Maui

[BayouQueen]

Really saddened by the news.

We are in a similar situation. Going in November/December, where part of the trip was to look for possible retirement locations.

So many lost everything and we hear they are asking hotels and others to work with the state to provide accommodations

On one hand, we're thinking about keeping the trip to Maui and volunteering in any way we can.
On the other hand, we don't want to be in the way or cause any problems for the relief effort.

It's hard to know what to do. We are scheduled to go next month. So far, our thinking is to make the trip, if the hotel is welcoming guests and if the airline is bringing in tourists. We do want to support the tourist industry there.
My gut feeling is that tourism will be discouraged and hotels will be utilized to house those who have lost their homes. We will be flexible.

It's heartbreaking. We spent our honeymoon on Kaanapali Beach 44 years ago and have been back many times.

 

[monsterkitty]

No some of us are just don’t fall for all that nonsense.

Here's some more "nonsense" for you:

The Lahaina area used to be a wetlands up until the mid to late 19th Century. It was a spiritual and political center as King Kamehameha sought to bring the islands together. In 1819 the British began using the area for whaling and by 1840, it was the main whaling center. In 1840, canals were dug so smaller vessels used to transport goods from the island to the ships. Shops were built as well as other businesses to serve the whalers. They also discovered that the whalers would pay good money for the fresh water in the area that they needed to survive.

In 1859, an oil well was discovered in PA and whale oil was no longer needed. The whaling industry died off and so did the importance of the area.

Water upstream that filled the canals was rerouted to feed the sugar cane crops. The Lahaina area wetlands dried up and were filled in with sand and built on.

The vegetation areas that remain receive very little water from upstream and the Lahaina area receives very little rain fall each year. Add in the drought situation from the past few years, the leaves on the vegetation is paper thin and has little protection.

So instead of just the "nonsense," we have colonial greed and capitalism, along with the changing weather patterns that have placed the area at risk.

You are correct about the human cause of the fire, because that colonial greed and capitalism really fueled the fires by rerouting and draining the wetlands. The climate change also is human caused, which has led to weather changes that have caused the droughts.

 

[gmi3804]

Here's some more "nonsense" for you:

The Lahaina area used to be a wetlands up until the mid to late 19th Century. It was a spiritual and political center as King Kamehameha sought to bring the islands together. In 1819 the British began using the area for whaling and by 1840, it was the main whaling center. In 1840, canals were dug so smaller vessels used to transport goods from the island to the ships. Shops were built as well as other businesses to serve the whalers. They also discovered that the whalers would pay good money for the fresh water in the area that they needed to survive.

In 1859, an oil well was discovered in PA and whale oil was no longer needed. The whaling industry died off and so did the importance of the area.

Water upstream that filled the canals was rerouted to feed the sugar cane crops. The Lahaina area wetlands dried up and were filled in with sand and built on.

The vegetation areas that remain receive very little water from upstream and the Lahaina area receives very little rain fall each year. Add in the drought situation from the past few years, the leaves on the vegetation is paper thin and has little protection.

So instead of just the "nonsense," we have colonial greed and capitalism, along with the changing weather patterns that have placed the area at risk.

You are correct about the human cause of the fire, because that colonial greed and capitalism really fueled the fires by rerouting and draining the wetlands. The climate change also is human caused, which has led to weather changes that have caused the droughts.

"Sense" has no place in some people's worlds.

Thanks for sharing. The west sides of the islands are arid and dry, getting worse every year, and very susceptible to fires and high winds exacerbate the danger.

 

[dvcgirl67]

Here's some more "nonsense" for you:

The Lahaina area used to be a wetlands up until the mid to late 19th Century. It was a spiritual and political center as King Kamehameha sought to bring the islands together. In 1819 the British began using the area for whaling and by 1840, it was the main whaling center. In 1840, canals were dug so smaller vessels used to transport goods from the island to the ships. Shops were built as well as other businesses to serve the whalers. They also discovered that the whalers would pay good money for the fresh water in the area that they needed to survive.

In 1859, an oil well was discovered in PA and whale oil was no longer needed. The whaling industry died off and so did the importance of the area.

Water upstream that filled the canals was rerouted to feed the sugar cane crops. The Lahaina area wetlands dried up and were filled in with sand and built on.

The vegetation areas that remain receive very little water from upstream and the Lahaina area receives very little rain fall each year. Add in the drought situation from the past few years, the leaves on the vegetation is paper thin and has little protection.

So instead of just the "nonsense," we have colonial greed and capitalism, along with the changing weather patterns that have placed the area at risk.

You are correct about the human cause of the fire, because that colonial greed and capitalism really fueled the fires by rerouting and draining the wetlands. The climate change also is human caused, which has led to weather changes that have caused the droughts.

Great post. I was also reading that a group, the Hawaii Wildfire Management Organization warned in 2014 that Lahaina was among Hawaii's most fire-prone areas because of it's proximity to parched invasive grasslands, steep terrain and frequent wind. And that was ten years ago, the area has only grown more parched in the last several years. It was a disaster waiting to happen....now 80 lives lost, over 5 billion to rebuild according to current estimates.

We're going to have to get smarter in this world of ours and build sustainably. Things may not look the same in Lahaina. The materials used to rebuild need to be much more fire resistant. They'll need to take care about what types of trees and plants they put in....and how close to houses they are. On and on....lots for them to think about, but if done correctly, they could be a model for future construction and/or fireproofing of other fire-prone areas.

 

[SteveH]

I've been following this closely as I have a coworker there and have been considering a relocation. This is such a tragedy and so many things happened to take place at once to make matters worse... and worse. The loss of life count has just begun, last I saw there were still around 1000 missing. The devastation to homes and pets is just as disturbing, but the unknown factors for the future, finding people, food, housing all that is all that matters. This fire echos so much of the Paradise fire in California.

I encourage everyone to find a few dollars to donate to which ever group in Maui you feel could use the support; Food Shelters, Humane Society. Red Cross, but check first and make sure they are legit and have an actual presence in Maui or on the islands of Hawaii. I'm listing a few should anyone want to help;
mauifoodbank.org
mauihumanesociety.org
hawaiicommunityfoundation.org
redcross.org/local/hawaii.html

On one hand, we're thinking about keeping the trip to Maui and volunteering in any way we can.
On the other hand, we don't want to be in the way or cause any problems for the relief effort.

We're in the same boat. We contacted our rental and let them know if they needed our place we'd gladly give it up. As of now we're waiting to hear. Like you too if we go we're planning on volunteering any way we can. My friend there said don't make changes yet, give it few weeks since they are dealing with the immediate crisis.

Wondering what kind of person would laugh at this. Let's ask @DCLMP.

There are at least 80 dead so far. Really funny, right?

The same people that get angry when the first response to a tragedy is talking about climate change, instead of the human tragedy that is unfolding in front of us. There will be plenty of time to analyze the causes and conditions that led to it. But jumping to conclusions is just comical and shows a complete lack of sensitivity.

 

[disneyseniors]

It's hard to know what to do. We are scheduled to go next month. So far, our thinking is to make the trip, if the hotel is welcoming guests and if the airline is bringing in tourists. We do want to support the tourist industry there.
My gut feeling is that tourism will be discouraged and hotels will be utilized to house those who have lost their homes. We will be flexible.

It's heartbreaking. We spent our honeymoon on Kaanapali Beach 44 years ago and have been back many times.

My daughter and soninlaw have had a trip booked for a year for their 25th anniversary. It's a split stay between Kaui and Maui. I believe all Island trips will be cancelled so those who lived on Maui can have places to stay. I heard that Honolulu has already cancelled all tourist reservations. I think it's sadly going to be a long, long time before it is back to "normal".

 

[dvcgirl67]

I've been following this closely as I have a coworker there and have been considering a relocation. This is such a tragedy and so many things happened to take place at once to make matters worse... and worse. The loss of life count has just begun, last I saw there were still around 1000 missing. The devastation to homes and pets is just as disturbing, but the unknown factors for the future, finding people, food, housing all that is all that matters. This fire echos so much of the Paradise fire in California.

I encourage everyone to find a few dollars to donate to which ever group in Maui you feel could use the support; Food Shelters, Humane Society. Red Cross, but check first and make sure they are legit and have an actual presence in Maui or on the islands of Hawaii. I'm listing a few should anyone want to help;
mauifoodbank.org
mauihumanesociety.org
hawaiicommunityfoundation.org
redcross.org/local/hawaii.html


We're in the same boat. We contacted our rental and let them know if they needed our place we'd gladly give it up. As of now we're waiting to hear. Like you too if we go we're planning on volunteering any way we can. My friend there said don't make changes yet, give it few weeks since they are dealing with the immediate crisis.

The same people that get angry when the first response to a tragedy is talking about climate change, instead of the human tragedy that is unfolding in front of us. There will be plenty of time to analyze the causes and conditions that led to it. But jumping to conclusions is just comical and shows a complete lack of sensitivity.

I agree with a lot of what you said, but it is possible to send money (I have), and help in many other ways if you happen to take your trip....and discuss root causes at the same time. We can talk about climate change at the same time, because it's going to have to be a part of the conversation as they rebuild and as we look at other fire-prone parts of the country as our climate changes.

All that the grand majority of us can do is send money from afar and mourn all of the victims (humans and pets)....and look to the future and what we can do differently. I've heard multiple officials/politicians on the ground in Maui bring up climate change....one saying...."climate change is here". So, if the people of Hawaii feel comfortable discussing it, I think we should be as well.

 

[dvcgirl67]

My daughter and soninlaw have had a trip booked for a year for their 25th anniversary. It's a split stay between Kaui and Maui. I believe all Island trips will be cancelled so those who lived on Maui can have places to stay. I heard that Honolulu has already cancelled all tourist reservations. I think it's sadly going to be a long, long time before it is back to "normal".

I think your daughter and son-in-law will be fine traveling to Kauai, but may want to choose an island other than Maui if they're interested in a split stay. I believe Honolulu would be open for business....a different Island and a city for that matter.

I read yesterday in the NYT that there are no travel restrictions except to Maui at this time. Even there....they're going to want to get tourists back as soon as possible....it's the lifeblood of those islands. I heard that they're lifting restrictions on short term rentals on Maui as they know people will need places to live.

 

[Lehuaann]

My heart is broken. I spoke to my uncle, and he said we have Ohana on the missing/deceased list. Apparently, the emergency sirens weren’t activated and phone texts came late

 

[PollyannaMom]

My heart is broken. I spoke to my uncle, and he said we have Ohana on the missing/deceased list. Apparently, the emergency sirens weren’t activated and phone texts came late

 

[Dan Murphy]

My heart is broken. I spoke to my uncle, and he said we have Ohana on the missing/deceased list. Apparently, the emergency sirens weren’t activated and phone texts came late

's for you and family.

 

[dvcgirl67]

My heart is broken. I spoke to my uncle, and he said we have Ohana on the missing/deceased list. Apparently, the emergency sirens weren’t activated and phone texts came late

That's so sad. I'm so sorry for your loss.

 

[Chili327]

No what’s funny is what you think the cause of it is.?

Regardless jumping to the conclusion that a fire was caused by global warming is funny.

So what do you think the cause is/was?

 

[Southernmiss]

Silly me....falling for all of those facts from those pesky scientists.

Yep. Our daughter's 10 week summer biology internship was related- how to make plant foods tastier and plants resistant to related changes.

Thankfully someone is trying to keep us and the planet all alive for future generations.

The fire in Maui is devastating and heartbreaking and hurts my heart every time I catch a news story. Dh and I were there 30 years ago. The people are resilient, but it will never be like we remember it.

 

[dvcgirl67]

Yep. Our daughter's 10 week summer biology internship was related- how to make plant foods tastier and plants resistant to related changes.

Thankfully someone is trying to keep us and the planet all alive for future generations.

The fire in Maui is devastating and heartbreaking and hurts my heart every time I catch a news story. Dh and I were there 30 years ago. The people are resilient, but it will never be like we remember it.

We just visited...first time, back in May for our 25th anniversary. Oahu and the Big Island (the latter also suffered from fires very near where were stayed). I got that sense as well, that the people are super resilient. We've never been to Maui, but this little town really seemed to have a lovely quaintness to it, kind of like Sanibel Island that got decimated by a hurricane last year. You can rebuild, but some of that charm is sadly gone.

 

[bcla]

I agree with a lot of what you said, but it is possible to send money (I have), and help in many other ways if you happen to take your trip....and discuss root causes at the same time. We can talk about climate change at the same time, because it's going to have to be a part of the conversation as they rebuild and as we look at other fire-prone parts of the country as our climate changes.

All that the grand majority of us can do is send money from afar and mourn all of the victims (humans and pets)....and look to the future and what we can do differently. I've heard multiple officials/politicians on the ground in Maui bring up climate change....one saying...."climate change is here". So, if the people of Hawaii feel comfortable discussing it, I think we should be as well.

There's no indication of how it started. Could have been someone being careless, an electrical fire, or maybe lightning (although I'd think that would have been known). The only thing I've heard for the Lahaina fire is that a small fire was put out, thought to be extinguished, and then flared up later. The high wind conditions from the far offshore hurricane clearly contributed. Possibly to the flareup and definitely to the eventual spread. Whether or not climate change was meaningful is a point of valid discussion.

As for visitors - that's a really thorny issue. There are thousands whose home are damaged or destroyed, so obviously they need a place to live where hotels and rentals exist. But tourism is also the #1 segment of the Maui economy, and people need to work.

 

[dvcgirl67]

There's no indication of how it started. Could have been someone being careless, an electrical fire, or maybe lightning (although I'd think that would have been known). The only thing I've heard for the Lahaina fire is that a small fire was put out, thought to be extinguished, and then flared up later. The high wind conditions from the far offshore hurricane clearly contributed. Possibly to the flareup and definitely to the eventual spread. Whether or not climate change was meaningful is a point of valid discussion.

As for visitors - that's a really thorny issue. There are thousands whose home are damaged or destroyed, so obviously they need a place to live where hotels and rentals exist. But tourism is also the #1 segment of the Maui economy, and people need to work.

No, we don't know how it started, but that the conditions were in place for it to literally come down that slope like a wall of fire. I've read that the electric company had also had great concerns about a big fire as they have lots of lines up that way. That's how a lot of wildfires start....with a downline line, and it was very windy. It's now the deadliest natural disaster in the States history. We just witnessed a California style wild fire,....in Hawaii.

I've never been to Lahaina, but it looked like a real town where locals would live? Seems to me that's going to cause a huge issue as housing is already at such a premium in Hawaii. I would be a lot of those folks work at the restaurants and resorts around Maui. However, they need jobs and a paycheck right now and so they'll need to keep the resorts open.

We visited Oahu and The Big Island and while it was obvious that there was housing on Oahu, many travel across the island to work over in the Honolulu area causing terrible traffic. They're building a kind of light rail to help with that, but apparently it's taking forever. On the Big Island, we were at the Mauna Lani....a couple of other hotels were down there, but landing on the BI, it legit looked like we were landing on the moon.....all lava fields. We asked several people....where do you guys live? Many live up on the slope a bit in towns where it's naturally green....and they can grow things. But housing is tight...and pricey.

 

[TinkAgainU]

Wondering what kind of person would laugh at this. Let's ask @DCLMP.

There are at least 80 dead so far. Really funny, right?

Before you assume they were "laughing" the icons for a laugh Also show tears - keep in mind a LOT of people assume that is a tearful icon.

 

[bcla]

I've never been to Lahaina, but it looked like a real town where locals would live? Seems to me that's going to cause a huge issue as housing is already at such a premium in Hawaii. I would be a lot of those folks work at the restaurants and resorts around Maui. However, they need jobs and a paycheck right now and so they'll need to keep the resorts open.

The stats showed more than 12,000 living in Lahaina. We spent about a single day (didn't have much time) on Maui and that involved the peak of Haleakala, check in at our hotel in Wailea, and dinner in Lahaina. Being tourists, we didn't exactly pass by too many residential areas, but it certainly sounds like there was a substantial residential part of Lahaina with that many people.

There's certainly no lack of land on Maui for any kind of new housing. Apparently part of the issue were the dry grasses growing wild on former agricultural land. I would think that with these fires, there might be a lot of remediation as well as the possibility of replacement housing being built on some of that former agricultural land.

 

[dvcgirl67]

The stats showed more than 12,000 living in Lahaina. We spent about a single day (didn't have much time) on Maui and that involved the peak of Haleakala, check in at our hotel in Wailea, and dinner in Lahaina. Being tourists, we didn't exactly pass by too many residential areas, but it certainly sounds like there was a substantial residential part of Lahaina with that many people.

There's certainly no lack of land on Maui for any kind of new housing. Apparently part of the issue were the dry grasses growing wild on former agricultural land. I would think that with these fires, there might be a lot of remediation as well as the possibility of replacement housing being built on some of that former agricultural land.

Yes, I read that the invasive grasses are a big part of the problem....and they've dried out considerably thanks to a persistent drought on the leeward side. They were the fuel. I also read that scientists are reporting that the clouds are thinner....so producing less rain. When I first heard that the winds from Hurricane Dora contributed, but that humidity was very low...it didn't make sense to me. But they said it was very far out but big enough that there was no humidity...but plenty of wind. Recipe for a disaster.