Marathon Weekend 2016

[cburnett11]

The pools are heated to 80 degrees I believe. No problem swimming in the winter. They even heat the water parks. We went to Typhoon Lagoon and virtually had the place to ourselves in the week after the marathon.

We may have been there the same day. I think it was early afternoon on the 14th (Wednesday) that we decided to go. When we walked up to the Typhoon Lagoon entrance, the workers jokingly asked if we were lost. It didn't get to 70 that day and the employees told us that they had already decided the park would be closed on Thursday/Friday because of the low temps. The water was plenty warm and we spent most of the time in the wave pool and the lazy river... although we did go to the Shark Reef and were able to stay in as long as we wanted because there were only a handful of people there. I'm guessing there were no more than 50 to 75 guests in Typhoon Lagoon that afternoon. It was cold when you got out of the water, but it was a fun experience.

 

[JClimacus]

We may have been there the same day. I think it was early afternoon on the 14th (Wednesday) that we decided to go. When we walked up to the Typhoon Lagoon entrance, the workers jokingly asked if we were lost. It didn't get to 70 that day and the employees told us that they had already decided the park would be closed on Thursday/Friday because of the low temps. The water was plenty warm and we spent most of the time in the wave pool and the lazy river... although we did go to the Shark Reef and were able to stay in as long as we wanted because there were only a handful of people there. I'm guessing there were no more than 50 to 75 guests in Typhoon Lagoon that afternoon. It was cold when you got out of the water, but it was a fun experience.

Yes I believe we were there Wednesday. We did everything there, and road the crush'n'gusher about a dozen times in a row. If you remember an old guy with two adult sons, one about 6'4", that was us. The staff were happy to see us just because they were deprived of human contact.

 

[JClimacus]

Yeah, I remember them closing it on Thursday and I'm glad we went earlier. I would have been torqued not to get in since we had free water park tickets because the Poly pool was closed.

 

[Z-Knight]

according to Jeff Guadette, in that Runnerworld article a few posts back, the reason that you don't start off to fast is that you don't want to run faster than your aerobic threshold. If you run faster then you enter the anaerobic phase at which point you will start to build up lactic acid in your muscles and that makes you bonk. Basically you tire yourself out sooner and with a greater period left to run so you end up just completely losing your pace at the end. Obviously it would be idea just to run at the threshold level rather than 15+ seconds/miles slower because that could also be hard to make up later, so he suggests at least doing so for the first 3-4 miles before settling into a more goal pace.

Also, I learned from that article that you want to take in fuel early on because your body has a harder time processing carbs from digestion the later you go, so you want to have the carbs sort of ready to go - which is why lots of people do the pasta carb loading, etc the days before. For half marathons or less this is usually not necessary because those people can complete in 2 hours or so, but anything that would take you longer than 2 hours then you should do the pre-loading. Basically your body is able to store about 2 hours worth of carbs so after that it has to get it from the fuel you put in, but if you start of running fast early the fuel you put in may not be processed by your body and hence you bonk. So start of slower the first few miles, take in food and let your body process it and then you'll be able to give it all at the end.

I'm going to have to try to take this advice - but I am definitely scared to lose as many as 15+ seconds for every mile in the beginning, because I won't be able to make up nearly 3 minutes (or more) in the second half of a marathon - at least I don't think. So my goal would be to limit to like 5 second losses. I don't know, but I have 3 more months to try things out.

 

[cburnett11]

Yes I believe we were there Wednesday. We did everything there, and road the crush'n'gusher about a dozen times in a row. If you remember an old guy with two adult sons, one about 6'4", that was us. The staff were happy to see us just because they were deprived of human contact.

We closed the place down, but probably didn't get there until after 2. It was me, wife, 20-yr old daughter and her boyfriend. He loves water parks, but we hadn't gone to TL yet and were running out of days. We were at MK earlier in the day and had brought our swim suits in case it warmed up. It never really warmed up that day, but I saw the weather forecast for the rest of the week being even cooler so we headed there anyways.

We walked over to Contemporary to bus it over to TL, but they had some weird schedule going so the buses weren't running directly there and we weren't aware of that. Someone in management happened to walk by and when he heard we were trying to get there he comped us a cab that got us there really quickly. We felt both special and silly pulling up in a cab at the gate with an empty parking log. It was almost like the Wally World scene in Vacation.

I think Crush'n'Gusher was one of the only things we didn't do there. Our time was limited because of how late we got there and it was way warmer in the water than walking around. My daughter's BF did a number of slides, but we were content to mostly stay in the water. If I recall correctly, my wife chose not to swim but was willing to bring us dry towels the moment we exited a pool/slide.

I don't recollect seeing your group, but I'm sure we would've run into each other that day. I've never been in a theme park (Disney or otherwise) with that few people before. It was like we "hopped the fence" on a day it was closed.

By the way, we just happened to be down there in January at the time of the Marathon weekend... we arrived Saturday before noon. I had never considered running a marathon before (I've done 3 halves), but was quickly convinced Sunday morning when I saw you runners coming through Disney Studios. Before the day was over I told my wife that I would be signing up to run in 2016 and will be down there to "only" do the marathon.

 

[Keels]

Just dropping in to say that this thread is amazing - all of the training talk and advice from @FFigawi, @BuckeyeBama , @IamTrike, @LSUlakes, @JClimacus, @Optimator and other super-experienced runners is outstanding. Better than anything I could read in a magazine. Thanks y'all!

 

[BuckeyeBama]

I'm going to have to try to take this advice - but I am definitely scared to lose as many as 15+ seconds for every mile in the beginning, because I won't be able to make up nearly 3 minutes (or more) in the second half of a marathon - at least I don't think. So my goal would be to limit to like 5 second losses. I don't know, but I have 3 more months to try things out.

It took me a while to figure out what works best for me. I finally landed between 15-20 seconds for the first 4 or 5 miles depending on running conditions. If it is hotter, I add the extra mile. On really cool runs I might only do this for the first 3 miles, but I usually go 4.

If I only do 5-10 seconds I just don't see the same benefits. I don't bonk, but I am not as "fresh" at the end. Could be totally mental, though.

 

[JClimacus]

We closed the place down, but probably didn't get there until after 2.

By the way, we just happened to be down there in January at the time of the Marathon weekend... we arrived Saturday before noon. I had never considered running a marathon before (I've done 3 halves), but was quickly convinced Sunday morning when I saw you runners coming through Disney Studios. Before the day was over I told my wife that I would be signing up to run in 2016 and will be down there to "only" do the marathon.

We were probably gone by 2. We got there shortly after it opened. I remember that weird vibe as well with the empty park, but I loved having the place to ourselves. I recommend it to anyone who hasn't gone there at that time of year. I can't believe they even heat the wave pool!

You're going to love running the marathon at Disney. Nothing like it, and you can't pick a better place to do your first. Make sure to treat yourself afterwards. Last year I had the all you can eat at Liberty Tree Tavern on Sunday evening, this year I'm going to see what kind of damage I can do at the Hoop Dee Doo Revue.

 

[PrincessV]

On negative splits...

First: I've not yet run a full marathon, and I don't expect to run negative splits when I do. But honestly, that's mostly because I fully intend to make a few stops in the final miles. I do believe I could run at least some negative splits, assuming 100% healthy, ideal weather, and no injuries.

Second: I am not fast when it comes to distance. My half PR is a sloth-like 2:53. Based on McMillan's calculators, my 5K PR indicates I should be running a much faster half; my body disagrees, lol! (McMillan also says that based on my half PR, I shouldn't be able to go as fast as I do at shorter distances. Confirming what I've known for 30+ years: I'm not built for endurance. But I do it anyway )

BUT outside of summer when I have to slow down in late miles to avoid heat stroke, I nearly always run negative splits, no matter the distance. It's not always a consistently dropping pattern, as in every mile faster than the last, but the final 25% of whatever distance I'm running is almost always faster than my first 25%. I seem to go about it pretty naturally and without a lot of thought: I just take the early miles at a comfortable pace, assess how I feel at about the halfway mark and if I'm feeling good, I crank it up a bit, reassess at around the 3/4 mark, put a little more in if I'm still feeling good, then go for broke the last mile or two. The benefit to me, as a slower runner, isn't so much a time goal, as feeling really good at the finish. For me, nothing beats feeling strong and in total control at the end, and negative splits does it.

So for anyone following along, thinking none of this negative split stuff applies to us mid- to back-of-the-pack folks, I say give it a try in training - you just may like what you feel!

 

[Mimsy Borogove]

On negative splits...

First: I've not yet run a full marathon, and I don't expect to run negative splits when I do. But honestly, that's mostly because I fully intend to make a few stops in the final miles. I do believe I could run at least some negative splits, assuming 100% healthy, ideal weather, and no injuries.

Second: I am not fast when it comes to distance. My half PR is a sloth-like 2:53. Based on McMillan's calculators, my 5K PR indicates I should be running a much faster half; my body disagrees, lol! (McMillan also says that based on my half PR, I shouldn't be able to go as fast as I do at shorter distances. Confirming what I've known for 30+ years: I'm not built for endurance. But I do it anyway )

BUT outside of summer when I have to slow down in late miles to avoid heat stroke, I nearly always run negative splits, no matter the distance. It's not always a consistently dropping pattern, as in every mile faster than the last, but the final 25% of whatever distance I'm running is almost always faster than my first 25%. I seem to go about it pretty naturally and without a lot of thought: I just take the early miles at a comfortable pace, assess how I feel at about the halfway mark and if I'm feeling good, I crank it up a bit, reassess at around the 3/4 mark, put a little more in if I'm still feeling good, then go for broke the last mile or two. The benefit to me, as a slower runner, isn't so much a time goal, as feeling really good at the finish. For me, nothing beats feeling strong and in total control at the end, and negative splits does it.

So for anyone following along, thinking none of this negative split stuff applies to us mid- to back-of-the-pack folks, I say give it a try in training - you just may like what you feel!

Thank you for saying this. All the talk about time, pacing, and strategy had me a bit stressed out, to the point where I was stressing out my BRF, and I'd like to be on speaking terms when we run Dopey together (also my first marathon because I apparently like to challenge myself to the extreme).

My philosophy with running is simply, if it's not fun, what's the point? I do it to escape/mitigate stress and it's the one area of my life where I'm not total Type-A obsessive.

That being said, I do admire and appreciate the discussions and advice between those more elite than me. My twin-in-law runs a 3ish hour marathon and is going to Boston in April, but we have very different running strategies - though we are still very supportive of the other.

I guess I'm saying that while I appreciate the discussion this far, it's sometimes disheartening to see those who are significantly faster than me get down on themselves publicly regarding their pace/time (citing specific times/paces). You're all very good and wonderful and allowed to be disappointed, but I am still in awe of your paces.

It's all about perspective.

 

[LSUlakes]

Just dropping in to say that this thread is amazing - all of the training talk and advice from @FFigawi, @BuckeyeBama , @IamTrike, @LSUlakes, @JClimacus, @Optimator and other super-experienced runners is outstanding. Better than anything I could read in a magazine. Thanks y'all!

Mighty kind of you Keels.

A little story for everyone. For those who have Garmin and use Garmin connect, you know about how you can connect with people and compare and compete with people. Well most of the people that I am connected with a very successful runners and put up very impressive miles and times. Well, Monday one guy puts up a run of 26.2 miles that afternoon. Not a race or a organized event either, and if that wasn't enough he did it under 3 hours... for fun. I was like... well Im not going to have more miles than him this week. He followed up the next day with a easy 8 or 9. Just a interesting story I thought id share with yall.

 

[Baloo in MI]

So now that the deadline for POT is here, did everyone submit their times and did everyone run a time they had hoped for?

I got mine in a week ago, very happy with my effort and results, but still dealing with some aches and pains from it. Very glad the POT race is behind me.

 

[FFigawi]

I'm going to have to try to take this advice - but I am definitely scared to lose as many as 15+ seconds for every mile in the beginning, because I won't be able to make up nearly 3 minutes (or more) in the second half of a marathon - at least I don't think. So my goal would be to limit to like 5 second losses. I don't know, but I have 3 more months to try things out.

You're going to lose 15-30 seconds in the first mile anyway, no matter what your strategy is. It takes some time, unless you're in the very front row, for everyone to clear the line and get moving at a decent pace. You're also going to lose a few seconds per mile because you can't run the tangents and end up running more than 26.2. For example, I think 9:07 is exactly a 4:00 full, but in reality, you need to run closer to 9 or sub-9 in order to account for the extra distance you end up running. My advice would be to calculate the pace you need for your time goal, subtract 5-10 seconds per mile from that, and run at that pace the whole time. It easier to run a steady pace than to try to pick it up at the end.

 

[LSUlakes]

You're going to lose 15-30 seconds in the first mile anyway, no matter what your strategy is. It takes some time, unless you're in the very front row, for everyone to clear the line and get moving at a decent pace. You're also going to lose a few seconds per mile because you can't run the tangents and end up running more than 26.2. For example, I think 9:07 is exactly a 4:00 full, but in reality, you need to run closer to 9 or sub-9 in order to account for the extra distance you end up running. My advice would be to calculate the pace you need for your time goal, subtract 5-10 seconds per mile from that, and run at that pace the whole time. It easier to run a steady pace than to try to pick it up at the end.

I agree with the above. I have yet to run a race of 10k or more that is the exact distance. With large crowds it is not practical to try to run the tangents, and even if you try, you will end up wasting more energy than its worth. speaking of useful tips for marathon running. If it is warm on race day, try to stay to the outer edge of pack to keep cooler. The middle of the pack can make it feel another ~5 degrees warmer.

 

[Ariel484]

Thank you for saying this. All the talk about time, pacing, and strategy had me a bit stressed out, to the point where I was stressing out my BRF, and I'd like to be on speaking terms when we run Dopey together (also my first marathon because I apparently like to challenge myself to the extreme).

My philosophy with running is simply, if it's not fun, what's the point? I do it to escape/mitigate stress and it's the one area of my life where I'm not total Type-A obsessive.

That being said, I do admire and appreciate the discussions and advice between those more elite than me. My twin-in-law runs a 3ish hour marathon and is going to Boston in April, but we have very different running strategies - though we are still very supportive of the other.

I guess I'm saying that while I appreciate the discussion this far, it's sometimes disheartening to see those who are significantly faster than me get down on themselves publicly regarding their pace/time (citing specific times/paces). You're all very good and wonderful and allowed to be disappointed, but I am still in awe of your paces.

It's all about perspective.

Yeah, there has definitely been a lot of "serious pace talk" in this thread lately - maybe the most I have seen in the few years I've been a member of these boards.

I have totally had this feeling before and I just try to remind myself that running is very individual and very personal - someone not being happy with their slow-to-them, fast-to-me pace is not a knock on my abilities, and just because another person wants to negative-split their WDW marathon and I don't, and just because they are running 50-60MPW where I'm topping out at 40 or less, doesn't mean that I am doing something wrong. It just means that their goals and abilities are different than mine are - and that is okay!!

Like you said, perspective is key.

 

[BuckeyeBama]

BTW - no way do I plan to run a negative split at WDW. I run the Disney races totally for the fun of it. These runs are just another part of my family vacation.

 

[SarahDisney]

Okay, so, to go to an entirely unrelated topic ...

Opinion Poll: Running while slightly sick - yay or nay? Or does it depend on what kind of sick you are?

I've always been of the opinion that if I can get up and run, I should. I went out with the beginnings of a head cold this AM and I did not have the best of runs. I know the fact that I feel like crap now is just the cold getting worse because I have yet to take something for it (other than tea), but I'm wondering if I made the right choice running this AM, and I'm curious to know what others do. So what do you do when you're sick - reschedule the run, modify it in some way, or just go out there and do it?

 

[Ariel484]

BTW - no way do I plan to run a negative split at WDW. I run the Disney races totally for the fun of it. These runs are just another part of my family vacation.

I wrote that post about not negative splitting the marathon and I just now realized that I HAVE negative-split the marathon before...normally the Magic Kingdom mile takes me a long time due to all of the character photos there, and that's in the first half. So voila - negative split!

Pretty sure that's not the kind of strategizing you guys were talking about in earlier posts though...

 

[Ariel484]

Okay, so, to go to an entirely unrelated topic ...

Opinion Poll: Running while slightly sick - yay or nay? Or does it depend on what kind of sick you are?

I've always been of the opinion that if I can get up and run, I should. I went out with the beginnings of a head cold this AM and I did not have the best of runs. I know the fact that I feel like crap now is just the cold getting worse because I have yet to take something for it (other than tea), but I'm wondering if I made the right choice running this AM, and I'm curious to know what others do. So what do you do when you're sick - reschedule the run, modify it in some way, or just go out there and do it?

I've heard the rule of "if it's above the neck, run...if it's below the neck, don't run." Sometimes if I have a cold or whatever I find that running does help me feel better - clears out the sinuses, gets the blood moving, endorphins going, whatever. But if it's a pretty bad cold or a sinus infection, I shut it down. So this probably isn't helpful...I just sort of play it by ear. Depends on how sick I feel I guess.

 

[IamTrike]

BTW - no way do I plan to run a negative split at WDW. I run the Disney races totally for the fun of it. These runs are just another part of my family vacation.

Disney races are a different beast. At my pace Disneyworld races are crowded enough that if I wanted to PR it would be really frustrating. I have a really hard time of running tangents so I wind up with a lot of extra distances. That plus the general environment just make it a much better race to just relax and enjoy.

Okay, so, to go to an entirely unrelated topic ...

Opinion Poll: Running while slightly sick - yay or nay? Or does it depend on what kind of sick you are?

I've always been of the opinion that if I can get up and run, I should. I went out with the beginnings of a head cold this AM and I did not have the best of runs. I know the fact that I feel like crap now is just the cold getting worse because I have yet to take something for it (other than tea), but I'm wondering if I made the right choice running this AM, and I'm curious to know what others do. So what do you do when you're sick - reschedule the run, modify it in some way, or just go out there and do it?

If it's a cold or cough I run. Anything else I rest.