New policy for reservations based on check IN date

[DVC Mike]

so all told you're looking at maybe a couple hundred unhappy members versus 100,000+ who are either blissfully unaware and won't be affected anyway, or who are aware and are happy with the new changes. I think making comments (and I've seen others here as well) that "membership" is unhappy with the new policy is misleading--some are unhappy with it but many many more are happy or don't care .

The majority of DVC members do not read forums like these, so when MS says the change was initiated at membership request they are most likely telling the truth. People complained about having holes in their reservations and wanted a system more like a hotel system and MS listened. The majority of DVC members do not read these forums, and so will not know, or even think about (it certainly never occurred to me until I read it here ) how to "work" the system to their advantage (they didn't know about DBD booking either). The majority of DVC members are good people who will play by the rules (just as they did before), and so in the end it will be a wash--hard to get times and room types will still be hard to get and other times will still not be a problem. There will be those who will take advantage, but that was the case before as well, and will be no matter what system is in place.

I think the bulk of the membership will be satisfied with the change. When DVC called me, they said they were getting emails both condemning and praising the change. They said the feedback would be considered by DVC management.

 

[bellazachmom]

OK, it's time for me to come clean ...

I need to apologize to the entire DVC membership because I feel that this new "enhancement" is all my fault.

You see, my family has been BCV owners for a few years but we have never been able to stay there because, due to my hubby's active duty military career, we can't seem to plan our trips very far in advance. Next year is different, however, and we know that he will be home April and May so we decided to take a trip to the happiest place on Earth. After visiting this board for a while, and reading many posts on the subject, I decided that I better call DBD to insure that we got our Ded 2BR/2Q at BCV.

Yep, that's right, my reservation must have been the one that pushed them over the edge!

So, to all of my fellow owners, I sincerely apologize.

 

[aurorafan]

Just addressing the comment that only 40-50 are opposed to this "enhancement"...

I didn't say only 40-50 were opposed to this "enhancement", I said there were probably only 40-50 in this thread--again my point being that this doesn't even come close to representing the whole "membership" of DVC. Again I know that there are others who are opposed to this that don't post here, but again I think they're in the minority.

There have been way more views of this thread than posts.

True, but many of those views are also from repeat viewers/posters

For me, the fact that the choice is out of my hands rubs me raw. Even if I'm not going at key times or for a key unit type, taking my choice away...it just irks me plain and simple that that fact now exists.

I understand that and can see where it would be a problem for those of you who did DBD. I would still argue that most of the members didn't even know about DBD and so this new policy won't affect them one way or the other. Most of them will assume it's like a hotel reservation (since they didn't do a "traditional" specific size unit/specific time of year timeshare) and that someone else got a room before they could. DVC's flexible program doesn't guarantee anyone a certain room type at a certain time of year, everything is subject to availability. I can also see the problems with more than 7 day bookings, and I'm sure that's one they'll hear about from lots of people, not just people on the boards.

 

[DVC Mike]

Why is it necessary to give DVC time to "tweak" their own policy before members express themselves to MS, even to the point of suggesting that the policy be "immediately revoked"? If that's how a member feels about the change, why discourage members from expressing their feelings?

My point was I feel that for people to demand that the policy be revoked without having a full and complete understanding of the new policy is a bit premature, as I said below. Yes, we can discuss our concerns about what the policy is, but there have been incorrect statements made (yes, I freely admit, based upon bad information given out by poorly trained MS staff) in this thread that have caused people to get very upset (for example, having to wait a week to book your 8th night).

I am just advising calm until all the details of this policy become clear. Yes, our discussion here is raising the issues we need to bring to DVC for further clarity, and that is going to happen -- eventually.

I didn't say we should not be discussing the potential effects of the change, as long as it's healthy discourse.

I just think people calling for the policy to be immediately revoked is premature. People have contacted DVC to express their individual concerns (I expressed mine yesterday when DVC called me in regards to my email).

Let's give DVC management a chance to receive, process and evaluate the member feedback and see if they would tweak the new policy. Let's give this some time to play out and see what affects this new policy really has, and what (if anything) DVC implements to address any shortcomings.

 

[Dean]

I can see where some of these things would save them money, but how can limiting banked points to 7 months and the other changes help them? Other than maybe getting people to spend money on more points?

I was just pulling items out of my hat that I felt had some credibility in ONE way or ANOTHER and would get people going. Many will say these things won't happen and I'd agree that most or all will not but are good focal points to discuss the issues and make the point that the current item is a minor change.

A minimum LOS would decrease phone calls and also allow better planning of housekeeping and other visit specific resources. Esp if they said a minimum stay of 3 days starting on Fri/Sat or 4 days starting on MondayTues. Limiting banking and borrowing could make reservations easier. Most options could serve to give developer purchases priority over resale.

 

[Laurabearz]

I think the bulk of the membership will be satisfied with the change. When DVC called me, they said they were getting emails both condemning and praising the change. They said the feedback would be considered by DVC management.

My guess is the majority of those sending in emails of praise have not thought about all the posible abuses that WILL occur.

 

[Dean]

Right, and I think this is why many people used DBD in the past. They felt it gave them the best shot during certain periods. It doesn't mean they used it all the time. For example, I'm sure you have quite a few tricks up your sleeve depending on what TS you're planning on using ... but I hardly think you use up your bag of tricks if you dont need to. It's not like you'd use them for every ressie I wouldn't think.

Exactly. Take our visit last week to Gatlinburg which I posted about earlier. I started with 12 units for one week each and made adjustments and changes over the months to end up with 9 units with part for a full week, part for 4 nights and part for 2 nights. I also got a free upgrade from a 2 BR to a 3 BR based on my priority within their system. Fortunately one of the benefits of having a higher priority in Bluegreen is free changes and cancellations. While a member who was not part of the priority group (based on how many points you own AND whether they are technically developer purchased or not) would have had a $35-50 change fee per each reservation and each change, changes were free to me as a Gold member. I positioned myself up front to be Gold, the highest priority level they had at the time, and to LIKELY be Platinum, them rumored to be coming and to be at either 60K or 65K points. Well the change is now coming and while it's not absolutely official, the details have been leaked and is very favorable to me. This will place me in the top priority group rumored to be around 350 members currently with some 300K (rough guess) or so total members.

 

[Dean]

There is a key difference between DBD and Walking though:

Again, emotion vs logic. Is there really a difference if it's allowed under the rules, intended or not. Does it really matter logically whether they intend to use that room that night or not if the rules allow the process. I'd suggest that it does not matter even if the action means the unit goes unused if it's within the rules, again intended or not, and that the system will adjust if it's not intended and enough of an issue to be seen as a problem.

My guess is the majority of those sending in emails of praise have not thought about all the posible abuses that WILL occur.

Laura, I think you're selling people short. Do you think that I can think of every possible way to use this system, or the next one or the one after that? I'd bet I can come up with additional usage options that give myself an advantage not yet posted on this thread and given I've already spent $50,000 in the past 6 years to put myself in a favorable position with my timeshares, I would be willing to invest $$$ to have that advantage if I felt it was necessary.

As DVCMike is trying to say, the system is in place, lets see where it truly settles out before we make a final judgement. Done appropriately it should do exactly what I believe DVC intended but it will require a backbone, something MS has been lacking over the years when it comes to sob stories or consistency. But regardless those who put enough time and effort in to learning the system will come out ahead of those that don't.

 

[jdg345]

My guess is the majority of those sending in emails of praise have not thought about all the posible abuses that WILL occur.

and/or they feel it doesn't affect them today, so they don't need to worry about. Vacation Needs can and do change ... many people forget that.

 

[Laurabearz]

Dean... The thought of walking a reservation would have never ever occurred to me, if I hadn't read it here.... But I will admit my brain is just not wired that way. I also feel that MOST DVC members wouldn't even even consider walking a reservation. To Me that's not selling them short, that's thinking highly of them

 

[bobbiwoz]

Found out about the rule while on vacation, (still having a great time at VWL!) and the first thing I thought was that I was glad I have NYE this year, what a mess it's going to be trying to get that next year. I do not like the new rules because they make it possible not to have an 11 month advantage for a home resort, and that is what I thought I had been guaranteed when I bought DVC.

Bobbi

 

[tidefan]

What we are trying to say here, is that that, under this new system, preference for any reservation is given to those who are arriving earlier, whereas before everyone had exactly the same opportunity to reserve any room. Whether they took the opportunity was up to them.

But, according to this logic, you will have priority over those arriving after you, and they will have priority over those arriving after them, etc...

And honestly I keep trying to see how this really is much more beneficial for those who booked their whole stay at once.

I think that there is a definite benefit of the new booking policy. It will severly reduce, if not eliminate, non-contiguous stays. Everyone keeps talking about "fairness" on this thread, well what is fair? Say I wanted to go from Dec 28th to Jan 4th. Under the old system, since apparently so many booked DBD to get NYE, there was a high probability that I would get 3 nights, be shut out for night 4, and then have the next 3 nights. Now I could waitlist and hope that comes through, but there is no guarantee that it will. Now, I would be stuck moving twice during my stay. Is that "fair", just so someone can be there for 1 night? Under the new system, I either get it or I don't, but my stay will be in 1 room the whole time.

I understand all of the concern of getting these rooms at certain times and that everyone wants them, but I don't think that the problem is the booking system, but rather that there is more demand for those rooms at certain times than there is supply. This is why I think that the most reasonable solution would be to bump the points up for those high demand times and lower them elsewhere. Isn't that what the point structure is intended to do anyway, to even out the demand over the year?

 

[tidefan]

Found out about the rule while on vacation, (still having a great time at VWL!) and the first thing I thought was that I was glad I have NYE this year, what a mess it's going to be trying to get that next year. I do not like the new rules because they make it possible not to have an 11 month advantage for a home resort, and that is what I thought I had been guaranteed when I bought DVC.

Bobbi

Just to make a quick point, if there are 400 members looking for a 300 room supply on a certain day, and all 400 call DBD at 11 months, then 100 of those members effectively don't have the 11 month window either, so you aren't "guaranteed" it under the old system either...

 

[kfalsey]

I agree with Dean, that the more dollars you have spent will give you an advantage in the new system definitely. (To insure this I just bought many additional points, so I can as others say game the system), when in actuality you are just trying to make that special date reservation, as the xmas reservations. For years many have been working with the system. I believe it is better since we can get the 7 day reservation together. I just became a member and was dreading going DBD. I could not believe that if I have the 11 mo window , I still had to call day by day. Being a new member I thought I had from the 11 mo to the 7 month before the vast majority started reservations. And, I know that the majority of the members did not know to go day by day to book. I will have 550 points for now which I believe should be fine. I hate to say this but, if you bought enough maybe you should have an advantage(?), since you will be the members going more often. I have read all the pages, and it does sound like everyone is getting a little emotional. Watching and thinking may be better for now. I am sure since we all read the boards here we can help each other as we have in the past, especially since I think most of the members do not even know about this site or the new rules. So, we as a group already have an advantage learning from others here.

 

[jade1]

But regardless those who put enough time and effort in to learning the system will come out ahead of those that don't.

Yep, and the folks contributing to this thread will likely be the most educated on the matter. So I would like to thank everyone and hope the discussion continues until all rules/angles/scenarios are covered.

 

[jade1]

the first thing I thought was that I was glad I have NYE this year, what a mess it's going to be trying to get that next year.

Bobbi

Same here, we have VWL until NYE-then switch to BCV....yea that will happen again.

 

[Luigi's Girl]

(SNIP) I hate to say this but, if you bought enough maybe you should have an advantage(?), since you will be the members going more often.

 

[robinb]

Same here, we have VWL until NYE-then switch to BCV....yea that will happen again.

I know how you feel. We have a standard view 1BR at BWV checking in on Sunday 12/28.

 

[SuzanneSLO]

I think that there is a definite benefit of the new booking policy. It will severly reduce, if not eliminate, non-contiguous stays.

I thought that at first as well, but the more I thought about it, I am not sure that it is really true. It seems to me that, under the old system, from the messages I read on these Boards, those who booked DBD at 11 months generally got most of the nights they wanted (AKV concierge excepted) and often got the missing nights using WL. Wondering if you were going to get all the nights may have been stressful, but it more cases, those booking this way were successful.

Where I see so many on these Boards reporting "involuntary split stays" was at the 7 month shuffle. I think that this new plan may help a little with that because members will have better knowledge about availability when they elect to switch and may elect not to switch at all based on that knowledge.

But I know that I booked my first DVC at 6 months out (BW view arriving on Columbus Day for 11 nights) with several missing nights. So call me a risk-taker (or a true believer in pixie dust) but I booked anyway and the WL came through for us on all but one night (we cancelled our back-up for that night and went home early).

And with the new WL policy prohiitng DBD WLs unless you have holes in your reservation, this may also encourage such "risky" bookings. -- Suzanne

 

[snowbunny]

It would be interesting (if I had the time, which I don't), to see whether there is crossover in the members who are angry about this change and those who have complained about long MS phone wait times.

I am thrilled about this change, it's one step in making the reservation system less time-consuming, cumbersome, and worry-inducing (what if I can't get the standard view on day 4????). All in one call, either I get it or I don't. Two thumbs up.