Regarding your SSN

[Muushka]

What's interesting are those people who call the credit bureaus and then refuse to give their social security number. The person at the credit bureau can see the full number on the credit report but they won't give it out to a voice over the phone. It often needs to be verified though so you end up with a stalemate.

There is discussion of no longer requiring social security numbers on credit reports but it's mind-boggling to think of how often the wrong info will end up on credit reports if that happens. If you think it's bad now...

Me for example.

OK, so you receive a letter stating that you are overdue on you cable bill for example. The letter says to call them at their number. So you call that number and they answer fillinthe blank collection agency. I tell them who I am and they look me up. They have my name and address and phone number, that is public information. They then ask me for my SSN. Who is to say that this is not a scam? Having been through this 5 times, we have yet to reach a stalemate. They have always given me the last 4 digits. Also, when I call them back, they have the case number that was assigned (and they ask for that) and also can see the number I am calling from so they know that I am who I say I am.

As a victim of ID theft, I am very careful who I tell my SSN to.

 

[CajunDixie]

How is having a SSN going to get you paid? For the record, as someone who had their name and SSN stolen and have dealt with it for the past 5 years, a SSN is not going to get you payment. It only makes tracking someone down easier. This is what I go through:

I get the letter from the collection agency. I call to dispute the charges. They ask for my SSN. I refuse to give it to them. They actually have it and tell me the last 4 digits (which are correct). I file a police report. I then have to prove that I am not the person that they are looking for (the thief lives in NY and I live in NC and so far all the charges have been utilities that I could not possibly use here in NC). I have gone through this scenario 5 times.

The collection agency ends up writing off the bad debt. I know because they let me know what becomes of it.

My docs ask for the SSN, but they will take a photo ID with name and address matching the info I gave them.

No, you cannot have my SSN. I will find a doc who does not require it and trusts me.

PS many times they ask for a SSN is because they are too lazy to create a unique identifier.

Can you tell I am a little bitter on this subject?

The point is that a doctor's office does not NEED your SSN. There are other ways that you can be identified that don't require a SSN.

In fact, according the the SSA (Social Security Administration), you are only required to give your number to specific entities. Doctors, insurance companies, and credit card companies are NOT on the list. These businesses are all just too lazy to develop their own way of identifying people. Until the digital age, when identity theft blossomed, people didn't think too much about safeguarding their SSN. Today they need to do so. It's nice to think that all of the people who work in these businesses are honest, but the truth of the matter is, they aren't. The majority of identity theft comes from people on the "inside."

At any rate...from the SSA's website:
*Snipped

Lazy??? Sorry but I don't agree. Non payment is usually the reason we ask for it. As an ambulance service we can't exactly ask for insurance up front nor prepayment. The only time I actually use it is when we send people to collections. And as a tiny service in a 2 stoplight town we probably send at least 1/3 of the patients to collections.

And if the collection agency that wrote off your account because someone stole your identity be ready for them to sell it to another agency in a couple years.

 

[OceanAnnie]

Lazy??? Sorry but I don't agree. Non payment is usually the reason we ask for it. As an ambulance service we can't exactly ask for insurance up front nor prepayment. The only time I actually use it is when we send people to collections. And as a tiny service in a 2 stoplight town we probably send at least 1/3 of the patients to collections.

And if the collection agency that wrote off your account because someone stole your identity be ready for them to sell it to another agency in a couple years.

 

[Muushka]

Lazy??? Sorry but I don't agree. Non payment is usually the reason we ask for it. As an ambulance service we can't exactly ask for insurance up front nor prepayment. The only time I actually use it is when we send people to collections. And as a tiny service in a 2 stoplight town we probably send at least 1/3 of the patients to collections.

And if the collection agency that wrote off your account because someone stole your identity be ready for them to sell it to another agency in a couple years.

As OceanAnnie said

What exactly are you saying here? (bolded part)


I am sorry if not having my SSN makes your job a little more difficult. The less people who have my SSN, the better.

PS You do know that the account that they wrote off was not mine, it was the thief that stole my identity, right?

 

[bonoriffic]

A dentist, doctor, or hospital can refuse to treat you for ANY reason what so ever so long as it is not an emergency and your stable.

They are only required to treat you in an emergency, other then that, just like any other PRIVATE business, they can refuse service to anyone

That certainly isn't true. There are plenty of reasons a hospital or doctor can refuse treatment, but "ANY" reason is not true. Some hospitals are not private either and have even fewer reasons they could refuse a patient.

Under your blanket statement of any reason, you could turn someone away for being a woman, black, a Jew, gay, or a Republican. Refuse treatment for any of those reasons and I guarantee you will no longer be practicing medicine and on the losing end of a civil lawsuit.

 

[here757]

Yes, I am serious but in actuality I have never had anyone insist that I put it down. 123-45-6789 would work good.

Unless I used your social security number there would be no way you could press charges so good luck with that.

LOL WOW sorry you took that litterally..

good luck with your fraud.. i really wish you well LOL

 

[angwill]

LOL WOW sorry you took that litterally..

good luck with your fraud.. i really wish you well LOL

Well you were the one who wrote it literally.

It may be fraud in your mind but if I refuse to give it and it is obvious it is not a real SS# it's not fraud in my mind and I would love to see someone try to prove it.

 

[Muushka]

It sounds like CajunDixie may be one of the bad seeds who feel superior when she feels people are beneath her because they owe money so that makes her feel entitled to everyones personal info.

This is why the debt collector/agency doesn't write off the debt correctly when it is identity theft and it ends up being sold to another agency instead. It makes the bad seeds feel powerful over those they feel are beneath them. This is usually due to a lack of self confidence so they see no need to help others and would rather squash them lower than they see themselves in their own mind because it makes them feel better than and more powerful. They should be working on their own lack of self esteem in a healthy way. I saw a lot of those in collections but what goes around comes around in the end. If someone has suffered identity theft it is not fun to make it harder for them.

If I understand you correctly, lets take me for example.

Once this NY Cablevision received all of my information proving that I was not the person who ordered the cable and didn't pay the bill, they will, in turn, sell my name and SSN to other collection agencies? Is that what you are saying? If yes, that is just wrong.

I have frozen all of my credit and the person who stole my id and SSN still has her address associated on my SSN history. In other words, when I look up my SSN on IDTheft911 site, all of my previous addresses that I have lived in over the past 20 years show up, including the thief in NY's address. They (Experian) have received notice from me with documentation to remove that address from my SSN. Really irritating. I just checked, it is still there.

While we are talking ID theft (well, I am anyway) I did a wise thing last year. My homeowners ins offered a ID theft rider for about $12 a year. Best $12 I ever spent. This time when it happened, I had my ins company on my side. They hooked me up with IDTheft911 (at no cost to me) and they appointed an associate to help me. In addition to the credit monitoring, she also did all of the paperwork for me to freeze my credit. She followed up on several questions I had. And told me time lines (like that thief will have her address with mine for up to several months) and what to expect. I highly recommend it. Plus, considering I had a pre-existing condition ( ID stolen before ), it was a bargain.

 

[Planogirl]

Me for example.

OK, so you receive a letter stating that you are overdue on you cable bill for example. The letter says to call them at their number. So you call that number and they answer fillinthe blank collection agency. I tell them who I am and they look me up. They have my name and address and phone number, that is public information. They then ask me for my SSN. Who is to say that this is not a scam? Having been through this 5 times, we have yet to reach a stalemate. They have always given me the last 4 digits. Also, when I call them back, they have the case number that was assigned (and they ask for that) and also can see the number I am calling from so they know that I am who I say I am.

As a victim of ID theft, I am very careful who I tell my SSN to.

You do realize that everyone at the credit bureau can see your social security number because it's on your file? Plus if you deal with identity theft or a mixed file and you call the credit bureau, you have to verify it before they can proceed to correct your information?

There's no other way.

 

[Planogirl]

If I understand you correctly, lets take me for example.

Once this NY Cablevision received all of my information proving that I was not the person who ordered the cable and didn't pay the bill, they will, in turn, sell my name and SSN to other collection agencies? Is that what you are saying? If yes, that is just wrong.

I have frozen all of my credit and the person who stole my id and SSN still has her address associated on my SSN history. In other words, when I look up my SSN on IDTheft911 site, all of my previous addresses that I have lived in over the past 20 years show up, including the thief in NY's address. They (Experian) have received notice from me with documentation to remove that address from my SSN. Really irritating. I just checked, it is still there.

While we are talking ID theft (well, I am anyway) I did a wise thing last year. My homeowners ins offered a ID theft rider for about $12 a year. Best $12 I ever spent. This time when it happened, I had my ins company on my side. They hooked me up with IDTheft911 (at no cost to me) and they appointed an associate to help me. In addition to the credit monitoring, she also did all of the paperwork for me to freeze my credit. She followed up on several questions I had. And told me time lines (like that thief will have her address with mine for up to several months) and what to expect. I highly recommend it. Plus, considering I had a pre-existing condition ( ID stolen before ), it was a bargain.

Have you contacted Experian about the address? They will remove it if you let them know unless it's still linked to some item on the report. Keep in mind that the addresses listed come from the credit items.

Of course they may not help you if you don't provide your social security number. Their system is reliant on those at this time.

 

[NYCDiane]

some people might not realise this...

lets say you owe me money for services..say i did on your lawn.. u decide not to pay me.
i can go downtown and file a warrant of debt. it becomes a court case.. if i win then i get a judgement...

if i have your ss number i can go to the irs. and file a claim on ur tax return..all i would have to do is submit a copy of the judgement. you dont see a return til the judgement is payed in full. even it it takes years.

same with bank account numbers.. if i have the bank account number i can submit a copy of the judgement and freeze your accounts.. all of the account your name is on..
that would include . ur and ur spouses. if you and your kids have accounts, any business accounts you hold.

in VA they passed a law.. cant use the SS number for identity purposes at all.

With a court case, you would have to file papers and servce the other party so they would have their say in the case and prove if they paid you or present evidence as to why they don't owe you. You can't juse "get a judgment".

Second, you can't put a lien against their federal tax refund. You cannot. I don't know what your STATE law is in regards to putting a lien against a state refund ( and I highly doubt you can do that) but I know you can't put a lien against someone's federal refund (except in the cases of child support, federal student loans, or tax owed)

There are also new laws regarding freezing bank accounts. If the money is from certain sources or if it has less than "x" amount of money in it, you can't freeze the account.

 

[Muushka]

You do realize that everyone at the credit bureau can see your social security number because it's on your file? Plus if you deal with identity theft or a mixed file and you call the credit bureau, you have to verify it before they can proceed to correct your information?

There's no other way.

Yup, I know that and provide it when investigating the ID theft and monitoring the credit report.
It is the collection agencies that I will not give it to.

Have you contacted Experian about the address? They will remove it if you let them know unless it's still linked to some item on the report. Keep in mind that the addresses listed come from the credit items.

Of course they may not help you if you don't provide your social security number. Their system is reliant on those at this time.

I sent a registered letter with all of my info (including SSN) and have receipt of the fact that they got the letter back in April. My ID theft counselor said it takes several months to have this removed. I will give them 1 more month (4 is definitely several) and contact them again.

It is costly to send these letters with receipts. So far $30.00 for postage for this crap. Really irritating. And the thief pays nothing.

Thanks PlanoGirl!

 

[here757]

With a court case, you would have to file papers and servce the other party so they would have their say in the case and prove if they paid you or present evidence as to why they don't owe you. You can't juse "get a judgment".

Second, you can't put a lien against their federal tax refund. You cannot. I don't know what your STATE law is in regards to putting a lien against a state refund ( and I highly doubt you can do that) but I know you can't put a lien against someone's federal refund (except in the cases of child support, federal student loans, or tax owed)

There are also new laws regarding freezing bank accounts. If the money is from certain sources or if it has less than "x" amount of money in it, you can't freeze the account.

did you not read what i put? i said you have to file the case.. and IF YOU WIN.. it becomes a judgement..
and yes you can put a lein on a tax return .. see step 5..
http://www.ehow.com/how_4552871_collect-debt-judgement.html

anyone can collect on a judgement that i owed to the. u have to follow proper channels..

 

[here757]

Well you were the one who wrote it literally.

It may be fraud in your mind but if I refuse to give it and it is obvious it is not a real SS# it's not fraud in my mind and I would love to see someone try to prove it.

using someone eles ss number is fraud.. no two ways about it...
im sure it can be proven..
if you use someone eles ss number at ur doctor office. and then that person has it investigated and they trace back to your doc.. do u not think they will give the authorities ur info?

LOL go ahead and live in ur bubble.. LOL

 

[Muushka]

I worked for the state once. I had to take a course and they (fed government) required a SSN to take the course. I called in opposition to giving the SSN (of course!). They told me to enter 000-00-0000 as a SSN. Which I did. And have not been prosecuted yet.

 

[here757]

I worked for the state once. I had to take a course and they (fed government) required a SSN to take the course. I called in opposition to giving the SSN (of course!). They told me to enter 000-00-0000 as a SSN. Which I did. And have not been prosecuted yet.

because that obviously doesnt belong to anyone....

 

[Muushka]

because that obviously doesnt belong to anyone....

I guess my point was that you can, in fact, give a bogus SSN and not worry about getting into trouble.

 

[angwill]

because that obviously doesnt belong to anyone....

Neither does 123-45-6789 so enjoy your warped bubble too. Some people must try their hardest to prove they are right no matter what.

 

[here757]

Neither does 123-45-6789 so enjoy your warped bubble too. Some people must try their hardest to prove they are right no matter what.

LOL u didnt disclose u plan to use 123-45-6789 til after everyone told u it was fraud..

 

[Muushka]

So, in conclusion, what have we learned from this thread?

1. You can give bogus SSN and not get arrested for ID theft and there are two ways about it.

2. You do no HAVE to give your SSN when asked for it

3. Check with your HO insurance, it may have an awesome rider for ID theft

Anyone else?

Oops, I need to qualify that number 1. If it is 000-00-0000 or 123-45-6789 you won't get arrested