Looking For A New Camera - Need Help Please!!

[Master Mason]

Beautiful shots Martha

 

[makinorlando]

Beautiful shots Martha

 

[DestinationDisney]

Martha -

Thank you so much for sharing your night pictures with me and your offer in answering my questions about the Canon S2/S3. I love the colors that you captured in the firework picture! I think you took some pretty incredible pictures for being "on the fly" and not being able to change camera settings!

I'm really glad to hear that you enjoy the Canon S2. When you said the ISO is limited, and the S3 has a higher ISO, what does that mean? The S3 has more IS ability?

With the S2/S3 you do have the option of buying converters - there is a telephoto converter, wide angle converter and a close up. You do need an adapter tube for these, which is good to have to protect the cameras lens.

Where can I buy something like this? A telephoto lens is used to take pictures of objects at even further distances, correct?

I took this hand held using the fireworks mode and the timer so I did not shake the camera pressing the shutter release.

So you're saying that your S2 has a "fireworks mode"?? Is this similar to a timer? Thats incredible!! I'd really love to have something like that.


Thanks again for your help ...I'll be sure to hit you up if I think of any other questions regarding this camera (or camera buying)!

 

[DestinationDisney]

Master Mason -

Wow! Thank you so much for your taking the time to answer my questions so completely. Now I really understand the difference between the different types of cameras out there.

I think the bridge camera might be good for me, however I think I'd like to buy something that I can upgrade and buy different lenses for. The XTi looks like an amazing camera, but after looking at the price of the regular XT, I don't know if I can afford that. These digital SLR cameras don't come with lenses do they? I'm assuming thats an addional cost?

I'd really love to get a digital SLR camera with IS and a high zoom. Then, I can buy special lenses at a later time. Do you know if there are digital SLR cameras that come with a lens? Or do most only sell the base, and then you choose the lens?

Should I look for a camera with an ISO higher than 800 if I want to take night shots that actually come out?


Thank you again for your wealth of information. I'm really excited about learning about cameras and hopefully I'll soon be able to offer advice to other like you are doing for me. I really appreciate your help!

Erica

 

[DestinationDisney]

Boy, this is beginning to get a little embarassing. I feel so bad, I can't believe the amout of questions I'm asking!


Okay another question for you photography buffs...

I read that a 12x optical zoom is too much and can distort the image. Is this true? Should I stick to a 10x opt zoom?

 

[manning]

What's taking you so long? where's the next question??

That's how you'll learn.

As far as answers if we don't know the answer we'll make one up!!!

As far as my Sony H5 12x I haven't noticed anything, or should I say nothing that bothers me, but I think all telephotos will have some distortion.

Just took a look at a couple of 432mm shots and didn't notice any distortion.

 

[handicap18]

From the info you've posted it looks like the S3 IS (or that category of camera) is more up your alley. The prices of dSLR's are coming down all the time, so that is definately something to think about down the road. Advantages you'll get with the dSLR's are fast startup time, little to no shutter lag, bigger digital sensor allowing for better high ISO pictures (basically film speeds of 800, 1600, and on some 3200) among other thing. The dSLR's will not give you a big zoom. The S2/S3 has a 12x optical zoom, other camera's in the category will have 10x zoom. Only very few lenses for dSLR's have a 10x and most of them that do are average (quality wise) at best. Most zooms for dSLR's are about 4-6x, but quality & optically on a dSLR you don't want much more. Thus the large number of different lenses to choose from, in focal length, aperture and price.

Price wise the S2/S3 IS is a great camera. It definately seems as though it meets your current needs and budget.

Happy shopping.

 

[handicap18]

dSLR's do come in 'Kit' form. In other words there are packages put together that include a lens, maybe 2. These lenses are typically "entry level" type lenses. For the digital rebel it normally includes an 18-55mm lens. You can opt to purchase the body only and find your own lens. Many suggest Sigma's 18-125mm. Very good size for "walk-around" lens. Another lens that is typically associated with dSLR Kits is a 70-300mm. Canon does make quite a few IS (image stabilization) lenses in a number of different focal lengths (ie: 18-85, 28-135, 70-300, 70-200 to name a few {at least I'm pretty sure, if not its very close to these lengths}). Prices are typically 5 to 8 times the cost of lenses without IS. Keep in mind that IS will only assist with keeping the camera/lens steady. It will not keep your subject steady.

There are hundreds, if not thousands of lenses available to be used with Canon and Nikon dSLR's. Sigma, Tamron and Tokina also make lenses that can be used. These are typically less expensive, but also (in most cases) not as good quality as lenses made by Canon or Nikon.

 

[DestinationDisney]

mhutchinson -

The website you provided me on the camera specifics is amazing. Thank you for referring me to that!

Now here are my questions for you (you didn't think you would get away without a few questions from me, did you?? )

You will get better results from a dSLR due to better glass and the larger sensors, but some of the noise from a point and shoot can be easily cleaned up in most photo software tools or by a specialty tool like Noise Ninja.

Another thing I know nothing about, the NOISE from point and shoot cameras can cause problems with photos? Can you explain this more...I'm not sure exactly what you mean.

I myself went through a similar camera purchase cycle. I had a SLR, left it out in the sun too long, bought a new SLR, got tired of development costs and darkroom chemical costs. Got frustrated with the shutter delay and short flash range resulting in blurred or missed shots and decided to upgrade. I was really, really going to go with a Mega Zoom Like the Panasonic or Canon (now I would add the Sony to choices), but the dSLR just felt right back in my hands.

I'm glad to hear that I'm not the only one who is in this boat, and that you went through the same ordeal not too long ago. I'm having the same frustrations with my digital cameras...the flash range is really poor and they don't offer the zoom that I'm looking for.

I'm starting to rethink the Canon S3, and become more interested in a dSLR camera. Can you recommend a few to me? How much would one cost with a decent lens (but not too pricey)?

The only two times I regret that decision is when I wish I could stick it in a shirt pocket or when I get dust on the sensor (which is an easy fix, just another thing to do).

I know what you mean in wishing you could stick the camera in your shirt pocket, it sure isn't going to be the same as it was carrying around my lightweight Kodaks.

Okay, one more question...how do you get dust on the sensor? Actually, maybe I should ask first...what is a sensor? And how difficult will the be for me, a beginner, to fix?


Thanks again Mike, for all your help!!

 

[DestinationDisney]

What's taking you so long? where's the next question??

Haha, I'm glad you don't mind my questions! I'm really getting a bit out of control over here, but you're right..thats the only way I'll learn.

As far as my Sony H5 12x I haven't noticed anything, or should I say nothing that bothers me, but I think all telephotos will have some distortion. Just took a look at a couple of 432mm shots and didn't notice any distortion.

Okay, so another question then ... how do you take a 432mm shot? Excuse me for being naive, but how do you develop this type of picture? Do you have to put the camera in a special setting to have it take this size picture?


Thanks again, I'll be sure to keep the questions coming!!

 

[DestinationDisney]

Handicap -

Thanks for the additonal help! I'm still debating which camera to get, I think you're right though. As a beginner, I may want to start out with the Canon S3.

Okay now here come my questions for you....

Advantages you'll get with the dSLR's are fast startup time, little to no shutter lag, bigger digital sensor allowing for better high ISO pictures (basically film speeds of 800, 1600, and on some 3200) among other things.

Now, you mentioned that the dSLR's have "little to no shutter lag". Does this mean you can take pictures fast, one right after the other? Will I have a difficult time doing that with the Canon S3?

You also said that dSLR's allow for high ISO pictures. To my understanding, having a high ISO allows you to take better quality night pictures and action pictures. If I go with the Canon S3, will I have poor quality night/action shots as opposed to a dSLR?

The dSLR's will not give you a big zoom. The S2/S3 has a 12x optical zoom, other camera's in the category will have 10x zoom. Only very few lenses for dSLR's have a 10x and most of them that do are average (quality wise) at best. Most zooms for dSLR's are about 4-6x, but quality & optically on a dSLR you don't want much more.

Why is it that on dSLR's you don't want a high zoom as opposed to the 12x zoom on the Canon?


Thank you!!!

 

[handicap18]

Since I'm here, I'll try and answer a few before heading off to bed.

Noise is the digital equilivent of grainieness (sp?) on film. Everything is in focus, but its not really SHARP.

There are a few ways to clean dust of the sensor. First off dust can get on the sensor when changing lenses and also when using the zoom on the lens. The suction of air can suck in some dust. How much you get and how often you'll have to clean it depends on how often you take pictures and how careful you are when changing lenses (turn camera off and point the front of the camera down and don't change lenses outdoors in windy conditions are examples). You can use a little air blower to blow the dust of the sensor or use sensor swipes with a few drops of a liquid solution to take the dust off.

A 432mm shot is the focal lenth that the lens was set at when the shot was taken. Its said that the human eye see's at the equilivent of 50mm on a film camera. To get a 432mm shot (or there abouts) you would use a zoom telephoto lens such as a 70-300, 80-400, 200-400 etc.

As for dSLR's themselves. Nikon's D50 and Canon's Digital Rebel XT can both be had for less than $1000 (probably around $800 or so) with a decent lens like the Sigma 18-125mm (even less is you just get the 18-55mm 'kit' lens). Nikon also will have an 18-135mm lens available next month and they currently have an 18-200mm that is awesome, but also costs close to $800.

 

[DestinationDisney]

Handicap -

So as far as the dSLR cameras that come in 'kit' form, would you say that I'd be better off quality-wise getting the Canon S3, than getting a dSLR camera that comes with an entry level lens?

Although, if I DID decide to go with a dSLR, I could always wait and save up to get extra lenses. But I would hate to start out with a lens that isn't great quality. It sounds like having a good "walk around" lens is going to cost a lot in addition to the camera base.

You mentioned that the IS lenses are quite a bit more expensive than lenses without IS. How important would you say it is to get a lens with IS?


Thank you again for your help!! You have no idea how much I appreciate all of this information and guidance!

Erica

 

[DestinationDisney]

Noise is the digital equilivent of grainieness (sp?) on film. Everything is in focus, but its not really SHARP.

Oh gosh...I actually thought that this meant the "noise" the camera makes when it takes a picture. I was wondering why that would cause a bad shot!?

There are a few ways to clean dust of the sensor. First off dust can get on the sensor when changing lenses and also when using the zoom on the lens. The suction of air can suck in some dust. You can use a little air blower to blow the dust of the sensor or use sensor swipes with a few drops of a liquid solution to take the dust off.

Which would you recommend that I use? Where can I purchase sensor wipes, do I need to go to a specialty camera store? Can I use this on my point and shoot Kokak camera?

As for dSLR's themselves. Nikon's D50 and Canon's Digital Rebel XT can both be had for less than $1000 (probably around $800 or so) with a decent lens like the Sigma 18-125mm (even less is you just get the 18-55mm 'kit' lens). Nikon also will have an 18-135mm lens available next month and they currently have an 18-200mm that is awesome, but also costs close to $800.

Okay this information alone tells me that a dSLR is WAY out of my price range. I'm looking to keep costs under $400. It sounds like the Canon S3 is right up my alley, but I'm going to keep looking around at the other high zoom cameras.

Thank you again for your help!!!

Hope you are able to get some sleep after all my questions!!

 

[handicap18]

Handicap -

Thanks for the additonal help! I'm still debating which camera to get, I think you're right though. As a beginner, I may want to start out with the Canon S3.

Okay now here come my questions for you....



Now, you mentioned that the dSLR's have "little to no shutter lag". Does this mean you can take pictures fast, one right after the other? Will I have a difficult time doing that with the Canon S3?

I'm not sure of the shutter lag on the S3. I believe it is better than most P&S digitals though. Others that have the S2 or S3 can comment better on its performance in that regard.

You also said that dSLR's allow for high ISO pictures. To my understanding, having a high ISO allows you to take better quality night pictures and action pictures. If I go with the Canon S3, will I have poor quality night/action shots as opposed to a dSLR?

The S3 does a pretty good job with ISO 400 & 800. I've seen some sports pictures taken with the S2 that came out pretty good. With a dSLR you have a lot more flexibility. You can use ISO 1600 and a lens that has a VERY wide aperture (aka f/stop) and get excellent shutter speeds. Something you really can't duplicate on any type of P&S.

Why is it that on dSLR's you don't want a high zoom as opposed to the 12x zoom on the Canon?

Thank you!!!

Glass is the biggest factor, bigger lenses mean more glass, which means more weight. Also with lenses, you have to make some sacrafices. If you get a long zoom then, a lot of times, you have to give up speed (how wide the aperture can open). The 18-200mm (11x zoom) lenses out there start at about $400. Most really don't have very wide apertures which makes it harder to get faster shutter speeds and even sometimes for the lens to be able to focus properly. You can also get some image issues, corners of the picture will look out of focus or not exposed properly for example.

 

[mhutchinson]

I am so glad you like that site, I cannot tell you how many times I was going there when I was trying to decide.

Now it is off to my homework assignement...I mean answers (I hope)

Another thing I know nothing about, the NOISE from point and shoot cameras can cause problems with photos? Can you explain this more...I'm not sure exactly what you mean.

Noise. Noise is static and loss of image quality in a picture. Typically due to low light and is more noticeable in darker areas. In film it would be equivalent to the film grain or particle sizes in the film. As an example film with a 64 speed rating has small particles and produces little graininess, whereas an 800 speed film uses larger particles and thus produces a more grainy image...but the 800 speed can capture images faster and in lower light

It is to a digital image what static is to a radio, or a 'snowy' image to a TV picture ...BUT enough babble...the Noise Ninja site has some nice examples of pictures with noise and then removed which would probably better explain this, just follow the link http://www.picturecode.com/

I'm starting to rethink the Canon S3, and become more interested in a dSLR camera. Can you recommend a few to me? How much would one cost with a decent lens (but not too pricey)?

Price...you will spend a few hundred dollars more than the S3IS, for basic kits and then several hundred and thousands more when you must have the precious ...I mean top end lenses. Both Nikon and Canon have some very nice offerings. The Canon has the Rebel XT and Nikon has the D50 which run about $600 -$1,000 depending on lenses and options. For me I started this way and ended up with a Canon 20D. The Rebel was too small in my hands, and I liked the Nikon D70 better than the D50 and the Canon 20D ended up having a very large rebate.

Okay, one more question...how do you get dust on the sensor? Actually, maybe I should ask first...what is a sensor? And how difficult will the be for me, a beginner, to fix?

The sensor is the 'film' of a digital camera and literally you can get dust on it. This will mostly happen if your lenses are not clean when you mount them, if you change them in an area where the air is not stable, or in rare instances it can get pushed in through a lens. Typically it is not very detectable, but if you take a picture of a perfectly blue sky and analyze the picture for grayish of off tone spots...this is a sign of dust on the sensor. Cleaning it off requires minimal sensor cleaning tools to a good little kit (depending on the severity). Basically you follow the camera directions for cleaning the sensor which is typically having a fully charged battery, locking the mirror up (my camera has a 'sensor clean' function), and lightly puffing the dust off (never with compressed air) and using a statically charged brush to grab the particles. The new Rebel XTi has a sensor shaker built in to help reduce this issue.

So how did I do ???

Mike

 

[manning]

Haha, I'm glad you don't mind my questions! I'm really getting a bit out of control over here, but you're right..thats the only way I'll learn.




Okay, so another question then ... how do you take a 432mm shot? Excuse me for being naive, but how do you develop this type of picture? Do you have to put the camera in a special setting to have it take this size picture?


Thanks again, I'll be sure to keep the questions coming!!

It's very simple. there is a rocker switch on the back of the camera. one side is marked with a W for wide and the other with a T for telephoto. You press W and the lens zooms out. Press T and the lens zooms in to 432mm or anywhere in between. As long as you press on the switch the lens will zoom until it reaches the limit.

You are not putting it into a special setting. Turn on the camera, look at the LCD If you like what you see you take the picture. Otherwise press W or T to zoom the lens in or out. Nothing to it.

 

[Master Mason]

Here is the thing to keep in mind regarding zoom.

With a P&S or a Bridge, they tell you the optical zoom in a x factor. So you could have 3x 4x etc... up to 12x or so. What that tells you is what ever the lens starts at you can multiply that times your x factor and get the end number. However, few tell you in the open what that start and end number are. So if your start is 5mm with a 10x your end would be 50mm, which is incredibly wide, and you probably wont see but the numbers were easy If the start is 25mm and you have a 10x your end would be 250mm.

With the dSLR lenses, they tell you upfront what the range is. So you might end up with a 18-55 70-300, 18-125, 500-1000 etc... The times factor isn't important because you know where you start and where you end.

And just to confuse things a bit, since the sensors are smaller than 35mm film there is a conversion factor. In the Cannon it is 1.6x for the XT. So if I want the true number I have to take the lens number and mulitply it by 1.6.

But the beauty of the dSLR is you can change out the lenses, which allows you diffrent mulitples, different appatures etc..... This increases what you can ultimately do with the camera, but at a cost.

Here is something that I always try and keep in mind when I am decideing on what to buy as well. I have to ask myself, when I am basing my decision on cost, am I going to be happy with what I buy at the lower cost, or am I ultimately going to have to spend the higher price anyway because I won't be happy with what I can get at the lower price.

I have found in the past, if I really wanted the more expensive item, and settled for something else because of cost, I end up spending for both what I really wanted in the first place, as well as the one I had settleed for..... That is the really expensive way to do it.

Finally, my experience is cannon. If I were to buy the XT again, I wouldn't get the kit lens, and would apply that money to a sigma 18-125, which is what I have now, and the kit lens is in a box in the garage.

There is a thread currently here about the Pentax, which I understand is slightly cheaper, and the people discussing it seam very happy with it. The people with Nikons always seam happy with them as well.

I think in the dSLR world (IMHO not trying to upset anyone or knock anyones decisions or purchases) Cannon and Nikon are a toss up, like deciding between coke and pepsi, it is just which one you like better. Pentax would be like RC, good, been around a long time, just doesn't have the reputation of the other 2, and the rest are new comers like olympus and sony, and I really know nothing about them.

But there are always 7up and mountain dew for those that don't like cola's so it is really a matter of what you want thats important.

 

[hipporina]

I bought the Sony H2 online last night. I spent several hours on the net reading different reviews and that is the one I chose. It seems comparable to the S3, just a little cheaper. I picked that one over the S3 because of the cost difference. I ordered mine from Circuit City and am picking it up from the store later today. I paid $304 for mine. It is 12% off on their website, and then if you do a google search for coupons, there is a 10% off coupon available too. I was thrilled with the price and I can't wait to get the camera!

 

[Groucho]

There is a thread currently here about the Pentax, which I understand is slightly cheaper, and the people discussing it seam very happy with it. The people with Nikons always seam happy with them as well.

I think in the dSLR world (IMHO not trying to upset anyone or knock anyones decisions or purchases) Cannon and Nikon are a toss up, like deciding between coke and pepsi, it is just which one you like better. Pentax would be like RC, good, been around a long time, just doesn't have the reputation of the other 2, and the rest are new comers like olympus and sony, and I really know nothing about them.

Glad to see the Pentax get mentioned. I just glanced at this thread and was sad again to see DSLRs discussed as if Nikon and Canon are the only companies making them, which is of course not true. There are several others that are very good (nowadays, you'd have a hard time buying a poor DSLR), and the beauty of the Pentax is the low price, and you give up little or nothing in quality to the "big name" ones (and gain some things, like ergonomics and a larger LCD or in-camera IS on the K100).

For the longer zoom on a DSLR, the cheap ones probably won't match the quality of the more expensive long zoom lenses but should easily match a PnS's lens. You can get by fairly cheaply - for example, sigma4less.com has a 70-300mm lens for the Pentax for $115. That gives you slightly more zoom than a 12x. (Equivalent 450 vs 432.)

If your limit is $400, you're out of luck now... a couple months ago, you could have picked up the Pentax ist DL for as cheap as $367 but that didn't stay that price for very long and are now mostly sold out. Currently you're probably looking at closer to $450 or so after rebate if you can find one, or the popular choice now is the K100D with shake reduction for just under $600. All prices include the 18-55mm kit lens.

For PnSs, I've been really impressed with the photos that YEKCIM has posted, taken with a Fuji S5200. Surely some of it is photographer skill but the actual technical quality has been excellent, and it can be had for $240 at Beach currently. If I was buying another PnS, I'd definitely consider that one (especially since I loved the quality I used to get out of my Fuji 2800.) I'm not very familiar with the S2/S3, but the Fuji goes up to 1600ISO while the S2 goes to 400 and the S3 tops out at 800. The Fuji does go to "only" 10x zoom. It also unfortunately uses XD cards instead of SD.

(I admit that I haven't read the whole thread, so hopefully I'm not repeating anything already said in the thread!)