"Other Rumored Lands" @ DHS

[rteetz]

no offence, but you don't have any kind of proof, you just have angry internet fan theories along the same lines as people on-line believing Luke Skywalker was Kylo Ren a few months ago... which really didn't make any kind of sense but whole lot of people seemed to want to believe anyway... So if keep that in mind and just you look at the Marvel thing logically, it all kind of falls into place...

First off Disney owns "all" the Marvel characters, so why would they build themed lands in their parks for just the Avengers/MCU characters? The answer is they won't... and they haven't, but they can't build a themed land for all the Marvel characters until they get all the Marvel Movies into a single story continuity, which they seem to be in the process of doing

Disney/Marvel's "Captain America Civil War", which comes out May 6th, will introduce the new Spiderman that will also be appearing in Sony's stand alone films, and a then a few weeks later on May 27th Fox's "X-men Apocalypse" will be released which will probably be the end of the current X-men story line... so it sounds like a re-boot of X-men is coming up real soon

Once Disney solves the problem of the story continuity and gets the Disney/Sony/Fox film in sync, they are also making it more and more difficult and expensive for Universal to do anything with Marvel in Orlando. At a certain point they only way for Universal to make any money on the theme park rights to Marvel is buy selling those theme park rights to Disney, and the distribution deal for DreamWorks probably figures into that, because Disney is "letting it expire". Comcast/Universal and the Walt Disney Company don't really care how they make money, as long as the keep making money and not losing it.

So step one is getting all the movies in sync, and when Kevin Feigie got moved to Walt Disney Films, he also stopped producing/supervising Marvel Television to focus completely on the films, and I'm assuming that means not just the "Disney/Marvel" produced films but also the "Sony" Spiderman, and probably the "20th Century Fox" films as well. Then not long after that it was Announced that Joe Rohde would head up Marvel Theme park attractions, but the movies are going dictate whatever they do in the parks, so we're going to have to wait and see what happens with Civil War and X-men Apocalypse this May

I never said I did have any proof.

I've never said Disney would never get the rights back but I don't see it happening any time soon at least not in the next 10 years. Disney and universal seem very happy with the deal right now I don't see any reason they don't. If Disney was eager to get marvel in the parks it would've been done in Disneyland, or at any of the foreign parks. So far nothing more than meet and greets has been done in Disneyland and you have one iron man attraction in Hong Kong. Not even Shanghai is opening with anything more than meet and greets.

This thread is regarding what other lands could come to DHS. It's not a universal vs. Disney debate and it's not about whether marvel is coming to the WDW parks because it isn't right now.

 

[Eoghann]

no offence, but you don't have any kind of proof, you just have angry internet fan theories along the same lines as people on-line believing Luke Skywalker was Kylo Ren a few months ago... which really didn't make any kind of sense but whole lot of people seemed to want to believe anyway... So if keep that in mind and just you look at the Marvel thing logically, it all kind of falls into place...

First off Disney owns "all" the Marvel characters, so why would they build themed lands in their parks for just the Avengers/MCU characters? The answer is they won't... and they haven't, but they can't build a themed land for all the Marvel characters until they get all the Marvel Movies into a single story continuity, which they seem to be in the process of doing

Disney/Marvel's "Captain America Civil War", which comes out May 6th, will introduce the new Spiderman that will also be appearing in Sony's stand alone films, and a then a few weeks later on May 27th Fox's "X-men Apocalypse" will be released which will probably be the end of the current X-men story line... so it sounds like a re-boot of X-men is coming up real soon

Once Disney solves the problem of the story continuity and gets the Disney/Sony/Fox film in sync, they are also making it more and more difficult and expensive for Universal to do anything with Marvel in Orlando. At a certain point they only way for Universal to make any money on the theme park rights to Marvel is buy selling those theme park rights to Disney, and the distribution deal for DreamWorks probably figures into that, because Disney is "letting it expire". Comcast/Universal and the Walt Disney Company don't really care how they make money, as long as the keep making money and not losing it.

So step one is getting all the movies in sync, and when Kevin Feigie got moved to Walt Disney Films, he also stopped producing/supervising Marvel Television to focus completely on the films, and I'm assuming that means not just the "Disney/Marvel" produced films but also the "Sony" Spiderman, and probably the "20th Century Fox" films as well. Then not long after that it was Announced that Joe Rohde would head up Marvel Theme park attractions, but the movies are going dictate whatever they do in the parks, so we're going to have to wait and see what happens with Civil War and X-men Apocalypse this May

Okay so you criticize us for only having "angry internet fan theories" (not angry by the way, I just find the people's refusal to deal with reality laughable) but then you spin a wild theory with no timeline, that ignores known facts and that doesn't even pass the most basic logic test. Just a few problems with your theory:

• There's no need for a unified Marvel Cinematic Universe in order to build a Superhero land. They could easily just introduce new characters as they got them.
• While Sony and Disney are on relatively good terms and currently working together, it is well documented that Fox and Disney do not. To the extent that Marvel Comics have stopped publishing a Fantastic Four comic and have de-emphasized the X-Men franchise along with associated posters, toys etc.
• Disney has no legal say in how Fox & Sony use their licenses. Those licenses are in perpetuity so long as movies are produced by certain dates.
• Where is your evidence that Disney are making it more expensive for Universal to do anything with their Marvel License? Universal is on record that they will not be letting that license go and it is reported to be quite profitable for them. What could Disney even do?
• Kevin Feige's move (again widely reported) has nothing to do with Sony or Fox and everything to do with clashes between him and Marvel CEO Ike Perlmutter (who is known to be something of a micromanager)

You can spin any fantasies you like but don't get all upset when the rest of the world points out that's all they are.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

no offence, but you don't have any kind of proof, you just have angry internet fan theories along the same lines as people on-line believing Luke Skywalker was Kylo Ren a few months ago... which really didn't make any kind of sense but whole lot of people seemed to want to believe anyway... So if keep that in mind and just you look at the Marvel thing logically, it all kind of falls into place...

First off Disney owns "all" the Marvel characters, so why would they build themed lands in their parks for just the Avengers/MCU characters? The answer is they won't... and they haven't, but they can't build a themed land for all the Marvel characters until they get all the Marvel Movies into a single story continuity, which they seem to be in the process of doing

Disney/Marvel's "Captain America Civil War", which comes out May 6th, will introduce the new Spiderman that will also be appearing in Sony's stand alone films, and a then a few weeks later on May 27th Fox's "X-men Apocalypse" will be released which will probably be the end of the current X-men story line... so it sounds like a re-boot of X-men is coming up real soon

Once Disney solves the problem of the story continuity and gets the Disney/Sony/Fox film in sync, they are also making it more and more difficult and expensive for Universal to do anything with Marvel in Orlando. At a certain point they only way for Universal to make any money on the theme park rights to Marvel is buy selling those theme park rights to Disney, and the distribution deal for DreamWorks probably figures into that, because Disney is "letting it expire". Comcast/Universal and the Walt Disney Company don't really care how they make money, as long as the keep making money and not losing it.

So step one is getting all the movies in sync, and when Kevin Feigie got moved to Walt Disney Films, he also stopped producing/supervising Marvel Television to focus completely on the films, and I'm assuming that means not just the "Disney/Marvel" produced films but also the "Sony" Spiderman, and probably the "20th Century Fox" films as well. Then not long after that it was Announced that Joe Rohde would head up Marvel Theme park attractions, but the movies are going dictate whatever they do in the parks, so we're going to have to wait and see what happens with Civil War and X-men Apocalypse this May

If your goal was to try and weave a bunch of random Hollywood comings and goings into an argument that the evil geniuses at Disney are attempting to back Comcast and Sony into a corner so they "give up" their rights under stress...and then Disney will shell out billions into building new rides - laughable in Florida - based on them...

...you're only about 99% short of persuasion in convincing me.

For the billionth time: both Comcast and Disney make lots of money off the deal...in Disney's case it's 100% free money - that's what fees for ip with no operational costs yields - and they are as happy as clams.

 

[DanBoris]

no offence, but you don't have any kind of proof, you just have angry internet fan theories along the same lines as people on-line believing Luke Skywalker was Kylo Ren a few months ago... which really didn't make any kind of sense but whole lot of people seemed to want to believe anyway... So if keep that in mind and just you look at the Marvel thing logically, it all kind of falls into place...

First off Disney owns "all" the Marvel characters, so why would they build themed lands in their parks for just the Avengers/MCU characters? The answer is they won't... and they haven't, but they can't build a themed land for all the Marvel characters until they get all the Marvel Movies into a single story continuity, which they seem to be in the process of doing

Disney/Marvel's "Captain America Civil War", which comes out May 6th, will introduce the new Spiderman that will also be appearing in Sony's stand alone films, and a then a few weeks later on May 27th Fox's "X-men Apocalypse" will be released which will probably be the end of the current X-men story line... so it sounds like a re-boot of X-men is coming up real soon

Once Disney solves the problem of the story continuity and gets the Disney/Sony/Fox film in sync, they are also making it more and more difficult and expensive for Universal to do anything with Marvel in Orlando. At a certain point they only way for Universal to make any money on the theme park rights to Marvel is buy selling those theme park rights to Disney, and the distribution deal for DreamWorks probably figures into that, because Disney is "letting it expire". Comcast/Universal and the Walt Disney Company don't really care how they make money, as long as the keep making money and not losing it.

So step one is getting all the movies in sync, and when Kevin Feigie got moved to Walt Disney Films, he also stopped producing/supervising Marvel Television to focus completely on the films, and I'm assuming that means not just the "Disney/Marvel" produced films but also the "Sony" Spiderman, and probably the "20th Century Fox" films as well. Then not long after that it was Announced that Joe Rohde would head up Marvel Theme park attractions, but the movies are going dictate whatever they do in the parks, so we're going to have to wait and see what happens with Civil War and X-men Apocalypse this May

How exactly will Universal stop making money on Marvel? Everything Disney does with Marvel indirectly benefits Universal so as long as Marvel remains popular it will make money for Universal. The amount Universal pays is tied to the rate of inflation, not the popularity of the franchise. Since Marvel is dramatically more popular now then when the contract was made it's likely that Universal is paying a bargain price for the license.

There is no way Universal is giving up the rights anytime soon. You don't even need to take out word for it....

"Asked in an interview in July if Universal would ever sell those rights, Thomas L. Williams, Universal’s theme park chairman, answered with one word: “No.”"

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/16/b...for-star-wars-attractions.html?referrer=&_r=0

 

[lockedoutlogic]

How exactly will Universal stop making money on Marvel? Everything Disney does with Marvel indirectly benefits Universal so as long as Marvel remains popular it will make money for Universal. The amount Universal pays is tied to the rate of inflation, not the popularity of the franchise. Since Marvel is dramatically more popular now then when the contract was made it's likely that Universal is paying a bargain price for the license.

There is no way Universal is giving up the rights anytime soon. You don't even need to take out word for it....

"Asked in an interview in July if Universal would ever sell those rights, Thomas L. Williams, Universal’s theme park chairman, answered with one word: “No.”"

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/16/b...for-star-wars-attractions.html?referrer=&_r=0

This.

Every single thing they do cross promote each other via the ip and they both sell more tickets/travel/merchandise and split the take.

I think the basis to this crazy, borderline hateful tact on this thread is the illusion that rides = more money.

At universal now...they likely do. And at Disney in the 90's they did...but since then they fight economics and brutal realities to spend as little as they can on ride systems because they have far more diminishing returns once Disney hit the average vacation wall at 7 days when AK opened.

Realize that for Disney to build a marvel park in Florida and for it to be worth it the average stay would have to increase by 2-3 days past the societal limit of roughly 7...and they have no way to change that. They might be unable to hold that line. They met their immovable object there.

 

[TT77]

I never said I did have any proof.

I've never said Disney would never get the rights back but I don't see it happening any time soon at least not in the next 10 years. Disney and universal seem very happy with the deal right now I don't see any reason they don't. If Disney was eager to get marvel in the parks it would've been done in Disneyland, or at any of the foreign parks. So far nothing more than meet and greets has been done in Disneyland and you have one iron man attraction in Hong Kong. Not even Shanghai is opening with anything more than meet and greets.

This thread is regarding what other lands could come to DHS. It's not a universal vs. Disney debate and it's not about whether marvel is coming to the WDW parks because it isn't right now.

So why do you all think Joe Rohde was put in charge of developing the Marvel properties for the parks worldwide last fall? to me that seems like an indication that they plan on the Marvel properties for the parks worldwide

 

[TT77]

How exactly will Universal stop making money on Marvel? Everything Disney does with Marvel indirectly benefits Universal so as long as Marvel remains popular it will make money for Universal. The amount Universal pays is tied to the rate of inflation, not the popularity of the franchise. Since Marvel is dramatically more popular now then when the contract was made it's likely that Universal is paying a bargain price for the license.

There is no way Universal is giving up the rights anytime soon. You don't even need to take out word for it....

"Asked in an interview in July if Universal would ever sell those rights, Thomas L. Williams, Universal’s theme park chairman, answered with one word: “No.”"

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/16/b...for-star-wars-attractions.html?referrer=&_r=0

As Disney is developing the Marvel properties for the it's parks worldwide Universal would have spend money to compete... except Universal won't be able to off the film versions of the characters Like they can with Harry Potter, so is suspect at some point Thomas L. Williams, will sell out

 

[rteetz]

So why do you all think Joe Rohde was put in charge of developing the Marvel properties for the parks worldwide last fall? to me that seems like an indication that they plan on the Marvel properties for the parks worldwide

Just because he was put in charge doesn't mean they are going to get the Orlando rights. They can still go world wide without Orlando.

Also if they wanted to go world wide so urgently it would've been done already. Rohde was put in charge last year.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

As Disney is developing the Marvel properties for the it's parks worldwide Universal would have spend money to compete... except Universal won't be able to off the film versions of the characters Like they can with Harry Potter, so is suspect at some point Thomas L. Williams, will sell out

You have to be trolling...if so well played.

But for everybody else: universal is Comcast...Comcast is worth more than Disney.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

So why do you all think Joe Rohde was put in charge of developing the Marvel properties for the parks worldwide last fall? to me that seems like an indication that they plan on the Marvel properties for the parks worldwide

Nope, nope, nopeity-nope

 

[TT77]

Okay so you criticize us for only having "angry internet fan theories" (not angry by the way, I just find the people's refusal to deal with reality laughable) but then you spin a wild theory with no timeline, that ignores known facts and that doesn't even pass the most basic logic test. Just a few problems with your theory:

• There's no need for a unified Marvel Cinematic Universe in order to build a Superhero land. They could easily just introduce new characters as they got them.
• While Sony and Disney are on relatively good terms and currently working together, it is well documented that Fox and Disney do not. To the extent that Marvel Comics have stopped publishing a Fantastic Four comic and have de-emphasized the X-Men franchise along with associated posters, toys etc.
• Disney has no legal say in how Fox & Sony use their licenses. Those licenses are in perpetuity so long as movies are produced by certain dates.
• Where is your evidence that Disney are making it more expensive for Universal to do anything with their Marvel License? Universal is on record that they will not be letting that license go and it is reported to be quite profitable for them. What could Disney even do?
• Kevin Feige's move (again widely reported) has nothing to do with Sony or Fox and everything to do with clashes between him and Marvel CEO Ike Perlmutter (who is known to be something of a micromanager)

You can spin any fantasies you like but don't get all upset when the rest of the world points out that's all they are.

Fox and Disney don't have problems, Fox and Disney are building Avatarland in Orlando at the moment, Fox and Marvel's CEO Ike Perlmutter have the problems for the reasons you mentioned, and for those reason Ike Perlmutter was cut out of Marvel film by Bob Iger and Alan Horn when they put Kevin Feige in charge of Marvel Films

The things you've listed as "widely reported" are the angry fan theories, that's seems to be where the confusion is coming from. I not spining fantasies, I'm trying to inform people the difference between logic and "fan news" site click bait

 

[TT77]

Nope, nope, nopeity-nope

you seem to be the one trolling

 

[TT77]

Nope, nope, nopeity-nope

lockoutlogic is a good name for you

 

[rteetz]

Fox and Disney don't have problems, Fox and Disney are building Avatarland in Orlando at the moment, Fox and Marvel's CEO Ike Perlmutter have the problems for the reasons you mentioned, and for those reason Ike Perlmutter was cut out of Marvel film by Bob Iger and Alan Horn when they put Kevin Feige in charge of Marvel Films

The things you've listed as "widely reported" are the angry fan theories, that's seems to be where the confusion is coming from. I not spining fantasies, I'm trying to inform people the difference between logic and "fan news" site click bait

You don't back up this logic with facts.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

You don't back up this logic with facts.

Not at all...that's the problem with not well versed fandom

 

[lockedoutlogic]

you seem to be the one trolling

It's hard to even be nice here...you are just not following.

Can't you just trust when both Disney and Comcast - repeatedly - till the cows come home shoot down every suggestion that the contract is gonna change in 2.2 seconds or less?

Just can't accept it?

 

[DanBoris]

As Disney is developing the Marvel properties for the it's parks worldwide Universal would have spend money to compete... except Universal won't be able to off the film versions of the characters Like they can with Harry Potter, so is suspect at some point Thomas L. Williams, will sell out

They won't?

 

[Eoghann]

The things you've listed as "widely reported" are the angry fan theories, that's seems to be where the confusion is coming from. I not spining fantasies, I'm trying to inform people the difference between logic and "fan news" site click bait

You haven't presented any logic at all. Logic is not taking 4 unrelated facts and joining them together to suit your narrative. Nor is it making statements as though they are fact when you have not one shred of evidence to support them.

Ignored.

 

[seascapemvy]

You have to be trolling...if so well played.

But for everybody else: universal is Comcast...Comcast is worth more than Disney.

Comcast is not worth more than Disney. Look up their market cap for yourself.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Comcast is not worth more than Disney. Look up their market cap for yourself.

Comcast has
Traditionally operated with more operating capital and cash on hand.

Their market caps are close. About an 8% difference.

The premise of the poor, misguided "argument" I was discussing was "Disney rich...universal poor"

But you have to speak slowly, use pictures and BIG words to even have a chance of penetrating the shields.