Looking For A New Camera - Need Help Please!!

[Master Mason]

Glad to see the Pentax get mentioned. I just glanced at this thread and was sad again to see DSLRs discussed as if Nikon and Canon are the only companies making them, which is of course not true. There are several others that are very good (nowadays, you'd have a hard time buying a poor DSLR), and the beauty of the Pentax is the low price, and you give up little or nothing in quality to the "big name" ones (and gain some things, like ergonomics and a larger LCD or in-camera IS on the K100).

Your right, Pentax does get a little short shifted around here, but I think that is because people talk from what they know, and what decisions they made. People that have canons tend to think they are the best because hey they decided to buy it.

I had a Pentax 35mm SLR, that I used all though high school and college. I loved that Camera, and gave it to my oldest boy when I finally decided to go to digital. He then got my P&S digital when I decided to go dSLR. I also have a box full of my dads old film SLRs he would get a new one every couple of years.... But I digress, I was happy with my pentax, but it was all manual, so I didn't have an investment in expensive lenses.... I think that is really how most folks end up becoming addicts of a certain company, they don't have to trade out their major expense in lenses when they want to upgrade the bodies. That was why later in life my dad stuck with Canon, because the lenses all worked on whatever new body he purchased.

 

[DestinationDisney]

Mike -

Thank you! You did a great job on your homework assignment...haha, boy did that comment have me laughing!

Thank you SO MUCH for answering my questions on the dSLR kits. As much as I'd really like to purchase one, they are way out of my price range as I'm only looking to spend about $400 maximum. Its amazing how much they can cost, especially when you add on top end lenses and other options. I think this is something I'll be interested in doing in the future, but right now I can't afford to spend that kind of money.

What do all of you do for a living that allows you to spend thousands of dollars on camera lenses?? I'm only teasing!

The sensor is the 'film' of a digital camera and literally you can get dust on it. This will mostly happen if your lenses are not clean when you mount them, if you change them in an area where the air is not stable, or in rare instances it can get pushed in through a lens. Typically it is not very detectable, but if you take a picture of a perfectly blue sky and analyze the picture for grayish of off tone spots...this is a sign of dust on the sensor. Cleaning it off requires minimal sensor cleaning tools to a good little kit (depending on the severity). Basically you follow the camera directions for cleaning the sensor which is typically having a fully charged battery, locking the mirror up (my camera has a 'sensor clean' function), and lightly puffing the dust off (never with compressed air) and using a statically charged brush to grab the particles.

As far as this goes, do you think it would be wise for me to purchase a sensor cleaning kit for a high-zoom non-dSLR camera?

Also, why is it bad to use compressed air?

Thanks again for answering my questions...now get back to your homework!

 

[DestinationDisney]

It's very simple. there is a rocker switch on the back of the camera. one side is marked with a W for wide and the other with a T for telephoto. You press W and the lens zooms out. Press T and the lens zooms in to 432mm or anywhere in between. As long as you press on the switch the lens will zoom until it reaches the limit.

DUH!! Well don't I feel like a dope! So basically, you mean just zooming in and out? I don't know whats wrong with me...I guess I thought it meant something different like using a special lens or special camera.

I think all of this research is getting to my brain!!

 

[Anewman]

As far as this goes, do you think it would be wise for me to purchase a sensor cleaning kit for a high-zoom non-dSLR camera?

Also, why is it bad to use compressed air?

On a "non-dslr camera"AKA point and shoot camera, there is no way to clean the sensor(to my knowledge). But since they do not have actual shutters or interchangable lenses, I have never really heard of them getting dust on the sensor.

 

[Judge Fudge]

Make sure you put the S3 into high speed continious mode. Read the manual for exact instruction, or it's the same button as the timer button I believe. Located on the right side of the camera near the lense.

 

[DestinationDisney]

Master Mason -

Wow! This was a lot of great information that you gave me! I'm really enjoying learning the basics of photography so I can help determine what will best suit me.

With a P&S or a Bridge, they tell you the optical zoom in a x factor. So you could have 3x 4x etc... up to 12x or so. What that tells you is what ever the lens starts at you can multiply that times your x factor and get the end number. However, few tell you in the open what that start and end number are. So if your start is 5mm with a 10x your end would be 50mm, which is incredibly wide, and you probably wont see but the numbers were easy

I FINALLY understand the whole concept behind optical and digital zoom now. So, you're saying that in comparing P&S or bridge cameras, I should look at the end number (like 300mm) rather than the 'x factor'...correct?

I used the website that Mhutchinson gave me, http://www.dpreview.com/ and you can select certain cameras and it will give you a side-by-side comparison of each camera. It does in fact give the start and end mm #, so now I know what to be looking for.

Here is something that I always try and keep in mind when I am decideing on what to buy as well. I have to ask myself, when I am basing my decision on cost, am I going to be happy with what I buy at the lower cost, or am I ultimately going to have to spend the higher price anyway because I won't be happy with what I can get at the lower price.

I have found in the past, if I really wanted the more expensive item, and settled for something else because of cost, I end up spending for both what I really wanted in the first place, as well as the one I had settleed for..... That is the really expensive way to do it.

I completely understand what you mean. However, as much as I'd really like one, right now I can't afford to spend $800+ on a dSLR camera. And of course, I want a new camera NOW so I can bring it on our upcoming trips. I'm not saying that I'm going to purchase a camera on a whim, because I'm doing my research to find a camera that I'll be happy with in the long run. My boyfriend would have an absolute fit if I spent $1000 on a camera because we're trying to save for a house.

So, it seems as though I'll be doing it the "expensive way" but I think the high zoom bridge camera will be a good start for me. Then I'll most likely become spoiled and want to go for the dSLR.

There is a thread currently here about the Pentax, which I understand is slightly cheaper, and the people discussing it seam very happy with it. The people with Nikons always seam happy with them as well.

I think in the dSLR world (IMHO not trying to upset anyone or knock anyones decisions or purchases) Cannon and Nikon are a toss up, like deciding between coke and pepsi, it is just which one you like better. Pentax would be like RC, good, been around a long time, just doesn't have the reputation of the other 2, and the rest are new comers like olympus and sony, and I really know nothing about them.

You mentioned the Pentax...now is this a dSLR or a bridge camera? Do you know if they make bridge cameras that I'm interested in?

So in other words...you feel the Pentax is just as good a camera, but it doesn't have the popular reputation that Canon and Nikon do, correct? I just want to be sure that it isn't taking the cheap way out (sorry to all you Pentax users) or an "imitation" camera that is modeled after the Canon or Nikon but doesn't produce good resutls.


Thanks again for taking the time to answer my questions at such great lengths. It is very much appreciated!!

 

[DestinationDisney]

I bought the Sony H2 online last night. I spent several hours on the net reading different reviews and that is the one I chose. It seems comparable to the S3, just a little cheaper. I picked that one over the S3 because of the cost difference. I ordered mine from Circuit City and am picking it up from the store later today. I paid $304 for mine. It is 12% off on their website, and then if you do a google search for coupons, there is a 10% off coupon available too. I was thrilled with the price and I can't wait to get the camera!

Congratulations on your purchase!! I'm considering the H5, which is very similar to the H2. Let me know how you enjoy your camera! You sure did get it at a great price...I'll have to keep Circuit City in mind when it comes time to buy! Thanks for the pointers!

 

[DestinationDisney]

On a "non-dslr camera"AKA point and shoot camera, there is no way to clean the sensor(to my knowledge). But since they do not have actual shutters or interchangable lenses, I have never really heard of them getting dust on the sensor.

Thanks for the quick answer!! So the sensor is the part of the base where the lens would connect, correct?

 

[DestinationDisney]

Groucho -

Thanks for the input on the Pentax cameras!

For the longer zoom on a DSLR, the cheap ones probably won't match the quality of the more expensive long zoom lenses but should easily match a PnS's lens. You can get by fairly cheaply - for example, sigma4less.com has a 70-300mm lens for the Pentax for $115. That gives you slightly more zoom than a 12x. (Equivalent 450 vs 432.)

Currently you're probably looking at closer to $450 or so after rebate if you can find one, or the popular choice now is the K100D with shake reduction for just under $600. All prices include the 18-55mm kit lens.

Okay, so you mentioned that the 70-300mm lens at sigma4less for $115 that would fit the Pentax. So, if I'm guessing correctly, the 18-55mm lens kit that you said came with the K100D would give me a lot less zoom?

For PnSs, I've been really impressed with the photos that YEKCIM has posted, taken with a Fuji S5200. I'm not very familiar with the S2/S3, but the Fuji goes up to 1600ISO while the S2 goes to 400 and the S3 tops out at 800. The Fuji does go to "only" 10x zoom. It also unfortunately uses XD cards instead of SD.

The Fuji S5200 that YEKCIM has is another camera that I'm highly considering along with the Canon S3 and the Kodak Z612.

I'm just having such a hard time deciding ...it just seems that none of the cameras 'have it all'. I can't decide whether its more important to opt for a camera with a higher ISO, like the Fuji....or if I should opt for a camera with a higher zoom.

For the digital cameras I already own, I have 2 SD 1G cards so that would be a real bummer to have to buy new memory cards but I don't think thats something I should base my decision around, right?


The more I research, the more I make myself crazy!

 

[DestinationDisney]

Okay...more questions from the Royal Pain herself...

I've been looking up and comparing the different camera models that I'm interested in on www.dpreview.com. Some of the cameras are listed as being SLR-like and others are listed as being point and click what is the difference?

When I looked up reviews of the Canon S3, I found that most people complained about the same things. Most reviewers say that the LCD & EVF are small in size (2.0) and has very low resolution (115,000 pixels) and it makes it hard to review the pictures.

Reviewers also mentioned that "it has chromatic aberration (purple/green fringing) especially at the telephoto end of the lens" and they saw "a lot of tele shots with purple fringing especially at the extreme end of the lens". What exactly does this mean? A lot of people seem to be complaining about this...so I don't know if its something that I should weight my decision on.

When I looked up reviews on the Sony DSC-H5, it seemed a lot of people complained about issues with button placement. They said its very easy to accidently press the macro, flash or EV buttons as they are close to the right thumb. I don't exactly kno what this means, but being a beginner, this makes me a little nervous.

A problem specific that a few people reported was No RAW support, no USB control for time lapse photography (the S3IS has it), and no custom settings button (at least one not obvious). They also reported that there are some low light issues with the camera. Do you think these problems are worth eliminating this camera from my choices?

 

[Groucho]

I FINALLY understand the whole concept behind optical and digital zoom now. So, you're saying that in comparing P&S or bridge cameras, I should look at the end number (like 300mm) rather than the 'x factor'...correct?

The number in "x" or "mm" is just a different way of representing the same thing, like inches versus centimeters. MM is, of course, millimeters, and the "x" is how much zoom versus, well, nuttin'. I suspect that PnSs use that because it's normal on camcorders, which has been consumer-level longer than digital cameras, but that's just a guess!

Digital zoom is totally different and is not truely zoom at all. Ignore all references to digital zoom and pretend that it doesn't exist!

You mentioned the Pentax...now is this a dSLR or a bridge camera? Do you know if they make bridge cameras that I'm interested in?

I don't think Pentax makes a bridge camera.

So in other words...you feel the Pentax is just as good a camera, but it doesn't have the popular reputation that Canon and Nikon do, correct? I just want to be sure that it isn't taking the cheap way out (sorry to all you Pentax users) or an "imitation" camera that is modeled after the Canon or Nikon but doesn't produce good resutls.

The Pentax that got all the buzz going is the *ist DL, which came out with a $100 rebate a couple months ago and could be found online for as cheap as $467, for a final price of $367 - which is absolutely astonishing for a very nice DSLR. I love mine to death and have compared it with a friend's D50 and were they the same price, I'd still go for the Pentax due to its weight, feel, and larger LCD. (Image quality is king, of course, and they share the same CCD and produce nearly identical photographs - the lens you put on front will make the most difference.) Not to belittle the D50 - it's certainly well-respected and all, but the Pentax is certainly capable of holding its head high next to it.

Unfortunately, prices soon shot up and now inventory has mostly disappeared. You might be able to find one for $450 after rebate if you're lucky. The popular model now is the K100D, which has shake reduction AKA image stabilization and can be had for just under $600 with 18-55mm lens. The rebate on the DL ends in about a month, and I suspect that by then, you won't be able to find one anywhere! I do hope that their successes and great reviews will help put the Pentax equipment in more stores, too. With more production and placement in more stores, they could have easily sold out no matter how many they made, I suspect.

However, if you have a hard limit of $400, you won't be able to seriously consider any DSLR at this point, unfortunately. I'd look closely at the Fuji S5200 and save the extra money in a DSLR fund!

 

[Master Mason]

Master Mason -

Wow! This was a lot of great information that you gave me! I'm really enjoying learning the basics of photography so I can help determine what will best suit me.



I FINALLY understand the whole concept behind optical and digital zoom now. So, you're saying that in comparing P&S or bridge cameras, I should look at the end number (like 300mm) rather than the 'x factor'...correct?

I used the website that Mhutchinson gave me, http://www.dpreview.com/ and you can select certain cameras and it will give you a side-by-side comparison of each camera. It does in fact give the start and end mm #, so now I know what to be looking for.

Yes that way your comparing apples to apples. Having a low starting point is good, because it allows you to have a wide angle, but the x factor will make the end smaller as well. Also it depends on what your looking for, if you plan on shooting things that are far away, you want that distance capablity.

If you know that the mm numbers for the cameras your comparing, you'll be judging them on the same scale that way.

I completely understand what you mean. However, as much as I'd really like one, right now I can't afford to spend $800+ on a dSLR camera. And of course, I want a new camera NOW so I can bring it on our upcoming trips. I'm not saying that I'm going to purchase a camera on a whim, because I'm doing my research to find a camera that I'll be happy with in the long run. My boyfriend would have an absolute fit if I spent $1000 on a camera because we're trying to save for a house.

So, it seems as though I'll be doing it the "expensive way" but I think the high zoom bridge camera will be a good start for me. Then I'll most likely become spoiled and want to go for the dSLR.

Been there done that. And you might find that your perfectly happy with the Bridge or P&S camera you purchase and never decide that you want to move up to a dSLR. Lots of people don't like the dSLR's because of their size. Your not going to slip a dSLR in your pocket.

You mentioned the Pentax...now is this a dSLR or a bridge camera? Do you know if they make bridge cameras that I'm interested in?

So in other words...you feel the Pentax is just as good a camera, but it doesn't have the popular reputation that Canon and Nikon do, correct? I just want to be sure that it isn't taking the cheap way out (sorry to all you Pentax users) or an "imitation" camera that is modeled after the Canon or Nikon but doesn't produce good resutls.


Thanks again for taking the time to answer my questions at such great lengths. It is very much appreciated!!

The pentax is definately cheaper in cost. I think IMHO that it has more to do with the reputation and the companies decision to market at a lower price point. Many people equate cost with quality, which is definately not always the case. And I am sure that the Pentax is a good camera.

I had a pentax film SLR and was happy with it for many years. I choose the Canon for many reasons, one of which was my dad's love for his, which is the brand he decided on after going though them all. I still have his Practica which was a haseblat clone that he could afford when he was in High School.

Are you in information overload yet?

 

[Groucho]

Okay, so you mentioned that the 70-300mm lens at sigma4less for $115 that would fit the Pentax. So, if I'm guessing correctly, the 18-55mm lens kit that you said came with the K100D would give me a lot less zoom?

That is correct. You'll have to switch lenses when going from long zoom to wide-angle. There are lenses with similar spreads at the PnS ultrazooms - like 18-300mm - but you can't help losing some quality with such a compromise. That's why hardcore photographers love "prime" lenses, which have no zoom at all (plus they also can usually run at a lower F-stop which helps in low-light or fast-action photography.)

I'm just having such a hard time deciding ...it just seems that none of the cameras 'have it all'. I can't decide whether its more important to opt for a camera with a higher ISO, like the Fuji....or if I should opt for a camera with a higher zoom.

Well... higher ISO is useless if it's got a lot of noise. The real question is, how high can you go before noise becomes a real issue?

As for zoom... I'm not sure that you'll see a huge difference between 10x and 12x, and it could be argued that it's not as much of a "stretch" for the lens, which may help quality... but still, I'd tend to lean towards 12x (and did, for my last PnS) but the Fuji sounds extremely appealing, for a very cheap price.

For the digital cameras I already own, I have 2 SD 1G cards so that would be a real bummer to have to buy new memory cards but I don't think thats something I should base my decision around, right?

I feel your pain, fortunately memory cards are dirt-cheap lately! buy.com often has them for ridiculously cheap, as do a few other places.

The more I research, the more I make myself crazy!

I know the feeling - I'm going through the same thing trying to buy a ballhead for a monopod! Bleah!

Unfortunately, there is no (and never will be) a "perfect" camera...

As for PnS vs SLR-like, SLR-like usually just means that it LOOKS like a baby SLR camera, with a grip on the right side and a long lens on the lens (looking at the camera from behind.), and PnS usually means the little flat rectangles of most digital cameras. Generally, the camera end up looking SLR-like any time they have zoom of more than 3x or occasionally 4x.

 

[Groucho]

I had a pentax film SLR and was happy with it for many years. I choose the Canon for many reasons, one of which was my dad's love for his, which is the brand he decided on after going though them all. I still have his Practica which was a haseblat clone that he could afford when he was in High School.

If you have any of the old Pentax SLR lenses lying around collecting dust, keep me in mind. A nice thing about the Pentax DSLRs is 100% compatability with old lenses, which Nikon and Canon can't quite claim (but they do have plenty... but not all.)

And I assume you meant "Hasselblad" in the last sentence.

 

[Master Mason]

If you have any of the old Pentax SLR lenses lying around collecting dust, keep me in mind. A nice thing about the Pentax DSLRs is 100% compatability with old lenses, which Nikon and Canon can't quite claim (but they do have plenty... but not all.)

And I assume you meant "Hasselblad" in the last sentence.

yes I meant Hasselblad, my mind works much faster than my fingers most of the time.

My son has the lenses for the camera as well as the camera. So sorry about that... and it was all manual focus stuff at that time as well

 

[DestinationDisney]

Having a low starting point is good, because it allows you to have a wide angle, but the x factor will make the end smaller as well. Also it depends on what your looking for, if you plan on shooting things that are far away, you want that distance capablity.

The lowest starting point I've found for most is 35mm. I'm guessing this doesn't really give me wide angle, but I guess it doesn't matter much because I'm more focused on being able to shoot things that are far away anyhow.

Been there done that. And you might find that your perfectly happy with the Bridge or P&S camera you purchase and never decide that you want to move up to a dSLR. Lots of people don't like the dSLR's because of their size. Your not going to slip a dSLR in your pocket.

I'm confident that I'll be happy with the P&S. Its larger than my other P&S cameras, but its still light enough to carry around in my bag. I think a dSLR would be a big jump for me and it might be a lot for me to adjust to. I'm considering taking a photography class for fun at the local community college...hopefully that will refresh me on photo technical terms and if I enjoy it that much, then I'll consider getting the dSLR further down the road when I'm more comfortable with operating one.

Are you in information overload yet?

I'm definitely close to maxing out!! But I'm really enjoying learning about the different camera specifics. It makes me feel a bit more knowledgable about picking out a camera that I'll be spending a good chunk of money on....as opposed to just going into any old camera store and trusting what the "photo professionals" tell me.

Thank you VERY much for your help and for sticking around through all of my crazy questions! I imagine I must be getting on some peoples nerves, but its the only way I can learn!

Erica

 

[DestinationDisney]

Groucho -

Thanks for the great explainations...see, I'm starting to catch on!!

Well... higher ISO is useless if it's got a lot of noise. The real question is, how high can you go before noise becomes a real issue?

What would you consider too high, where noise becomes an issue?

As for zoom... I'm not sure that you'll see a huge difference between 10x and 12x, and it could be argued that it's not as much of a "stretch" for the lens, which may help quality... but still, I'd tend to lean towards 12x (and did, for my last PnS) but the Fuji sounds extremely appealing, for a very cheap price.

The cameras I've narrowed down my choices to are mostly 12x zoom. I still have the Fuji on my list, but its hard to move myself away from the Canon S3 and the Sony H5 cameras.

I feel your pain, fortunately memory cards are dirt-cheap lately! buy.com often has them for ridiculously cheap, as do a few other places.

Oh, I never even heard of that website...I'll have to check it out. Plus, I guess its not really worth trying to decide on a camera around what type of memory card it uses.

I know the feeling - I'm going through the same thing trying to buy a ballhead for a monopod!

What in the WORLD is that?!? Boy, do I have a lot ahead of me to learn!

Oh and thanks for clueing me in on what the difference is between PnS vs SLR-like cameras. This is good to know!


Thanks again!!!

 

[Master Mason]

The noise level of high ISO varries from Camera to camera. One may be great at 1600 and another terrible at 400, it is a funtion of the sensors. Also, what is acceptable to one person is terrible to another.

To put noise in a different perspective, it is like the static you might get from your radio, it keeps the music from being as clear as possible. The noise of a picture keeps the image from being as clear as possible. There are programs that will help fix noise issues as well.

The sensor is the part that captures the picture, like the film would if you had a film camera.

You shouldn't make your decision entirely on what memory it takes, but it can be one of your deciding points. Sony requires the Sony Stick. Others will have CF SD or others. Yes memory is cheaper now, but it is still and expense and if you can get something you have, or something you will likely to continue with, then that is a plus. But shouldn't be a ruling factor IMHO.

The Ball head is a part that goes on top of either a monopod or a tripod that allows you to move the camera about on top. so you can move it from horizontal to vertical or change the angle if your shooting up or down. Like if you wanted to take fireworks off a tripod, you need to angle the camera up to the sky.

And finally I don't think your getting on anyones nerves at all. Your asking good questions, and hopefully getting some good information. Everyone benifits. I love answering questions when I know something, because it helps me to learn even more. If you trying to teach something that means you have to have a clear understanding and the process helps the teacher as well.

 

[DestinationDisney]

Thanks again MasterMason!

I really feel like I'm learning a lot and beginning to really understand the different settings on a camera and what they're for. Its a shame, when I took photography in college, the professor never really took the time to explain the different parts to us and how they make the camera work. One would think that those are the basics that you'd need to learn before you can begin to learn more photography techniques.

As you said, I won't base my decision entirely on what memory the camera takes, but it certainly is one of my deciding points.

Now I know what a ball head is! Very cool...I've always wondered how people are able to move their cameras about on a tripod to shoot at different angles.

Speaking of tripods...someone mentioned in a previous post that they use a "mini tripod". How much money would one of these cost? Do you need to get a tripod based on the model of your camera?

And finally I don't think your getting on anyones nerves at all. Your asking good questions, and hopefully getting some good information.

Thanks for telling me this....I was beginning to think everyone was getting fed up with me like "geez, will this girl just pick the camera already!?!"



Oh, and another question....

One of the cameras I'm considering is a Kodak P17. It states that the camera comes with an internal flash and an external hot-shoe. What is this?

 

[DestinationDisney]

Could someone please explain this to me....this will probably be helpful in narrowing down my choices.

When I looked up reviews of the Canon S3, I found that most people complained about the same things. Most reviewers say that the LCD & EVF are small in size (2.0) and has very low resolution (115,000 pixels) and it makes it hard to review the pictures.

Reviewers also mentioned that "it has chromatic aberration (purple/green fringing) especially at the telephoto end of the lens" and they saw "a lot of tele shots with purple fringing especially at the extreme end of the lens". What exactly does this mean? A lot of people seem to be complaining about this...so I don't know if its something that I should weight my decision on.

When I looked up reviews on the Sony DSC-H5, it seemed a lot of people complained about issues with button placement. They said its very easy to accidently press the macro, flash or EV buttons as they are close to the right thumb. I don't exactly kno what this means, but being a beginner, this makes me a little nervous.

A problem specific that a few people reported was No RAW support, no USB control for time lapse photography (the S3IS has it), and no custom settings button (at least one not obvious). They also reported that there are some low light issues with the camera. Do you think these problems are worth eliminating this camera from my choices?