More Channels to be Cut at Dish Network

[JB2K]

Last month, I posted about the "possibility" of Dish Network cutting certain Fox-owned stations from their lineup (FX, National Geographic Channel, and the FSN family of regional sports networks).

Those channels were permanently deleted from Dish on October 1.

They're not finished, yet.

If Dish and Fox can't come to terms on a carriage agreement for certain local Fox affiliates, those channels will be pulled from Dish Network, as well. This would take effect on November 1, 2010.

The channels affected are those owned and operated by the Fox Broadcasting Company as well as those owned and operated by Local TV,LLC.

Key markets that will be affected are among the nation's biggest, such as NYC/NJ and Philadelphia while "Local TV" Fox stations are located in mid-size markets such as Denver and St. Louis.

Here's the budget angle - for those of you who are affected (and dissatisfied with Dish, in general), I am wondering if these changes would be grounds for you to terminate your contract with Dish without penalty?

 

[Disneychix]

I don't think it would be without penalty. I'm sure there's some wording in the contract that states all programming is subject to changes.

If some of the markets may be losing local FOX stations (am I reading that right?) people can still get the stations through digital antennas I assume.

I am upset with DISH as we lost some ABC/Disney/ESPN channels a couple months ago. Well, we lost the HD versions which makes no sense to me as we still get the regular channels. When I called they basically said, "ABC is negotiating with us."

 

[JB2K]

If some of the markets may be losing local FOX stations (am I reading that right?) people can still get the stations through digital antennas I assume.

Correct - those local channels will still be broadcasting - they just won't be sending their signal to Dish's satellites.

I am upset with DISH as we lost some ABC/Disney/ESPN channels a couple months ago. Well, we lost the HD versions which makes no sense to me as we still get the regular channels. When I called they basically said, "ABC is negotiating with us."

That is noteworthy, to mention - I read Dish did pull a group of Disney-owned channels from their lineup and later returned the SD (Standard Definition) versions, only.

However, Disney does have a history of being somewhat aggressive in the placement of all of their channels on a pay-TV lineup. Basically, Disney's policy has been "all or nothing", which means an operator must carry, for example, SoapNet, if they want to carry ESPN or the Disney Channel.

 

[RooRach0906]

The reasoning behind losing the Disney/ABC family HD channels was because they could not agree on a price and Dish did not want to raise the rates for customers. I like this because we do not have to pay more.

I assume that is probably some of the reason the same thing is happening with Fox.

To be honest, I would rather lose channels then have my rates increase and then not be able to afford it anymore and then have no tv at all. I do mean no TV where I live I would get maybe 3 channels even with a digital antenna.

 

[Colleen27]

The reasoning behind losing the Disney/ABC family HD channels was because they could not agree on a price and Dish did not want to raise the rates for customers. I like this because we do not have to pay more.

I assume that is probably some of the reason the same thing is happening with Fox.

To be honest, I would rather lose channels then have my rates increase and then not be able to afford it anymore and then have no tv at all. I do mean no TV where I live I would get maybe 3 channels even with a digital antenna.

Quite honestly I think that's just spin to make subscribers feel better. Around here DirecTV pricing is on par with Dish, and they're not cutting channels rather than paying the fees. I think Dish has come to a point where they know they can't raise rates and are looking for other options to better the bottom line; we're all so used to paying the same prices for less and less service/product that they see this as a feasible way to increase profits. And if it works, if they don't lose customers, I expect to see other providers following suit.

 

[JB2K]

To be honest, I would rather lose channels then have my rates increase and then not be able to afford it anymore and then have no tv at all.

I disagree.

If you lose a channel that has a niche audience, such as SoapNet, that may not be a big deal to the majority -- but when you are talking channels that are part of the most basic of cable packages, such as the Fox network, Dish Network is alienating a whole group of viewers.

It's statements like Roo's that make operators like Dish Network justified to keep trimming the channel lineups even further...

And back to the Disney HD cuts on Dish -- what good is "Free HD for Life" going to be when you only have a small number of channels to watch, to begin with?

 

[nunzia]

You know..I just changed to Dish after having some issues with Direct..taht now looks like a mistake, and of course I have a contract with Dish now

 

[Ava]

This is going on with Cablevision as well. We don't have Cablevision any more, but because we live in their service area I keep seeing commercials on our local channels stating that as of xyz date Fox may pull their programming from Cablevision, blahblahblah.

This has also happened two other times in the past year with Cablevision. Once with Food Network, which I think was resolved before they lost the programming. The other was with ABC, and they actually did pull the plug on that one, on the night of the Oscars no less. ABC was back on Cablevision before the show was over, so someone raised the white flag pretty quickly, but it was annoying.

I don't who is "right" or "wrong" in these disputes, but I do think networks are struggling to find new ways to make a profit. With the advent of Tivo & similar devices, advertising $ are down because no one watches commercials any more. Advertising used to be the main way networks made money, so they have to come up with something new.

 

[jenseib]

Is this everywhere? i have Dish ands still have those channels?

 

[griergirl2]

We have ATT U-Verse and they are doing it too! The big one we might lose right now is HGTV!!! If that ends up being the case we are going elsewhere as that is what is on our TV a huge majority of the time!

 

[sam_gordon]

Around here DirecTV pricing is on par with Dish, and they're not cutting channels rather than paying the fees.

It depends on when the contracts between program providers (Fox, ABC, etc) and the providers (DirecTV, Dish, Comcast, etc) expire. It's possible (if not likely) that DirecTV's contract with Fox expires next year or the year after and you'll see the same thing.

I read an article linked from a satellite forum that said Cablevision (cable company) pays News Corp (parent of Fox) $8.5 million a year to carry TWO New York channels. Now News Corp wants to charge $34 million a year! Source

Later in the thread (take it for what it's worth) had these channel prices:

Fox Business Network current pays $3.7 million a year for - seeking $18.4 million (500%)
National Geographic Wild at $2.9 million - seeking $14.7 million (507%)
Fox Deportes at $500,000 - seeking $2.3 million (460%)

Now, I truly believe Fox wants to up the rates they charge Dish. Dish can decide whether to accept the new rates or try to negotiate.

My contract with Dish runs out next month. I don't know that I will change providers. I know I *DON'T want cable, I've never really liked Direc's GUIs, and I like live sports too much to totally cut the service (and go to Netflix, online, etc).

 

[cm8]

It depends on when the contracts between program providers (Fox, ABC, etc) and the providers (DirecTV, Dish, Comcast, etc) expire. It's possible (if not likely) that DirecTV's contract with Fox expires next year or the year after and you'll see the same thing.

I read an article linked from a satellite forum that said Cablevision (cable company) pays News Corp (parent of Fox) $8.5 million a year to carry TWO New York channels. Now News Corp wants to charge $34 million a year! Source

Later in the thread (take it for what it's worth) had these channel prices:


Now, I truly believe Fox wants to up the rates they charge Dish. Dish can decide whether to accept the new rates or try to negotiate.

My contract with Dish runs out next month. I don't know that I will change providers. I know I *DON'T want cable, I've never really liked Direc's GUIs, and I like live sports too much to totally cut the service (and go to Netflix, online, etc).

 

[MomofKatie]

OP, which markets are involved? We live in Metro Charlotte, and we have not had any stations cut- still watching FX and Nat Geo here. We don't have any local Fox sports channels, but do have Fox Soccer Channel, and it is still on.

If we lost Fox Soccer, DH would cancel in a heartbeat and go to Time Warner cable or DirecTV...

 

[ajh88]

This has just happened to my parents too. I had been telling my dad he was going to have to switch and I guess he thought it would be worked out, but it wasn't. Losing Fox Sports was a huge blow - we watch nearly every Cardinals game together - and even though they have 250 channels, they only watch about 10 of them. Well, when 1 of the 10 gets cut, that's a good chunk of their programming. The thought of losing the local Fox affiliate was just the icing on the cake.

Not to mention that just a couple of weeks prior, I had been trying to help him negotiate a lower rate - he had gotten a flyer for DirecTV in the mail and called DISH to see if they would match the rate. Their response? Well, you could switch to a different (smaller) package and then you would pay less. Ya think?!? So, no dice on that (I know they aren't obligated to lower a rate - it is just aggravating that "new" customers are lured in with introductory rates while "loyal" customers are offered no discounts or specials for said loyalty).

Oh well, his DirecTV installer is supposed to be coming tomorrow. DISH says he will be charged $20 early cancellation (his 2 year contract was almost up anyway) and it burns me that they can change programming and continue to charge the same rate, but he has to pay to leave because of the programming changes.

 

[Mommee]

We have ATT U-Verse and they are doing it too! The big one we might lose right now is HGTV!!! If that ends up being the case we are going elsewhere as that is what is on our TV a huge majority of the time!

There goes that idea. Was thinking of switching to U-Verse when our Dish contract is up, but that's the ONE channel that I actually watch!

 

[Kathi OD]

Quite honestly I think that's just spin to make subscribers feel better. Around here DirecTV pricing is on par with Dish, and they're not cutting channels rather than paying the fees. I think Dish has come to a point where they know they can't raise rates and are looking for other options to better the bottom line; we're all so used to paying the same prices for less and less service/product that they see this as a feasible way to increase profits. And if it works, if they don't lose customers, I expect to see other providers following suit.

It might be spin OR it could be that the contracts with DirecTV aren't up yet. If that's the case, you may see a similar situation happening w/ their customers in a year or so.

ETA: sorry, didn't see sam's post before posting.

 

[Molliday]

We have ATT U-Verse and they are doing it too! The big one we might lose right now is HGTV!!! If that ends up being the case we are going elsewhere as that is what is on our TV a huge majority of the time!

That is one of the few channels I would so upset to lose!

 

[JB2K]

We have ATT U-Verse and they are doing it too! The big one we might lose right now is HGTV!!! If that ends up being the case we are going elsewhere as that is what is on our TV a huge majority of the time!

You're right -- U-verse is not without its' own channel cuts -- they recently elimiated the Hallmark channels, and according to what you're saying, if they don't come to an agreement with Scripps (owners of HGTV and others), those channels may be cut, too...

As for going elsewhere -- where does one go? The local CATV company? It's not like you have a lot of choices, out there...

 

[JB2K]

OP, which markets are involved? We live in Metro Charlotte, and we have not had any stations cut- still watching FX and Nat Geo here. We don't have any local Fox sports channels, but do have Fox Soccer Channel, and it is still on.

If we lost Fox Soccer, DH would cancel in a heartbeat and go to Time Warner cable or DirecTV...

OP, here - click the two hyperlinks in my original post to see exactly which Fox stations are affected.

Again, this only applies to TV stations that are actually owned by Fox and also by a firm called "Local TV, LLC".

In many smaller communites, your Fox station could be owned by a third party -- those stations are not affected by the potential blackout.

You said you were STILL watching FX/Nat Geo on Dish Network??

 

[MomofKatie]

OP, here - click the two hyperlinks in my original post to see exactly which Fox stations are affected.

Again, this only applies to TV stations that are actually owned by Fox and also by a firm called "Local TV, LLC".

In many smaller communites, your Fox station could be owned by a third party -- those stations are not affected by the potential blackout.

You said you were STILL watching FX/Nat Geo on Dish Network??

Nat Geo yes, FX- couldn't find it on our lineup. Thought we had it, but I guess not.

I did check, and looks like Fox Sports and Sport South are both gone. There is a statement up saying they have added 20 other regional channels to make up for the Fox outage. I never watched the other channels, so don't watch these, either.