Old China vs New China Itinerary

[MeDisney]

Any feedback or comments on the new China vs the old China itinerary? Here are some differences between the itineraries that I noticed. I seem to prefer the older itineraries vs the newer ones which seem to have less activities.

OLD
(*These are in the old itinerary that do not appear in the new itinerary.)
Hong Kong: dinner, market
Guilin: flight, white elephant
Chengdu: Tai chi, tuk-tuk food tour, face opera, hot pot
Shanghai: light show

NEW
(*These are in the new itinerary, not in the older version.)
Beijing: peking dinner, dinner
Guilin: train, dumpling dinner
Xi An: bike, Muslim quarter

 

[sayhello]

Any feedback or comments on the new China vs the old China itinerary? Here are some differences between the itineraries that I noticed. I seem to prefer the older itineraries vs the newer ones which seem to have less activities.

I did the China trip in 2018. The itinerary didn't change much that I know of, between then and 2024.

OLD
(*These are in the old itinerary that do not appear in the new itinerary.)
Hong Kong: dinner, market

I assume you're talking about the welcome dinner that's now a welcome breakfast. Yes, one less meal, but it's not a big deal. The food was good, but nothing earth-shaking. The market was fun, but again, not a huge loss.

Guilin: flight, white elephant

I'd much rather take the train than fly! This is a different order of days. The white elephant exchange *WAS* a tremendous amount of fun. It's too bad they didn't keep that.

Chengdu: Tai chi, tsk-tuk food tour, face opera hot pot

The Tai Chi was not very well attended. The timing was awkward. It was right in the middle of getting ready/having breakfast so you'd really have to juggle things or not clean up afterwards to do it. I chose to sleep in a bit instead! Apparently so did almost everyone else (only 7 people participated).

I don't recall a tuk-tuk food tour. I don't see it on the website.

The face-changing opera *is*, to me, the biggest loss of the new itinerary. I really, really enjoyed it. But I'm not sure if it's still performed anywhere besides Chengdu. And the way they have re-arranged the days, to me, is a GOOD thing. Skipping Chengdu means you don't have to do the death march day of Chengdu -> Xi'an -> Guilin all in one day in order to see the terracotta soldiers. And I've heard good things about Xi'an (see below). You still see Pandas in Xi'an, so I call it a good change.

The Hot Pot restaurant was great, it's too bad they haven't found another one to take you to.

Shanghai: light show

We didn't see the light show in Shanghai. At least, not as a part of the ABD. Some of us walked across the street from the Shanghai Peninsula to watch it after our post-day in Shanghai.

NEW
(*These are in the new itinerary, not in the older version.)
Beijing: peking dinner, dinner

The peking duck dinner was part of the itinerary back when I did it. It was an interesting experience. I didn't really like the peking duck, but others really did. I supposed it's one of those things you should try at least once!

Guilin: train, dumpling dinner

The train to Guilin sounds wonderful! We did a flight to Guilin followed by a LONG bus ride after an EXTREMELY long day!! This sounds SO much more relaxing. And dumplings are always good.

Xi An: bike, Muslim quarter

Samantha Brown did a show on China, and one of the activities she did was biking the walls of Xi'an. It actually looks like a very cool activity to me. Xi'an looks very nice, and I would have liked to have spent more time there. I don't know anything about visiting the Muslim quarter.

Anyways, a few good things lost, several really positive gains. Overall, still a FABULOUS itinerary!

Sayhello

 

[MeDisney]

Wow thank you so much for the detailed response! That really helps. I’m glad the new itinerary is not worse than the original. I’ll have to check out that bike tour.

 

[sayhello]

Here's the Samantha Brown episode about Xi'an.

https://samantha-brown.com/episodes/season-1/xian-china/

Sayhello

 

[thanxfornoticin]

Holy cow. I read your old/new list and figured I was missing something, that they would never skip Chengdu. But they really are. We did the trip in 2019, and Chengdu was absolutely one of the top 3 highlights of the trip - the food, the beautiful/spotless 'panda city' itself, the panda reserve, and the face-changing opera (amazing). We've even talked about returning to spend more time just in Chengdu. Having experienced some of these things in 2019, and now seeing the 2025 itinerary, we'd have to think extra long before paying that much money for what appears to be much less in the way of experiences. I absolutely agree with the above poster who mentions the long, sometimes difficult travel days around China. But instead of removing Chengdu, they should have added a day on the tour to not rush Xi'An. Glad we did the trip when we did - in more ways than one.

 

[sayhello]

Holy cow. I read your old/new list and figured I was missing something, that they would never skip Chengdu. But they really are. We did the trip in 2019, and Chengdu was absolutely one of the top 3 highlights of the trip - the food, the beautiful/spotless 'panda city' itself, the panda reserve, and the face-changing opera (amazing). We've even talked about returning to spend more time just in Chengdu. Having experienced some of these things in 2019, and now seeing the 2025 itinerary, we'd have to think extra long before paying that much money for what appears to be much less in the way of experiences. I absolutely agree with the above poster who mentions the long, sometimes difficult travel days around China. But instead of removing Chengdu, they should have added a day on the tour to not rush Xi'An. Glad we did the trip when we did - in more ways than one.

Oh, I agree with you. Adding a day would have made much more sense than removing Chengdu altogether. But for some reason they seem far more likely to remove days from ABDs than to add days. In fact, I don't think I've ever seen them add days to an ABD that I can recall.
I just wonder if something happened to the venues in Chengdu over COVID that made them change their minds about Chengdu? Someone on a fb group mentioned that the bathrooms at the face-changing venue this year were absolutely gross. Which I totally do not remember them being bad at all. It took China far longer to return to "normal" tourism post-pandemic. Who knows?

Sayhello

 

[MeDisney]

Holy cow. I read your old/new list and figured I was missing something, that they would never skip Chengdu. But they really are. We did the trip in 2019, and Chengdu was absolutely one of the top 3 highlights of the trip - the food, the beautiful/spotless 'panda city' itself, the panda reserve, and the face-changing opera (amazing). We've even talked about returning to spend more time just in Chengdu. Having experienced some of these things in 2019, and now seeing the 2025 itinerary, we'd have to think extra long before paying that much money for what appears to be much less in the way of experiences. I absolutely agree with the above poster who mentions the long, sometimes difficult travel days around China. But instead of removing Chengdu, they should have added a day on the tour to not rush Xi'An. Glad we did the trip when we did - in more ways than one.

I agree with you that I was disappointed with the removal of Chengdu. We love to travel for food and we were looking forward to Chengdu as it is a UNESCO gastronomy city. It's interesting that you say you would go there to spend more time and I have considered a pre/post trip there but the logistics look difficult and would have preferred the services of ABD to take us there.

I love your idea to add a day to Xi'an, but as Sayhello mentioned, ABD seems take away days rather than add. They have done that to many older itineraries such as Peru, that now ends in Cusco instead of Lima plus the removal of the lunch, making it also more difficult to get home.

I do love the older itineraries and glad to have done several of them. But now I'm considering other China tours that visit Chengdu. A&K has an itinerary that includes 2 days each in Chengdu and Xi'an, plus a cruise with similar or less than cost of ABD, depending on cruise rooms. It does not go to Hong Kong or Guilin but does other cities. And of course no park visits. But the itinerary has me thinking I should try A&K this time. Hong Kong seems like an easier place for me to add than Chengdu.

 

[sayhello]

I agree with you that I was disappointed with the removal of Chengdu. We love to travel for food and we were looking forward to Chengdu as it is a UNESCO gastronomy city. It's interesting that you say you would go there to spend more time and I have considered a pre/post trip there but the logistics look difficult and would have preferred the services of ABD to take us there.

I love your idea to add a day to Xi'an, but as Sayhello mentioned, ABD seems take away days rather than add. They have done that to many older itineraries such as Peru, that now ends in Cusco instead of Lima plus the removal of the lunch, making it also more difficult to get home.

I do love the older itineraries and glad to have done several of them. But now I'm considering other China tours that visit Chengdu. A&K has an itinerary that includes 2 days each in Chengdu and Xi'an, plus a cruise with similar or less than cost of ABD, depending on cruise rooms. It does not go to Hong Kong or Guilin but does other cities. And of course no park visits. But the itinerary has me thinking I should try A&K this time. Hong Kong seems like an easier place for me to add than Chengdu.

Guilin (the cruise on the Li River/gumdrop mountains) is really beautiful and special. The shopping in Yangzou could happen anywhere.

Hong Kong is also a very interesting place, but it does make the logistics a bit more complicated because of the no Visa needed for Hong Kong vs mainland China. Speaking of which, that really *would* complicate things a bit logistics-wise if you do Chengdu *before* the trip, because you'd have to enter mainland China, exit and go to Hong Kong on your own. I really liked having ABD handle the arrival in mainland China. Just something to keep in mind. Maybe a post-day instead?

I still think that, compared to some of the other trips they've "slimmed down" over the years, the changes to the China trip are definitely not even close to the worst I've seen. Still VERY worth doing.

Sayhello

 

[MeDisney]

Guilin (the cruise on the Li River/gumdrop mountains) is really beautiful and special. The shopping in Yangzou could happen anywhere.

Hong Kong is also a very interesting place, but it does make the logistics a bit more complicated because of the no Visa needed for Hong Kong vs mainland China. Speaking of which, that really *would* complicate things a bit logistics-wise if you do Chengdu *before* the trip, because you'd have to enter mainland China, exit and go to Hong Kong on your own. I really liked having ABD handle the arrival in mainland China. Just something to keep in mind. Maybe a post-day instead?

I still think that, compared to some of the other trips they've "slimmed down" over the years, the changes to the China trip are definitely not even close to the worst I've seen. Still VERY worth doing.

Sayhello

The Nat Geo Signature China looks like it has Chengdu and Xi’an with a mix of flights, trains, and cruise. But after reading a post on the Egypt Nat Geo on here, not sure I’d do it over ABD. Nice that A&K does laundry mid trip.

 

[*WDW*Groupie*]

I agree with you that I was disappointed with the removal of Chengdu. We love to travel for food and we were looking forward to Chengdu as it is a UNESCO gastronomy city. It's interesting that you say you would go there to spend more time and I have considered a pre/post trip there but the logistics look difficult and would have preferred the services of ABD to take us there.

I love your idea to add a day to Xi'an, but as Sayhello mentioned, ABD seems take away days rather than add. They have done that to many older itineraries such as Peru, that now ends in Cusco instead of Lima plus the removal of the lunch, making it also more difficult to get home.

I do love the older itineraries and glad to have done several of them. But now I'm considering other China tours that visit Chengdu. A&K has an itinerary that includes 2 days each in Chengdu and Xi'an, plus a cruise with similar or less than cost of ABD, depending on cruise rooms. It does not go to Hong Kong or Guilin but does other cities. And of course no park visits. But the itinerary has me thinking I should try A&K this time. Hong Kong seems like an easier place for me to add than Chengdu.

I have traveled with A&K and I'm not sure I'd choose to again. While knowledgeable, the A&K guides do not try to form any kind of connection with the guests. I recall when we were in Ushuaia we asked the guides for a restaurant recommendation and they told us the best one in town. But when we got there every table was filled with A&K guides (outgoing and incoming) and they made it clear to us that they would he there for several hours. Would've been nice if they had told us in advance of sending us there -- why did they think we were asking them? The guides are *nothing* like ABD guides and fellow travelers mostly kept to themselves since there was no effort on the part of the guides to help establish any connections between the guests. Just my $0.02.

 

[TikiThunderPirates]

While the face changing opera in Chengdu was interesting, and the Panda's are a highlight for most people, We didn't actually spend much time in Chengdu during our ABD. By the time we arrived it was later in the day, and by the time you check into the hotel it's basically dinner and done for the night. Next day is Panda's and you do end up with several hours in the afternoon where most people did some walking/shopping in the downtown area, because that evening was the face changing opera and you needed to be ready to board the bus. And the next morning you're on a flight again out of Chengdu.

Now the food we had was great, some of the most memorable of the trip due to the Sichuan-style food, but overall it didn't feel like we saw that much of Chengdu. It was great to have experienced a stop in that region of China, but if cutting out Chengdu gets rid of the "Amazing Race" day of two flights in one day (which it does on the new itinerary) then that feels like a win over all. That day is just so miserable and Xi'an was definitely a place we would have loved to have more than a few hours.

As a note we did not have the tuk-tuk tour in Chengdu, just sit down restaurants for all the meals and in Beijing we had the peking duck dinner which was really really good.

It was a bit concerning at the start of our tour when they made changes, (like removing the tuk-tuk food tour) but at the end of the trip, we felt like as long as we hit all the major stuff (which we did) the small things like where we ate didn't end up mattering to us as much as we thought it would. The food was always amazing and we came away realizing the details didn't matter as much as we thought and stressed they would. It's a great trip and even with the changes we would go, and enjoy one less flight in a very very packed itinerary.