Poof! Gone is our Middle School Honor Roll

[Mermaid02]

See, here is where your definition of "snowflake" parent and mine disagree.

If a parent has a child who has worked hard and done well in school, one who has achieved the honor roll and is rightfully proud of it, and that parent wants the child to achieve public recognition, THAT is not a "snowflake" parent. There is nothing wrong with being publically proud of my child's accomplishments.

Now, my DD15 isn't very good at spelling. She always tries hard, but she just can't spell worth a darn. Perhaps I get angry when she doesn't get put on the honor roll too. She should be recognized and made to feel special too, I mean obviously it isn't her fault she can't spell, she must have inherited it from her dad - the world's WORST speller. IF this were the way I view things (disclaimer - I DON'T), THEN I would be a "snowflake" parent - see how special my little snowflake is, even if she really is just an average student, dagnabbit!! Someone oughta recognize my beautiful snowflake cause *I* think she is perfect!

Kids need to learn that sometimes, some people are going to be better at things than they are. Sometimes, others will get recognition, and they won't. Same DD15 tried out for the volleyball team this year. Previously, in her very small middle school, she had played for 3 years on the volleyball team - loved it, played well. Suddenly, this year, little fish in BIG pond in the gigantic high school. She tried out, did her best, was obviously outplayed, and didn't make the team. Was she disappointed? Yes. We all were. But no one went running to the volleyball coach, demanding that they cancel the season because too many girls didn't make the team. the best players get the recognition of playing on the team, others, who may have tried just as hard, but didn't have quite the skills or ability, DID NOT. That's life. Lesson learned. Same with honor rolls, those who work hard, and some that don't work hard but have inate ability, get recognized. As it should be. Some don't. Work harder, try harder, or live with not being on the honor roll. THAT'S LIFE.

To me that is the EPITOME of a snowflake parent.... LOOK AT WHAT MY KID DID! I DEMAND public recognition for MY CHILD.

If the school has a special ceremony or breakfast fine... if they DON'T for WHATEVER reason... that's life. Go with the flow.... don't sweat the small stuff...

 

[luvsJack]

Even little kids know when they're being ********ted. My son came home with awards in Kindergarten and when I started to praise him he said "Everyone gets those, it's not anything real." From the mouths of babes.

America's academics have been declining for years and what do we do? Lower the bar so everyone can be included in mediocrity. Teachers know who is working their butts off and should have an award for those students. But to take away the actual achievements of the few and spread the praise around to everyone just to make it "fair" helps NO ONE.

To make the students who aren't as bright or hardworking think they are just as good as the best and brightest sure as heck isn't fair because reality is going to kick them in the teeth when they find out that employers don't hand out checks the same way politically correct schools hand out awards. We don't need to coddle their fragile egos to get them to achieve.

Asian students test consistently higher than most others academically but have the lowest level of self esteem. They work hard because they are afraid to fail. Others have the lowest test grades but the highest self esteem because they've been told they were great and also come from a background were academic achievement isn't the norm so they have nothing to compare to. "The teacher says I'm great even though I can't do the same work that Cho Chang can so I'm going to be an engineer just like Cho! Yeah! "Hope that kid manages to get a government job once the politically correct lobby pushes them through college because a real employer won't pay them for their high self esteem.

Sorry, but I have to take exception with the statement I bolded. I do not nor will I ever base a person's worth on how intelligent they are. Intelligence is something you are born with not something you have achieved.

Being hardworking, now that is something that is instilled in a person by thier up-bringing or environment. And I firmly believe that all children need to be taught to be hardworking at whatever they do. And hardwork is something that should be awarded, even if that hard work doesn't equal the same outcome as little suzy's higher than average intelligence.

As for the kid becoming an engineer just like Cho Chang. Are you saying that a kid should be told there are limits on what she or he can become? IMHO, a child should be encouraged to at least try and become whatever they choose. At some point they may realize that they need to change courses, but that's ok too (its that reach for the moon, you may fail and catch a star theory and I do believe it)

Backing up to your comment about your Kindergartener, let me be clear, I don't mean that everyone should get an award or the same award. But I do know that sometimes it is the C student that worked his tail off to get that C that needs and deserves that reward more than the kid who has all A's. And sometimes its the kid that has worked really hard, maintained a good grade and has no parental support at all that deserves the award. There are many reasons for recognition and not all of them have to do with being a straight A student.


You are right, no employer will pay for high self esteem but no child is going to get to an employer to be paid without one. A kid with no self esteem is lucky to get out of high school much less get a degree. The time in grade school and in high school is the time to build that self esteem so that they can make their dreams come true.

 

[rgf207]

The Honor Roll is a recognition for outstanding students and is classified by a High Grade Point Average. That's what it is. Unfortunatly there are many students struggle and receive passing grades but do not fall into the high GPA category. There is no recognition program for that. That's life.

The same situation exists in many other places. The film industry and music industry are prime examples. There are awards for movies that are exceptional but there really aren't any for movies that are "average"

This is life. Not every person gets recognized or receives a trophy. We need to stop thinking that every child or person needs to receive something so their feelings aren't hurt. That's not how the world works.

 

[luvsJack]

See, here is where your definition of "snowflake" parent and mine disagree.

If a parent has a child who has worked hard and done well in school, one who has achieved the honor roll and is rightfully proud of it, and that parent wants the child to achieve public recognition, THAT is not a "snowflake" parent. There is nothing wrong with being publically proud of my child's accomplishments.

Now, my DD15 isn't very good at spelling. She always tries hard, but she just can't spell worth a darn. Perhaps I get angry when she doesn't get put on the honor roll too. She should be recognized and made to feel special too, I mean obviously it isn't her fault she can't spell, she must have inherited it from her dad - the world's WORST speller. IF this were the way I view things (disclaimer - I DON'T), THEN I would be a "snowflake" parent - see how special my little snowflake is, even if she really is just an average student, dagnabbit!! Someone oughta recognize my beautiful snowflake cause *I* think she is perfect! :sad2:

Kids need to learn that sometimes, some people are going to be better at things than they are. Sometimes, others will get recognition, and they won't. Same DD15 tried out for the volleyball team this year. Previously, in her very small middle school, she had played for 3 years on the volleyball team - loved it, played well. Suddenly, this year, little fish in BIG pond in the gigantic high school. She tried out, did her best, was obviously outplayed, and didn't make the team. Was she disappointed? Yes. We all were. But no one went running to the volleyball coach, demanding that they cancel the season because too many girls didn't make the team. the best players get the recognition of playing on the team, others, who may have tried just as hard, but didn't have quite the skills or ability, DID NOT. That's life. Lesson learned. Same with honor rolls, those who work hard, and some that don't work hard but have inate ability, get recognized. As it should be. Some don't. Work harder, try harder, or live with not being on the honor roll. THAT'S LIFE.

I don't know that anyone is suggesting your daughter make the honor roll even though she is not good at spelling and is not making the grade. Honor roll is and should be for the students with the gpa to get there.

But there are other reasons to recognize a child, its not always about grades.

 

[Sorsha]

I am not saying that at all- what I am saying is get over it if there is no ceremony. Teach your kids that personal satisfaction is MORE important than public recognition....

I can absolutly agree with this statement. Personal satisfaction IS more important than public recognition. The problem I have, when public recognition has been and still IS the societal NORM, is that "snowflake" parents are demanding to have it removed or changed because Little Johnny doesn't make the honor roll and it hurts his wee little feelings.

It gets changed so everyone gets included, no one gets left out. Now not only has it dimished the accomplishment of the honor roll kids and taken away their incentive to continue to work as hard, but it has also given Little Johnny a false way of viewing life. NOT everyone wins, NOT everyone gets recognition, and he needs to get used to the idea.

 

[Mermaid02]

I can absolutly agree with this statement. Personal satisfaction IS more important than public recognition. The problem I have, when public recognition has been and still IS the societal NORM, is that "snowflake" parents are demanding to have it removed or changed because Little Johnny doesn't make the honor roll and it hurts his wee little feelings.

It gets changed so everyone gets included, no one gets left out. Now not only has it dimished the accomplishment of the honor roll kids and taken away their incentive to continue to work as hard, but it has also given Little Johnny a false way of viewing life. NOT everyone wins, NOT everyone gets recognition, and he needs to get used to the idea.

That's a really good point.... seems like everyone is whining about something!

 

[Mermaid02]

Um- it looks like you quoted yourself and I quoted myself, when in fact we quoted each other......... LOL

 

[Sorsha]

I don't know that anyone is suggesting your daughter make the honor roll even though she is not good at spelling and is not making the grade. Honor roll is and should be for the students with the gpa to get there.

But there are other reasons to recognize a child, its not always about grades.

Of course there are! That was my point in a previous post. Public recognition (the giving of awards) is a part of life. I have no problem with giving recognition to kids, and adults, for whatever they are good at.

My problem lies when a person or group of people demand that that particular form of recognition be changed so that EVERYONE can get the same recognition. No one left out, no one loses. That is NOT realistic. No one is ever going to be good at everything, and it is OK to learn that sometimes, someone gets public recognition and I do not.

 

[Sorsha]

Um- it looks like you quoted yourself and I quoted myself, when in fact we quoted each other......... LOL

How the heck did we manage that??? *scratching head*.

One public award I know I will not be getting - fluent use of internet message boards...LOL

 

[cheermom1]

You know at the same time if we keep moving the bar down and water everything down to make all kids feel good about themselves then what are we doing to the kids that really NEED to be challenged?? It seems like to me that we are holding them back...if they are not able to live to their full potential we are holding them back...I don;t want a doc who went to school that the bar was set so low that I don;t get good care I need and than I die as a result...

now I'm not saying that the kids that aren't to the other kids level should always not be recognized but they should be on their level not on the honors though b/c that is not where they are...I was one of the students that was more not on the honor roll than on it and I am telling you that I would NOT want to be on the honor roll if I didn't make the qualifications b/c it would give me false hope and believe in myself!

 

[Tinkmom75]

You know at the same time if we keep moving the bar down and water everything down to make all kids feel good about themselves then what are we doing to the kids that really NEED to be challenged?? It seems like to me that we are holding them back...if they are not able to live to their full potential we are holding them back...I don;t want a doc who went to school that the bar was set so low that I don;t get good care I need and than I die as a result...

now I'm not saying that the kids that aren't to the other kids level should always not be recognized but they should be on their level not on the honors though b/c that is not where they are...I was one of the students that was more not on the honor roll than on it and I am telling you that I would NOT want to be on the honor roll if I didn't make the qualifications b/c it would give me false hope and believe in myself!

Exactly, I fought to have my DS's bar raised so he would be challenged and have to work harder. The school fought against me every step of the way. Plain and simple, he made their scores look better. I had to wait for MS for some more diversity and even that is getting watered down. In the mean time he has developed poor habits because he has never had to work hard to achieve his grade. Is that his fault

 

[Mom-to-2-Princesses]

OP here again!

I really appreciate all the responses, and obviously the number of postings shows this is an area which has a diversity of ideas. It has helped me understand the parents at our school who are for the change.

But, just to clarify something -- I was never upset that the breakfast went away. We still showed up and got our grocery store donut! This wasn't just about the ceremony being changed. It was about the Honor Roll totally disappearing and wanting more information about how this is handled across the country. If 90% said, "yup that happened at our school" then I would understand the dynamics better. For us, it is not even posted on the walls, it just does not exist.

It will be interesting to see how this effects the efforts of the kids in the future. To be honest, my kid is going to be fine. I know she will strive to be her best. My concern is for the other kids, I want all the kids to try their best and use their talents. I want our school to be as good as it can, as a whole.

 

[mamacatnv]

I wanted to comment on a poster awhile back that said Charter and Private schools can hand pick their students. Maybe Private can, but Charter cannot.

My DD is in a Charter school - a Charter school is a public school and therefore cannot hand pick anyone.
Entry at our school is handled as follows:
Returning students first, siblings of returners second and then open enrollment.
If the number of new applicants exceeds available slots then a lottery is held amongst the new applicants.

What the Charter school can now do is set an academic as well as behavior standard. My DD's school is very strict regarding behavior and does not put up with beastly children in the classroom. Her school also has a very high academic standard that the kids must meet, but I can tell you that the school does everything in their power to help these kids succeed.
They hold competitions, they have small class sizes, they attract good teachers because of their standards, they offer support in all academic areas, they have heavy parent involvment and they openly communicate with the parents to keep everyone on board. Not all the kids are little geniuses but the school does know what their abilities are and groups them in classes based on their abilities. They have graduated math classes, reading classes etc. My DD is certainly not bored, she is challenged on a daily basis, she works hard and is rewarded for her efforts. Her classmates that might not be as bright are in a slighly lower class and have the ability to achieve the same grades that she does and they are all rewarded accordingly.

I could say that the level B kids didn't earn the "same" grades my DD did but what good does that do anyone. The school due to its autonomy can sort the kids so that everyone can succeed to the best of their own individual abilities. It is an everyone wins scenario without randomly rewarding everyone just because

We are not allowed to touch our kids' science fair projects, they put the fear of flunking into the kids so that the kids (and parents) all know, it is their project not the parents and I must say based on the asthetics of what I have seen, this rule is adhered too.

 

[luvmy3]

Hang around the mall on a Friday night and listen to the way the kids talk- character is seriously lacking in our youth. I wouldn't roll my eyes about a kid showing kindness, gratitude or being humble. I would roll my eyes at a bunch of snowflake parents who are po'd because the school's honor roll breakfast was canceled.

Actually my post is pretty clear, I'm rolling my eyes at the monthly ceremony, not the kids who recieve it
Oh, and see my response below.

Oh, but that's sooo subjective. Do you give that to a normally misbehaving kid who all of a sudden starts acting decent? Or do you give it to the reliably good kid who you tend to forget about it because they never give you any trouble? And won't that make the future criminals feel bad about themselves if they don't get a character award?

Our students vote on the winner each month, so really its just a popularity contest, and the recipient isn't always the best choice. Also alot of them are just made up awards like Trustworthyness to Self, which my dd won. Even the principal didn't even know what to say about that one in her speech, made for a very amusing ceremony. I would have rathered go to a ceremony for her when she got on the Honor Roll last quarter, at least that actually means she did something other than be the most popular pick out of the finalists. Those awards are a waste of time and were only invented as yet another way to get the students to "feel good" because G** forbid a school award students who get good grades and leave anyone out

 

[CathrynRose]

Ridiculous.

My boys - neither of them - since Jr High on - have ever been on an Honor Roll. Nor do they deserve to be.

They do the bare minimum, to get by. They so *just enough* to pass their classes.

Both of them are wicked smart, and brilliant and funny - but you know what? They're lazy bums.

The kids that DO give extra effort, and do hunker down and bust their butt's for their grades DO deserve recognition for such.

Ridiculous. What have we all become?? We're NOT all equal. We all have our own *thing* we're good at. Why does everything have to be some level playing field.

It's things like -this- that make kids like mine, think to themselves "Why should I? It's not like I'd be treated any differently" and they'd be right.

What a shame.

 

[Tinkmom75]

I wanted to comment on a poster awhile back that said Charter and Private schools can hand pick their students. Maybe Private can, but Charter cannot.

My DD is in a Charter school - a Charter school is a public school and therefore cannot hand pick anyone.
Entry at our school is handled as follows:
Returning students first, siblings of returners second and then open enrollment.
If the number of new applicants exceeds available slots then a lottery is held amongst the new applicants.

What the Charter school can now do is set an academic as well as behavior standard. My DD's school is very strict regarding behavior and does not put up with beastly children in the classroom. Her school also has a very high academic standard that the kids must meet, but I can tell you that the school does everything in their power to help these kids succeed.
They hold competitions, they have small class sizes, they attract good teachers because of their standards, they offer support in all academic areas, they have heavy parent involvment and they openly communicate with the parents to keep everyone on board. Not all the kids are little geniuses but the school does know what their abilities are and groups them in classes based on their abilities. They have graduated math classes, reading classes etc. My DD is certainly not bored, she is challenged on a daily basis, she works hard and is rewarded for her efforts. Her classmates that might not be as bright are in a slighly lower class and have the ability to achieve the same grades that she does and they are all rewarded accordingly.

I could say that the level B kids didn't earn the "same" grades my DD did but what good does that do anyone. The school due to its autonomy can sort the kids so that everyone can succeed to the best of their own individual abilities. It is an everyone wins scenario without randomly rewarding everyone just because

We are not allowed to touch our kids' science fair projects, they put the fear of flunking into the kids so that the kids (and parents) all know, it is their project not the parents and I must say based on the asthetics of what I have seen, this rule is adhered too.

I don't think I expressed my thoughts clearly. I meant, they (Charter and private) pick the students who represent them in competitions based on the best. Not the students who get enrolled at the school. Sorry, I see how it seemed I was saying what you thought.

 

[mamacatnv]

I don't think I expressed my thoughts clearly. I meant, they (Charter and private) pick the students who represent them in competitions based on the best. Not the students who get enrolled at the school. Sorry, I see how it seemed I was saying what you thought.

Very true regarding the teams the school has - math, robotics, geography, spelling, SimCity etc. Our Charter does not have athletics.
However, they are hand picked from their exisiting student body just like any other school would do. The kids have to try out to be on the teams etc.

 

[Tinkmom75]

Very true regarding the teams the school has - math, robotics, geography, spelling, SimCity etc. Our Charter does not have athletics.
However, they are hand picked from their exisiting student body just like any other school would do. The kids have to try out to be on the teams etc.

That's the problem with some of the schools (like mine). There are no real tryouts. Everyone makes the team because it might hurt someones feelings to be cut. That's kind of like the honor roll thing.

 

[mamacatnv]

That's the problem with some of the schools (like mine). There are no real tryouts. Everyone makes the team because it might hurt someones feelings to be cut. That's kind of like the honor roll thing.

Okay, I get what you were saying. Not a practice I agree with be it in school athletics or academic/performance teams but happening more and more in our schools/society today.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I understood honor roll in elementary school.

Your middle school policy is silly.

Our society in general is striving too hard to not hurt anyone's feelings and not striving hard enough to encourage and reward success.