking at used as cash buyers. I guess they knew they wouldn't be making any money off us. Anyway, we went there because they were offering some promotion on used cars (I can't remember all the details, but it was something like a special rebate). We read all the fine print in the ad before we wasted our time. Asked the salesman if the particular car we were interested in qualified and were told yes. Asked if we had to finance and were told no. Well, sat down and worked some numbers, all was looking good. Got to the finance office and were told that no, that car didn't qualify and if we wanted any car under the promotion we had to finance and accept some other crazy option -- can't remember now. Needless to say, we left so fast.... the salesman saw us go and asked what was wrong -- DH said "Ask your finance officer." Anyway, we wrote a letter to the AG about it.

FWIW, this crud happens in the motorhome world, too. We just got done purchasing a motorhome and we saw just as much sleaze in that industry as I've ever seen in the car industry. Fortunately, we found a great unit from a great private seller who lives near us and has volunteered to go on our first trip with us(in his new rig) in case we need help with anything. Well worth it to avoid the sleaze.

 

[drakethib]

Just FWIW, I need to add that there are some dealerships who are on the up & up.

My in-laws just bought a van and the salesman told them just facts with no BS as well as the finance guy.

When they were signing papers the finance guy told them he had protection plans that he could offer but would only tell them about it if they were intrestedand not waste their time if they weren't.

 

[shaylahc]

We had an experience at a Toyota dealership here in NC (Toyota of Durham) where they couldn't get the vehicle we wanted so they tried to order it. Our salesman INSISTED we had to order it from the factory with about $2000 worth of options we didn't want. Later on I found out that was a load of cr@p, they order all their vehicles from the manufacturer with these same options so when people shop the only vehicles to choose from have these same options and they are stuck buying them whether they want to or not Thankfully they never were able to get the vehicle we wanted and we ended up going somewhere else and buying exactly what we wanted (a 2005 Sienna LE with no extra options )

 

[ceecee]

That's why we have used the same salesman for our last three new cars. He is up front and there is absolutely no pressure. Could be why he is the dealers top salesman many years running.

 

[Muushka]

Just FWIW, I need to add that there are some dealerships who are on the up & up. Snip...QUOTE]

Oh yes indeedy! We RAN from Hendrick Dodge over to a Mazda dealership where the sale was totally painless and absolutly NO secret hidden added things. I really should have reported those bozos (Hendrick) to the AG also.

 

[Beherenow]

We used carsdirect.com that was recommended by several friends. They find most cars for lower that you can get at dealership. If they can not find a car that matches what you want, they may order one. Check them out. The model that we wanted with the options that we wanted was rare, but they were able to find one for us. They did all the searching and we are very pleased.

 

[melaniemiller2002]

I really like Costco's no fuss system. You find a car you like, go get your financing, then walk into the dealership and you buy the car at a prenegotiated price that Costco has already agreed on. And it's a very good price...my mother and my sister bought their cars a month apart; my sister used Costco, my mother did not (she thought she could be a better deal haggling). Turns out my sister paid $3000 less than my mother....at the same dealership. They had different financing because my mother went through her credit union and my sister went through her bank. But the price of car was $3000 less in my sister's case...and she didn't spend any time hassling, arguing, or bartering. She walked in, picked out her color, and presented them with her financing.

Several of our friends have bought cars on Ebay and are VERY happy. They were able to pick up trucks coming from Texas that they would have spent thousands more had they bought them here (it's a BIG 4WD community here with all the snow and such). The vehicles all turned out beautiful and several of them are still under factory warranty. We are thinking of looking into that for the Expedition we want to buy. We don't want to spend more than $15,000 and we can get a really nice 2000 Expedition for that on Ebay. Here, we would pay quite a bit more because they are VERY popular vehicles.

Melanie

 

[fiveacesmmb]

HERE'S ONE THAT YOU'LL LOVE!!! Went to the Chrysler dealer near here to look at a Town & Country. They just announced employee pricing. Also had a 2000.00 rebate. Should have been a good deal right?? WRONG!! I told them to give me the best price, as I had a check to pay for the car with me. First he takes the MSRP from the bottom of the sticker...subtracts the 2000.00 then gives me the employee price. Well.....the employee price is a fixed number!! He should have given me the employee price and then subtracted the 2000.00 rebate. He insisted that's the way it should be done. He wanted to charge me 3000.00 more than my sister just paid for the same van less than 4 months ago. I left and went down the street and bought a new Quest that night!!! And I paid 5000.00 less than the sticker price!!!! Almost 2500.00 lower than the invoice price in the Consumer reports guide. We had no hassles with the Nissan dealer. I told them I had a check and if they met my price I'd take the van home right then. So I did....and boy do I LOVE this van!!!

 

[kehouse]

another thing to do when you have a really bad experience with a dealer, is to contact the company in which they do business with. i noticed at out toyota dealership that they had alot of plaques, that said they had great customer service records with the company. never thought about it till then, but i guess they could lose their good standing if more people thought to send something to the company. just a thought.

 

[MrsPete]

Asked if we had to finance and were told no. Well, sat down and worked some numbers, all was looking good. Got to the finance office and were told that no, that car didn't qualify and if we wanted any car under the promotion we had to finance and accept some other crazy option -- can't remember now. Needless to say, we left so fast.... the salesman saw us go and asked what was wrong -- DH said "Ask your finance officer." Anyway, we wrote a letter to the AG about it.

We don't generally buy new cars, but the author of the Tightwad Gazette proposed an interesting method for getting a rock-bottom price -- this would really only work with a new car. She had her husband chose a vehicle. He sent a letter to all the dealerships within a 100 mile radius inviting them to send him their "best offer" on the exact model, options, color, etc. He made it clear that he would accept only one "bid" per dealer, and that he would buy (cash sale) by a certain date from whichever dealer who offered him the best price. I can't remember the details, but I believe he did very well.

My own best advice: Make two trips. On the first trip, CHOOSE the car. Refuse to talk money; at this point it's not their business whether you plan to finance, trade, or pay in coconuts-- you're not that far along in the process yet. Once you've chosen the car, make your second trip to talk money (do not drive the car on trip #2 -- it makes it harder for you to walk away if the deal's bad). Discuss the total price of the car (including taxes, tags, etc.). Refuse to talk monthly payments, rebates, etc. If the salesperson tries to steer the conversation elsewhere (and he will), say, "I want to talk about one thing only: the total price of this car." Refuse to discuss anything else, refuse as many times as necessary. Leave, if necessary. You are the customer, and you are in charge of whether the proceedings continue. Discuss what matters to you most: the total price of the car. Once the final price of the car is negoiated, THEN AND ONLY THEN do you discuss trade-ins, financing, rebates, etc.

The other piece of advice is to keep your emotions out of the process. Don't be swayed into buying more car than you need. If the deal doesn't feel right, walk away. Lots of people sell cars. Nothing is unique about this particular car --you can get the same thing from the dealer in the next town.

 

[Muushka]

This really is a funny and sad thread both at the same time. Reminds me of the time I went to a Toyota dealership in FL with a friend who was not too savvy in the car-buying department. She talked with a salesman about a certain model that she was interested in. He proceeded to talk with her about what the monthly payment would be. I asked him what the price of the car was and he talked only in terms of the monthly payment. I finally said "are you or are you not going to tell the price of this car?" and he answered "no, I am not". I could not believe my ears. I walked out and my friend followed after a few minutes. Unbelievable.

In fact, remembering our Hendrick Dodge fiasco, they rolled the extras into the monthly payment because they felt that the things that they added in were something that the consumer should have. And they automatically add it in because "everyone just wants the monthly payment" information only.
To which I replied "how arrogant of your dealership to make those decisions for your customers". AAARRRGGGHHH

Yes, get the price first. Then the trade-in and then the financing. They truely believe that consumers are idiots.

 

[drakethib]

We don't generally buy new cars, but the author of the Tightwad Gazette proposed an interesting method for getting a rock-bottom price -- this would really only work with a new car. She had her husband chose a vehicle. He sent a letter to all the dealerships within a 100 mile radius inviting them to send him their "best offer" on the exact model, options, color, etc. He made it clear that he would accept only one "bid" per dealer, and that he would buy (cash sale) by a certain date from whichever dealer who offered him the best price. I can't remember the details, but I believe he did very well.

My own best advice: Make two trips. On the first trip, CHOOSE the car. Refuse to talk money; at this point it's not their business whether you plan to finance, trade, or pay in coconuts-- you're not that far along in the process yet. Once you've chosen the car, make your second trip to talk money (do not drive the car on trip #2 -- it makes it harder for you to walk away if the deal's bad). Discuss the total price of the car (including taxes, tags, etc.). Refuse to talk monthly payments, rebates, etc. If the salesperson tries to steer the conversation elsewhere (and he will), say, "I want to talk about one thing only: the total price of this car." Refuse to discuss anything else, refuse as many times as necessary. Leave, if necessary. You are the customer, and you are in charge of whether the proceedings continue. Discuss what matters to you most: the total price of the car. Once the final price of the car is negoiated, THEN AND ONLY THEN do you discuss trade-ins, financing, rebates, etc.

The other piece of advice is to keep your emotions out of the process. Don't be swayed into buying more car than you need. If the deal doesn't feel right, walk away. Lots of people sell cars. Nothing is unique about this particular car --you can get the same thing from the dealer in the next town.

I go in with pre-approved financing, knowing the actual invoice price of the car, and have already calculated what my max monthly note will be.

I was about to walk away from a car (ask my wife as she was getting embarassed by my horse trading) as we were $1.06 over my maximum payment. I made them give me some t-shirts and key chains to make up the difference.

 

[tlbwriter]

We don't generally buy new cars, but the author of the Tightwad Gazette proposed an interesting method for getting a rock-bottom price -- this would really only work with a new car. She had her husband chose a vehicle. He sent a letter to all the dealerships within a 100 mile radius inviting them to send him their "best offer" on the exact model, options, color, etc. He made it clear that he would accept only one "bid" per dealer, and that he would buy (cash sale) by a certain date from whichever dealer who offered him the best price. I can't remember the details, but I believe he did very well.

This is even easier now that almost every dealership has an "internet sales manager." Many even have forms on their websites to send your requests. Tell them exactly what you want and ask for the best out-the-door price (be sure to specify "out the door," or else you'll find that what seems like the best deal actually costs more than others because the fees are so high).

 

[floridagirrl2]

When we bought our Honda Element, we called and/or emailed about 7-8 different dealerships. Once we found the best price, we obtained financing through our credit union and went to the dealership. The sales person did ask if we would at least discuss financing with the finance manager, and we agreed.

The sales person and finance manager did a "good cop/bad cop" routine where the salesperson was the good cop and the finance manager was the bad cop. The sales person even told us before we went in to talk to the finance manager, "Remember, when you fill out the satisfaction survey that Toyota sends, it's strictly about me, not about any of the other staff."

The finance manager tried to sell us GAP insurance as well and when we declined, a previous buyer just HAPPENED to come by and start sobbing in front of us about how she had a wreck right after she bought the car and now owed more than insurance would pay. How coincidental (NOT) that she showed up when the finance manager was trying to sell us gap insurance. I saw her several hours later still in the dealership and realized she was an employee (and an actress as well!).

Also, the finance manager tried to pressure us into signing up to finance through the dealership--I did not like some of the wording of the contract (that if we were ever late on a payment, they could demand full payment for the entire amount on the spot). and declined to sign. The finance manager went ballistic, insisted this was "standard language" and went on a tirade about how we didn't trust him!! (HE WAS RIGHT! )

My DH got a little embarrassed (I was very firmly declining to sign the contract) and started apologizing...the finance manager thought he had us at that point, but he was mistaken. He ended up making a big show of tearing up the contract. (THIS must be what it's like to go through a timeshare presentation! ). We did end up buying the car, for the previously-agreed-upon price, and using our credit union financing.

 

[Cheshire Figment]

About 14 years ago my wife and I were in the market for a (new) used car. We decided we wanted a Plymouth Acclaim. We knew through research that a reasonable price was in the mid-$7,000s. We did not have a trade-in. We went into a dealership on the last Saturday of the month and saw a car in the color and model with the options we were interested in with reasonable mileage and a price on the windshield of about $9,400, talked to a salesman and test-drove it.

I then made the following statment to the salesman: "I don't care what the price is. I don't care about any add-ons or taxes. Just prepare a contract and the bottom line should start with a number less than eight."

He came back with a contract at $7,964 and almost fell to the floor when I pulled out my American Express card. Anyway, the car lasted us about six years and we put about 120,000 niles on it.

Next time we went to buy a (new) used car we decided on a 97 Taurus (in late 1999). Again test drove car, had it inspected by our mechanic, they agreed to take care of a couple of minor problems and quoted a final price of about $11,900, which I felt was too high. Rather than argue I came back the next day with a check for $11,000 made out to the dealership with that car's VIN on it. I've now put 92,000 miles on that car.