Observations about Park dining and ADRs

Momelie

Mouseketeer
Joined
Apr 14, 2004
Messages
489
This isn't meant to be about the DDP at all, but a general observation I made this weekend about the current state of dining at WDW.

We ate at the Plaza on Saturday evening, around 6pm. We were given the window table right in front of the check in desk. It was right in front of me and I couldn't help but notice some things.

First - I can't tell you how many people kept walking up and asking for a table, only to be told that they had no reservations. I'm honestly estimating over 100 in a nearly 2 hour period (while we were waiting for table, then full 3 course meal). The looks on their faces, for the most part, were a sight to be seen!

Second - Out of those people that were asking for a table, I would estimate that 80-85% had NO idea that a reservation would be needed at all. Out of that 80%, over half were on the DDP, and said they needed to use their credits somewhere, but nowhere had reservations available. I really felt sorry for the woman who you could tell had been told the same thing at other restaurants, and then told her family they'd just go get hot dogs across the street. The CMs were sending people to Tomorrowland Noodle Station, which was amazingly open.

Third - I was honestly amazed at those who were told there were no reservations, and then proceeded to argue with the CMs about said availability! Like dissing the CM is going to get you a table - yeah, right. Although I did like the style of the guy that tried to bribe his way in - next time use more than a $5 bill, though. The CMs were really taking a battering, and it really wasn't their fault. No wonder they changed shifts frequently!

My overwhelming feeling after seeing this played out in most of the restaurants I ate in over the long weekend, is that the whole dining end of the parks is in DIRE need of something, but I'm not sure what. Expansion? Don't sell more DDPs than you have seats available? Better communication and education about making ADRs? (God forbid what that would do to little ole me, though! I'm on DDE, and while I'm there 2-4 times a month (about 5 nights), I never know 180 days in advance!)

I also encountered what I thought was gross overcrowding in the CS restaurants, though not quite as intense as the TS at dinnertime. Pinnochio's Village Haus, I literally had to ask somebody who looked like they were about to leave if I could have their table - and somebody else tried to slip in while we were making the switch! I thought some fights were going to break out.

Anyway, it seems like the demand for tables GREATLY exceeds the supply. Don't know what to do about it, but..... its there, and I don't think its going to get any better without some change.

What do you think?
 
You bring up some good points. It's hard to know how many people now use the DDP, but it's safe to say that it has caused more people to dine at TS restaurants than would have without it. That and the general upswing in park attendance mean that there are more people jockeying for the same number of seats.

And, it certainly helps explain why Disney has decided to convert Tusker House to a TS restaurant.
 
I think you are absolutely right. When we were there in November '06, I was blown away by how much harder it is to get into the restaurants than on our previous trip (April05 (both times on DDP). I had ALL of my ADR's made in Nov, but still had to wait a long time and deal with lots of overcrowding. My family became quickly tired of wasting precious park time 'waiting' to get into eat. Our mission is to get in, eat and get out. But it was just as bad, if not worse, at the buffets. We thought the buffets would be better (with a 2 year old anyway):confused3 Worst was Teppanyaki, must have been a bad night. We gave up on our ADR after waiting over an hour (and we were there early as instructed). We ate snacks and CS and lost a TS. :mad:

We leave in several weeks:cool1: and I have tried to book meals that I hope will help avoid the crowds. I almost didn't book it this time, but we tried to give it one more shot. :)
 

I noticed the same thing in December, saw a woman at San Angel Inn argue with the cm for several minutes when she couldn't just walk in and be seated. Just like I noticed people on MVMCP nights getting irate that they had to leave MK since they didn't have wrist bands and people irate because they couldn't get into the Candlelight Processional Dinner Package line and couldn't get on the rides via the fastpass line since they didn't have a fastpass. WDW vacations are all about planning and not everyone knows that poor things. I feel for them. And while the DDP is partly responsible for the increased patronage in restaurants, the Disney Dining Experience Card as well as just increased numbers of people going to WDW in general are also to blame. Disney is doing a terrific job of marketing their product. I agree that they need to have more seats at restaurants, the cs places are horrible during peak times. Sort of like a Wal Mart on Christmas Eve, one hour before closing type mentality!

I do have to say that when you purhcase a package through a TA, or Disney directly and that package includes the DDP you are told when to make your dining reservations, the number to call etc. People clearly do not read the information on the product they just spent thousands of dollars buying. So in that sense I think its just sort of dumb on their part. I realize not everyone is a disboarder who knows all there is to know, but if you bought something, anything and don't read the directions you have nobody to blame but yourself.
 
"...just increased numbers of people going to WDW in general are also to blame. Disney is doing a terrific job of marketing their product."

Good point. We bought into DVC nine years ago and were thrilled the first few years with how manageable the parks were during the "off season." We would go in the fall and had great times. About four or five years ago we were there for a fall trip and could not believe the crowds. Not as heavy as summer, but certainly not off season. Disney had come up with the "food and wine festival." Now there is the free dining period, and the springtime flower festival (or whatever it is.)

On top of this, Disney has built quite a number of new resort hotels, many of them affordable (not dissing those who can't afford the Grand Floridian -- I am one who appreciates Disney making magical on-site resort hotel vacations more affordable for everyone). During the same time, there has been no increase in the number of parks available. In fact, there is now one less water park.

Seems to me the idea, a good one from a business standpoint, is to pack people into the parks year round. Packed parks with no significant increase in restaurants and dining options means more demand at the restaurants. This requires advanced planning and ADRs and virtually shuts out walk-ins.

Again, this is good from a business standpoint, but sort of takes the wind out of the "Magic" sails in my book.

Would that Disney would honor Walt and set aside the almighty dollar and the every expectant share holder just a bit and think about building addtional parks, additional attractions and additional dining options to keep up with the demand a little better. Don't need perrenial light-crowd parks, but the huge increases in patrons we have seen over the last ten years is taking its toll, with no relief in sight.

Just my humble "disappointed during our off season visits" opinion.

BTW, I love Disney planning and thrive on grabbing those ADRs 180 days out and we still enjoy our vacations. We have just tailored our expectations and how we manage the parks and dining. Sure wish for those more spontaneous days of old though.
 
"...just increased numbers of people going to WDW in general are also to blame. Disney is doing a terrific job of marketing their product."

Good point. We bought into DVC nine years ago and were thrilled the first few years with how manageable the parks were during the "off season." We would go in the fall and had great times. About four or five years ago we were there for a fall trip and could not believe the crowds. Not as heavy as summer, but certainly not off season. Disney had come up with the "food and wine festival." Now there is the free dining period, and the springtime flower festival (or whatever it is.)

On top of this, Disney has built quite a number of new resort hotels, many of them affordable (not dissing those who can't afford the Grand Floridian -- I am one who appreciates Disney making magical on-site resort hotel vacations more affordable for everyone). During the same time, there has been no increase in the number of parks available. In fact, there is now one less water park.

Seems to me the idea, a good one from a business standpoint, is to pack people into the parks year round. Packed parks with no significant increase in restaurants and dining options means more demand at the restaurants. This requires advanced planning and ADRs and virtually shuts out walk-ins.

Again, this is good from a business standpoint, but sort of takes the wind out of the "Magic" sails in my book.

Would that Disney would honor Walt and set aside the almighty dollar and the every expectant share holder just a bit and think about building addtional parks, additional attractions and additional dining options to keep up with the demand a little better. Don't need perrenial light-crowd parks, but the huge increases in patrons we have seen over the last ten years is taking its toll, with no relief in sight.

Just my humble "disappointed during our off season visits" opinion.

BTW, I love Disney planning and thrive on grabbing those ADRs 180 days out and we still enjoy our vacations. We have just tailored our expectations and how we manage the parks and dining. Sure wish for those more spontaneous days of old though.

I so agree with you. Its MVMCP, MNSSHP, F & W Festival, Pirates and Princess Parties, Free Dining, and a bunch of other things they do now to reel people in all year long. And its not just WDW. Disneyland is the same way. And they don't have a DDP or anywhere near the full service dining WDW does so you can't say its a DDP thing at Disneyland. I miss the off season days too, yet I love the new rides, shows, and all the other perks of them being busier and therefore having more money to invest in the upgrades.

In the end, as long as there are this many people going to WDW, they will eat, sleep and ride everthing the rest of us do and we will feel the affects of it. DDP or not.
 
::yes:: Momelie, your post is one of the best I have ever seen!
It has been harder to get at TS when you just want to wing it. The days of just walking up to Crystal Palace are no more :sad2: . I think Disney needs to add more TS locations (the 2 new ones at AK are a good start).
 
Just a thought here from my own experience which I have written about on the RB before..

One night, we were exhausted, came back to our hotel, Yacht Club and wanted to eat somewhere. We went to the Galley Restaurant and were turned away as a walk-in.....yet when I looked in, the restaurant appeared relatively open for tables.. I went to guest services and talked to someone, she suggested I use room service. I thought this is strange, why are the tables not taken. Another castmember heard our conversation with the previous castmember at guest services, looked up the Galley and said when would you like to dine... She said 5 minutes from now? I said that would be great. She made a reservation, gave me the slip and back I go to their hostess station outside where one of the castmembers said to me, you learn fast. I thought what the heck is going on here, in we walked and had a nice dinner...

Are they trying to discourage walk-ins, I do not know, are they holding tables for future reservations, I do not know, but something was strange that night and we did get to eat. Thank goodness, we were pretty hungry and needed to sit down.

Momelie, great post on your observations......
 
Out of that 80%, over half were on the DDP, and said they needed to use their credits somewhere, but nowhere had reservations available.

This is from the OP's thoughts. I believe this will become a major issue in months to come. People don't realize how difficult it has become to walk into a restaurant and many don't know which park they'll be in when so they don't want to be tied to a reservation. I know we always make them but we often changed them last minute. Not anymore.

I believe you'll hear alot of complaints about not being able to use TS credits this summer. The DDP looks like it's now oversold and coupled with OOP patrons, it's become impossible to walk in and use.

Stay tuned.
 
I've just got my wife to read this thread to try and explain to her why i am making plans for our adrs so i have a list for when i ring up,and why i have to do this 180 days in advance.We go in Dec and she wanted to wing it,but at last she has realised why i've been working out where we are going to eat.Thanks,you've made my life easier.:thumbsup2
 
I think part of what needs to be understood is that the restaurants are not taking walk ups. However, if you call Disney Dining, you might be able to get an ADR within the next 20-30 minutes. Carry a cell phone with the DD number programmed into it and call before you walk up. I've read more frequent stories of people who were told "no walk ups" but turned around, called Disney dining, made and ADR and were in within a half hour.
 
I have to say that I have been lucky enough to have never experienced what I am hearing everywhere about TS being so hard to come by.

We have travelled 5 times to Disney and NEVER had a problem getting seated at a TS restaurant, either as a walk-up or making an ADR in advance, be it days or weeks.

We have just booked for end of August this year (free dining period) and I was able to get every TS reservation I wanted for the whole time we are there. While I didn't have definite times and was flexible on some dates, I was fixed on 2 restaurants on 2 particular dates (one of which included Le cellier) and was able to get exactly what I wanted.

Maybe I just got lucky, maybe it was a bit of Disney 'magic' or maybe I just was flexible enough that my plans didn't suffer.

Whilst I don't believe that everything I am reading/hearing is 'hype' or lies, by the same token I would be interested to see statistics that prove without a doubt that people are not able to make ADRs because of the parks being too busy/overselling of the DDP/whatever it may be - rather than just lack of prior planning :confused3
 
restaurants DO take walkups if they're not booked. what's not done is space for walkups are not reserved. it's not saying much, but i got a scifi dine-in walkup in march.

but that will vary between restaurants anyway. even under the disney umbrella, they're all acting as separate entities in some respects. some will accommodate if you show up early, some will make you wait until your ADR time anyway.
 
Just my humble "disappointed during our off season visits" opinion.

BTW, I love Disney planning and thrive on grabbing those ADRs 180 days out and we still enjoy our vacations. We have just tailored our expectations and how we manage the parks and dining. Sure wish for those more spontaneous days of old though.


This sums up my feelings, too. I'm always torn when I see the deals, especially free dining, because I know that is the only way a lot of folks can take a Disney trip, but then I'm discouraged because we plan our trips during "slow season" in order to have a little breathing room in the parks/restaurants/resorts. "Slow season" is just gone, that's all.

And as far as the ADRs go, I find myself making more and more plans at off-beat places, where I'm sure to get an ADR and not have to wait 30 minutes to be seated even with that ADR!! Places like Fresh, and Tony's.

I've always said that as soon as a restaurant becomes a "darling" here on the Dis, it becomes impossible for us to get the ADR and it becomes impossible for the restaurant to keep up with all of the new adoring fans, and it crashes in quality and service.

I think that's what happened to Brittany Spears . . .
 
We travel in the "off-season" (January) and every year I think it gets busier and busier. We have seen many, many people turned away at TS restaurants. I try and stress to friends and relative who are traveling to WDW to make the ADRs!!! You really can't go to WDW today without them and expect to get into any TS restaurant.

I think the increased volume to people means they need to build more restaurants. I few new ones would be great!!!
 
A large number of people, don't like to make reservations for dining, because they feel like they're being tied down, and lose they're flexability. I can't tell you how many times I've talked to people planning trips to Disney, and I ask them, have you made your dining reservations? They say not all of them, we're going to leave several meals open, and just see what happens. Well tough luck. You should have planned, and made res. 90 days out.
 
A large number of people, don't like to make reservations for dining, because they feel like they're being tied down, and lose they're flexability. I can't tell you how many times I've talked to people planning trips to Disney, and I ask them, have you made your dining reservations? They say not all of them, we're going to leave several meals open, and just see what happens. Well tough luck. You should have planned, and made res. 90 days out.
 
I'm definetly showing this post to my family so that they will "get it" about making dining plans 6 months in advance.
 
A large number of people, don't like to make reservations for dining, because they feel like they're being tied down, and lose they're flexability. I can't tell you how many times I've talked to people planning trips to Disney, and I ask them, have you made your dining reservations? They say not all of them, we're going to leave several meals open, and just see what happens. Well tough luck. You should have planned, and made res. 90 days out.

You mean 180 days out right seeing as you can make ADRs at 180 days now :)
 


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