please close this thread

[MrsPete]

He said I don't appreciate him - when I asked what that meant, he said it's because when he come shome from work I do not always have a huge smile on my face and say "Hi Honey! How was your day?" and all that. There are other things... I definitely appreciate him and he knows that - I wish we had a censor button sometimes when we're mad...

Guess what. You're guilty of the thing you say you hate about him: you're not making him feel appreciated, head-over-heels-in-love, etc.

You say you're doing other things to make him feel appreciated, and he should know that you love him. Sure, that's all well and good. But TO HIM one thing that really matters is that when he comes in the door, you notice him, take a moment to reconnect, and just generally are happy to see him. This is just a part of his personality: whether you care about this or not, it matters TO HIM. This is actually a fairly common thing for guys -- it's a daily homecoming ritual that he craves, and it's an easy way to show him that you care.

If you discuss it with him, you'd probably find out that HE THINKS he's showing his love by being the breadwinner. He doesn't realize that you don't particularly appreciate this detail. He doesn't realize that YOU want him to notice the things you do around the house, etc.

You two need to discuss what makes you feel loved and cherished, then decide whether you can provide those things to one another. If you can, then do them. If you can't, then it's time to break up.

 

[MrsPete]

Apparantly they have busy lives, and yet just when she is making plans to spend some precious time off with him, his parents take priority???

I can see that HE is busy with working full-time and taking a class on Monday nights, but SHE is currently working part-time. She even said that her social calendar isn't full.

Haven't you wondered why her BF would demand that she do all the household chores to his satisfaction

Um, did she say that he was fussy about how things are done? My husband isn't.

I think it's fair for each person to do half the household work, but HE is doing more than his share of the breadwinning -- why shouldn't she pick up some of the slack at home? Later, when school starts, and their schedules are equally busy, THEN it'd be unfair if he didn't do more housework.

 

[Jeafl]

This topic has been discussed to death, but I just wanted to put my 2 cents in anyway

As someone who has been very happily married for the past 21 years, I have learned a few things along the way. I got married pretty much right out of college, and I learned that my expectations of our relationship have changed a lot over the years.

First of all, the most important thing I have learned is that no relationship is ever 50-50. Once I realized that, I was much happier. If both people realize that at times it is more like 60-30, or even 90-10 they feel less resentment. Over the years, those percentages have gone back and forth, sometimes in my favor and sometimes in his. Circumstances are constantly changing, and if you don't figure out how to go with the flow, you will never be happy. We just came to the conclusion that it doesn't matter who does something as long as it gets done. We are a team, first and foremost.

Secondly, I think the OP is sad that it appears the "honeymoon" phase has now turned into the "reality" phase. It is a harsh reality, but it is inevitable. Life isn't always going to be hearts and flowers. I remember feeling the same way when responsibilities started interfering in our social life. It is part of having a mature relationship.


How you deal with speedbumps like this is your best indicator as to whether or not you are willing to make your relationship work. Do you love him enough to do more than your share? Does he love you enough to do more than his share? It is definitely worth finding out.

I don't want to be mean, but in the scheme of things, sharing a birthday dinner with his mother, or fighting over housework are really trivial things in a relationship. The true test of a relationship is when you are faced with infidelity, the death of a parent, the serious illness of a child, serious finiancial problems, etc. If you or he have doubts now, how would you ever face a more serious problem? I agree totally with poohandwendy. Communication, on BOTH of your parts, is your only chance right now.

 

[LoraJ]

I agree with Disney Doll. LoraJ - you are talking about a wedding, Disney Doll is talking about a marriage. It is not a requirement to have a big wedding to get married. A marriage doesn't cost any more than living together, just saves a lot of legal bills if you aren't truely committed to the relationship in the first place and want to "go your separate ways."

Yes, but none of us know exactly what the finanicial reasons are that NewJersey's sister and her boyfriend are waiting due to financial reasons to really comment. I always hear lots of stories where guys want to propose, but can't afford the ring. So they wait and save. Of course they don't have to do all that and can just go to the court house, but sometimes it is very important to have the dream wedding. Maybe they only have entry level positions and just want to feel more settled and know where they are going in their lives before they get married. That's what they want to do. That's how their finances can change when they get married. Again, we don't know their story or what is important to them.

 

[heidica]

Yes, but none of us know exactly what the finanicial reasons are that NewJersey's sister and her boyfriend are waiting due to financial reasons to really comment. I always hear lots of stories where guys want to propose, but can't afford the ring. So they wait and save. Of course they don't have to do all that and can just go to the court house, but sometimes it is very important to have the dream wedding. Maybe they only have entry level positions and just want to feel more settled and know where they are going in their lives before they get married. That's what they want to do. That's how their finances can change when they get married. Again, we don't know their story or what is important to them.

Finances change all the time, even after marriage and will change through out a persons life. Waiting until things are "just right" might take a long time and then you'll never get married. In my opinion, the basic costs of living together ie rent/mortgage, groceries, telephone, cable and utilities are the same whether you are living together or married. If someone wants to live together, and they are committed to the relationship, then they should get married. If someone isn't committed, then don't live together. If you are committed, you should be able to take the next step and get married.

 

[lil mermaid]

You know, OP, you say that your boyfriend doesn't make you feel cherished and special. But, you know - sometimes guys show they love you in other different ways. It appears that YOUR guy shows his love to you by being a provider, by encouraging you not to work so that you can concentrate on your doctorate.

Also is it really so difficult to put a smile on your face when he comes home and act genuinely happy to see him? Heck who knows, maybe if you act that way you will eventually feel that way. It is important to him, and really isn't all that difficult.

 

[HoneyPooh]

Guys show they love you in all different ways. After 22 years married (and 36 since we met) mine has taken to showing me he loves me by bringing me odd items from flea markets. Today it was a tea cup saucer....no tea cup. Very pretty but not sure what to do with it. Anyone have any ideas? Kind of like when your cat brings you a dead mouse.

When we were first together it was roses, now saucers, go figure.

Sorry for the hijack, I'll be going now

 

[paigevz]

Guys show they love you in all different ways. After 22 years married (and 36 since we met) mine has taken to showing me he loves me by bringing me odd items from flea markets. Today it was a tea cup saucer....no tea cup. Very pretty but not sure what to do with it. Anyone have any ideas? Kind of like when your cat brings you a dead mouse.

When we were first together it was roses, now saucers, go figure.

Sorry for the hijack, I'll be going now

 

[LoraJ]

Finances change all the time, even after marriage and will change through out a persons life. Waiting until things are "just right" might take a long time and then you'll never get married. In my opinion, the basic costs of living together ie rent/mortgage, groceries, telephone, cable and utilities are the same whether you are living together or married. If someone wants to live together, and they are committed to the relationship, then they should get married. If someone isn't committed, then don't live together. If you are committed, you should be able to take the next step and get married.

Once again, none of us know what this couple is saving for to make any judgements.

I'm living in sin now and loving it. And guess what? We're going to get married. Hooray! And guess what else, moving in together WAS a commitment and a huge step in our relationship. Even my parents were thrilled. It's what worked for us. Obviously living together before marriage isn't for you. So don't do it. That's the bottom line.

From what I have read, the stats on living together before marriage are a bunch of bolgna. Just think how much worse the marriage statistics would be in general if people didn't live together before they got married. I think divorce stats would be WAY up.

There's actually lots of men and women out there who don't want to ever get married. They choose to live together though and that's just the way it works for them.

 

[heidica]

Once again, none of us know what this couple is saving for to make any judgements.

I'm living in sin now and loving it. And guess what? We're going to get married. Hooray! And guess what else, moving in together WAS a commitment and a huge step in our relationship. Even my parents were thrilled. It's what worked for us. Obviously living together before marriage isn't for you. So don't do it. That's the bottom line.

From what I have read, the stats on living together before marriage are a bunch of bolgna. Just think how much worse the marriage statistics would be in general if people didn't live together before they got married. I think divorce stats would be WAY up.

There's actually lots of men and women out there who don't want to ever get married. They choose to live together though and that's just the way it works for them.

I've been married 8 wonderful years this November, so need to worry about me. It was not my intent to be judgemental and was not referring to anyone in specific, which is why I chose to use words like "somone" and "they". Again, in my opinion, using finances as an excuse to not get married just doesn't work for me, because finances change so much. Now, I'm not saying I don't feel there are good reasons to not get married, there are good reasons to not get married, I just think finances isn't one of them. If someone has to use finances as an excuse to not get married, then my next line of thought would be "what else is going on". Just the way I see it. Again, it is the wedding that cost a lot of money, not the marriage. Being married can save you money - one health insurance policy instead of 2, shared banking fees, instead of 2, taxes, etc (that is until kids come along ). Not sure why you think the stats on divorce are a bunch of bologna - I would hope in whatever study was done they looked at a bunch of people who lived together and a bunch of people who didn't live together before marriage and did an average on who got divorced and who didn't. Simple number crunching. I haven't read any of these studies myself, but it just sounds like a statistical average comparing those who lived together and those who didn't, not the overall percentage of divorces, but instead comparing 2 groups of people. I would also hope the study didn't try to guess why the marriages of those who lived together didn't work out, that isn't what they study was looking at. The study just did some number crunching and presenting the results.

You stated that living together has worked for you - I am glad to hear that. As we have both seen from this thread alone, that doesn't always happen. I also hope your marriage goes well.

 

[kimmikayb]

One thing I've never understood about DIS.....why does a poster come here asking for advice and when they don't like what they hear, they ask to have the thread closed?

For the record, I agree with Poohandwendy too. She has some excellent posts.

 

[Cool-Beans]

What did I miss? Is this the thread that had the really long OP without any spaces between the lines?

I, too, am tired of everyone closing threads when they go in a direction they don't like. I'm glad Pete is cutting back on closing everything when the OP (mini-mod) decides they don't like others' opinions.

 

[poohandwendy]

Just wanted to add one more comment before the thread is closed...not about the OP's situation, but a book recommendation.

Anyone who is having issues in their relationship (married or not) regarding getting what you want or need from your partner should really read "His Needs, Her Needs: How to Build an Affair Proof Marriage" (I *think* the authors last name is Harley)

I know the title sounds strange, mentioning affairs. And it does discuss how affairs happen, why they happen, etc. BUT, the reason I think it is such a great book is because it talks alot about how men and women often have different 'basic needs' and have a hard time communicating them. And how we are often insulted that the person we love does not automatically KNOW what we want and need. And how we can resent them for not realizing how important those needs are.

It talks about how we tend to give our partner plenty of what we need, not realizing that they may (usually) have different needs and that in doing so, we may be neglecting what they really want and need from us. And the resulting frustrations and problems.

Imagine, for example, that you really love apple pie and your partner loves ice cream. You think ice cream is nice, but what you really want is apple pie. They keep on bringing you ice cream, thinking it is a loving gesture and then get upset that you are not thrilled. (just a very loosely based example, LOL)

It talks about how to communicate your needs and emphasizes listening to your partner to understand that while they may have a need that you don't really think is a big deal, to them...it is really important. And that when our needs aren't met, how we pull back emotionally from our partners. How the relationship breaks down and resentments are built.

I dunno, just thought I would mention it because I think this is an issue that comes up very often in long-term relationships/marriages. It is easy reading and even has worksheets and questionaires to work on the issues (if you are into that sort of thing).

I, personally, recommend it because it was the one self-help book that made it easy to open up discussion with my DH without him rolling his eyes (Oh God, she is reading another relationship book).

 

[momrek06]

Interesting...I thought this Thread had some really good solid points that ANYONE not just the OP could benefit from and now it is going to get closed...or locked...

The FIRST post of this Thread has been deleted. The OP, despite being young and having some issues with her BF, I really think she should have stated her thoughts and questions for all of us BUT she should have maybe then mentioned she was leaving out certain data about the relationship that she felt she did not want in the Thread...but she didn't and as the Posts went on, other Posters "figured" she wasn't telling us everything and then that is when it seemed she got a little upset but in reality the Posters were correct. Bottomline: it is terribly hard to offer up advice when you only get a portion of the story.

 

[SplshMtn99]

A title like that ALWAYS makes me come read what I missed. BAD IDEA!!

Oh & by the way, I'm 42, married almost 18 yrs...and even I learned some stuff here. Thanks everyone.

 

[wendyl]

A title like that ALWAYS makes me come read what I missed. BAD IDEA!!

I know---I probably would not have opened a BF complaint thread but once I saw that title--I knew I had to see what all the fuss was about.

OP: why delete all your posts? I don't get it. You had to know some people were going to disagree with you. Deleting your posts just makes it look like your ashamed of your own thoughts and feelings and you shouldn't be--they are yours and you are entitled to them. But, don't block out some of the responses given in disagreement to you--sometimes it's hard to see past our own feelings to realize the other side.

I really wonder what the responses would have been like if the story and male/female roles were reversed. I wonder if the OP was working full time, and juggling that with taking classes, and had communicated to her BF that two things that were important to her after a long day of work was that the house be clean (because a messy house is stressful to her) and that she could come home to someone who seems happy to see her----would those same posters on this thread think that request was unreasonable (like they did with the BF as the full-time worker and the OP not)? If the OP, under those circumstances, started a thread about being upset with her BF because she came home after a long day of work and the house was still dirty, laundry not done, and the BF didn't even seem glad to see her----I'll bet you'd be hard pressed to find support for the BF in that case.

OP: as an outsider looking in, it seems like you both want the same things (for your feelings to be respected and taken as a priority), and neither of you are meeting those needs for each other. About the house cleaning and laundry thing: since you KNOW that is important to him (and you have the time--while he doesn't), when you choose not to do it---he (because almost all males do) sees it as you not respecting or caring about his feelings. He probably comes home each day hoping you will have cared enough about his feelings and what matters to him, to greet him with a smile and have the house clean so he doesn't have to add house cleaning and laundry to his day before its time for him to start doing school work. When he gets angry that its not done, it's probably not because you didn't "meet his expectations", but more that you didn't respect his feelings enough to take time out of your day to do something that was important to him. Isn't that EXACTLY what you are complaining about him doing to you? You want him to take the time out of his day for some quality time together--and when he chooses not to do that, you feel that your feelings aren't respected. Very valid feeling. But, try and realize you are guilty of the same thing.

I doubt that you purposely avoid cleaning sometimes because you don't care about his feelings---your probably avoid it sometimes for the same reason I do---because there are hundreds of other things you'd rather do. I doubt that he fails to make the effort to plan special time with you because he doesn't care about your feelings---he probably just feels overextended as it is with working full time and being a student that he feels there are other things he should be doing. You both need to quit thinking you are the victims of selfishness from your mates, and realize you both need to make the effort to DO the things that are important to each other.

 

[musicotb]

someone may have asked me to close this thread... and delete everything I posted... because I was honest and told him I posted this...

 

[VSL]

Finances change all the time, even after marriage and will change through out a persons life. Waiting until things are "just right" might take a long time and then you'll never get married. In my opinion, the basic costs of living together ie rent/mortgage, groceries, telephone, cable and utilities are the same whether you are living together or married. If someone wants to live together, and they are committed to the relationship, then they should get married. If someone isn't committed, then don't live together. If you are committed, you should be able to take the next step and get married.

The main reason that BF and I aren't married yet is because we can't afford to live together. We will move in together before getting married, but only so that everything is organised and we can come back to our own place after the honeymoon and stuff (so the inconvenience of moving our stuff will be done before the wedding).

But I suppose it's different for other people, and I know that there are many people out there who really want to have a lavish wedding - I know that my BF hasn't proposed yet because he can't afford a ring that he wants to get (we weren't even going to get a ring..). For that, I think it's a good idea to save up rather than take out a loan or something.

I see it as being like waiting until you're 100% ready to have children - if you do that then you'll probably never have them (if you want them).

Also, not everyone wants to get married. I do, for the legal protection (I don't feel the need for a formal ceremony to be married in God's eyes though - but that's just me), but there are some people out there who are just against the whole thng. And how would gay people get around this in the US (I know that they can have a civil union in the UK and Canada)?

I'm rambling again and it's going way OT... sorry

 

[Jennifer S]

This topic has been discussed to death, but I just wanted to put my 2 cents in anyway

As someone who has been very happily married for the past 21 years, I have learned a few things along the way. I got married pretty much right out of college, and I learned that my expectations of our relationship have changed a lot over the years.

First of all, the most important thing I have learned is that no relationship is ever 50-50. Once I realized that, I was much happier. If both people realize that at times it is more like 60-30, or even 90-10 they feel less resentment. Over the years, those percentages have gone back and forth, sometimes in my favor and sometimes in his. Circumstances are constantly changing, and if you don't figure out how to go with the flow, you will never be happy. We just came to the conclusion that it doesn't matter who does something as long as it gets done. We are a team, first and foremost.

Secondly, I think the OP is sad that it appears the "honeymoon" phase has now turned into the "reality" phase. It is a harsh reality, but it is inevitable. Life isn't always going to be hearts and flowers. I remember feeling the same way when responsibilities started interfering in our social life. It is part of having a mature relationship.


How you deal with speedbumps like this is your best indicator as to whether or not you are willing to make your relationship work. Do you love him enough to do more than your share? Does he love you enough to do more than his share? It is definitely worth finding out.

I don't want to be mean, but in the scheme of things, sharing a birthday dinner with his mother, or fighting over housework are really trivial things in a relationship. The true test of a relationship is when you are faced with infidelity, the death of a parent, the serious illness of a child, serious finiancial problems, etc. If you or he have doubts now, how would you ever face a more serious problem? I agree totally with poohandwendy. Communication, on BOTH of your parts, is your only chance right now.

I totally agree. Great post. You said it much better than I.

 

[LoraJ]

I've been married 8 wonderful years this November, so need to worry about me. It was not my intent to be judgemental and was not referring to anyone in specific, which is why I chose to use words like "somone" and "they". Again, in my opinion, using finances as an excuse to not get married just doesn't work for me, because finances change so much. Now, I'm not saying I don't feel there are good reasons to not get married, there are good reasons to not get married, I just think finances isn't one of them. If someone has to use finances as an excuse to not get married, then my next line of thought would be "what else is going on". Just the way I see it. Again, it is the wedding that cost a lot of money, not the marriage. Being married can save you money - one health insurance policy instead of 2, shared banking fees, instead of 2, taxes, etc (that is until kids come along ). Not sure why you think the stats on divorce are a bunch of bologna - I would hope in whatever study was done they looked at a bunch of people who lived together and a bunch of people who didn't live together before marriage and did an average on who got divorced and who didn't. Simple number crunching. I haven't read any of these studies myself, but it just sounds like a statistical average comparing those who lived together and those who didn't, not the overall percentage of divorces, but instead comparing 2 groups of people. I would also hope the study didn't try to guess why the marriages of those who lived together didn't work out, that isn't what they study was looking at. The study just did some number crunching and presenting the results.

You stated that living together has worked for you - I am glad to hear that. As we have both seen from this thread alone, that doesn't always happen. I also hope your marriage goes well.

When I googled, it seemed like everyone referred to some 1997 study done. I couldn't find any conclusive evidence about anything. I didn't see any specific percentage numbers. But the theory was that since they had the guts to live in sin, they would have the guts to get out of a bad marriage because teh sactity means less to them. While someone who waits until marriage may be doing so for moral reasons, and would stay in a bad marriage. That's the only theory I could find.

I did find that 75% of those who live together before marriage do end up getting married (there's a percentage of those who never get married but continue to live together because they don't want to get married). I'm sure there are just as many broken up engagements for those who didn't live together. Which is why I find these studies inconclusive. There's also a They also didn't mention who was working and who was a SAHM. There's just too many other factors to point at other than being "they lived together first, that's why they got divorced".


Anyway, while I am totally for living together before marriage, I would never advise it to the OP. They were too young and only together 2 months. More than living together before marriage, I think people should live on their own for a little while.