Nasty School Letter -- Other Way

[C.Ann]

There is a difference between exposure and immersion that borders on official sanction. Folks who believe in mixing religion and schooling, and feel strongly enough about it, have the option to home-school or send their children to private school. No majority should have the right to foster even a mildly-oppressive educational environment just for the sake of "fun". :

Schools can celebrate Thanksgiving and New Years. If more diversion is deemed necessary, more secular holidays can be introduced.

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Why are Thanksgiving and New Years okay, but nothing else?

 

[bicker]

why should we say no cupcakes for the entire school because a few have a weight problem?

When it was "a few" I agreed with you. It's not "a few" anymore so more substantial measures are appropriate. However, I think parents should be able to give their own (fit) children as many cupcakes as they wish.

Why are Thanksgiving and New Years okay

They're secular holidays.

 

[C.Ann]

They're secular holidays.

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Where does your taxpayers concern fit into that?

 

[bicker]

Where does your taxpayers concern fit into that?

Different thoughts. We're talking both about the celebrations, and the cupcakes served at them. The taxpayer concern was with regard to the impression that school resources, including teacher time, was being used to support these celebrations.

 

[C.Ann]

Different thoughts. We're talking both about the celebrations, and the cupcakes served at them. The taxpayer concern was with regard to the impression that school resources, including teacher time, was being used to support these celebrations.

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Ahhhh..but "teacher time" is being used anyhow when they just "change" the holiday to something else as in "Harvest Party", "Winter Celebration", etc.. And wouldn't teacher time be involved in Thanksgiving and New Years?

As for school resources, the only thing I can think of that is being used is the classroom (which is already in use) and as you mentioned, the teachers time (which with a little creativity could actually be a learning time).. Paper goods, decorations, treats, etc. are normally provided by parents..

 

[aplejax76]

I have read though this entire thread. I have never jumped into a debate but I have to on this one !!!!!! I am Catholic. Went to Catholic school all my life. We dressed up for our HALLOWEEN party and PARADE. I DO NOT think that schools should cancel the festitivies because it offends a couple parents. This is the first time I have heard of schools changing halloween. I hope it doesn't happen here!!!!!!!!!!!!! This so ridiculous!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[seashoreCM]

2 years ago my son wore an orange shirt and black pants to school on Halloween. I also put green hair gel in his hair. The teacher took him aside and told him she "didn't appreciate the way he was dressed" and that it was "Inappropriate". The male gym teacher also had on black sweats and an orange shirt. And the hair gel? He had worn the green and blue to school on several occasions. I hated that teacher.

Were the rules published in advance to the contrary?

Otherwise this one calls for a parent teacher conference where you take the teacher aside and tell her you don't appreciate how she deals with children. The teacher's behavior is called destroying self confidence. No need for you to to reference any particular holiday or tradition.

 

[Schmeck]

Umm, Thanksgiving is not secular - it's from the Pilgrims, who thanked God for their deliverance in the 'New World'... It's just been watered down in recent times.

Most of the major Christian holidays are based on pagan rituals - Easter, Christmas, etc... and All Saints' Day is a fabrication made to tone down the significance of Samhain.

 

[nuttylawprofessor]

Attention, there will be no more fun allowed in school. There is nothing to celebrate. Now stop smiling, that's not allowed either.

No, you can't have a treat. Eat your ketchup, it's one of your servings of veggies today.

At least we, as a country, are focusing on what is actually important.

 

[ThreeMusketeers]

OMG..People..schools...everyone..PLEASE LET OUR CHILDREN BE CHILDREN! LET THEM EAT CANDY AND BE HYPER ON HALLOWEEN. ARE ANY OF THESE KIDS THINKING OF DEMONS...NO!!! THEY ARE THINKING OF DRESSING UP LIKE A DISNEY PRINCESS..OR (OTHER FAVORITE DISNEY CHARACTER AND GETTING LOTS OF CANDY!! )

I SAY..GET OVER IT!

 

[lark]

That being said, I also think it incorrect for minorities religiously to demand that a school cancel celebrations for holidays. If 30 kids would love a Halloween party & 1 wouldn't, I think the decision is obvious.

I agree it's obvious -- although actually I think it's obvious the other way. 30 to 1 is exactly where this stuff is at its most pernicious.

There are a zillion ways to celebrate an October 31 holiday in a way that can still be fun for children but don't make those who find it inconsistent with their religious beliefs have to choose between attending school or participating in something that is inconsistent with their religion. Just as one Jewish child in a class of 31 shouldn't have to participate in a manger reenactment (or leave that day because his teachers and friends are), one Christian child should not have to participate in a celebration that celebrates something the child finds religiously abhorent. The damage done by making children participate or leave school for these kinds of things seems so dramatically more extreme than the damage done by making the holidays secular that I have trouble even seeing the issue.

If we're allowing minority religious people to be oversensitive or using non sincerely held beliefs to justify being difficult that's one thing. (E.g., objecting to orange cupcakes as opposed to objecting to people dressed like witches.) But if we're talking about things abhorent to sincerely held religious beliefs, just secularize the thing, make the rules clear to parents, and have fun. The kids care a lot less than the parents. Unfortunately, what ends up happening is that secularizing it is often exactly what many parents in many communities don't want to do -- whether it's picking on the christian fundamentalists or the muslims or the Jews, it's often exactly about trying to make certain kids unwelcome, usually phrased in some pernicious argument like "this is political correctness amok," or "this is how we did it when I was a kid and everyone had fun, you're hurting the kids."

 

[bicker]

Ahhhh..but "teacher time" is being used anyhow when they just "change" the holiday to something else as in "Harvest Party", "Winter Celebration", etc.. And wouldn't teacher time be involved in Thanksgiving and New Years?

So? Celebrations like that have educational value, and as secular holidays there is no conflict.

 

[mommy22gurlz]

Come on people, is it really that big of a deal? My daughter counted down the days to when she finally got to wear her Halloween costume to school last Friday for "Character Day".

Kids are only kids for a very short time, and if dressing up in a costume that makes them feel super cool and getting to have candy and cupcakes all day is what it takes to make their little worlds go 'round then count my kids in!! Life's just dang short to not have a good time.

JMHO!!

 

[In a hurry]

Since when can kids only dress up on Halloween? My daughter plays dress up all of the time. She doesn't need a school sanctioned holiday to be a princess, a doctor or a cowgirl. That is what imagination is all about. Halloween is a chance for business to sell a great deal of candy and over priced low quality costumes. It is about marketing, not about kids being kids.

 

[snookhams]

Halloween is not such a big celebration here in the UK, and both DS go to Church Schools so we have no celebrations there, the children here in the UK do not go in dress up on this day.

This said we did have a few childen knocking last night and yes we had sweets for them (only about 4 children knocked), just because we choose not to celebrate we do not want to spoil others fun.

 

[Downrivermama]

After taking dd 7 trick or treating last night and having her tell me that she was "Obsessed" (pretty good word for a 7 yo!)with candy, I don't think anything else mattered to her!

Children who are obese are most likely becoming that way at home, not school.

As for using class resources for celebrations, her class last year went on a field trip every month (with parents driving students). 10 in all. I rather they stay at the school and do something.

Let's face it in our world today, everything is comercialized.

 

[bicker]

Come on people, is it really that big of a deal?

Each person gets to determine for themselves how big of a deal it is. Society gets to determine how large of a minority is large enough that society feels obligated to respect it.

I'd also like to thank everyone for maintaining a very respectful discussion, despite the disagreements. Nice chatting with y'all.

 

[skbasnett]

Yesterday, my DS went to school in his Tigger costume and had the time of his life. He goes to daycare but the school goes up through K. All the kids were REQUIRED to be there in costume. Even if they were in the afternoon session, they HAD to come in in the morning and get picked up at 11:30. I think it is great that I put him in a school that does this. I see no reason why the holidays are NOT being celebrated. Who cares if just a few parents dont want it. Keep your kids home then.

And to whomever said that Thanksgiving is a secular holiday, you are incorrect. It is only celebrated by Americans thereby not connecting it to any religion.

I found this post about Thanksgiving. Please notice it is a Federal Holiday:
Thanksgiving, Thurs., Nov. 24. A federal holiday observed the fourth Thursday in November by act of Congress (1941), it was the first such national proclamation issued by President Lincoln in 1863, on the urging of Mrs. Sarah J. Hale, editor of Godey's Lady's Book. Most Americans believe that the holiday dates back to the day of thanks ordered by Governor Bradford of Plymouth Colony in New England in 1621, but scholars point out that days of thanks stem from ancient times.

 

[mjkaferle5]

..........almost all Christian holidays are based on Pagan ones.......

Do a little research, they are not 'based' on Pagan holidays.

One theory says that Christmas was decided to be celebrated on Dec. 25 to steer people away from a pagan holiday on the same date.

Easter celebrated the resurrection of Jesus. There are pagan symbols that somehow got attached to the celebration of Easter, such as eggs etc. But Easter is not based on a Pagan holiday.

I am just saying that 'based' probably isn't the best word to use. The christian and pagan holidays have become intermingled throughout time. But one didn't use the other as a 'template' for their holiday.


Anyways, I could just see a bunch of Pagans sitting around saying that there holidays were based on Christian ones.

 

[aplejax76]

Dear Parents,

Please have your child refrain from laughing and having fun. We also feel a strict diet of seaweed and soy is what is best for the child!!!!
Thank You,

The Party Pooper