poll: busesfor wheelchairs only

[MidgeD79]

This is inspired by another thread that started out about wasted time and there were a couple of posts about having buses just for wheelchairs so the general population don't have to wait for them. As a mom of a child who used a wheelchair my first reaction is no. I fought to hard in school and many public places for him to be a part of the normal world. I'd like to hear other people's opinions.

 

[CDSTapisRouge]

My opinion is the same as yours. I personally do not have anyone in my family that needs a wheelchair, but that is not to say that there will never be a time in my life that there will not be someone (could even be me). I would NOT want anyone to treat them/or me any differently. It does not bother me at all to have to wait while a wheelchair is loaded onto the buses. Yes it takes a bit of time, but in my opinion, we are all equal and just as much as I want to get to the parks as quickly as I can because I am excited I am sure they are as well. It would never even cross my mind to think they were "taking up my time"...

 

[aka-mad4themouse]

I can't imagine making wheelchair-bound guests wait until a wheelchair-only bus arrived for them. As much as I'd like to "get on my way" as soon as the bus is loaded, I try hard to remind myself that the person in the wheelchair wants to get on her way as well. I voted "no" to any special buses.

 

[Eeyore'sthebest]

NO! NO! NO! NO! NO!
Sorry, just wanted to make sure everyone understood my 2 cents!
My DH is HC. He is a SAHD and uses an ECV when we are at the parks. My DD worships the ground he walks on. They have an incredible relationship. He tries VERY hard to make sure he still does alot with our DD.
We got the ECV to make sure he can accompany us at all times. At some point our DD will understand that her dad is different than other dads. I do not want this shoved in her face. And this isn't even taking my DH's thoughts and feelings into this. My DH led a very active life until he became disabled. This ECV took alot of pride swallowing on his part. Off my soapbox - sorry.

However, we are the people that wait for the next bus and don't scoot up to the HC door bypassing the big line.

But that being said, I'm sure there would be someone at WDW (not implying Dis'ers) that would complain that the HC bus is nicer, comes faster, gets a better bus site..... You get the point.

 

[eeyoreiscool]

I don't think there should be a separate bus for wheelchairs, but I do think the bus drivers need to be better trained on how to get them into the bus. We have seen way too many times where the wheelchair occupant was telling the bus driver what to do because they had no clue. IMO this seems to be what the biggest holdup is. The drivers who know what they are doing get the wheelchairs loaded very quickly and you really never notice they are going on first.

 

[coffeeandfags]

I havent voted coz none of them really apply.
What i would like to see are DISABLED (not neccesarily wheelchair) buses.
I have a disability which means its very hard for me to hold on when standing on a bus. Now, i dont look disabled to the untrained eye so nobody ever gives up a seat for me hence, i find Disney buses hard going!!
Disney could give bus passes to the disabled and let only them and their families on. Even if each bus went to 2 or 3 resorts at a time, i wouldnt mind as long as i had a seat!

 

[Disbug]

I have a 4 year old daughter in a wheelchair, and I also, voted no. People who are disgruntled from having to wait are far and few between, although I have encountered them. Perhaps, if they had handicapped busses, the next thing would be buses for the old folks, or those with a cane, because they move, too slow. The people who are upset by waiting for a HC person to board a bus would be the same ones complaining if they saw a practically empty HC bus take off without them. I think most people, although anxious to get to the parks, are understanding and kind about taking a few extra minutes to board those with mobility issues.

 

[bicker]

Beyond the reasons folks mentioned already, I also worry about the impatience as much as anything else. I understand and sympathize that folks are excited to be at WDW, and for some it will be their only chance, but I don't think it is reasonable to expect that a guest's time would be treated so valuable that it even comes close to warranting ostricizing guests who take a bit more time to board the bus (or board an attraction, for that matter).

 

[Schmeck]

I thought Disney had vans that could be used for families with members in wheelchairs, especially if there were 2 or more wheelchair/EVC bound in the group.

I think a lot of the hostility comes from Disney's policy of loading wheelchair users and their families first, even if the wheelchair user gets to the bus stop 5 seconds before the bus arrives, while others may have been in line for 15-20 minutes. If two families with wheelchairs show up, a dozen people may get on before the queue is allowed to. I think Disney needs to have accessible lines, so that all guests get equal treatment. I don't see this happening though, because they would need to figure out a way to keep the tie-down area open for a wheelchair while people are loading. So, wheelchairs will get loaded first, and they also get unloaded last.

 

[seashoreCM]

IMHO it is not a bad idea to give wheelchair guests and their familes (all of whose members endure everyday inconvenience too) some extra pixie dust.

I have a disability which means its very hard for me to hold on when standing on a bus. Now, i dont look disabled to the untrained eye so nobody ever gives up a seat for me !

Also, IMHO it is reasonable for disabled persons to reveal their disability in exchange for extra pixie dust such as Guest Assistance Cards or one of the front seats which I think are labeled as for disabilities in Disney buses. Being in a wheelchair is obvious but many disabilities are not.

Suppose that the family wants to travel together and there was not enough room. If none were in a wheelchair they could all get off and wait for the next bus quickly.

Ito figure out a way to keep the tie-down area open for a wheelchair while people are loading. So, wheelchairs will get loaded first, and they also get unloaded last.

I have seen Disney drivers plead with prior boarding guests to free up the tie down area for a later arriving wheelchair guest. One way to solve this problem is for the driver to stand at the open back door and declare that he will wait until the wheelchair guest is boarded on that or the next bus. This would require a policy change in the bus dispatching department and also the ability to send another bus ahead to the next destination to pick up guests the affected bus would otherwise pick up.

(Warning: Math PhD. problem follows)

The first wheelchair guest arrives one minute before the first bus arrives and there is a long line. Two more wheelchair guests arrive one minute after the first bus leaves and there are a few other people left behind standing. Buses each hold two wheelchairs. Should the first wheelchair guest be (have been) boarded on the first bus?

Disney hints:
http://members.aol.com/ajaynejr/disney.htm

 

[CheshireVal]

I think a lot of the hostility comes from Disney's policy of loading wheelchair users and their families first, even if the wheelchair user gets to the bus stop 5 seconds before the bus arrives, while others may have been in line for 15-20 minutes. If two families with wheelchairs show up, a dozen people may get on before the queue is allowed to. I think Disney needs to have accessible lines, so that all guests get equal treatment. I don't see this happening though, because they would need to figure out a way to keep the tie-down area open for a wheelchair while people are loading. So, wheelchairs will get loaded first, and they also get unloaded last.

This is a good point. I don't have a problem waiting for wheelchairs and ECVs to load, but I sometimes *do* have problems when they've got HUGE parties with them, so that by the time I get on the bus I have to stand, even if I was close to the front of the line. Or, if the wheelchairs and their parties make me *miss* a bus altogether, that's even worse!

I traveled to Disney over December with my Aunt, who rented an ECV for the first time. I never boarded the bus with her-- I let my cousins do that. My immediate family (my mom, brother, my DH) waited in line with everyone else.

I don't think there's an easy solution to the problem. I will say, though, that I wasn't nearly as frustrated with the ECV/wheelchair loading in December as I have been in the past. It seems that the process is much more efficient than it has ever been!

 

[minnie61650]

Beyond the reasons folks mentioned already, I also worry about the impatience as much as anything else. I understand and sympathize that folks are excited to be at WDW, and for some it will be their only chance, but I don't think it is reasonable to expect that a guest's time would be treated so valuable that it even comes close to warranting ostricizing guests who take a bit more time to board the bus (or board an attraction, for that matter).

Since I became diabled in 2002 I rent an EVC when I vacation. When I am in Vegas there are only a few cabs available for WC users and the wait for one can be quite while. When I am at Disney I am usually on the next bus or the one following. It is wonderful that Disney is so "HC friendy". Just remember WC/EVC guests may be the first on but we are the last off. BTW just my DH boards with me (he actually helps load me on the bus and helps the driver tie the chair down so we can be on our way quicker.) The rest of my family family waits in the regular line.

 

[seashoreCM]

For those who chose poll answer #1, the driver should load up passengers in order of arrival, and if it is not possible to board wheelchair guests, radio normally for another bus.

For those who chose poll answer #2, the arriving driver seeing a wheelchair guest should declare the bus to be a wheelchair only bus, load wheelchair passengers, then close the doors, circle around the block, come back and load up other guests, correction, close the doors, move the bus one inch, open the front door, correction, close the back door, not move, open the front door, and load up other guests.

For those who chose poll answer #3 or #4, should a large party accompany a wheelchair guest boarded first and people are left behind, Disney should cause another bus to arrive in less than half the normal time between buses.

 

[WillCAD]

I think wheelchair-only busses would make for longer waits for those in wheelchairs. After all, there would not be nearly as many WC busses as regular busses, so wait times would go way up for those waiting for the WC busses.

Besides, public transportation has to be h/c accessible by law, so if there were WC busses, the regular busses would still have to accomodate wheelchairs.

If there were a better system of getting the WC Guests on and off the busses, it might help. Even the newer busses are still not the greatest.

 

[Chip 'n Dale Express]

As someone who's been a driver for Disney in the past...

One thing you have to take into consideration is Federal ADA law. The law (in far more words) states that the guest using the mobility device must be boarded first (in a manner of speaking). If he or she cannot board the bus because there is no room (or if someone refuses to give up thier seat in the securement area), then that bus is considered a full bus, and cannot legally pick up any passengers at that particular stop. (They can pick up at the next stop as normal)

So, technically speaking, if there are two people on the bus, each one sitting on the fold up seats, and they refuse to move, then, by law, no one else can board that bus, and the bus moves on.

(This does not apply if the guest cannot board due to mechanical challenges, as then the bus is deemed a non-accessible bus)


So basically, that's why a guest using a mobility device must board first. Not to mention it's 100x easier to strap down a wheelchair on a empty bus than it is a full bus.

Now, onto WHY does it take so long to strap down some scooters or wheelchairs? The problem is that EVERY mobility device is different. Many do not have "safe" tie down points. Drivers have to assess the situation, and figure out which areas are safe to strap down based on bar strength, and center of gravity. Not to mention, sometimes it's quite difficult to reach certain areas.


The bottom line is that all guests should ride together, and we should be sensative to each others needs. If one guest takes a little bit longer to board the bus, then so be it. If the roles were reversed, we'd want the same care and safety considerations that the other person got.

 

[Schmeck]

So, it's actually a law that wheelchair guests get boarded first? That's giving a group of people rights over another group, isn't it? I don't think enforcing it would hold in a court of law in the US.

I think everyone should have equal access to buses, and other transportation. I do not think anyone should have access over anyone else though. Doesn't seem fair to me. I thought the ADA was about making it all fair, for everyone?

 

[Chip 'n Dale Express]

Well, technically the law is worded so that if the passenger in the wheelchair cannot board, no one else can. So, technically speaking, you can board the entire bus, save a tiny spot for the wheelchair, and then board the guest with the wheelchair.

However, in real life, this is not practical. Hence why it's done as it is.

 

[goofy4tink]

The way I figure it is this.....there aren't all that many wheelchairs/ECVs at WDW. I think that in all my trips, I have been at one bus stop that had two parties with a wheelchair or ECV waiting to board. I think about having to wait an extra 20 minutes on the offchance I can't get on that particular bus, and then thank heaven that I have the ability of getting around on my own two feet. I'm sure that, for the most part, those that have special needs would rather wait with us, rather than get boarded first in their special conveyance.
But, if you get a bus driver like we had at AKL last year...well, that's a horse of a different color!!! He boarded an ECV, bus was down in it's 'kneeling' position. When he went to lift that puppy back up, it wouldn't budge!!! The bus was full of people, the driver kept trying to get the bus back to standing, it's not working, people are starting to gripe. The driver got everyone off the bus, except for the ECV and occupant, and again tried to raise the bus up, saying it had been too heavy with everyone on it. Still nothing. It was almost funny. He did call for another bus, but when the other bus came, those that had been taken off the first bus got trampled on by newcomers who just charged right past those of us waiting for the new bus. I'm surprised all out war didn't break out. Just as we were getting on the second bus, lo and behold the 'kneeling' bus got up!!! Now, looking back on it...it was pretty funny. But, man...people got really bent out of shape fast. If people would just take a patience pill, life would go much more smoothly. I mean, after all..what difference, in the long run, is an addtl 20 minutes going to make in your life??

 

[Schmeck]

Yes, I wish we could all be patient first as well, and I also agree that everyone deserves access to public transport, etc. There's actually a clause in the ADA that does not allow the disabled to have access to something that is not also available to the general public as well. I doubt anyone would make an issue about that though.

I guess it just doesn't strike me as doing it the right way at WDW when wheelchair guests get first access to transport, when others have been waiting there longer. Yes, I wouldn't want to be in their position of needing assistance in that way, but I see us as all equal beings on this planet. Of course, to me, this issue is small potatoes. I don't get angry when I have to wait to get on a bus, and I don't mind helping those that need help. I've frequently explained the WDW policy to those that need to use the lift on buses, actually! Some people have tried to navigate the narrow queues, not seeing the HC logo at one side.

 

[mommic32]

I think a lot of the hostility comes from Disney's policy of loading wheelchair users and their families first, even if the wheelchair user gets to the bus stop 5 seconds before the bus arrives, while others may have been in line for 15-20 minutes. If two families with wheelchairs show up, a dozen people may get on before the queue is allowed to. I think Disney needs to have accessible lines, so that all guests get equal treatment. I don't see this happening though, because they would need to figure out a way to keep the tie-down area open for a wheelchair while people are loading. So, wheelchairs will get loaded first, and they also get unloaded last.

I agree with the above as well.
I believe that I am paying the same amount of money as all people in scooters, have my 2 daughters and husband with me and have to WAIT while the scooters whole family plus whom ever else is with them board the bus first even as they roll up as the bus is just arriving. ( while I have stood in line waiting for some odd minutes). I feel that there should be a system. There needs to be a limit on the amount of people that board with the person in the scooter. Sorry! I am sure some will not agree and this is very contraversal,, but on my last trip there were more scooter family members than there were non handicaped people waiting in line to board the bus..